mini-XLRs?

[Justin Anderson]

This is one of the questions I didn't get to ask yesterday; what was the reason for choosing mini-XLRs over the traditional size? And, will there be any difference in quality and workflow because of this?

[Damien Molineaux]

Sorry, I can't answer your question Justin. I guess the answer is simply size, four regular XLRs would take up a lot of space on that small body. The question I asked and haven't found an answer to yet, is where can I find right angled mini-XLRs ?

Cheers,
Damien

[david farland]

JJ or other RED member mentioned real estate on camera and that a few audio companies had released products with mini-xlr. Might of been a comment on way of the future but forget.

Cheers,

stop press: missed your post , Damien

[Simon Dean]

I would thinks it's simple - why use mini-Xlr? Because they're smaller. Only difference I can think of is that they won't be quite so robust as the full size ones. (and you'll need cables to support it).

[Ken K]

I talked to Neutrik about this yesterday. They don't make the mini-XLR connectors, but referred me to their competitor Switchcraft, who does make them (talked to them yesterday, too). I'll find out tonight if they make right-angled ones, as I have their product catalog in my hotel room. If you're interested, I'm going to be making some mini-XLR to XLR cables with Musilux cable and Switchcraft and Neutrik connectors.

[Jarred Land]

You guys are right.. size was the problem. We coulda just put 2 channels of input in but we wanted to give you 4, and to put 4 on the boards we needed to go mini. Same reason for the mini-bnc (well the mini-din ports to be exact)

Chazmo.. PM me, would love to help get the word out on your mini xlr cables.

[Cam McGrath]

The correct connectors to use are Switchcraft TA3M for the 4 audio inputs and Switchcraft TA5M for the audio out connector. The quality is not compromised and there will be no effect on workflow - it's just a smaller version of an XLR. In saying that, the smaller connectors are a little more fragile than full sized XLRs and as such should be treated accordingly. Breakout cables from mini to full size and strain-relieved to the cage/body/handle would be the smartest way of hooking up audio gear.

Oh yeah, and they don't make them in a right-angled configuration.

[david farland]

Excellent filmnorth...

From a daily use perspective, are you suggesting 1,2,4 or 5 way breakout mini-xlr to xlr cables.
Maybe RED could commission someone to make common ones or we could get them done ourselves?

From an Oz perspective who would you recommend to make up these...I know soundie's are particular about their plugs & cables, i.e specific cable manufactures, silver solder etc

Cheers,

[Cam McGrath]

David, I am going to make them up myself. And for anyone else who wants - not a problem! For most day to day use 2 channels would probably suffice but I am thinking of doing a single cable with the 4 input connectors plus the one output (5 pin) connector. I'm not sure however if the signal on the audio output is 2 Channel (assignable) balanced, 4 channels unbalanced or two AES. From a quick forum search I think it's 2CH Balanced. If this is the case, then the cable would have 6 XLR's on one end and 5 miniXLR on the other (camera) end. Another option would be to bust the mini's out to a box that had 4 input & 2 output sockets on it. Better than 6 XLRs going clunk-clunk all day long against your camera! Single mini's to full size is another option and of course you just use only what you need on there at the time.

Hmmm, food for thought.


cheers

Cam

[Pig]

I've given this a bit of thought, and I'll be making a box that will attach to the RED ONE, using the four mini-XLR connections.
From there there's two options as I see it, well more really but two main ones:
1) one (or two) channel(s) exit(s) the box at the top and is (are) used for an on-cam mic, and the other three (two) channels all exit through one cable out the bottom. There's actually three separate cables, but they are held together with a soft fiberglass sleeving.
2) all four channels exit through the bottom

At the other end there's a break-out cable or box with full sized XLR connections that go into a mixer's line-out.

The design allows for a firm attachment to the RED body, and has a push button for its release. I need the measurements (distance between the miniXLR connections), and confirmation that the drawing on the Red.com site is showing the pins the right way up (pic below shows it wrong); and I could make it already. If anyone from Red could give details of spacing of the miniXLR connections, I'd appreciate it.

It vaguely looks like this:
http://25p.org/redxlr1.gif RED One detail: http://25p.org/redxlr.jpg

Or in a FLV video (http://25p.org/redxlr.flv), if the above pic is unclear.

[Ken K]

Jarred or Jim,

Are you guys still planning on including mini-xlr -> xlr adapters with the Red for audio? Just wondering if I should start making some mini-xlr -> xlr cables in my free time for anyone who may need them (once sound is enabled). You guys are slammed at the moment, so I'm assuming something like that would be shipped later?

[Steve Sherrick]

Chazmo, I'll be in line for the cables if you make them.

Steve

[GlennChan]

Here's the cable I'd like to see:

Like this:
http://www.trewaudio.com/store/product.php?productid=109&cat=0&page=1
except with more connectors.

4 x XLR for each audio input on Red (of course).

1 x headphone jack for the return feed. In this headphone jack, it should be wired in parallel to a female headphone connector. This way, the cameraperson can put in his/her headphones and monitor audio too (this is a good safety). The other end goes into the mixer's return feed of course.

The overall cable is to two parts, joined by a single connector. This lets you easily detach all the audio cables at once when you move the camera... and you only plug a single cable back in. This way it's harder not to plug every input back in. The cable should pull apart somewhat easily... you want this so that you don't accidentally move the mixer and drag the camera off the tripod. / Ideally it wouldn't be a locking connector like XLR. The cable I linked to does this.

This connector might need a lot of pins.

--camera side would have mini XLRs, the mixer side would have full-sized XLRs.

--I'm not sure about the XLR return feed. See #2

2- Where I think the big question mark is in monitoring ALL four channels. The Red camera has an XLR out and a minijack/headphone out. Can they output each of Red's channels? Or do they mirror each other?

The latter option might suck. And since you only have 2 channels of return, you might design the cable differently (e.g. have the minijack/headphone return feed share pins with the XLR; or not).

If you can monitor each of Red's 4 input channels by themselves, then you might want a switch on the mixer side of the cable that lets you flip between channels 1/2 and 3/4.

2b- I believe the XLR out is a stereo XLR out... 5 pins.

2c- I don't really get the XLR out. If you wanted really high quality you'd likely record double system sound.