To complete the revolution....

[I Bloom]

So it seems like Red and Apple are poised to really turn the film industry upside down in terms of quality versus cost. So what is necessary to complete this revolution? Maybe its 4K monitors, but I think its actually high quality high luminance 4K projectors. If someone could create a projector for below 20 grand that could project 4K images from a single drive, encoded in a more or less open codec then the movie industry would find itself in a whole new realm. Opening up the floor for exhibitors and producers to cut out a whole lot of middlemen. Shoot a movie on a camera you own, cut it in house, color grade it on a projector you own, put it on a standard hard drive and ship it for full quality exhibition on the same projector. Something like this could effect everything from features to high end corporate presentations. I know, I know, I'm not the first person to think of this, but hopefully someone with the means to make it happen is also thinking about it.

IB

[Sanjin Jukic]

Apple did not launch 4K display because nobody still offer 4K LCD on the market. 4K projector with a home theater price is still just a dream.

[Chris Kenny]

I wonder how long it'll be before the world's first 4K guerilla drive-in (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/entertainment/guerilla-driveins-124118.php). :)

[Craig Ryan]

as far as 4k displays...theres still tomorrow right?

[Post]

Apple did not launch 4K display because nobody still offer 4K LCD on the market. 4K projector with a home theater price is still just a dream.

Never say never. It was just a couple of years ago that 4k at this price was also a dream. I love it when dreams come true.

[PaulClements]

eCinema are launching a couple of nice pro displays at NAB but they're only 1080p by the looks of it. Not found anything about a 4k monitor as yet though. The technology is there, just not at a reasonable price as yet.

[Stephen Gentle]

At this point in time, 4K LCDs are impractical. And as The Third Man said, nobody makes a 4K panel. It would probably cost the price of several cinema displays anyway.

[Damien Molineaux]

So it seems like Red and Apple are poised to really turn the film industry upside down in terms of quality versus cost. So what is necessary to complete this revolution? Maybe its 4K monitors, but I think its actually high quality high luminance 4K projectors. If someone could create a projector for below 20 grand that could project 4K images from a single drive, encoded in a more or less open codec then the movie industry would find itself in a whole new realm... <cut>

IB

Well, sounds just like the kind of challenge for Red doesn't it ? I think after Red One and FCP integrating Red Code the missing link is indeed how to view these 4k films we're about to make. My little finger is twitching (is that only in french that little fingers give hints ?), anyways I wouldn't be surprised if Red got into projectors, maybe not yet, but soon !

Cheers,
Damien

[PaulClements]

4K monitors already exist.

Sharp launched one some time ago, at least as a prototype, it was 64" 4k x 2k resolution, here's a link to it on engadget. (http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/15/sharps-4k-x-2k-64-inch-ultra-high-res-monitor/)

They will be available soon enough, whether they will be affordable to the masses will depend largely on a decent company adopting them. I imagine Apple will be the key player in the 4k monitor market, due to their adoption of 4k with Red and of course now in FCP.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

At this point in time, 4K LCDs are impractical. And as The Third Man said, nobody makes a 4K panel. It would probably cost the price of several cinema displays anyway.

4K LCDs have been demonstrated by multiple manufacturers, including Samsung, LG, Westinghouse / ChiMei and Hitachi. The market for 4K displays is about to become very real.... I'm not expecting to see any 4K displays announced at NAB, but I would bet on one or two hitting the market by Siggraph this fall or by the end of the year. Actually, I'm beginning to think this may play a role in Apple's delay of Leopard until October. Think new displays and resolution independence.

Video cards with 2X dual-link DVI will drive 4K, the upcoming UDI interface that Apple and others has pledged support to will support 4K over a single cable.

I see no reason why those of us editing 4K can't have full-res preview / edit abilities within the next year.

[Joe Carney]

I think shooting 4K, delivering 2k or 1080p will represent about 90% of the market for awhile. Think 1080x24p on demand over the net. Most (like myself) are still waiting to upgrade to 1080p at home. I think Red/FCP6 could be the key to creating both quantity and quality for driving upgrades in the HT market.

[PaulClements]

Lets not forget that there are 4k scanners such as Grass Valleys (I believe demoing at NAB). It's not just digital acquisition that will move 4k to be more mainstream, film will likely be scanned at 4k more commonly and so the market for editors requiring a 4k monitor will be far greater than just those who have access to footage shot on a RedOne or Dalsa.

I'm with Jeff on this one. Before the end of the year we will see 4k monitors available, they'll be expensive to begin with for sure, but in time I can quite easily imagine seeing one listed on Apple's site for a few thousand dollars.

[I Bloom]

I think that the technology behind a DLP projector seems to me like its going to be much more inherently WYSWYG than most monitors and I imagine that they can be manufactured more cheaply than say a 4K LCD and be more reliable in terms of frame rate and refreshing. So an ideal system would be cutting on say two 23 inch or 30 inch monitors and previewing and grading on a 4K projector. Thats the setup they have at laser-pacific now lets put one in your garage.

IB

[Jaime Vallés]

Guys, RED announced that they will be making their own 4K projectors and displays!!!!

4K post just got a lot easier for regular people.

[Petr Dvorak]

Guys, RED announced that they will be making their own 4K projectors and displays!!!!

4K post just got a lot easier for regular people.

Are you JOKING?! :w00t:

[Clint Johnson]

According to Gibby, they are going to develop a 4K projector. Since the Sony 4K projectors are on the wrong side of $100,000 I wonder if Red will stick to its M.O. and sell it for just under $20,000?

If they are bright enough, we mere mortals won't be able to get one because the theatre chains will order them bulk- a hundred at a time.

[Kyle Spicer]

LoL dont forget you have to have a place to put the thing! Its the size of a Mac truck.


http://www.reduser.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=437&d=1176788187

[Paul Wizikowski]

I think shooting 4K, delivering 2k or 1080p will represent about 90% of the market for awhile. Think 1080x24p on demand over the net. Most (like myself) are still waiting to upgrade to 1080p at home. I think Red/FCP6 could be the key to creating both quantity and quality for driving upgrades in the HT market.

I agree. Personally I intend to shoot 4k REDCODE RAW, send to REDCINE, export ProRes422 (which is 2k), edit, master for broadcast (currently SD), back up footage to Quantum LTO-3 superloader.

Apple had a booth showing a split screen of 10-bit uncompressed HD 4:2:2 footage sitting beside the same footage kicked out to ProRess422, brought in and kicked back out again 10 times and you could not see a line seperating the two! The 10th generation of ProRes422 was indistinguishable from the uncompressed 10 bit footage!

When RED and Apple say their codecs are visually lossless, they mean exactly that!