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View Full Version : Stolen RED DRAGON #01615



Ron Elliot
09-06-2014, 10:14 PM
Some one just broke into my apartment and stole my RED DRAGON #01615, MacBook Pro, five glyph hard drives, set of nine IRND filters, O'Connor matte box, tv logic 7" monitor, Canon 5dmk3, a set of Anton Bauer 140 batteries, and more.
This occurred in Long Island City, NY, 9/6/14 around 6:00PM. Any help would be appreciated.

Ron Elliot

Neil Dearman
09-06-2014, 10:18 PM
Dude they are going to hell!!!!! I hate hearing about this man always hits the heart hang in there man!!!!!

Kwan Khan
09-06-2014, 10:21 PM
Bad..

Russ Fill
09-06-2014, 10:31 PM
Sounds like they knew what they were looking for. didn't leave anything they would not need.
So sorry to hear. I hope you get it back...

Nick Fury
09-06-2014, 10:58 PM
At least tell us you had insurance...

Owen Rennie
09-06-2014, 11:10 PM
Sux to hear Ron.. Yes hope nick is right and you have insurance...

Also bit late now but i recommend everyone buy one of these.. weighs 350kg, i welcome people to try steal it ;)

Tom Greenberg
09-07-2014, 05:45 AM
F**ing Scumbags!! I hate hearing about stuff like this. Good luck Ron…hope you were well insured...

ericyoung
09-07-2014, 06:09 AM
Sorry to hear your news! :sad:

Does sound like a knowledgeable burglary. Do you advertise your home address anywhere with your kit list?

Lakis Amarantithis
09-07-2014, 10:37 AM
It might be a good idea for Red to design a kind of a gps addition to put in the camera so it'll give you always the location where you shoot like the phones have. That can benefit people who travel and shoot and in this case benefit the owners from theft.

If the thief turn it on the gps will locate the camera.

Very sorry for your loss!

Alexandros Tsoupras
09-07-2014, 11:40 AM
It might be a good idea for Red to design a kind of a gps addition to put in the camera so it'll give you always the location where you shoot like the phones have. That can benefit people who travel and shoot and in this case benefit the owners from theft.

If the thief turn it on the gps will locate the camera.

Very sorry for your loss!

+1000 on that.

Brian F Kobylarz
09-07-2014, 12:50 PM
It might be a good idea for Red to design a kind of a gps addition to put in the camera so it'll give you always the location where you shoot like the phones have. That can benefit people who travel and shoot and in this case benefit the owners from theft.

If the thief turn it on the gps will locate the camera.

Very sorry for your loss!

This has been suggested as a possible feature going all the way back to the RED One's.

Unfortunately, it can work against us as well.
Just imagine if one expert hacker were to penetrate the security on RED's servers and extract the code to send out a command query "Find all RED's".
How much would the crooks pay for that data? Download the code and the hacker might make it an app for sale to their "industry".
In that case, the cameras themselves would be vulnerable until the factory resets the search ID's on each individual body.
Using hacked GPS data could tell a thief exactly where the camera was secured during lunch - or in what hotel room, which truck, etc...

Only a matter of time before one of them figures out how to reverse engineer the GPS flag to disable it.


A few other ideas suggested at one point or another:
1. The ability for the camera to require a password to boot up. Surprisingly, a lot of owners objected to that idea. There was a great fear of being locked out by mistake.
2. Detection of a stolen ID when firmware is being updated and a silent notification sent back to RED.
3. A small program that can be accessed on the web that would flag R3D's at post houses (Camera ID is currently captured in the metadata)

Other approaches were proposed as well - bottom line, every possible solution had at least one flaw but there does need to be a workable solution at some point.

Sulekh Suman
09-07-2014, 12:53 PM
Kill switch!

Christof Paul
09-07-2014, 12:57 PM
i would gladly take the risk of someone hacking into red's servers in exchange of having a gps signal coming from the camera and being able to locate it at all times. nothing is perfect but it works for cellphones and cars and would be a very welcome addition to me.

the other solution is for all of us to simply not buy it no matter what the price. it also should not be too hard to put the serial number into the metadata and being able to "fingerprint" each and every clip anywhere to the camera if came from.

Brian F Kobylarz
09-07-2014, 01:28 PM
it also should not be too hard to put the serial number into the metadata and being able to "fingerprint" each and every clip anywhere to the camera if came from.

Unique information is already baked in.

As I mentioned in point #3 above, the serial number is in the metadata - not visible in REDCineX Pro, but can be retrieved with a hex editor.

This was an early innovation that RED introduced back in 2007.


Quoting Stuart English in December of that year:

Please let everyone that you do business with know that RED ONE cameras have a unique 9 digit electronic serial number - a P.I.N - that complements the physical serial number tag. The latter may be erased, defaced or otherwise tampered with, but the P.I.N can't.

The P.I.N is also written to every video frame recorded (its in the .R3D file) but an instant view of the camera P.I.N is available by pressing the key to the right of the joystick, plus the joystick itself. The P.I.N will then be displayed in the rear LCD panel. In the case of my test camera, the P.I.N is ABC_123_XYZ

The P.I.N is also displayed on the rear LCD panel and on all monitor ports at camera boot up from Build 8 firmware onwards.



To the best of my knowledge, the capture of unique camera ID information carried into EPIC's and Scarlet's.
The "fingerprint" is in every single frame, not just the clip.

Gavin Greenwalt
09-07-2014, 02:27 PM
Would be great if REDCine-X Pro would refuse to render any frames from stolen cameras. I would also be perfectly happy with RCX prompting me so that I could email RED if I get any footage from a thief. Any reputable post house I'm sure would be more than happy to report stolen camera footage.

Donald MJ Anderson
09-07-2014, 02:30 PM
Would be great if REDCine-X Pro would refuse to render any frames from stolen cameras. I would also be perfectly happy with RCX prompting me so that I could email RED if I get any footage from a thief. Any reputable post house I'm sure would be more than happy to report stolen camera footage.

I like that idea but lets hope for no bugs in that code! Yikes!

Curran Giddens
09-07-2014, 02:42 PM
Would be great if REDCine-X Pro would refuse to render any frames from stolen cameras. I would also be perfectly happy with RCX prompting me so that I could email RED if I get any footage from a thief. Any reputable post house I'm sure would be more than happy to report stolen camera footage.

I think this is a great idea.

Med D
09-07-2014, 02:47 PM
Just imagine if one expert hacker were to penetrate the security on RED's servers and extract the code to send out a command query "Find all RED's".



Or one not-so-expert hacker just looking up home addresses for people who are asked to use their real names on a public web forum? Nothing like posting your name and identifying yourself as a $40k+ camera owner to the world.

30 seconds and a free website offer addresses for both you and the OP -- your street is shown as "Ho#$%t. Of course those are not always accurate but I doubt it would take many tries to get a direct hit.

Hrvoje Simic
09-07-2014, 03:51 PM
It might be a good idea for Red to design a kind of a gps addition to put in the camera so it'll give you always the location where you shoot like the phones have. That can benefit people who travel and shoot and in this case benefit the owners from theft.

If the thief turn it on the gps will locate the camera.

Very sorry for your loss!


This has been suggested a few times since the early days of Red, made some myself, but back then these thingies weren't on the market:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_box_gps?k=gps+tracker



EDIT: just saw that Brian made a nice summary.

Brian F Kobylarz
09-07-2014, 04:00 PM
Or one not-so-expert hacker just looking up home addresses for people who are asked to use their real names on a public web forum? Nothing like posting your name and identifying yourself as a $40k+ camera owner to the world.

30 seconds and a free website offer addresses for both you and the OP -- your street is shown as "Ho#$%t. Of course those are not always accurate but I doubt it would take many tries to get a direct hit.

That includes a pretty big assumption - that any equipment is accessible at the same location. However, a GPS track would verify or exclude.
Not to mention any IDS or other security processes and or protections are in place.

No matter where the gear is stored, a good rule of thumb is to ensure the response time by authorities is shorter than a thief can penetrate the perimeter, bypass protections, access the gear and escape.

My point on the hacker is that it could tell someone with bad intent where any camera would be within a few feet.


As far as RCX locking up footage, that would need to be date sensitive (locks after date xx/xx/xx when reported stolen). Otherwise, everything that camera ever shot would be locked out.
A thief could circumvent that measure by using or supplying an "archived" version of RCX that had not been updated.

Gavin, I believe it was you that brought up a report to RED feature years ago - damn straight - a great idea. Keep pushing it.

All others - contribute ideas to help protect everyone in this community.

Lakis Amarantithis
09-07-2014, 06:26 PM
Another idea is for Red to put a code there that only owners have and if you don't put it every month the camera stops working.

Gavin Greenwalt
09-07-2014, 07:26 PM
Or one not-so-expert hacker just looking up home addresses for people who are asked to use their real names on a public web forum? Nothing like posting your name and identifying yourself as a $40k+ camera owner to the world.


If any not-so-expert hackers are thinking of stealing my camera based on my Real-Name and Facebook information... sorry it's inside a locked facility, behind a dead bolted door, chained to the wall with an alarm system that automatically calls the police. ;)

Les Dittert
09-07-2014, 07:55 PM
If any not-so-expert hackers are thinking of stealing my camera based on my Real-Name and Facebook information... sorry it's inside a locked facility, behind a dead bolted door, chained to the wall with an alarm system that automatically calls the police. ;)

Mine is in a large heavy gun safe.
Gavin, you touch on something rather frightening : robbers can google the real names and find the address. Rather frightening.
Oh, forgot to mention : I have a 9mm Glock close by and I have no problem using it. ;)

Jay Silver
09-08-2014, 07:21 AM
I'm with Les, big gun safe...not terribly expensive but heavy and strong. 9mm...well, that couldn't hurt to have close by incase you were home while the break in was going on...just saying...

Timur Civan
09-08-2014, 07:31 AM
I seriously want to know if it was insured.

Should the unthinkable happen like this again, I'm curious about the claims procedure. How does the insurance company handle it? Do you just get a check? For full new value? Or do they account for depreciation?

Tom Hamilton
09-08-2014, 08:49 AM
This just showed upon EBay, serial number not given, Dragon M apparently;

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RED-Epic-Dragon-M-Brain-/261582580977?pt=Digital_Cameras&hash=item3ce7896cf1

Donald MJ Anderson
09-08-2014, 10:09 AM
This just showed upon EBay, serial number not given, Dragon M apparently;

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RED-Epic-Dragon-M-Brain-/261582580977?pt=Digital_Cameras&hash=item3ce7896cf1

Selling a 25K item with 4 feedback points means I`ll be sending him a western union payment immediately.

Rome Will
09-08-2014, 07:06 PM
Ron,

I sincerely hate this happened to you. This is one of my biggest fears...that my gear will get damaged or worse, stollen, before I get a chance to shoot something great with it. I pray you are able to track down your equipment and get your stuff back. Again, I hate this happened- I wish it on no one.

Daniel Reed
09-08-2014, 07:24 PM
Liability insurance is so critical, both against theft and accidental damage by use.
Annual coverage is inexpensive, often less than a dollar per hundred w/ a deductible.
If you haven't done so yet, speak to a broker that deals w/ entertainment insurance.

If you're in the SF Bay Area, Larry Walsh is your man.
I suspect he can get or direct you to coverage if you're elsewhere in the states:
http://www.entertainmentinsurance.com/

Daniel Reed
09-08-2014, 07:53 PM
That's probably Luke Newmann - he's been offering a Dragon M on the boards for a few days now.
Like the ebay entry, Luke is in Oregon, his Dragon M has 12 hours on it and he's asking about the same price:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?120951-RED-Dragon-M-Brain-(-25-999)



This just showed upon EBay, serial number not given, Dragon M apparently;

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RED-Epic-Dragon-M-Brain-/261582580977?pt=Digital_Cameras&hash=item3ce7896cf1

EDIT: Looks like Luke raised his asking price from 26K for brain only to 30K w/ accessories.

Daniel Reed
09-08-2014, 08:05 PM
I seriously want to know if it was insured.

Should the unthinkable happen like this again, I'm curious about the claims procedure. How does the insurance company handle it? Do you just get a check? For full new value? Or do they account for depreciation?

Depends on your insurance, but often liability insurance geared towards business assets is replacement cost.
The deductible is just subtracted from what you get - you don't pay it.

In the case of theft you will often need to file a police report and forward that information.
In terms of damage, a repair quote.

Turn around times vary greatly - from days to weeks and in some extreme cases it may take months.

Gavin Greenwalt
09-09-2014, 04:58 PM
How fast is RED at replacing? I assume you can jump the line and they'll make an exception for you. But do you have to buy an X and then upgrade it or is there a replacement Epic-X Dragon price? I was looking at that since I was updating my Insurance yesterday and wasn't sure what to list for value.

Paul E. McCarthy
09-09-2014, 05:51 PM
I doubt that it would be hard for RED to put a flag in the next firmware update that would lock cameras with stolen camera numbers.

Daniel Reed
09-09-2014, 06:05 PM
Depends on your policy, you may need to read over your policy fine print and/or ask your broker. From my experience entertainment liability coverage is usually replacement cost. If that is indeed the case you list the value it would cost you to buy a new comparable product, in your case that would be an Epic-M Dragon as there is not yet a Epic-X Dragon model. I'm not sure about the tax costs

In terms of RED shipping you another one, I suspect they'd treat it as just another sale. i.e. you're buy an Epic Dragon at normal costs.
I don't think there really is much of a line atm for new Dragon cams. Per my RED rep, it it says in stock on red.com, it usually ships w/in a couple days of cleared payment.


How fast is RED at replacing? I assume you can jump the line and they'll make an exception for you. But do you have to buy an X and then upgrade it or is there a replacement Epic-X Dragon price? I was looking at that since I was updating my Insurance yesterday and wasn't sure what to list for value.

J Obertone
09-09-2014, 06:33 PM
Very sorry to hear about this. How can we help?
Is there a master list of stolen #'s so we can use if a shady camera comes around or for buying used etc?
I have used Athos for insurance covering break ins, theft etc as well as a little GPS in the case.

Donald MJ Anderson
09-09-2014, 07:01 PM
Very sorry to hear about this. How can we help?
Is there a master list of stolen #'s so we can use if a shady camera comes around or for buying used etc?
I have used Athos for insurance covering break ins, theft etc as well as a little GPS in the case.

There is a stolen list but RED wont tell you anything without the owners permission. It makes checking a pain in the ass.

They will check if you are paying the transfer fee.

Daniel Reed
09-09-2014, 07:28 PM
What makes you think there isn't something like that already in place? :coolgleamA:


I doubt that it would be hard for RED to put a flag in the next firmware update that would lock cameras with stolen camera numbers.

Leroy Jackson
09-10-2014, 10:09 AM
DAM.... Man they had to be watching you. Don't nobody just wake up and be like...... I think I'll steal a Dragon today.
This is VERY sad. I'm gonna give my Epic a big hug when I get home.... Providing it's still there.

Patrick Tresch
09-10-2014, 10:13 AM
... I'm gonna give my Epic a big hug when I get home.... Providing it's still there.

I'll drink on that! Cheers!

Pat

Ron Elliot
09-10-2014, 11:00 AM
Thanks everyone for the support, this is a heart breaking experience for me this has really put me out of business They have taken the tools I need to make a living with and provide for my family. Wicked is not even close to what it is, I hope that the police catch who ever is responsible for this and I'm hopeful the insurance company will do the right thing but that will take some time to know as of right now I have to figure how not to let the anger consume me and find some work that can keep my mind in a positive direction. I hope I can rebuild off of this, I believe in GOD and Karma is a mother. If anyone hears of anything or see anything please let me know My laptop was taken also and it had all of the projects Ive been working on for the last several years so I am completely starting all over.
I can use a drink and a long job I can get lost in.

Thanks
Ron Elliot
RED DRAGON 01615 (Stolen)

Clayton Taylor
09-10-2014, 07:39 PM
Holy hell that's a grip. Sorry to hear it. Some people should be taken out and shot... that's definitely a worthy crime. Hopefully insurance pans out. I know my policy has theft and burglary... hopefully I'll never have to use it. Keep us posted - hope it works out for you.

Dunkan Wolf
09-12-2014, 10:15 AM
a gps module inside the sidehandle would nice