Fog and Sillhouettes. Please help

[Martin Gustafsson]

I have been asked to film a music video for some friends. The inspiration/reference for the look they want is the DVD-cover of John carpenters The Fog (http://www.horrordvds.com/reviews/a-m/fog-se/fog-se_fl.jpg) and Metallicas Unforgiven video (the band performance parts) (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5cGvzApDZKI) .

Sillhouettes: lots of smoke and backlight in other words.

I'm guessing I'll mostly have 1-3 people in frame at once. It would be nice to squeeze them all in (6 people) at some point if it's possible but limited lighting resources will probably make that difficult.

We don’t have much of a budget, most of the equipment will be borrowed from friends.

We are filming with a RedOne using Nikon lenses in a room that’s about 15 * 15 meters all in all. Aiming for a f-stop somewhere between 2,0 – 5,6 I guess. Not sure if we will have any ND-filters for the camera.

We’ll be wanting a contrasty end result but with some flexibility for color- and contrasttweaking in post so I don’t want it to be too under/overexposed in the camera to begin with.

Can anyone help me out and tell me what lights and smokemachine I’ll need?

I can borrow 2-3 redheads, 2 kinos and a small lenslight from a friend for free so I’ll do that but I think I might have to rent a bigger lenslight for a stronger backlight/silhouette-effect? Any suggestions?

What smokemachine will I be needing to fill a room that big? (15*15 meters). They are not looking for a haze effect, they want thick fog.

Has any one of you filmed something like this? Can anyone point me to some similar reference videos.

Please help me out. Give me some suggestions.

[el_duderino]

I'm not seeing a whole lot of fog in the Metallica video, looks like an out of focus, mottled canvas photographic backdrop. Just throw most of the light onto the background and let the foreground performers remain the mostly in the dark. Add a bit of fill or side lighting on the band to taste.

It also looks like they're using a shift/tilt lens. If you're using a nikon mount, try getting a hold of a LENSBABY, similar selective focus tricks can be archived. You'll want some practice using the lensbaby before the shoot though.

Best of luck, post some stills/footage when you're done.

[Charles Angus]

A big 20amp hazer will make a lot of smoke.

Also, dry ice smokers are great for billows of ground-hugging fog.

With that package, I would rimlight with the redheads, probably rigged down from the ceiling.

Use the kinos to light up the cool background you will need to have - I would want it about 1-2 stops under, as the fog will lower the contrast and make it brighter. The fog needs to be brighter than what can be behind it.

The backlights will flare nicely when you get theme in the frame, and make the fog nicely visible. The background lights will give you your silhouette effect.

[Martin Gustafsson]

Thanks for the reply!

You sure gave me something to think about. After reading your post I re-watched the video and it didn´t look like I remembered it. Not as smoke filled as my recollection.

There is smoke in the solo part ( 3:20 - 4:35min ), and some smoke in the story-part but not as much in the rest of the video. I think I might have seen things that aren’t there in the low-res YouTube-video, haven’t seen a decent video quality version of the video in years. The canvas in the background looks like fog, but there doesn’t seem to be any motion so it´s probably a photo as you pointed out. And the softness from the tilt lens adds to the illusion. I would like to see the video in HD-quality and have a closer look.

Another thing that made me feel the video was filled with fog is probably getting it mixed up with the video for The Unforgiven II in my head ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1mgEQTMVB8 ). That video has also been named as a reference, particularly the smoke filled low angels of the solo-part ( 3:52 - 4:30).

Have any ideas about how to get something similar to those time specified shots in the two videos? Some sort of strong spot for the backlight and then a fill to prevent it all from blowing out?

I´m not sure what sort of light or how strong a light I am looking for but I guess it should be some sort of lenslamp to minimize the spill since that probably will be very visible in the fog.

I´m not sure about what sort of smoke-/fog machine I´m looking for? Will a simple machine made for live concerts look good or should I be searching for something different?

[Charles Angus]

Don't fill if you want silhouettes!

A silhouette by definition is something *unlit* against a lit background...

Fog is only visible if it is backlit to be brighter than what is behind it.

Use an appropriately sized fogger, a small Radioshack unit is good for a very small area, bigger units for commensurately bigger areas. Or get a whole whack of small ones.

[Martin Gustafsson]

Thanks for the feedback AngusChandler!

I understand that the sillhouett effect will be dimished or lost if I use a strong fill light. But would it be wrong to use a little fill to keep control of the contrast to the backlight if I find that necessary? I was thinking that I can always tweak the curves in post to get total darkness - but if it's totally dark to begin with I won't have any room for adjustments? The same goes for the bright parts if they are blown out. Am I thinking wrong? Would a fill light just end up like a bad compromise?

I don't have much experience with foggers. If I e.g. where to use a fill from the same angel as the camera - would that just end up making the fog look like a white wall in front of the performers? Should I rather concentrate on not having a too strong backlight/separation light (excuse me if my english terminology is a bit rusty) if I'm worried about the overall contrast in the picture?

[Christian Tanner]

But would it be wrong to use a little fill to keep control of the contrast to the backlight if I find that necessary?

the use of haze lowers your contrast quite a bit already. i understand that you're going to use smoke instead of haze - but i recon after a couple of shots some of that smoke will distribute evenly over your 15x15m set.

keep that in mind - i was quite surprised about that fact when i first shot with haze as a student...

what might also be of interest to you is:

that a light source obviously becomes quite apparent with smoke. (especially the inverse square law of light sources - its fall off). in your case that might even be working for you - but i think even in a "surreal" setting like your music vid seems to be, light sources becoming too apparent are usually undesirable. unless they're in shot.
the solution is - as usual - to use a bigger lamp and put it further away.

tanner

[Martin Gustafsson]

Hi again!

The video is finished and if you are interested you can have a look at it here: http://www.vimeo.com/2398873

The streamed version has a few quirks (strobe looks strange) that I'll try to fix in a few days. Guessing it has to do with vimeos 24fps conversion of my original 25fps footage or something but I'm not sure!? If you are a member and want to you can download a better 25fps 720p version from the same page.



The look and concept of the video evolved a bit after I talked to you guys but the basic premise of lots of smoke and backlights is still there.

I wanted a dirty silhouette look so I crushed the shadows, blew out the highlights and added grain and scan lines. The end result isn’t really RED-reference material but we went for something a bit grittier.

My first ever music video. My first ever solo project. I learned a lot and the end result turned out ok but there’s lots of room for improvement. Next time I hope I’ll do a lot of things different from the first time. The next one should be better! As always ;-)

Feedback on the video is appreciated!


Thanks for all the help!!

[Brandon Fraley]

Hi again!

The video is finished and if you are interested you can have a look at it here: http://www.vimeo.com/2398873

The streamed version has a few quirks (strobe looks strange) that I'll try to fix in a few days. Guessing it has to do with vimeos 24fps conversion of my original 25fps footage or something but I'm not sure!? If you are a member and want to you can download a better 25fps 720p version from the same page.



The look and concept of the video evolved a bit after I talked to you guys but the basic premise of lots of smoke and backlights is still there.

I wanted a dirty silhouette look so I crushed the shadows, blew out the highlights and added grain and scan lines. The end result isn’t really RED-reference material but we went for something a bit grittier.

My first ever music video. My first ever solo project. I learned a lot and the end result turned out ok but there’s lots of room for improvement. Next time I hope I’ll do a lot of things different from the first time. The next one should be better! As always ;-)

Feedback on the video is appreciated!


Thanks for all the help!!

just watched it. dude, I think it looks really awesome. The scan lines never would have occurred to me, but they look great (don't be surprised if you see that someday in one of my videos).

Were the strobes done on set or in post, since the RED ONE's rolling shutter definitely doesn't like strobes (at least in my experience)?

The only thing I don't like are the wide shots of the vocalist. The composition looks fine, but there's something about him just standing there that's decidedly un-cinematic. In the end not a big deal, just bugged me.

Other than that, I really liked it, great work. Did you use any plug ins for your effects?

[David Morgan]

Nice work...especially for a first time out on your own. I'm impressed. I liked you willingness to go black in the detail, just letting the silhouette show.

The only thing I didn't like was in the beginning there were a lot of shots repeated in the same order, and I'm not a fan of the repetition. I was very happy as you got longer into the video you mixed up your shots more.

The best thing I can say for the video is it makes me want to listen to their music, so excellent work!

I hope your friends know what a great deal they got from you for this.