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View Full Version : R3D metadata & 3dTracking... A suggestion



Vincent Thomas
11-16-2008, 04:43 AM
I was wondering if Red want to go to the next step with EPIC if they don't have to work on a solution to make 3D tracking possible with rolling shutter. I know in some case where mouvement isn't so important it could, but we have to face to reality that it's an important issue. Post-production FX are part of the pipe today especially in what the Epic is aiming at...
While not being a technician myself, there's something i was wondering. Will it possible that the sensor write all the needed data in the R3d file so that company making 3d software light Syntheyes, Matchmover or Boujou could develop algorithm to help as much as possible the tracking of skewed shoot?
Does it make sence? Possible?

Jim, what do you think the Red team think?


vincent*

Vigen Vartanov
11-16-2008, 05:29 AM
I am not good in traking , but what kind of metadate r3D must care for traking ? Distance ? DOF ?

Vincent Thomas
11-16-2008, 06:59 AM
I'm not a specialist on the subject, it could be quite delicate and it's a full time job actually

Obviously, you first need the focal lenght of the shoot, the film back of the camera and sometimes to need as well to measure the lens deformation by placing grids in front of the camera and shooting that for reference...

Now, this is the simple case. If the R3d file could also provide other informations to late know how much skew the camera is performing at every image, kind of deformed grid measuring the displacement of every pixels in that moment it will certainly help the developer of tracking software to code something specific to solve that issue? Maybe eventually smooth the motion?

Now maybe, all needed informations could be recorder by the camera and so make that hope impossible? I guess, it will be great to see Red and other concerned CMOS to open a discussion with post production software developers to study the question?

No?

vincent*

ericyoung
11-16-2008, 08:32 AM
... If the R3d file could also provide other informations to late know how much skew the camera is performing at every image, kind of deformed grid measuring the displacement of every pixels in that moment it will certainly help the developer of tracking software to code something specific to solve that issue? Maybe eventually smooth the motion?
...vincent*

This would be very tricky - it'd probably involve having to build at least two accelerometers into the body for pan/tilt speed and acceleration measurement!

Skew also has effects on objects moving across screen even with the camera stationary, and moving objects further away will have apparently less skew than objects in the foreground just because of apparent speed across the frame!

Personally I'm more concerned about not being able to shoot with short duration strobes at the moment.

Vincent Thomas
11-16-2008, 10:30 AM
Both are serious concerns. Blockbusters will be the first to be interested to be able to use such a large format format, i could see producer in hollywood exited and want to build movies around a trully epic experience... Now at the moment, post production on such movie in 2k require between 6 months to 18months of work by possibly hundred of people... And i know what i'm speaking about :)

On a personnal artistic point of view, i could live without. But i was just wondering that if this issue isn't taken more in consideration well maybe the Red and Epic can not all doors opened?

If i shoot at 3 or 4 times slower than adjust the speed back in post will i have a chance to both give the same feeling, avoid skew as much as possible and track my plate?
Just a question, maybe silly...?

v*

Steve Freebairn
11-17-2008, 07:12 AM
Jim has already stated that the skew in mysterium x and monstro will be less than what it currently is in the RED One. If you take all the skew away, it makes images that feel sterile, since even film has some skew and movement to it.