Red Won't Honor Warranty - Need Advice?

[michael zaletel]

Hi:

In the middle of a shoot, my Red One was writing to the Red Drive just fine one moment and then refused to mount the drive the next moment. Tried another drive, another cable, reinstalled firmware and called support and followed their troubleshooting instructions but the problem remained. Red then gave me an RMA number to send the camera in for warranty repair.

One of the main reasons we all bought these cameras was because of the great 1-year warranty. But how many of us have really had to send our camera in for warranty repair? A warranty (just like any other insurance) is only worthwhile if the issuer will actually stand behind it.

Then yesterday, I received the following email:

I got your camera in the other day and brought it directly to the techs for evaluation. After a very close evaluation, we were able to determine the problem of your camera. We narrowed it first down to the board, and when we were able to evaluate that board by itself, we noticed a burnt component. After carefully studying the board in conjunction with the component involved, we have determined that this will fall outside the scope of your warranty.

At this time we have stopped all repairs waiting for your permission to continue, with you understanding that you will be responsible for parts and labor. The quote for the repairs that I have at this time is $1300 plus shipping and handling. Please let me know if you will be covering these costs, or if you would like me to return the camera to you as is. I am very sorry for this inconvenience, and wish I had better news for you. Please let me know if you have any questions.

To which I responded as follows:

I don't understand? Are you suggesting that I damaged the board somehow? That doesn't make any sense? One minute the Red Drive was mounting fine and next minute it wasn't? Why wouldn't this be covered by warranty? Please explain...

Red Support then responded as follows:

It is not that you went in the camera and damaged the board, it is what happened through the eSata port. The protection component of the board was damaged indicating that there was tampering through the eSata port. Please let me know if you need any more information.

I then responded to that email as follows:

I appreciate the reply but I still don't understand. Can you explain what you mean by "tampering"? The only thing that can plug into the eSata port is the Red Drive cable. None of the pins were bent and there wasn't any type of burn, forced entry or anything like that? When you say "tampered", it makes it sound like you think this was "caused" and not just a malfunction? Please be more specific.

Then Red Support responded to my request for specifics as follows:

What seemed to happen with the camera was that two of the pins on the eSata port somehow got thrown way to much power to them when they should not have. The damage that was caused showed that this happened, and as this cannot happen with the drive itself (it cannot draw that kind of power), there is something that would not be covered under warranty going on. Please let me know if you need any more information.

So here is my question for the RED community. Should I just keep bugging them for a plausible and logical explanation for how something like this could have happened? Someone once told me that the Red doesn't have a fuse protecting the body like other cameras out there. Could this be the reason? We did not "tamper" with our camera in the middle of a shoot, why on earth would we? It's almost like they are suggesting we took a couple of bare wires, touched them to a couple of pins on the eSata port and stuck the other end in a nearby electrical socket. Incredible! But they are not even explaining how this could have happened.

The logical explanation is that the board went bad due to some internal electrical problem or some other manufacturing defect. This should, without question, be covered under warranty.

I feel that Red should either fix this problem free-of-charge asap or provide a logical explanation for how we could have possibly caused this damage ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I love Red and have been extremely satisfied with their support in the past but something doesn't seem right about this and I don't want something similar to happen to other Red owners in the future. The downtime alone is quite costly.

-shooter

[Steve Gal]

Did you plug the drive into the camera with the Drives power supply plugged in to AC power?

[Shawn Booth]

Is it possible someone tried plugging the drive cable somewhere else?

Regardless, warranty should be taking care of this. I know RED already takes care of us beyond expectation and they provide crazy upgrades and support for free... But the warranty, which is short lived, should cover the body fully for the life of the warranty - provided it is not determined that the user really toasted it/dropped it/etc....:bye2:

[Sarah C.]

This is disappointing to hear (Red's response).

~S

[Jarred Land]

Shooter.. First its not cool to post private internal communication on websites.. that's not going to help your cause much.

Second in terms of you questioning our warranty practices... I think if you ask anyone we more than live up to our obligations, we actually go 3 steps further.

Our tech's are trained to find problems, and find out if they were caused internally, or externally. If the camera or drive caused the issue, we repair it, no charge, under warranty, no questions asked. 99% of the repair work we do we do at RED we do under warranty, and sometimes we fix things that we shouldn't.

If something exterior caused the malfunction, and it's not subjective, it is not covered under warranty.

[Julio Quintana]

Although I am usually a firm defender of Red's customer care, it does sound like they owe you an explanation.

[Jarred Land]

Power Lemo was plugged into Drive port... Thats the explanation.

It happens, Hell, I came close to doing it myself once. They are the same size of Lemo so its not that uncommon.

[Brent@RED]

shooter, note at the bottom of the email chain between you and RED where the footer says: "This e-mail is the property of RED Digital Cinema Camera Company. It is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure. Distribution or copying of this e-mail, or the information contained herein, to anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited."

If you want to discuss your particular situation, please call me (Brent) at 949.206.7900.

Thanks,
BC

[Stephen Williams]

Power Lemo was plugged into Drive port... Thats the explanation.

It happens, Hell, I came close to doing it myself once. They are the same size of Lemo so its not that uncommon.

Hi Jarred,

A protection circuit would be a good idea IMHO.

Stephen

[Justin O'Neill]

Just for the record, the couple times I have had to send a RED in to be fixed, the techs determined the problem was covered under warranty and I got the camera back within two days. In the instance where this happened during a shoot, RED provided a body while mine was being fixed. It seems to me if they determine the problem is covered under warranty they go the extra step and make the process smoother then any other company I have dealt with.