Canon TX1: what RED MINI should be (except pro instead of consumer)

[Eugene]

http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/powershot/tx1/images/f01_main.jpg
http://www.dphotojournal.com/canon-powershot-tx1-review-sample-photos/
720p @ 30 fps for only $500, and it fits in a pocket. It has a 10x lens w/ OIS and auto focus. It has a 7 MP chip and can record 13 min. of HD video on a 4GB SD card.
I am getting one in May, as soon as they come out.
Sure it is only consumer grade. That is where RED and Jim come in. As soon as RED One ships out the door, Jim needs to get busy designing a pro RED MINI that is everything the TX1 is, but designed for a pro.
Make the RED MINI with a P2 card, don't compress the hell out of the data, have lots of manual control, have a bigger battery, better mic, video light hot shoe, and a bigger 16:9 LCD. The most important thing is to have Graeme make the colors accurate, unlike the super saturated colors coming out of Canon consumer products.

[Álex Montoya]

Have you seen the footage this camera takes? Is absolutely hideous.

[Joshua Murray]

Who wants a camera that small? What the heck would be the point?

[Jeremy Hughes]

There's hardly any compression on the PowerShot TX1. Bad codec. The quality is terrible. No manual control except for white balance, not even exposure compensation.

http://dcresource.com/reviews/canon/powershot_tx1-review/index.shtml Jeff Keller took some video and he said his 12 second clip was over 51MBs. http://dcresource.com/reviews/canon/powershot_tx1-review/MVI_0013.AVI
Here it is.

I suspect the PowerShot TX2 will be much better. What Canon does when they go into a new market is release a bad (or just not that impressive) camera with some or a lot of flaws, look at the reaction, hear what people want, then make an incredibly better one. Example HV10>HV20, the HV10 wasn't that bad though, but huge jump. They know what people want with the next one. I suspect it'll happen when Canon finally releases an AVCHD camera too.

The RED MINI will be way better. Beyond imaginable. But I guess the TX1 will be good for the price. If you're not doing anything big or using the video all the time.

[Emery Wells]

That certainly is quite a bit smaller than what I imagined the RED 'pocket cam' to be.

Ted's mantra was 'its not plastic, it is professional.'

To me, professional means interchangeable lenses. The second you stick almost any zoom on this so called 'pocket cam,' it will immediately lose its 'pocketableness.' Of course, im not implying you can't build a professional quality camera with a fixed lens... you most certainly could though I suppose it depends on your definition of professional.

I would imagine this 'pocket cam' will not literally fit in your pocket. Rather it will be a very compact RED cam that is highly portable and very light.

[PaulClements]

Ted did say the miniRed would fit in your pocket though, so I don't suppose it'll be much bigger. The question about the miniRed is whether it will use pl and other mounts similar to redone. In which case it might not fit in the pocket so well once it's kitted out!

I think the SI 2K Mini is the nearest thing to what we might expect:

http://www.siliconimaging.com/DigitalCinema/Images/SI-2Kmini_productpage.jpg

[Petr Dvorak]

Yes this "SI2K Mini" style is what I exactly expect from miniRED - I think RED can create more progressive distingtive design here and sell it like jewellery for cinematographer :biggrin:

[Eugene]

http://direct.tesco.com/pi/Enlarge/2/100-4232F.jpg
All we know is that it is not going to be made of plastic or be a toy. That rules out a Bratz RED TWO camcorder. We also know it will be pro and not prosumer, and that it will fit inside a pocket of unmentioned dimensions.

[Eugene]

We don't know how much it will cost, if it will record to SD or hard drive, if it will have interchangable lenses, how much it will weigh, if it will be 4K, if it will have a zoom, or if it will even have auto focus.
I am guessing it will be called RED TWO, but it could be called RED ZERO. We don't even know this for sure.
If I had Jim's money and was Steve Jobs' buddy, I woud want to take the iPhone and stick a better lens on it, stick a better CMOS chip in it, and slap a bigger hard drive on the side of it. Then I would load a scaled down version of Final Cut Pro onto it. Then it would be the coolest camcorder ever. But we don't know how good of buddys Steve and Jim are. Or RED could just take some cheapy brand camcorder, paint it red, and charge $300 more than the cheapy brand does, just because RED put its logo on it.
http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000CR7B1C.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V58517763_.jpg

[Jason Francois]

If I had Jim's money and was Steve Jobs' buddy, I woud take the iPhone and stick a better lens on it, stick a better CMOS chip in it, and slap a bigger hard drive on the side of it. Then I would load a scaled down version of Final Cut Pro onto it. Then it would be the coolest camcorder ever. But that is just what I would do. Or you could just take some cheapy brand camcorder, paint it red, and charge $300 more than the cheapy brand does, just because you put your logo on it.
http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000CR7B1C.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V58517763_.jpg

Good thing you're not Steve or Jim, then. :)

[Ace]

You do realise that the S2K mini is the sensor only. Capturing light is the easy part. Storing and processing it so that you can use it is not. For red, your paying 17500$ for what is essentially a supercomputer with a sensor attached. Fitting that in a tiny package will be LUNACY!

http://kyoproject.com/smile3.png http://kyoproject.com/smileycarbon.pngLooking forward to it.

[Mark K.]

Lunacy?...... THIS IS RED!!!!!

[Álex Montoya]

What are the specs differences between the SI-2K and the SI-2K MINI?

[Stephen Gentle]

You do realise that the S2K mini is the sensor only. Capturing light is the easy part. Storing and processing it so that you can use it is not. For red, your paying 17500$ for what is essentially a supercomputer with a sensor attached. Fitting that in a tiny package will be LUNACY!

http://kyoproject.com/smile3.png http://kyoproject.com/smileycarbon.pngLooking forward to it.

I agree. It's impossible!


But seriously, I can't wait for some more details. Hopefully we'll have them before IBC...

[Eugene]

For red, your paying 17500$ for what is essentially a supercomputer with a sensor attached. Fitting that in a tiny package will be LUNACY!
I don't know much about PDAs but the iPhone seems like a super PDA. Does it have supercomputer power, enough for a RED camera? I don't know. The iPhone is small and can run some form of OSX. There are open source PDA/phones that run Linux that are opensource.
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/IPhone compares the iPhone to the Neo1973.
I don't think a Neo1973 is a supercomputer, or is what RED should use for its computing power.
It seems to me that if anybody could build a pocket sized supercomputer for a pro camera, Apple would be the best to do it. But would Apple? Why help Jim? I hope Steve Jobs helps RED, for Jim's sake. It would be awkward for Jim to have to go to Sony and ask them to build a PDA sized supercomputer for RED, with all the bad mouthing of Sony that has taken place.

It isn't going to be easy to design the RED TWO. It would be easy to call Canon and have them rebadge a version of the TX1 for RED. To REDify it, they could change the green glowing power button to a red button and relocate it to the front of the camera. RED could bundle some Mac friendly software like Quicktime Pro with it to justify a higher price tag.
Nagh, we like LUNACY. I want RED TWO to be built around a tiny Apple supercomputer. There is probably no way Steve Jobs is going to liscense OS-X to another company, let alone sell them hardware, but we can dream.


Good thing you're not Steve or Jim, then.
Good thing for us all. :)

Here is what an 18x lens looks like. If RED is going to ever use a 20xish lens, it should be on the RED THREE. 18x is too big for a pocket cam, but is great for a "compact." But RED users might turn their noses up at a noninterchangable lens on a RED camera.
http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/images/prod_assets/top_product_heads/1289_header.jpg

[roxics]

I just hope for three things.

It's about the price of the Canon XH-A1
Has interchangeable lenses (a nice open lens mount like a c-mount)
Is high definition (720p or 1080p if it must)

Beyond that I wouldn't hold out hope for a 4K with a PL mount that fits in your pocket.

Red one does a darn good job on the high end, how about a RED for us mortals?

[Dave Cooper]

Have you seen the footage this camera takes? Is absolutely hideous.

The sample video in the link isn't really hideous. Pretty good actually for a still camera.


Who wants a camera that small? What the heck would be the point?

Ok so the HD-RH1 should be pulled off the market and anyone who uses it obviously doesn't know what they're doing? Smaller the better, there are a ton of uses and a very high demand for a HD camera that is small and gives off great quality.


Beyond that I wouldn't hold out hope for a 4K with a PL mount that fits in your pocket.

The HD-RH1 is 16k, small and maxes out at 1080p. Red maxes out at 4k+ for that price. It'd be great if RED can do the same or more for less.

[Eugene]

http://www.etherlab.com/jvc/centuryoptics/MC100_Century_grip.jpg

A big interchangeable lens on a pocket camera is going to be different for sure. It might look something like the pic above.