View Full Version : Build 18 with new Audio Board confusion
01-16-2009, 11:15 PM
Just come off a film that was recorded double system but we also attempted to record audio to the camera to simplify dailies delivery.
We had very mixed results and due to the hectic pace of production I had to leave the sound issues with the sound department. We had low levels, distorted levels and missing audio. We were Build 18 with new Audio Board installed.
I have had a look at the manual and I did refer sound department to the manual as well but I am a camera dude and I could not understand the manual. On Betacam style cameras it always seemed easy. The sound guy sent you zero level tone from a mixer and you adjusted the cameras VU meters to zero and off you went.
For future reference what should I say to the sound guy who wants to plug into the camera and how should the camera be set up?
Tom "what did he say sonny?" Gleeson
01-16-2009, 11:38 PM
Sounds like you may be recording to a RED ONE with prior gen audio board and used the wrong XLR cables. What is the serial number of the camera?
01-17-2009, 01:37 AM
Hey Brent, what would happen if they used the new audio board but the OLD cables? Aren't the old ones all capacitored up or something?
Would that stuff it up?
01-17-2009, 02:40 AM
No serial number as camera has been returned to owner but it had definitely been updated to the new audio board but the wrong XLR cables are a possibility I will check out.
Assuming the correct cables and new audio board what is the correct procedure for recording line level audio sent from the audio boys?
Dumb ass camera jockey
01-17-2009, 01:30 PM
I am no audio expert, so I will leave that to others on this forum :)
Basically, if new audio board - you need to use mini-XLR to mini-XLR cables in conjunction with mini-XLR to XLR adaptor. Old audio board - just one component - the RED mini-XLR to XLR cable.
01-17-2009, 05:33 PM
Basically, if new audio board - you need to use mini-XLR to mini-XLR cables in conjunction with mini-XLR to XLR adaptor
I dont get it. So you are saying I need to plug into the camera the mini-XLR to mini-XLR cable and then plug the mini-XLR to XLR adaptor and then plug the XLR audio feed from the Soundo into that? And I alsom assume that the mini-XLR to mini-XLR cable and the mini-XLR to XLR adaptor are proprietary Red cables?
Tom "need a hearing aid" Gleeson
01-19-2009, 05:01 PM
I don't understand too... do you have picture of them?
01-19-2009, 05:37 PM
From the sounds of it, the OLD board cables (mini-XLR to XLR) can't handle the new boards signal.
So we need a mini-XLR to mini-XLR cable, the adaptor to turn it XLR and then plug the XLR cable into finish it. And that all 3 of those pieces must be the new cable type to handle the signal?
((Not an expert, just making sure that's what you're saying to we're all on the same level. Because that's how we're reading it.))
01-19-2009, 06:29 PM
The old board had limited dynamic range, so the cables used with the older board padded the audio down a bit, about -10dB I believe. so if you were using those old cables with the new board, which is supposed to accept a full range signal, all your audio would be attenuated, probably much too low to be particularly useful. The mixer might have been trying to mix hotter with hotter sends, but then he runs the risk of distorting his signal as he tries to compensate for the attenuation built into the cables.
Any combination of new cables adapters should fix this problem, assuming they do not have the -10dB pad in them.
01-19-2009, 07:53 PM
I checked with the owner and was assured we were using the correct cables with the Audio upgraded board. Is there any online resource anywhere that has a simple plain speak guide to Audio with Red with the new boards?
Tom "don't ask much" Gleeson
01-19-2009, 07:55 PM
Correct, old audio board needs first image below.
New audio board needs the second and third images.
01-19-2009, 08:07 PM
couldn't you just remove the padding in the old cable. i don't see a reason for it not to work. Doesn't make sense. Is there anything inside the connectors other than cable in the 2nd and 3rd picture?
01-19-2009, 09:04 PM
couldn't you just remove the padding in the old cable. i don't see a reason for it not to work.
Is there anything inside the connectors other than cable in the 2nd and 3rd picture?
You could yes, and yes you are correct there is nothing other than cable in the other one.
The issue is there IS something NORMALLY in the first cable, so don't use it unless you are 100% certain.
01-19-2009, 09:15 PM
That's what I thought. Thank you.
01-19-2009, 10:13 PM
In the studio we generally reference 0vu to -20db. That being said you always need to keep in mind your source audio and its dynamic range and attacks. Just like picture digital is digital and if you overload your input you got garbage baby. If your sound person can through a limiter on the feed since you're using RED as your reference for edit that would help to control your peaks.
04-14-2009, 08:11 AM
Is there any online resource anywhere that has a simple plain speak guide to Audio with Red with the new boards?
Check out the new Build 18 V3.6.4 Operations Guide Tom....