How many in LA planning to rent out their Red?

[Bruce Allen]

Dear Red users...

I'm trying to decide whether to get on the Red list or just plan to rent one.

So, prospective Red owners... how much are you planning to rent a package for? Email me an offer and convince me not to buy one myself :)
I'm in the LA area.

I am estimating that out of the 1000+ pre-orders for Red, at least a hundred will be from LA. By the next rounds of pre-orders (Jan, NAB), we might hit 1000 cameras in LA... Since I don't exactly need to use the camera every day, it seems a bit greedy to want one all to myself. So, I should rent? Of course, the same goes for lenses! But the natural human instinct is to hoard, right...?

What do you think?

Bruce Allen
boacinema@gmail.com
www.boacinema.com

[Jeff Kilgroe]

I've wrestled with the same question myself and I'm buying. I know of a few people in my area that already have reservations and I'm sure there's some I don't know about and probably a lot more to follow. But I think I can be more productive if I own the camera myself and don't have to work around rental schedules and fees from others. I'll still rent the expensive glass when needed and at first see how my Nikkor lenses work out. But I'm not about to go buying Cooke primes, even used, until I have need to. I'm also interested to see what lenses RED will offer. Their upcoming zoom is intriguing... Their 300mm prime looks nice too, but I don't think I need it if my Nikkor 50mm-300mm zoom can do a decent job and get results that at least compare favorably.

I will probably rent myself and my RED out on occasion, but I won't try to make that a focal point of my business. As for rates, I don't even want to guess at this point because I don't even know how much my complete RED setup is going to cost just yet.

But I would bet that to rent a RED One from a major rental shop or some place reliable, you'll be looking at $2K per week or more. To rent an HVX in my area is about $1200/week, Varicam is $2500/week and that usually just includes one lens. So if you plan to use the camera for yourself 10 weeks or more over the next year or so, you may as well buy one. Also depends on how you plan to purchase. If it's financed out, the interest may eat you up if you don't have enough work for the camera and it's been my experience that renting gear out all the time just wears it down and eventually you have to repair it in order to get proper use out of it.

[Ben Feuer]

Bruce -
I've spoken with a couple of people about this very topic. I can guarantee you there will be fairly priced RED rentals in LA - even if you can't find anyone else, you can ask me or LonewolfHD, who is probably going to show up on this forum any day now.
When I get a little more time, I'm going to try to organize LA RED owners who want to rent - hopefully create some kind of unified group so no one gets undercut, screwed over, et cetera; not sure what form this will take at the moment, but that's what forums are for, right?

[Charles Papert]

penfever, that's an excellent idea. I have foreseen a quick devaluation of the rental charge of this camera as those who have invested a lot of money in their package get panicky a few months in and start renting it for a song, or "throwing it in" when they get hired for jobs with it, etc. The producers will catch on to this pretty quickly, and next thing you know it's "we can get a RED for $200/day, can you match that?"

[Jim Exton]

I rent nationwide, but will be spending a lot of time in LA this year so I will be available.

If anyone has a project coming up this year, feel free to contact me about Red #172 and operator.

Penfever has a great idea and I have spoken with him about helping create an LA Red database if you will.

[Ben Feuer]

I think the key idea here is standards and expectations. There are certainly going to be producers out there who rent RED for $200/day from a kid who doesn't have to support himself off of it...that's unavoidable. So what we can offer, together, is a guaranteed network of available, experienced shooters.

For example...
A RED breaks down on set. If you went with an individual, you're SOL. Through a RED group, you could potentially have another camera up and running the same day. All you have to do is 'reserve' camera availability for some shared portion of the sum. Which means you can make something from a RED "on standby" even if you're not out with it that day.

Another example...
Shooters can support each other through this network. We can talk about experiences, good and bad, and refer jobs to people who are just starting out; make sure that they get a fair rate for their equipment and expertise.

Yet another...
Possibly a collective arrangement for insurance. Something that would simplify it on the producer's end...one stop shopping for paperwork that guarantees him an 'in' for a whole network of RED camerapersons. This is especially appealing if linked to a website with live updates on how many cameras are still available for a given day.

I am compiling a mini-list of users, so anyone interested is welcome to PM me with an e-mail address.

[Jim Exton]

Penfever - I am in with you on this. I love these ideas, especially the shooters supporting each other through the network.

The thing that I am mostly concerned about is being able to deliver the data to the producer.

Perhaps we need some place in LA that can process the "negative" and make dailies for the client?

Or would it the client be expected to offload their own data for shooting the next day?

I just want their to be a smooth workflow for clients as everyone makes the transition to tapeless workflow.

[Blair S. Paulsen]

I am down the road a piece in San Diego but I figure that my RedOne and I will spend plenty of time in LA - there's a ton of work up there. My plan is to buy a van and outfit it with computer, hard drives, monitors, etc to support the camera and allow for on-set (or near set) data management. It also could serve as a video village either inside the van or under an opaque awning/tent rig on the side.

I am very interested in the kind of "I got your back" collective you are talking about, especially if there is a slick group rate insurance deal that someone can rig up. Having a phone list of available RedOnes at your fingertips every morning would be huge. I envision a deal where anyone who is interested puts their rig in the on-call queue with an approximate address. If you have a gig that day you can print out a list of on call cameras in order of how close they are to your shooting location and stuff it in your back pocket just in case you have a breakdown or the director suddenly decides they want multicam coverage of a tricky sequence.

[Ben Feuer]

It's a little like the temp agencies work now; and everybody from independents to studios uses the temp agencies.
As for the offlining idea - I think there could be a basic laptop-based "dailies" setup, especially w/2 RED-DRIVEs handed off. Just pop it thru REDCINE into a quick-compression format such as DV, and give the client a very good idea of what his final footage will look like - only he'll be pleasantly surprised when he sees the real thing! :)
If you do that on set, then I think the remainder of the offlining would be project and editor-dependent; I.E. more of a post problem. But these things are always negotiable.

[Steve Gibby]

I like the ideas on this thread. With over 80% of the world's entire entertainment media volume produced within a 50 mile radius of downtown L.A. there should be tons of RED One cameras based there. Don't forget, RED is headquartered just 50 minutes south of L.A., so it will be interesting to see what RED has up their sleeve for production support to the huge L.A. market.

I'm in L.A. weekly - my business used to be based there. I'll have two RED One cameras, including one of the very first ones shipped. I won't be renting out my cameras, but I will be looking for ace RED One shooters for my larger one-offs and series, when I'm not personally shooting, but functioning as a producer/director.

Networking and alliances are the core of this business (or any business). I'm sure Jarred will have some great ideas for networking RED One owners/users in the L.A. area. He's now based just down the 405 in Newport Beach.

[J. Bernard Vallon]

Great plan, If anyone wants to work one of the networks on the east coast id be happy to work it, or manage it. Owner/Ops are less common out here, which will make a network MORE nessisary.

-John

[Zakaree Sandberg]

i will be renting

[Chris Armstrong]

I'm also planning on renting out my red from time to time.

[Matt Uhry]

Penfever -
The thing that I am mostly concerned about is being able to deliver the data to the producer.

Perhaps we need some place in LA that can process the "negative" and make dailies for the client?

I just want their to be a smooth workflow for clients as everyone makes the transition to tapeless workflow.

Jim, I think there is an opportunity here for companies that already have big investments in decks and edit stations. There's going to be a need for a service where you can drop off a FW drive and they can make some combination of a DLT, HDCAM SR-W, DVC Pro HD, Digi-Beta, DVCAM and DVD's and deliver it to the Agency / Edit house the next day. I know a data only path is better for everybody but it's going to take a little while before it catches on.

Also they would need to apply the correct LUT to the Redcode RAW data. I wonder if there is any metadata with REDCODE that tracks the LUT you were using for viewing so at least you could be confident that what the editor sees the next day is what you saw on the monitor on set?

( I once almost got fired from a movie because the editor mixed up the RGB cables on his Avid and suggested to the producer that perhaps I was responsible for the wacky colors... this was a 35mm job and a VERY experienced editor. )

Matt Uhry
www.fuzby.com

[Sam Druckerman]

I plan to rent out my Red as well.

[Jim Exton]

Matt - That is great, I figured that the drives would be turned over to the production company every night and they would be responsible for off loading their footage.

If I remember correctly, I think there will be LUT metadata on the Red Code.

[Eric MacIver]

We'll have plenty of Red gear, support for it, etc. along with all of our existing gear (camera, grip, sound, lighting...), prepro office, screening room, post prod rentals, etc.

There's a lot more to production w/ Red than the body (yes, I know it's obvious).

That being said, barring any changes from Red, we do plan on offering our Red body at an initial rental price that at least seems fair for everyone: $495/day, $1475 a week.

We also follow the method of offering a "low price guarantee". We match or beat any price from any other legitimate rental house. Hopefully that benefits our customers and the industry by stemming off price-wars that could end up in resulting in lower quality gear or support.

It seems wise to agree on a rate to try to stick to, though the market will eventually settle itself on a price. That's why we will try to be fair from the beginning - like Red :)

[Bret Weeks]

Wow. The camera hasn't made it past the prototype stage, and you are already undercutting the market @ under $500 / day. I thank you as I'm sure the rest of the rental community thanks you - you've continued the bastardization of the rental industry.


What are you- Wallmart?

[Ben Feuer]

@Bret - Dude...chill out.
@Indie Rentals - 500 is certainly a fair price for the RED body. Are you also going to be offering package rental deals, or is that going to be negotiated with the individual? Also, are you interested in some sort of basic agreement among LA RED owners to prevent drastic undercutting? Seeing as your quoted cost is already at the bottom end of what most RED users were probably hoping to earn in rentals, it would be pretty disappointing to end up in a bidding war against individuals that landed somewhere in the 250/300 range.
One important distinction is that a lot of us (myself included) will be going out with our cameras as DITs. That's a little different than just renting equipment.

[Chris Gearhart]

The market forces will settle things. Personally I think the very thing that makes RED available to all of us will make it hard to charge high rates for rental. The Cost for a RED is 10% of the rest of the market (does this make RED Walmart?). How many of us are considering becoming RED renters? The supply-demand curve cannot be fooled.

If RED saturates the market and can pull the prices of the rest of the high-end production camera manufacturer/rental down, then the market will adjust, and $500/day will seem prescient. (I must admit, my hopes were dashed a bit at that rate too, but if it's easy enough for ME to get in the business, then there are enough others who can also get in to make this not a free ride). If RED does not, the Panavisions of the world can continue to garner confiscatory rates to its big production customers, and the average RED rate might side up in that direction because of the quality of the image.

On the other end of things, indie-type small budget productions have a hope of getting higher quality/quantity production--either upgrading their image quality, or increasing the quantity of material they can afford to shoot. They may therefore try to pay a bit more for the camera package they can rent, realizing a better cost value, but we can't hope to charge them massive rates.

In any case, RED renting will find its comfortable, market-supported level, and we will all learn to make a profit at that level or sink. The market will weed out many of us. Hopefully, threads like these will help pre-weed the faint of heart, and gird-up the hungry entreprenuers to do what it will REALLY take.

I expect that RED renting can become a wonderful opportunity for (LOTS) boutique renters, but you have to be hungry enough to make it work. Jim is hungry. . . This is a revolution, people! Not a friendly aquisition! That's partly why this is (blood) RED Digital Cinema, not panzy GREEN! :D

[Chris Gearhart]

All that being said, I'm in Chicago! Nanny nanny boo boo.

:rolleyes: :D

[donatello b]

i think INDIE's rate at 495 day/ 3day week is a fair price and goes hand in hand with RED sale price...the sale price of RED is NOT priced against current cameras that it outperforms ..
INDIE's price seems based on the cost of RED ( as a cinema camera not video camera) and NOT where it fits into the current rental market ( it does more then cineAlta so price it higher then cineAlta= cineAlta rental may have to be repriced) ...
the reason we can buy a RED is because RED is not priced where it fits into the current crop of camera's it outperforms !!! RED is not a video camera .. video camera's have always been priced higher ( rental) then film camera's because they have a shorter shelf life ...

i think if we look over to the DVX 100/HVX200/digitbetacams and other video camera's the day rate for those have NOT fallen in the rental houses - and 1000's own them privately...

there might be a RED rental premium during the 1st few months ? but once rental houses have a good stock the price should level out ..and of course premium rental houses will have their own accessory loaded REDS ( otto-red, clairmount-red etc) at a premium price ...

IMO there is going to be a shortage of PL lens in many markets after 1500 REDs hit the street ...

[Roxco]

Until RedUser has local forums, or for those who prefer email so they can filter it themselves. I put together a Yahoo Group for LA and another email based list for general RedCam issues - see below.

Rosco

-

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=375

For those in the LA/Hollywood/SoCal Area:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Red-LA/

Let's get this email party started,

Rosco

P.S. There is also a Red-L for everyone to use:

Here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Red-L/

These are Yahoo groups and you can hide your info.
They are open to all without moderation until noisy.

[Eric MacIver]

We're not trying to be Walmart or undercut everyone. We will beat or match any other rental house's price, but that's because we want to make sure we're offering our customers the best price and service in the area.

I know everyone would love to charge $1,000/day to rent their body. I'd love to be able to do that as well, but if anyone planned on doing that, I can guarantee you that the next guy would do $900, because that's a good amount to him/her. Then, the next would do $800, and so on and so forth until a good rate is settled upon.

We decided to try and make a fair price for everyone from day one. We're INDIE rentals. We're trying to help the independant filmmaker achieve their dream, because I'm one of them and I understand the struggle. I think that's where Red is coming from as well and I respect them greatly for that, because they could charge $30k for this camera and it'd still be a huge bargain.

Right now a Canon XL-H1 rents at $325/day. That camera was about $9,000 new and has a limited life (as HDV will be outdated at some point). Red is $17,500 and if it's modular, then it'll have a longer life. Compare it to Varicam's that are more than twice as expensive and go out at $800/day with lens. Also take into account anticipated repair needs, etc.

I'm guessing, but it sure seems like $500/day is where things would settle for the body only. Perhaps someone can start a poll on here to see what everyone else thinks. I mean, if the whole industry was at $800 and we were the only ones at $500, I can tell you, we wouldn't be killing all the business and we'd consider raising our prices a bit to match standards and demand.

[Martin Drew]

What would you be offering for $495, literally the body only, or does it include batteries and some drives?

M

[Charles Papert]

I've been forecasting for a while a scenario on how this issue may play out. From what I've read on the boards, I think a certain percentage of people who plan to buy RED cameras are doing so because they think it's cool and state-of-the-art, and not because they actually have a business plan to pay it off. Chances are that they have previously owned DV/HDV/small format HD cameras and perhaps made a bit of money doing odd jobs with them here and there, maybe even write off the fact that they haven't recouped their investment by considering this an expensive hobby. Let's call one such chap Bob.

Bob eagerly plunks down the deposit on RED and when his number is called, frantically scrambles to get a loan from bank or family to bring his baby home. Scours the boards to figure out the absoute cheapest way to accessorize the camera with mattebox, follow focus etc. Gets his whole package together (maybe without lenses though, being resigned to rent as needed) and builds a fantastically gorgeous website to sell his services.

Bob calls up his old clients and raves about his new camera, they think it sounds great, but when the first job comes around, the budget is basically the same as it was on DV. No problem, introductory deal time and off Bob goes to shoot the local car ad or corporate quickie with his shiny new RED camera for $400 day labor and gear combined. The client is enthusiastic about the images (or at least pretend to be, as far as they are concerned they can't really see the difference!!) and promise that the NEXT one will be better paid--as it turns out, the next one is less money: "help us out on this one though, Bob", they say; "we've got a big job coming in June" (which goes away in April).

A few months down the road, Bob is looking at his monthly nut and panicking a bit--there's all kind of great accessories and lenses and things coming out to support the camera, and he really wants to own the latest toys, but he's not making enough money to cover his loan as it is. So he drops his rental price on his website, creates package deals, "lowest price in town!' type of stuff. Meanwhile, there's other guys in town doing the same thing (but darn it, THEY own a whole set of lenses, and they are offering even cheaper packages!).

Bob has been renting his lenses from Eric at IndieRentals, so they know each other. One day a producer calls Eric and asks him for a half-price rental on a RED package, because that's what they've been paying Bob. Next time Bob calls Eric, Eric rightfully wonders to Bob why he's been giving his package away, and Bob can only shrug and say "it's all they'll pay--I've gotta keep the camera working!"

And on it goes. Of course, there are going to be higher-end clients who will pay the appropriate rate, because they are used to paying for Digibeta and Varicams etc., but there's a large market that has embraced the lower cost structure of small format video that are going to have a hard time paying more.

Another parallel scenario is those who buy their packages to make low-budget short films and features etc...chances are they won't be budgeting or getting any more money for the camera package than they were for a DV/HDV type setup, as these types of projects are usually cut to the bone anyway.

I draw a lot of this from what I have seen in the Steadicam world as rates and rental prices have slowly eroded even up to high-budget features with A-list operators. We've had plenty of discussion amongst ourselves about holding the line, but there is always someone who is willing to work for less money (and amazingly, producers and studio bean-counters that embrace the "logic" of saving $400 on the budget sheet versus paying an hour of overtime for the entire company when the inexpensive/less experierenced operator needs many more takes to get the shot).

I think that $500 a day is a very fair (perhaps too fair) price for body-only, but of course there will need to be a known set of accessories such as hard drive, various support bracketry etc. which will likely ensure that there is no such thing as a $500 rental--the a la carte items will likely drive the starting price up to $650 at least.

[Blair S. Paulsen]

Charles, as usual, is all over this issue. In the last year or two I have gotten much more militant about holding to my rack rates. If we keep undercutting each other then eventually nobody will be able to feed their families. The vexing piece of the equation is that many clients and even some producers simply do not understand or care about the finer points of image quality. The extra takes required when green operators dump the shot is often just considered par for the course - and considered worth the trade off for the lower rate, especially if the crew size is small.

I wish I had some wisdom to share on this, instead I just wonder if I will be able to stay in this business. My best idea so far is to try and educate producers. The wide availability of HD media (HD-DVD or Blu-Ray) should help (whenever it happens), as it will make it easier to get HD reels out. I am also hoping that the image quality of the RedOne and other newer HD or better cameras will make the differential between SD and HD more obvious. There is also the improvement in the general baseline of display tech in the field which may be the cart pulling the horse, but at least its pulling toward higher quality.

Bottom line - dropping your rate to get work is very short sighted and affects all of us, not just you. PLEASE don't do it.

-yes, I am going to get flamed by the "how can you blame me for trying to survive" posters but this issue is critical to all of us.

[donatello b]

what exactly are the rack rates ?
perhaps somebody could post a out line of rates ??
i guess it all comes down to where each is currently sitting ..
seems everybodys rate is all over the place .. for some it might be 500 day others 2500+ day ...
IMO camera size has NO affect on ones day rate ...
one has their DAY rate (10hrs -none of that flat day rate that could go 18-20hrs) .. then there is equipment rate = 2 separate items.

then there is the rate you do for friends on their project ...

i do have friends that have several rates .. corporate, commercial, feature, doc etc ... and most tend to charge more if they are shooting film ?? now that i don't get?? but then i do the exact opposite -charge 3-4X my day rate to shoot SD 2/3" ccd type camera 's ? soooooooooooo i guess we all have our little premiums

[Ben Feuer]

Charles's concerns affect all people thinking of renting RED; a community of peers would be precisely the thing to avoid such a situation. In more professional circles, these are referred to as unions; they have their flaws but they are beautiful things.
Professional, career renters shouldn't be forced to match the prices of hobbyists casually recouping cost. But in a union-less world, that is precisely what comes to pass. It's a tragedy of the commons for a cinema world.
I, for one, will adopt a zero-favors pledge on my RED. That means no assistance without pay in cash or in kind. It was different when I was in school, but now that I'm in LA, seeing the kind of hubris and injustice the "I have a great movie" mentality breeds, I'm feeling a bit less ... charitable.
In all things, fairness should be the guiding principle. But that door swings both ways.

[Ralph Oshiro]

Hmmm . . . I just posted this in the other "rental" thread, but decided it would be more relevant here instead . . .

. . . Well, I just spoke with some F900 shooters at work, and the going rate for F900 packages appear to be $1,200/day on the low end, to about $1,500/day on average (in the Los Angeles-area market). This is a minimal package with one lens, sticks, and bricks. This is a bit higher than I thought they rented for. I had thought that F900s rent for about $800-$1,000/day, but I must've been basing my estimates on weekly rates. My personal RED rental rate (should I decide to rent at all) will likely fall somewhere in between Indie Rentals' $500 rate and these F900 rates. On the low end, I think $850/day is a reasonable starting point. But I forgot how many days in a week those F900 rates were for. Are people mostly doing 3-day weeks or 4-day weeks these days?

Now I'm going to read indie rentals' posts and the others and post a follow-up comment . . .

[Ralph Oshiro]

Well, just read Indie Rental's post, and as a customer, they sound like a great place for people like us! I had never even heard of IR until now, and I drive right by its offices EVERYDAY! Hopefully they'll welcome a walk-in visit from me someday soon!

[Ralph Oshiro]

FWIW, here's some of my (minimal) rental experience . . .

Panasonic DVX100 major L.A. rental house rate: $275/day.
Ralph Oshiro's DVX100 rental rate: $250/day.
I rented my DVX100 to a stage. It sat there for several months and earned $6,000. I didn't give them a discounted week--I simply added extra accessories at no charge (which was nearly the dollar equivalent anyway).
*[Note: this was almost two years ago--rates have lowered considerably, I'm guessing, on this camera]

Panasonic SDX900 major L.A. rental house rate: $550/day.
Ralph Oshiro's Sony DSR450 [Sony's quasi-SDX900 look-alike 2/3" DVCAM] rental rate: $450/day.
I rented it to a show for two days and paid 90% of the cost for all my new bricks.

[Blair S. Paulsen]

I think $850/day with a decent zoom lens, sticks, bricks and at least 3 RedDrives would be in the ballpark in LA. One thing I am thinking is that the traditional 3 day week might not make sense when the RedOne first hits the market due to supply being so limited, maybe a 4 day week until the market floods and then shift back to a 3 day week. Some folks do 8 day months which I don't see making sense for the RedOne for a least a year.

I am planning to set my rack (standard) rate at $2,000/day with support van, monitor, lenses (still primes, cine zoom), batts, RedDrives, computers for data management, me as DIT. I will discount for multi-day gigs but never below $1,000/day no matter how long the show lasts. Of course this is comparing apples to oranges since it includes a person which is normally not part of a camera rental.

This is all hypothetical of course since price fixing is a crime :cool:

[Ralph Oshiro]

I am planning to set my rack (standard) rate at $2,000/day with support van, monitor, lenses (still primes, cine zoom), batts, RedDrives, computers for data management, me as DIT.That sounds right on the money [forgive the pun]! You as the DIT, plus all that support gear--that's a great rate for a lot of support. I think F900 owner/operators make between $2,000-$2,500 a day for the gear, themselves, and a sound guy.

[Ralph Oshiro]

One thing I am thinking is that the traditional 3 day week might not make sense when the RedOne first hits the market due to supply being so limited, maybe a 4 day week until the market floods and then shift back to a 3 day week. Some folks do 8 day months which I don't see making sense for the RedOne for a least a year.I hope we can do 4-day weeks too! Eight-day months? Wow! It used to be 12-day months, no? What do you think a fair monthly rate would be for RED in the first year?

[Eric MacIver]

Believe me $500/day rate is BODY ONLY and is subject to change. With the viewfinder, zoom lens, redrail, 2 drives, 3 batts, charger, sticks/head, follow focus, matte box, NDs, cabling and an HD monitor (comparable to an F900 "package") I'm GUESSING we'll be at about $1250 (comparable to an F900 "package").

We are a full-service location and we though we have our low-price guarantee, if everyone in the area is charging $800/day and our cameras are busy, then we'd raise our rates.

We don't operate on a business model of undercutting everyone. Those business are out there and they tend to provide poor service, support and selection. If we were to undercut too much, it would hurt our ability to support our gear as well as we do (24/7).

FYI, this is another reason I suggest individual owners work WITH their gear or sub it out through a rental house when they aren't working with it. It solves the insurance problem, gives you job credits, helps you keep your rates higher, avoids servicing and theft problems, etc. Trust me... More than one customer at a time and you have to start getting into problems you probably don't want to deal with unless you want to make that your full time business.

And Charles had a good point. As excited as owners are about going out with their Red's just to test them, it might be a good idea to always own another camera to at least "force" your client to pay more for the Red - even if it's just to train them that there is a difference... For your own benefit.

Anyway, we're on Highland, just south of Sunset in Hollywood - anyone is welcome to come by and discuss with us 9-5, M-F.

[Ralph Oshiro]

Believe me $500/day rate is BODY ONLY and is subject to change. With the viewfinder, zoom lens, redrail, 2 drives, 3 batts, charger, sticks/head, follow focus, matte box, NDs, cabling and an HD monitor (comparable to an F900 "package") I'm GUESSING we'll be at about $1250 (comparable to an F900 "package").Well, that sounds like a very sound price schedule. It's totally in-line with competing packages, and clearly maintains the "value perception" of the product. Renting from a "real" company with a real office and real support staff definitely has its benefits. Indie Resources sounds like a great place to do business with. Also, you can't beat that central, Hollywood location.


Anyway, we're on Highland, just south of Sunset in Hollywood - anyone is welcome to come by and discuss with us 9-5, M-F.Would love to stop by someday and say hi!

I assume it's confidential, but how many RED ONEs has your company reserved? Also, are you aware of any of the other big L.A. rental houses that have RED reservations (you know who all I mean)? I'm dying to know if any of the big shops in town had the vision to make any commitments to RED.

[Bruce Allen]

You Red people are very nice - thank you so much for all of your responses to my original question! I look forward to renting a Red in the future ;)

Of course I wish I could buy one but promising to pay $17500 would be an offer in bad faith because I don't have that kind of money in my bank account!

If anyone runs out of money when paying for the Red, let me know - maybe I can buy some rental time in advance from you (hopefully for a good rate!). Still better than paying interest to financial institutions...

Cheers

Bruce

[Steven Parker]

I too am in LA and hope to rent out #1037 on occasion...

by the way Lakeview, I'm from Chicago and can work locally so let me know if you need another Red!

penfever, please include me in this LA-area Red Group... I'm flying solo, shooting a lot of little indie features so Red makes sense as my first camera purchase, but to be a part of support system that's being talked about here is invaluable - how do I join?!

It seems right to me to be in the $1200/day range for a fully set-up Red - sticks, bricks, drives and some kind of RedCine support/transfer. But lenses are where I differ...in my work, I'll be using 35mmPL primes mostly; others will bring their Nikkors, still others will shoot B4...perhaps rates will depend on the chosen lens package/final rez the client wants?

I mean, if I have a shoot for a client who needs 1080p, do I go out and rent an F900? No way. I've got #1037!

But can I charge the client above as much as I would charge the client who wants 4K RAW?

[Eric MacIver]

Would love to stop by someday and say hi!

I assume it's confidential, but how many RED ONEs has your company reserved? Also, are you aware of any of the other big L.A. rental houses that have RED reservations (you know who all I mean)? I'm dying to know if any of the big shops in town had the vision to make any commitments to RED.

If/when you stop by you can peak at our titanium "R"s. Suffice to say I plan on having the most in LA :)

[donatello b]

rental houses .....
guessing = you will see OTTO-RED's