Cineform & Adobe cinemaDNG

[Jack Kelly]

From what I can tell, Adobe's cinemaDNG and Cineform RAW aim to provide very similar solutions i.e. a common "RAW" format. Is that a fair assumption? Or will cinemaDNG be a mathematically lossless format?

I'm just wondering if Adobe are talking to Cineform about licensing Cineform RAW? I wonder if it might hinder the post production community if there are too many competing RAW formats (cinemaDNG, Cineform RAW, R3D, DNG).

[David Taylor]

The goal of CinemaDNG is to recommend deterministic format(s) that allow for consistency in post tools. There are a number of parties involved in the process, so it's not yet prudent to try to predict specific formats or outcomes. All companies participating have expertise with Raw formats in their own areas. If that general knowledge can be combined in a way that is beneficial to the community at large then hopefully all workflows may benefit.

[Jack Kelly]

Thanks loads for the reply, David!

I expect it's not possible to tell us... but... can you confirm whether or not Cineform are involved in the cinemaDNG design process? I certainly hope Adobe have had the sense to approach you!

[David Taylor]

It's a multi-party exercise, including CineForm. There is no one entity that is driving a specific agenda other than the overall goal stated when the effort was announced.

[Steve Freebairn]

Can't wait for CinemaDNG to come to fruition!

[Jay A. Kelley]

David,

In your opinion, do you expect something useful to come from this, or just a lot of feather fluffing.

I don' t understand how this can be a "community" thing when the codec software can represent some rather serious income to certain businesses. (Like yours for instance!).

I am just trying to figure out how this will work and what people have to gain from it

Jay

[David Taylor]

Jay, we think when properly executed standards can be a good thing for the community at large. I think that is the attitude of all participants entering the CinemaDNG process. The effort is new, so we'll have to see how it evolves. Each participant has their own business motivations - after all participation in standards always has business motivations. As it relates to certain proprietary technology (perhaps ours) that might be relevant, I'm not sure yet how it will play out, but our minds are open as we participate.

[Jack Kelly]

Just wondering out loud... I wonder if Adobe will (try to) buy Cineform?!

[Tom Lowe]

Man I just want a Camera RAW plugin for Premiere Pro CS3. :(

[Obin Olson]

Tell me about it Tom! scchhheeezzzz! when?

[Obin Olson]

Adobe buys CineForm and turns the industry upside down overnight with FULL 4k support for ALL raw formats across the CS3 board..now we are talking, meanwhile apple still claims it's the "best" but does nothing to prove it other then sell more Iphones to consumers.

he he he/out.

[Tom Lowe]

Tell me about it Tom! scchhheeezzzz! when?

You know, one crazy thing I noticed on the Adobe website is that Premiere Pro Elements (the $99 beginners version of Premiere) apparently supports Camera RAW, meaning you can import DSLR RAW straight into the program. How can their $99 program support RAW, but not the $699 Pro?

Does anyone know if this is actually the case?

BTW, if I upgrade to Prospect 4K, does that mean I can import CR2 RAW frames right into Premiere without running them through Photoshop, Bridge or AE?

[David Taylor]

BTW, if I upgrade to Prospect 4K, does that mean I can import CR2 RAW frames right into Premiere without running them through Photoshop, Bridge or AE?
Yes, the "other" CR - CineForm RAW. CineForm RAW clips will import right onto the PPro timeline - and all other AVI or MOV applications for that matter. The reason is that the CineForm decoder "hides" from the calling application the fact that the data is actually Raw.

To be specific to what I think you were asking, Camera Raw is a DSLR format. Neither Premiere Pro nor Prospect 4K do anything with Camera Raw.

[Tom Lowe]

Yes, the "other" CR - CineForm RAW. CineForm RAW clips will import right onto the PPro timeline - and all other AVI or MOV applications for that matter. The reason is that the CineForm decoder "hides" from the calling application the fact that the data is actually Raw.

To be specific to what I think you were asking, Camera Raw is a DSLR format. Neither Premiere Pro nor Prospect 4K do anything with Camera Raw.

David, apparently Premiere Elements can do it. And of course AE can do it. They use the Camera RAW plugin. Why they haven't implemented this in Premiere Pro CS3 seems odd to me. Any chance you guys could implement this in Prospect 4K? I know it's somewhat niche, but for me, that would make Prospect worth upgrading to.

[Rudi Herbert]

David, apparently Premiere Elements can do it. And of course AE can do it. They use the Camera RAW plugin. Why they haven't implemented this in Premiere Pro CS3 seems odd to me. Any chance you guys could implement this in Prospect 4K? I know it's somewhat niche, but for me, that would make Prospect worth upgrading to.

Tom,

I've been importing RAW images into Premiere for a while now through BRIDGE. I dont think I needed to open them from Photoshop first, but I will check and get back to you on that since the images I imported were more as a reference for a mood/color and not to keep as a working element in the timeline, but at least through Bridge you can do it right now. I'll look into it.

[Tom Lowe]

Tom,

I've been importing RAW images into Premiere for a while now through BRIDGE. I dont think I needed to open them from Photoshop first, but I will check and get back to you on that since the images I imported were more as a reference for a mood/color and not to keep as a working element in the timeline, but at least through Bridge you can do it right now. I'll look into it.

Yeah Rudi, thanks, that would be helpful. I know that people use Bridge to post-produce RAWs for timelapse, but I don't know how to do it myself, and even if I did, I don't know whether it would be more efficient or convenient than simply batching them in Photoshop.