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View Full Version : Love the new The DSMC® Low Light Optimized OLPF!!! ETA when it comes out?



Neil Dearman
09-15-2014, 09:05 PM
Went does it come out? Also do i just need to buy this one cause the current one is for Skin Tone-Highlight, please let me know thanks!!! Really excited about this :)

Julio Quintana
09-15-2014, 11:05 PM
Just FYI, the "new" Low Light OLPF is just the original version 1 OLPF that shipped with the early Dragon cameras but was ultimately replaced by version 2 (highlight/skin tone OLPF) in order to eliminate unwanted magenta flares and improve highlight roll off. But the original was at least a full stop better in low light so it will definitely have useful applications.

I believe Jarred mentioned that current cameras will start being converted to the swappable OLPF system at the end of the month.

David Battistella
09-16-2014, 12:03 AM
End of this month.

Battistella


The interchangeable OLPFs for Dragon begin shipping at the end of the month.

Each OLPF module is $195. We will begin with shipping the "Low Light Optimized (http://www.red.com/store/products/dsmc-low-light-optimized-olpf)" and the "Skin Tone-Highlight (http://www.red.com/store/products/dsmc-skin-tone-highlight-olpf)"

"Low Light Optimized" is the original Dragon OLPF tuned for shooting higher ASA shooting, and similar to the OLPF used in the Epic MX.

"Skin Tone - Highlight" is the current OLPF shipping with Dragon that offers a stop of extra highlight protection, the most incredibly accurate skin-tones and color science as well as additional flare control, with the expense of a stop of light sensitivity.

We are working on an array of OLPF Modules including:

Underwater : Tuned for underwater shooting
IR Monochrome : Tuned for shooting B&W IR images.
IR Color: Tuned for shooting Color IR images
Dragon Standard : In the middle of the "Low Light Optimized" and the " Skin Tone - Highlight " .
Monochrome: Standard Monochrome OLPF

For customers that have taken delivery of a camera with the previous OLPF system we will convert your cameras to the new system for free at any RED Certified Service Centers. If you are not able to send to a service center, contact dragonupgrade@red.com to get a modification kit sent to you for $100. Need to send back your old OLPF to get a credit of $100 to net free modification. Will need to do one-off firmware update to have camera moved from “fixed OLPF” status to “swappable”.

sergio arguello
09-16-2014, 03:58 AM
The real question is is it exactly the same with the same orbs and other flare issues or hopefully tweaked to dial some of that stuff out?

Tommaso Alvisi
09-16-2014, 05:47 AM
I think it's the same.

Donald MJ Anderson
09-16-2014, 07:19 AM
I think it's the same.

The Goldilocks or middle OLPF is a purchase for sure. I`m hoping they offer an even lower light version down the road that doesn't have the technical problems of V1 or I`d settle for just a fixed V1 with current low light.

Not sure how long I`d need to wait for either though.

Kevin Marshall
09-16-2014, 09:56 AM
The Goldilocks or middle OLPF is a purchase for sure.
We don't know that for sure. Of course we'd all hope that RED gets it right on their third try, but it could very well have issues of it's own, just as the V1 and V2 did. We'll just have to wait until it's out.


I`m hoping they offer an even lower light version down the road that doesn't have the technical problems of V1 or I`d settle for just a fixed V1 with current low light.

Not sure how long I`d need to wait for either though.

The V2 (now the "Skintone-Highlight" version) was their attempt at fixing the technical problems of the V1 (Low-Light Optimized). I wouldn't get too hopeful.

Kevin Marshall
09-16-2014, 06:39 PM
Customers shouldn't have to purchase an additional item to get back what they lost by having the new OLPF installed.
You don't necessarily have to. The upgrade to interchangeable OLPFs is free (plus shipping), and you can specify a different OLPF than what you currently have during the upgrade. If you want to wait until the Dragon Standard OLPF is available, then you're not purchasing an additional item.

Owen Rennie
09-16-2014, 06:49 PM
Originally Posted by Jarred Land
snip...


People just need to figure out what OLPF they want, and if they want their stop to be at the top or at the bottom and select the OLPF that is right for them. The vast majority have chosen the right one ( the new OLPF ) and are very happy with it but there are a few vocal people that want to see that OLPF back and we are happy to put it in their cameras.
Originally Posted by Jarred Land
Ivan, the upside down OLPF was our mistake.. that one we accept. When we do dumb things like that it doesn't really help our credibility so I can understand the wink.


But the new OLPF is not a botch. As much as there is a handful of people here adamant to keep pressing the issue over and over and over again, There are alot of very high caliber cinematographers and directors out there shooting the biggest films that tested both and have chosen the new OLPF for the right reasons.


And the new OLPF does not make the camera less sensitive than the old MX. Yes, it is less sensitive than the old OLPF+Dragon, but you gain a stop in the highlights, you get better color , better skintones and it eliminates the IR leak and flares. The old OLPF since it didnt do the best at stopping IR it boosted the image in the bad kind of light.. IR color contamination all over.


That's why we made the new OLPF, which has more green and less RED/IR in it ( much just like the Alexa OLPF ) . One side effect was the red channel spiked up in the noise floor so you would see that red chroma noise in the shadows and it would look much worse than it was.. Thats what Graeme is taking care of right now. Even with the new OLPF, Dragon has lower luma noise than the MX, and of course the Dragon has the extra stops in the highlights, as well as an extra stop on top of the sensor that the new OLPF gives.


We are not going to add noise reduction by default... that's something best left to people that want it and its a bit subjective in application. I know everyone else does it.. much like sharpening... but that doesn't mean it's right.


I do agree with you that having 2 OLPFs out there isnt the best idea.. but we are giving people the choice anyways. There are some people out there that turn the camera to ISO 800 and point to a scene that has 6400 ISO worth of light and think they have noise at 800.. they just don't get it so it is hard to compare to.. but to be fair everyone did that with our last camera as well. What we can do is compare things to used to be and make sure we do as much as we can better and move forward.. sometimes you need to make hard decisions and trade something for something else.


For the last 7 years we have heard Skin Tones and IR and highlights over and over and over again.. I am happy that with the Dragon one OLPF and alot of work from Graeme took care of those 3 things, at the expense of a bit of light optically which we feel is worth the tradeoff.





After reading this I'll happily stick with v2

Bob Gundu
09-16-2014, 07:07 PM
I totally agree that Dragon and OLPF2 is not less sensitive than MX. Plus the color gains and roll off make it worth it for me.

Manu BERNARD
09-17-2014, 05:09 PM
I agree, color restitution and protective highlights it's what miss on the epic...as the sensibility! and for the price I don't thing it WORTH the uppgrade.

Neil Dearman
09-17-2014, 08:28 PM
Well I am getting my Credit back until they fix all the major issues, which breaks my heart cause I really want the dragon (still getting one but waiting until they have it right). A ton of my friends are doing the same too

Stacey Spears
09-17-2014, 08:32 PM
Neil, upgrading or buying new? Upgrade price goes up 3k in December.

Neil Dearman
09-17-2014, 08:55 PM
what? It goes up 3 grand in December, why thats not fair they are making people upgrade or have to pay more?

Phil Holland
09-17-2014, 11:09 PM
what? It goes up 3 grand in December, why thats not fair they are making people upgrade or have to pay more?

This was announced some time ago. More or less the early adopter discount. There's always a window. This happened with Epic before this too.

Brian Merlen
09-18-2014, 08:30 AM
well if swappable olpf option is out before the price increase that may help the people on the fence jump in... esp if all the issues are resolved by then...

personally i am very excited to finally try the low light solution! cant wait

Elsie N
09-18-2014, 09:04 AM
I'll definitely buy some of the optional OLPFs... but not the V-1. V-2 color just makes my old v-1 footage straight out of the camera look like black and white by comparison.

Brian Merlen
09-18-2014, 03:46 PM
i think they give you one of the olpfs for a trade...but if you want both you pay for the other? something like that...either way its fairly cheap

Christopher Probst
09-18-2014, 04:39 PM
That's correct Brian. First swappable OLPR free, all additional ones $195 each.