Possibility of a Canon or Nikon mount B4 adapter

[TimothyD]

I don't know if it is even possible to do this, but I am just wondering if there is any chance that the B4 adapter could be offered in Nikon or Canon mounts?

The reason I ask is that I will be almost exclusively using a 2/3" HD lens, but would really love to be able to just quickly put on a Canon or Nikon lens for shooting scenics and stuff. I have to imagine that re-collimating a lens will be quite difficult based on what I've read about it so far, and so I think this could be a cool option.

Like I said, I don't know if it is possible, but if it is, here is my vote that it would be a great idea and would add to the flexibility of the camera.

Tim

[CVB]

I thought they were already offering those... http://www.red.com/store/show_by_tags/OPTICAL+ADAPTORS

[TimothyD]

Thanks Curt,

Actually, I did know about the adaptors they were offering. What I was thinking would be cool is if they offered a B4 to FD or F adaptor, that way I don't have to change lens mounts to use still glass.

I don't think that I will be getting any PL mount lenses, so I was hoping to be able to just have a FD or F mount and then pop the B4 adaptor right onto that.

Thanks,

Tim

[Matthew Rogers]

I don't know if it is even possible to do this, but I am just wondering if there is any chance that the B4 adapter could be offered in Nikon or Canon mounts?

The reason I ask is that I will be almost exclusively using a 2/3" HD lens, but would really love to be able to just quickly put on a Canon or Nikon lens for shooting scenics and stuff. I have to imagine that re-collimating a lens will be quite difficult based on what I've read about it so far, and so I think this could be a cool option.

Like I said, I don't know if it is possible, but if it is, here is my vote that it would be a great idea and would add to the flexibility of the camera.

Tim

I don't think it will be possible because SLR lenses are designed for a single chip system I believe, and Servo ENG lenses are designed for a 3 CCD system. I'm afraid you are going to have to somewhat stick with either cinema lenses or ENG lenses.

Am I wrong here?

Matthew

[TimothyD]

I don't think it will be possible because SLR lenses are designed for a single chip system I believe, and Servo ENG lenses are designed for a 3 CCD system. I'm afraid you are going to have to somewhat stick with either cinema lenses or ENG lenses.

Am I wrong here?

Matthew


Hi Matthew,

Actually the B4 adaptor that Red is making deals with the 3 chip issue, as does the Abakus adaptor. What I am asking for, is that instead of that adapter only being offered in a PL mount, that they also offer an FD or F mount option. I have no idea if this is technically feasible, but if it is, I'd scoop one up in a second.

Cheers,

Tim

[Michael Schrengohst]

As I understand it - Each mount is set-in a metal plate -
and that attaches to the camera?

Why the B-4 mount is $3500 and the Nikon and Canon $500
I don't know. But having the ability to mount still
lenses (I already have 6 Nikkors lenses) with a $500 adapter
is very attractive. The fun part will be switching the adapters
from Nikon/Canon to PL.....

[TimothyD]

As I understand it - Each mount is set-in a metal plate -
and that attaches to the camera?

Why the B-4 mount is $3500 and the Nikon and Canon $500
I don't know. But having the ability to mount still
lenses (I already have 6 Nikkors lenses) with a $500 adapter
is very attractive. The fun part will be switching the adapters
from Nikon/Canon to PL.....

Hi Redguy,

The B4 adapter has lenses in it that correct for the 3 chip systems that 2/3" lenses are meant to work with. I just wish someone would rework a 2/3" lens to avoid the need for an adapter (aside from a metal plate as with the Canon and Nikon mounts)

[Brook Willard]

Ahh... the ol' adapter on the adapter route...

[Michael Schrengohst]

If you use 2/3" lenses with the B4 mount I understand that you can only shoot upto 2K because of the lens coverage?
And you lose the auto ability of any 2/3" lens anyway?
I know many shooters already own 2/3" HD lenses but it
would seem to me a better idea to take the $3500 and buy
a used Cine Lens??

[TimothyD]

Hi Redguy,

I don't need 4k, I'd like it, but I don't need it. I do want to occasionally use 4k for scenics, in which case I would use our extensive collection of Canon glass.

The main reason I'm going with a 2/3" HD lens is the zoom control. I don't use any other powered features, but I like a powered zoom.

Having said that, I'm still considering a S16 lens and the Red Motor and Supergrip route. That doesn't change the fact that I would need to collimate the lens mount when switching back and forth between a still adapter and the PL mount though...

[Jeff Kilgroe]

I don't think it will be possible because SLR lenses are designed for a single chip system I believe, and Servo ENG lenses are designed for a 3 CCD system. I'm afraid you are going to have to somewhat stick with either cinema lenses or ENG lenses.

You're right, but the Birger B4 adapter has optics installed to compensate for this... Hence the $3500 price tag.

What he was asking if there were any plans to have that B4 adapter available with a Canon FD or Nikon F mount rather than PL mount base (which the current adapter has). Seems like a reasonable request, but I would wonder just how many people would actually use such an adapter.

[TimothyD]

You're right, but the Birger B4 adapter has optics installed to compensate for this... Hence the $3500 price tag.

What he was asking if there were any plans to have that B4 adapter available with a Canon FD or Nikon F mount rather than PL mount base (which the current adapter has). Seems like a reasonable request, but I would wonder just how many people would actually use such an adapter.

I'll be the first to say, maybe it wouldn't be a whole lot of people who would have use for that type of adapter. On the other hand, I'll bet there are a lot of other ENG/EFP people who would love the flexibility of shooting both 4k and 2k, without swapping lens mounts, and without losing the powered zoom they are used to. So I bet that if it can be done, it would be popular enough to sell enough to make it worthwhile to Red. Wouldn't it just be a plate that screws on in place of the PL mount?

If Red or someone doesn't make one, I guess I won't be shooting any 4k. Unless of course I find out collimation is easy enough for me to handle. I have no idea how difficult it is, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it might be a pain;)

Anyway, it just dawned on me today that this could make shooting with still and 2/3" glass very simple.

Tim

[Erik Widding]

You're right, but the Birger B4 adapter has optics installed to compensate for this... Hence the $3500 price tag.

The B4 adapter isn't from us.

At the risk of asking a stupid question... Wouldn't you just need a piece of glass the same thickness as the prism to make up for the difference in magnification across the color spectrum?

This would not change the magnification of the lens, which may or may not be bad. Should not lose any appreciable amount of light. Or am I missing something here?

The something I would be missing, is that the individual colors may travel through different distances of glass in the prism that is in a standard B4 mount. And as such it would be a second order correction. I have never looked at the B4 specification, as I have never had a reason to use these lenses.

[Matthew Rogers]

You're right, but the Birger B4 adapter has optics installed to compensate for this... Hence the $3500 price tag.

What he was asking if there were any plans to have that B4 adapter available with a Canon FD or Nikon F mount rather than PL mount base (which the current adapter has). Seems like a reasonable request, but I would wonder just how many people would actually use such an adapter.

I see now. I was thinking about a nikon mount at the END of the B4 adapter, not at the Red cam end. Makes sense. However, why would you want to put a SLR lens on if you've got nice HD glass?

Matthew

[TimothyD]

Hi Matthew,

The reason to use still glass is that it gives you the 35mm depth of field, but without the price tag of a 35mm cinema lens. From what I've read S16 and 2/3" lenses will have a similar depth of field (or the same, can't remember). More importantly in my case I want to be able to shoot 4k sometimes.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The B4 adapter isn't from us.

Whooops.... My bad. I thought it was. Now who is it that's supplying it?

[Andrew Benz]

Whooops.... My bad. I thought it was. Now who is it that's supplying it?

Hi Jeff,

Abakus is the maker, though the design has been tweaked by the RED team to perform better w/ the redone.

http://www.zgc.com/zgc.nsf/product/C1044112A001BD4985256EC9005F5789

Here is another link for their 2/3 to 35mmhttp://www.zgc.com/zgc.nsf/product/6C01482B13C4ABBF85256FA9005CF84F

The other Andrew-- or as I like to refer to him--"The smart one" has posted alot of good info on the 2/3 to s16mm converter in the lens and efp sections. Red has also fleeting mused about the second converter and whether or not they may also go in that direction as well. Myself, due to the great design and integration of the supergrip/red motor/viewfactor solutions, I am looking at various pl mount s16mm zooms for doc and sports like the Canon Super 16 Cine Zoom Lens 10.6 to 180mm as prescribed by Stuart English... but I have many questions and need to test it w/ the red before I buy http://www.zgc.com/zgc.nsf/c7a682995edb4e7585256b4d001ebd57/3e992155ec7dd29b85256ffc0069fc0a?OpenDocument

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Abakus is the maker, though the design has been tweaked by the RED team to perform better w/ the redone.

Ah, that's ringing a bell... I'm sure I did read that here before.

[Andrew Benz]

OT- BTW-- Jeff thanks for the great info in the flash thread.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

OT- BTW-- Jeff thanks for the great info in the flash thread.

No problem. I'm glad people found it helpful. :)

[TimothyD]

Can anyone from the Red team comment on my request? I'd really like to know if this is possible. If it is, I'd gladly pay whatever it cost to get one. If I don't find a solution like this, it seems that I will not be shooting any 4k at all.

Even if it was only an hour long procedure to change out lens mounts, I would still go for a workflow that allowed me to just quickly swap my 2/3" lens and a still lens. I can't tell you how useful that would be to me. Crossing my fingers here...

Thanks,

Tim

[tj williams]

Timothy the B4 adapter only covers the windowed S16 sensor area If you could put Nikons etc. on the end of it then:

A. You would create a tele effect in each lens. since the field area is smaller.
If you turn the camera to full sensor then you will create a vignette.

B. Since the light would pass thru the nikon then the B4 would correct it as if it was a lens intended for a prism camera this would create optical problems.

This is asking the kitchen faucet to feed the fire hydrant...

[donatello b]

"wish someone would rework a 2/3" lens to avoid the need for an adapter"

the S16 lens that canon makes are 2/3" lenses with backend of the lens reworked for single film plane type camera's ....

so are you asking that a single adapter for B4 - correct the rays of light for focus for 2/3 HD/SD lenses and the same adaptor then accept 35mm still lens ? ( if yes) doesn't seem possible ...

[TimothyD]

Hi TJ,

Actually, what I'm asking for is that the B4 adapter is offered in a Nikon or Canon mount (Canon in my case because we have a lot of Canon glass)

That way, I have the Canon mount on the camera, and I could connect the B4 adapter directly to the Canon mount, rather than changing to and from the Canon and PL mounts.

You see what I mean? On the end of the B4 adapter is a PL mount, but I'd prefer a Canon mount. That way I just have the Canon mount on the camera, and a matching Canon mount on the lens adapter, and I can switch them out easily.

[TimothyD]

Hi Donatello,

Maybe my last post will clarify. But if not, here goes:

Red One with Canon mount + B4 adapter with Canon instead of PL mount.

See what I mean. By having this setup I could just take off the 2/3" lens (and adapter) and put on a Canon lens without having to deal with changing mounts and collimating.

Tim

[donatello b]

"I just have the Canon mount on the camera"..."and a matching Canon mount on the lens adapter"

OK i see it all now !!

[Mick van Rossum, NSC]

If it is technically possible you could try to contact Les Bosher in the UK, he is one of the best and knowledgeable camera and lens technicians in the world. Just ask him if he could replace the existing PL mount on the Abakus (or RED) adapter. He is a specialist in lens mounts, and he also could tell you if it is technically possible or not.
http://www.lesbosher.co.uk/

Mick van Rossum NSC
Amsterdam

[TimothyD]

Thanks Mick,

I'll shoot him an e-mail.

Tim

[TimothyD]

Ok folks, so I haven't heard back from Les yet.

Can anyone on the Red team tell me if my idea is:

1. Feasible

2. Something Red might be willing to consider offering

Thanks so much,

Tim