Red Cine competitor via cineform?

[Mike Harrington]

Looks like we may just have to convert to cineform raw...

anyone else notice this? Iwonder when we will see it

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/350/firstlighthr1.jpg

[David Taylor]

Actually First Light is an app we've intended for a while. It will (hopefully) show up late this year or early next. It will operate in a manner similar to the SetActiveMetadata app we currently provide for MacOS but with many more features for control and manipulation of Active Metadata - WB, 3D LUTs, and others.

I'll state upfront that First Light is not intended as a competitor to RedCine which has important features associated with it for developing R3D files.

As quick background, each CineForm file has a GUID (Globally Unique Identifier) created with the file. When any NLE, compositing app, or even WM or QT Players requests the CineForm decoder present a frame from a file, the CineForm decoder interrogates the Cineform Color Database (which is external to any app) using the GUID of the file being requested. The Color Database responds with current Active Metadata information for the requested GUID, including global controls about whether the user has turned ON or OFF the playback of Active Metadata. The Active Metadata is applied to the output of the decoder based on rules established by the user. In this manner Active Metadata operates similar to a Adjustment Layer in Photoshop. It is never flattened into the file unless the file is rendered. (Even then you have control about whether to render Active Metadata into the file or not).

You can begin to imagine many interesting ways to use Active Metadata to further enhance color workflows, including for distributed workgroups. We'll keep some of the details to ourselves until we release, but I thought I'd share a taste of some of the ideas with you.

[Mike Harrington]

sounds good to me....

being able to adjust the look non-destructively within any app is the pinnacle of working with RAW

as for not being a competiter to Red Cine..... it depends

if i were to have a choice of a reasonably good first light app(RedCine) that would output a look to Raw, but flatten it vs an app that would allow me to change that look during the editing process, without going back for some kind of conform....I would definately build the latter.

The versioning is nice, but if were dealing with a totally online workflow....I would rather version in my editor then go back to the source for a conform.

I hope you guys get access to red raw soon....until we see a cineform raw workflow from r3d this is all speculative

[Mike Harrington]

just to get my request in while I can....

definately give it a nice UI, with video feedback either in a seperate moniter or through Premiere...

curves ect would be nice...
i am already a customer, but for those coming from a red standpoint....this would sure add value to your product.

[David Taylor]

We're thinking similarly....

[Mike Zinner]

David(s),

do you think PP CS4 will allow to better access a clip's metadata settings? At the moment one has to launch the Cineform Global Controls panel to adjust the metadata. And while it is possible to jump to all clips on the timeline with the [<] and [>] buttons it is not the best workflow I can think of.

What would be the most straight forward workflow is to create a new CineForm effect (just like the CineForm realtime effects) that you drag onto a clip which then gives you access to all metadata parameters (and hopefully curves) of that particular clip - right within the normal PP/AE Effects panels. The fact that this effect does not affect the actual data but only adjusts the metadata would be quite irrelevant, because the actual output would look the same to the end user.

So I guess my question is, will CineForm FirstLight stay a standalone app accessing the clips with its own interface, or do you see a way to make it work as a "regular" effect that works in PP, AE, ...

Thanks,
Mike

[David Newman]

Mike,

We would love to do what you suggest, unfortunately Adobe never planned for this workflow, it is pretty new to concept of modify the way the image is developed before the filter chain. Not that we haven't made Premiere do a lot more than it was intended already, we will continue to push its limits.

[Mike Harrington]

push away....:construction: