Highest amount of money willing to give if your expectations were met?

[Joseph Hutson]

Would you buy a Scarlet if your expectations are met?

If so, how much would you be willing to spend if all of them were met?

Clear Speculation...just a fun poll.

[James T Mather]

17,500

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

I voted for $2500. A pocket camera, professional or not, it can't possibly have all the features found on bigger cameras. Lenses and sensors and what not are physically bigger on "good" cameras. So given the size/features ratio that I can speculate out of this "pocket camera", a good price would be $2500 and not a dime more.

[Joseph Hutson]

I chose $3,250 because that is pretty much all I have...so i guess compared to others' vote, it is equal to about 5 Grand. :-)

Anyway, I can hardly wait til NAB comes...also I hope they are cheap enough for me to buy 2.

Thanks to the people who vote, and explain why they voted for what.

[Craig Schober]

you should remove the $1000 and $2500 options. anyone choosing them either hasn't set their expectations high enough or are delusional about the price performance ratio that scarlet should and could have.

who cares about a $1000 or $2500 cam? we have dozens of those on the market already that do a perfectly fine job already.

[Jiri Bakala]

If it is to be better than Sony EX1 or Panasonic HVX200 (which is to be expected from Red:-), I have no problem paying $7,000 for it. The price points up to $4,500 are unrealistic and plain silly.

[Joseph Hutson]

you should remove the $1000 and $2500 options. anyone choosing them either hasn't set their expectations high enough or are delusional about the price performance ratio that scarlet should and could have.

who cares about a $1000 or $2500 cam? we have dozens of those on the market already that do a perfectly fine job already.

That was what I was thinking too. Is there a way to edit them? I didn't think that was possible.

[Digigenic]

you should remove the $1000 and $2500 options. anyone choosing them either hasn't set their expectations high enough or are delusional about the price performance ratio that scarlet should and could have.
We have no official documentation from RED on what the exact specifications on the camera are, therefore expectations will fluctuate all over the map. Any of those individuals voting for a lower price could just as easily make the same claims you've just made but aimed at the $5,000 or $7000 options. Nobody can make a definitive claim because it's based on pure speculation.


who cares about a $1000 or $2500 cam? we have dozens of those on the market already that do a perfectly fine job already.
Can't say everybody will agree with you making the claim that consumer cameras do a perfectly fine job already, but there certainly are a lot of them to choose from.

If the OP does remove those options, then the votes that were cast for those price points should be rounded up to the next available options.
If you want to keep the poll realistic, maybe we should have waited when we knew more facts about the camera, but like the OP said, it was just for fun.

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

Digigenic is right. You can't say that you only expect super-high-end products from this company when they have only released a single product and have not given details about the Scarlett. Therefore, it's a perfectly good assumption to think that the camera will only cost $2000 or $10000.

Personally, this is what I want from a smaller camera:
http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2007/10/03/what-i-really-want-part-ii/
Currently, no manufacturer has created such a product, so why not the Scarlett?

[Roberto B]

you should remove the $1000 and $2500 options. anyone choosing them either hasn't set their expectations high enough or are delusional about the price performance ratio that scarlet should and could have.

who cares about a $1000 or $2500 cam? we have dozens of those on the market already that do a perfectly fine job already.are you sure?.. if you're so certain.. then why 25% are there?.. don't underestimate who has given the bucks to red for being alive..

[Nathan Buxton]

ok guys... im going to say $2000 simply to try and lower the average here. The red one was revolutionary in the fact that it made new precedents in how we think about price points. $2500 sounds great... :)

maybe im dreaming... but what better way to take over an industry then to make all the competitors models overwhelmingly overpriced overnight.

[Mark B.]

It's ridiculous to even ask this question until we know exactly what its capabilities will be.

[Steve White]

It's not ridiculous to ask. Price is just as much a specification as sensor size. Often you have to design to a price point.

I'd consider Scarlet in the $1k to $5k range. The higher on that scale, the less I'd consider it, with $5k being almost zero.

[Matt Gottshalk]

Its all going to depend of course on the final feature set.

But when you consider it will 1.) most likely be 2k, and 2.) most likely be HVX sized or smaller ("pocket camera"), anything around $5k to $7k is a good target.

I mean heck, a new HVX goes for $5200.00

Who WOULDN'T pay $6k-ish for a 2k camera with a 35mm sensor and 4:4:4?

[Ravell]

Whoa - a Red Team member voted for $3250. Wonder if that means anything.

[Roberto B]

Whoa - a Red Team member voted for $3250. Wonder if that means anything.yeah.. what does this mean Deanan?..

[Ravell]

That's the DVX/XH-A1 pricepoint....Hmmm....

[Yannick Hagman]

With the HV30 kicking in around 1k I wouldn't pay more than 2.5k for a SCARLETT. It's not about the camera.

[Gian Paolo Vallati]

With the HV30 kicking in around 1k I wouldn't pay more than 2.5k for a SCARLETT. It's not about the camera.

Hi, Muroshi, IMO there is a huge difference between an interlaced 1080 HDV camera like the HV30 and a "Pocket Digital Cinema Camera", 24p, 2K with RAW code.

[Yannick Hagman]

not if distribution at the moment just is the web at the moment. HV30 shots 24p btw.

[Ramesh Jai]

Do we even know what features SCARLET has? It's like guessing the price of a car without even having a picture of it.

Ahem...$4500.

[Joseph Hutson]

Do we even know what features SCARLET has? It's like guessing the price of a car without even having a picture of it.


We are not talking about how much would you pay for a Scarlet when it comes out...whatever the specs. We are talking about how much our speculation has led us to expectations, thus the question...according to your PERSONAL expectations how much would you pay for it.

If you think it will be just a little consumer camera, you might vote for $1,000.
I expect much more.

About the Red Team Member voting in the $3,250, that would be GREAT if that meant...well you what. Scarlet whatever it is, I can't wait.

Professional, Pocket, Perfect!

[Craig Schober]

it would be really interesting to cross reference poll takers votes with those that currently own or soon to be owners of red. i suspect there are others like me that want a $7,500 scarlet because they want to be able to intercut some of it's cleanest stuff with their red 4k stuff. i think the further you get away from the high end version of scarlet, the less this becomes a possibility.

think of it, the only thing red one 4k can never be is easily portable. if you cut out some of it's expensive processing power and just deliver a raw 2k image with decent latitude and 35mm dof, you might end up with a truly portable $7,500 solution that actually cuts with 4k. it's selfish and maybe somewhat elitist of me but i hope scarlet sells for $10,000 and packs a real punch.

[Roberto B]

then, you'd lose the economies of scale.. no customers, no red scarlet.. no red portable solution.. no 35mm dof.. no 2k raw.. nothing at all.. only you dreaming over here.

[Joseph Hutson]

As I think about it, I wonder if it would be better to have the scarlet closer to $5K-$7K for the Scarlet, because you wouldn't want all of the consumers lining up to get one of the best cameras on the market...then they wouldn't hire you to do sporting events. Yet even truer, it is not the camera, but the hand directing the camera that really does the work.

But BOY, a camera like the Red One SURE DOES HELP!

[Eugene]

What, No $500 choice for price? Canon's Tx1 sells for below $500. Just kidding. I would pay $2,500 without thinking about it, because that is how much I paid in the past for my SD cameras. I could pay more, but I have to save money for a house. Just make Scarlet half the price of a Sony, and the world will beat a path to Jim's doorstep.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=ProductDetail&A=showItemLargeImage&Q=&sku=239238&is=REG

[César Díez]

10-12 k with all the accesories to work on the field... run and gun documentary set up included (i mean, camcorder+vfd+lenses+direct sound imputs ... tripods, monitors and others extras no included)

then i will buy mac+fcphd and my company will work very happy... (it would be perfect four our kinds of works... not cinematography, not publicity, but yes goog quality productions... (documentary, audiovisuales, etc...)

[Roberto B]

seems clear to anybody that a few of you can't wait to do charity..

[oldphart]

Would you buy a Scarlet if your expectations are met?

If so, how much would you be willing to spend if all of them were met?

Clear Speculation...just a fun poll.

I would be willing to pay 7000 USD if it is a body without lens - if it does not have interchangable lenses it is just another prosumer camera.

[Gabe S.]

I voted for 2,500. I understand you can only expect so much at that price, but i believe the Red team can work wonders ;)
And i'm poor.

[Yannick Hagman]

A 7000$ wouldn't make any sense. If you can come up with 7'000$ for a camera you most likely can come up with more and buy a red one.

[Joseph Hutson]

I would be willing to pay 7000 USD if it is a body without lens - if it does not have interchangable lenses it is just another prosumer camera.

What you said about "just the body"... BINGO! But at $4,500

I am still interested in seeing why that RED Team Member voted for $3,250

Anybody else know?

[Joseph Hutson]

I voted for 2,500. I understand you can only expect so much at that price, but i believe the Red team can work wonders ;)
And i'm poor.

Welcome to RedUser Gabe! Thanks for adding to the fun. :-)

[Gabe S.]

Thanks! I've been reading the boards since before the first Red One's shipped but this has been the only thing i could contribute thus far.
I believe in Red :)

[Matt Gottshalk]

A 7000$ wouldn't make any sense. If you can come up with 7'000$ for a camera you most likely can come up with more and buy a red one.

Not oif the 7K was all you needed to shoot.

For 17.5K all you get is the RED body, which is unusable until you add another 15K of gear, minimum.

[Joseph Hutson]

Thanks! I've been reading the boards since before the first Red One's shipped but this has been the only thing i could contribute thus far.
I believe in Red :)

Whether I contribute or not, I just dive in and have fun...I love the technological world we live in today!

[BASSAM MSSALATIE]

Voted for 7000 $ at least i will get what i have paid for :greedy:

[Eugene]

The Sony PMW-EX1 XDCAM EX SxS Pro HD Camcorder is what I would buy is Scarlet didn't exist. The Sony EX1 costs $6,500 at B&H, so that is what I would pay for a Scarlet. The cheaper Canon XH costs $3,300. The Canon GL2 I bought cost me under $2,000. So I guess that I would like to pay $2,500, but I would pay up to $5,000. I still need money left over to buy a new Mac. I am guessing that my G5 will not be up to the task of editing 2K.

[Joseph Hutson]

The Sony PMW-EX1 XDCAM EX SxS Pro HD Camcorder is what I would buy is Scarlet didn't exist. The Sony EX1 costs $6,500 at B&H, so that is what I would pay for a Scarlet. The cheaper Canon XH costs $3,300. The Canon GL2 I bought cost me under $2,000. So I guess that I would like to pay $2,500, but I would pay up to $5,000. I still need money left over to buy a new Mac. I am guessing that my G5 will not be up to the task of editing 2K.

It depends on all of the Specs of the computer. How much RAM, and how fast is the processor?

I have a MacBook Pro 17", and love it. It is all I have to edit on, and if it wasn't for Apple...well I guess the same story as you are describing about Red and Sony. I would have to use Windows.
ugh! Sorry Windows enthusiasts. :-) not really

I would probably HAVE to buy the EX1's if Red wasn't around also.

I love EVERYTHING about Red...some might dislike the way Red has advertised their products, and letting people speculate for a year or two, but I just want to take a minute, and say: "THANK YOU JIM AND COMPANY...I LOVE FORWARD THINKERS LIKE YOU ALL, AND CAN'T WAIT TO SEE THE SCARLET!!!

I think the ONE thing I will regret most this year, is not making it to NAB :-(
BOOOHOOOHOOOO!

[Yannick Hagman]

I wonder if Nikon or Canon will present anything on NAB. Will they leave the field to Red Digital Cinema without a fight?

[Joseph Hutson]

I wonder if Nikon or Canon will present anything on NAB. Will they leave the field to Red Digital Cinema without a fight?

Whether or not Canon brings anything, there will be NO competion in the price range.

GO RED!

[peter_kelowna]

Hi All,
I was pretty close to making a decision on the Sony XD cam EX. I was very careful about what I was reading on all websites after I found incorrect information on the official sonystyle website. They claimed the FX series as a FULL HD, when in fact it is only 1080i. As a matter a fact, there are camcorders at FutureShop (A leading Canadian electronics retailer) with little stickers "FULL HD" on them, when they are infact only the lower 1080i.

It was on a SONY forum that someone mentioned RED and I thought I'd chase it down. So far I am hooked. I think the camera would be amazing when the people at RED figure out how to put Three 4k CCD's in the RED.
Call it Red-3 (or RED - cubed_)
My purchase critera before I heard about RED is:
1) changable lens
2) Three 2k ccds' (as big as I could afford) or 1 big one.
3) solid state or hdd memory
4) ext. mic jacks
5) something not totaly locked into proprietorship. ie: software, lenses etc..

I'm only a hobbiest, but I may consider BIG RED if I can figure out a way
to make some extra money with it. RED is easily $30,000 just to get started.
The camera itself is useless without the power bricks, storage and lens.
I will wait till the Scarlett comes out first.
The people at RED did something pretty impresive with THE RED ONE. I don't know what to expect, but I'm not that sure I'd want anything less that what RED offers.

[Joseph Hutson]

Hi All,


Congratulations on your first post, and I am honored that two people's first post on the forum was on the thread I started.

To all who have voted in the poll, thanks. To all who posted on this thread, another thanks.

I am surprised at how many have made a response.

Thanks again to the 163 so far.

[Jeff Coatney]

A 2K camera for $2K (or in that neighborhood) that has the same workflow as a RED would be so overwhelmingly popular, it would protect RED ONE's flank in the market. Establishing the Red Code / Red Cine / FCP workflow with a solid beach-head that is fortified against counter-attack and bringing us all the more closer to the fabled RED ONE WORLD. I'm just sayin'... think about the bigger picture when you guys fantasize about paying $7,000 for this thing.

[Craig Schober]

I'm just sayin'... think about the bigger picture when you guys fantasize about paying $7,000 for this thing.

so $2,000 for a 2k cam isn't fantasizing but $7,000 for a 2k cam is?

[Gian Paolo Vallati]

My expectations:
- 2K RAW
- SSD 64Gb
- Nikon F mount
- up to 120 fps
- HVX size or smaller

I'd pay 7000$ (less than 4500 €) tomorrow

[Joseph Hutson]

My expectations:
- 2K RAW


I hope it is raw, whatever it is...that would be great!

[Lawrence Bansbach]

Hi All,
I was pretty close to making a decision on the Sony XD cam EX. . . .

My purchase critera before I heard about RED is:
1) changable lensI'm confused. You considered buying an EX, which has a noninterchangeable lens, yet you require a removable lens on the Red Scarlet?


I think the camera would be amazing when the people at RED figure out how to put Three 4k CCD's in the RED.
Call it Red-3 (or RED - cubed_)That will never happen, on at least two counts: the Mysterium is a CMOS chip (this is an important distinction, as CMOS chips tend to display rolling-shutter artifacts, although the Mysterium has been reported to suffer from them much less than other chips), and Red touts the benefits of a single chip, so it will almost certainly never use three.


2) Three 2k ccds' (as big as I could afford) or 1 big one.
Never CCDs and never three (see above).


3) solid state or hdd memoryI am not going out on a limb by saying that is certain. I can't imagine a tape drive.

[Jeff Coatney]

so $2,000 for a 2k cam isn't fantasizing but $7,000 for a 2k cam is?

How much does a Canon HV20 cost? (1920 x 1080) ... No further questions, your Honor.

[Joseph Hutson]

How much does a Canon HV20 cost? (1920 x 1080) ... No further questions, your Honor.

Is it RAW? 2K? I am sorry, I guess I better wait 'til NAB, but the Scarlet will not be ANYTHING like the HV20!

[Gian Paolo Vallati]

Is it RAW? 2K? I am sorry, I guess I better wait 'til NAB, but the Scarlet will not be ANYTHING like the HV20!

I totally agree
Canon HV20 : HDV compression, sensor CMOS 1/2,7".
IMHO it's a consumer camera.

[Jeff Coatney]

Is it RAW? 2K? I am sorry, I guess I better wait 'til NAB, but the Scarlet will not be ANYTHING like the HV20!

I'm not comparing Scarlet to the HV 20. I can't, because none of us know what Scarlet will be at this point. Yes, the HV 20 is a consumer camera but it has a killer price point for the features it offers. For what I want the Scarlet to do, I'm willing to pay $2,500 - $3,000. Other people have different needs and think that Scarlet should cost $7,000. Price alone doesn't determine whether something is professional or not, you have to look at the features and the form factor. I merely point out that RED has a history (albeit brief) of defying conventional wisdom with their pricing. That fact has enabled them to sell a lot of cameras. I believe that Scarlet will be equally as aggressively priced when it is introduced. I believe it to be in the range I've indicated. If it is, I will buy two. If it is more, I will buy none and I will rent yours when I need it.

[Jeff Coatney]

Jarred knows exactly what I'm looking for with regards to Scarlet and I can't wait for NAB. ;)

[krwl]

$999.98 never fails. :shifty:

[Finner]

$39,856

[Steve Freebairn]

I'd say finner is within 100 bucks of the exact amount.

[Finner]

I'd say finner is within 100 bucks of the exact amount.

As long as I did not overbid that would mean I win both show-cases.

[ColinSmith]

I'd like it to be a camera that would blow me away with it's features so much that I would be rushing to pay the $7000.

If it was $2000 but I was thinking, "well, not bad, pretty sweet for a $2000" camera..... not so good.

If the $2000 camera can blow me away..... win:win situation ;)

[Joseph Hutson]

I don't know if I want it to be a camera with features that blow you away for 1K-2K, because it will get TOO popular.

[Finner]

I suspect it won't even be a camera but rather a pro assist tool for the red1.

[Joseph Hutson]

I suspect it won't even be a camera but rather a pro assist tool for the red1.

VERY FUNNY!

[Finner]

Not trying to be funny. Ted even called it a "professional tool" and not a camera. Red is trying to establish themselves as making the best digital cinema camera in the world and have a lot on their plate with that. I question if building a toy prosumer camera fits with that goal.

[Joseph Hutson]

A toy? Scarlet?

[Joseph Hutson]

Maybe, JUST MAYBE, you didn't see this.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7183

DID YOU REALLY NOT?

[John Caballero]

I have been quite a wacky few months since Scarlet speculation started officially. I am sure the Red staff had a hilarious time reading the posts and probably the laughter help them relaxed a bit. It is scary to see grown up men and women going crazy like this about a new toy without knowing basically an iota about it beforehand. I would say only in America but our dear friends all over the world joined in the madness.
Hopefully Scarlet will be a bit over the HVX 200 capabilities and be a great tool; especially those that are starting out and do not have $30,000 in their “pocket” to shell out for the Red One.
If it becomes accessible to everybody so be it. Photo digital cameras are widely available to the public and professional photographers are still making a good living.
In a little longer than a week we will see pictures of the newborn and we will decide how beautiful or ugly she is, and if she will grow up to be a productive individual.

[John Caballero]

Sorry for the typo at the beginning, I meant to say It has been

[Joseph Hutson]

Sorry for the typo at the beginning, I meant to say It has been

In the future, you may edit your posts, after seeing typos. Then you will not have to admit a mistake. :-)

I just have fun taking part in the discussion, and you might call it madness, but I call it fun. ;-)


Ted might have called it a tool, and a camera IS a tool to capture video. Jim J also said CLEARLY it is a professional, pocket, camera!

[Finner]

Maybe, JUST MAYBE, you didn't see this.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7183

DID YOU REALLY NOT?

Just maybe you did not see Jim's signature "Everything in life changes..."

I think Scarlet will be a red 1 support tool and have a little intel on that.

[John Caballero]

Thank you for the posting advice, I will keep it in mind.
I have been in this business for 32 years and I’ve seeing the TOOLS to capture video go thru great changes. Heck, I saw the possibilities of making it look like film all the way back in the early 90s.
Of course it has been great fun to see all go speculating! Now let’s hope we can all use the camera for our projects. By the way, the price should not be more than the TATA NANO from India.
Let’s have a bit of more fun, shall we?

[Ravell]

Did this poll just change to anonymous voting?

[Joseph Hutson]

Did this poll just change to anonymous voting?

No...Why?

[Ravell]

It used to be public. You could see who voted for what.

[Joseph Hutson]

It used to be public. You could see who voted for what.

It still works for me. Is it just because I started the poll?

Here is the page.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=101

[Peter Majtan]

Big corporations (like Canon) "design" prices to keep the industry going forward, not to kill it. I know - I've designed (with working prototype) few years back RAM-based HD camera capable of shooting variable HD up to 120fps by modifying existing canon HW. The manufacturing cost for Canon was estimated to be way bellow 5K. Senior Canon executive said that if Canon was to release such a camera - it would "kill" the market, not something any of the "big-5" camera companies wants to do... The project "was too advanced for its time" and was scrapped. I moved on to Tokyo to design from scratch 6K/4K restoration system for 35mm feature films for Kurosawa family...

Having said that - RED is independent and "in-Your-face" young private company (THUMBS UP TO JIM AND HIS TEAM!!!) and they might just do that ("kill the market")...

Why not? Afraid that everyone will rush to buy the camera?
A) Great financial sense for RED...
B) Give everyone the same toll - the "art" will be what separates us (independent filmmakers). No more whining "Anyone can shoot like pro with RED ONE" kind...
C) Does this looks like Jim's vision? Only he knows...

If Scarlet did meet my expectations - I would be willing to pay 5K without a blink of an eye... (for basic body without any accessories or lens)

PS: Don't You just hate when someone asks a simple question (creates and thread) and instead of people just replying and expressing their own opinion (related to the question asked) they end up fighting and insulting each other because they disagree? What a shame...

[John Caballero]

Well, Mr. Jannard even got in on the fun when he said a while back…. What was it? O yeah, “the inmates are running the asylum! hehehe

[Joseph Hutson]

Thanks to all who have voted.