4K PLAYBACK NOW, is same in scratch [Archive]

View Full Version : 4K PLAYBACK NOW, is same in scratch

RRafael

01-29-2009, 03:55 PM

Adam Glick

01-29-2009, 05:30 PM

stephan orlandic

01-30-2009, 03:51 PM

Im looking for best performance to build a custum server for SCRATCH,
and see now! 1800MB/s System in SAS disk (can play 4K uncompress),
my question is.. better for Scratch Cine 2K Monitoring and playback?
i can use 1800 m/bs speed for delivery 4K and better Look resolution and quality monitoring in Color Work?
or is waste of money, i see hardware support for Scratch very expensive for new PC server builders!! anyone has experience!! please Share!

Hello,
If You don't know how to setup a system like this, contact guys at boxx.
You can't go wrong.
If You think You can do it by Yourself, well here are some recomendations:

SUPERMICRO SC846/848 - 24BAY SATA/SAS STORAGE/SERVER CASE
INTEL D5400XS MOTHERBOARD
2 X INTEL 9775 EXTREME CPU
4 X 1GB/2GB DDR2 800 FBDIMM ECC REG
QUADRO FX5600 (SDI)
24 X WD RE3 1TB
2 X 12PORT ARECA ARC-1680ix-12 RAID 6 SATA/SAS CONTROLLER

There is realy much more than just buying the parts.
Setting up the system is also very important.
Cooling, bios, windows, drivers.
Especially configuration of raid, and overclocking.

IF YOU CAN WAIT, THAN WAIT FOR NEW SUPERMICRO MB WITH 5500 CHIPSET, AND A PAIR OF NEW GENERATION XEONS. x5560,x5570 ...
It is way faster than the above cpus.

Hope this will answer some of Your questions.

Regards

RRafael

01-30-2009, 06:16 PM

Hello,
If You don't know how to setup a system like this, contact guys at boxx.
You can't go wrong.
If You think You can do it by Yourself, well here are some recomendations:

SUPERMICRO SC846/848 - 24BAY SATA/SAS STORAGE/SERVER CASE
INTEL D5400XS MOTHERBOARD
2 X INTEL 9775 EXTREME CPU
4 X 1GB DDR2 800 FBDIMM ECC REG
QUADRO FX5600 (SDI)
24 X WD RE3 1TB
2 X 12PORT ARECA ARC-1680ix-12 RAID 6 SATA/SAS CONTROLLER

There is realy much more than just buying the parts.
Setting up the system is also very important.
Cooling, bios, windows, drivers.
Especially configuration of raid, and overclocking.

IF YOU CAN WAIT, THAN WAIT FOR NEW SUPERMICRO MB WITH 5500 CHIPSET, AND A PAIR OF NEW GENERATION XEONS. x5560,x5570 ...
It is way faster than the above cpus.

Hope this will answer some of Your questions.

Regards

yeah! good Config, What W.OS? Server 2003 x64?
im sure is big work buil this server, and config raid, Os, Water Coolling but pay 300% part cost is Very Spencive.
Thx

RRafael

01-30-2009, 06:20 PM

Hi Ricardo,

Scratch Cine is used mostly for realtime playback of RED camera footage (.r3d files) and for transcodng & conforming r3d files into Quicktime, DPX etc. A fast RAID array is not required but you must have a special fast computer to play RED footage at HD and 2K quality.

Scratch (not Scratch Cine) can play back ANY type of footage/file and also has very powerful secondary color correction tools. For playback of 2K or 4K DPX or uncompressed files, you don't need a fast computer but you must have a fast RAID array like the one you mentioned. For realtime, high-quality playback of RED files, you still must have a special fast computer.

I can't tell you how to build a fast computer system for r3d playback in Scratch, but I can help you get one. ;)

Call me if you would like to discuss your needs with a company who understands how to build a Scratch system the correct way.

Ciao,

Adam
BOXXlabs

Thx! i planned use REDCINE to transcode 3rd to DPX files and Color Correction in Strach finish.
I can use 800 mbps Raid system?
like this one 8U 48 TB
8U Server Rack 48 Hotswap SATA II 3Gbs 32MB 7200K 1TB disk
2 IC8806 AMD Opteron Quad Core 2356 (2.3GHz/75W)
2 MICK740 DYNATRON A5LG 2U SOCKET F OPTERON COOLING HEATSINK
4 MYK246 4GB ECC Reg DDR2 667MHz Kingston VR Lifetime
48 HDS1001 Hitachi Ultrastar 1TB SATA 7200RPM 32MB A7K1000
1 HCV192 SUPER DVM-PNSC-824B BLACK 8X SLIM DVD-ROM DRIVE (P
1 BAT140 Battery Backup Module (requires slot)
1 MB1501 SUPER H8DAE DUAL OPTERON 940-PIN AMD 8131 CHIPSET
1 SO8034 MICROSOFT OEM WINDOWS SERVER 2003 STD R2 X64 w/5CA
1 SO805 Microsoft OEM Windows Server 2003 5 Client License
1 KITAX633 **Aberdeen Stonehaven X633 (Rdnt. PS) Kit**
2 HDS812 Seagate 80GB 9.5ms 7200.10 SATA 3Gb/s 8MB
**** TWO OS DRIVES INSTALLED RAID 1 ***
Plus PCIXpress 16X slot, to Quadro 5800 SDI
Buit Audio
400 MBPS Net

stephan orlandic

01-31-2009, 01:57 PM

Thx! i planned use REDCINE to transcode 3rd to DPX files and Color Correction in Strach finish.
I can use 800 mbps Raid system?
like this one 8U 48 TB
8U Server Rack 48 Hotswap SATA II 3Gbs 32MB 7200K 1TB disk
2 IC8806 AMD Opteron Quad Core 2356 (2.3GHz/75W)
2 MICK740 DYNATRON A5LG 2U SOCKET F OPTERON COOLING HEATSINK
4 MYK246 4GB ECC Reg DDR2 667MHz Kingston VR Lifetime
48 HDS1001 Hitachi Ultrastar 1TB SATA 7200RPM 32MB A7K1000
1 HCV192 SUPER DVM-PNSC-824B BLACK 8X SLIM DVD-ROM DRIVE (P
1 BAT140 Battery Backup Module (requires slot)
1 MB1501 SUPER H8DAE DUAL OPTERON 940-PIN AMD 8131 CHIPSET
1 SO8034 MICROSOFT OEM WINDOWS SERVER 2003 STD R2 X64 w/5CA
1 SO805 Microsoft OEM Windows Server 2003 5 Client License
1 KITAX633 **Aberdeen Stonehaven X633 (Rdnt. PS) Kit**
2 HDS812 Seagate 80GB 9.5ms 7200.10 SATA 3Gb/s 8MB
**** TWO OS DRIVES INSTALLED RAID 1 ***
Plus PCIXpress 16X slot, to Quadro 5800 SDI
Buit Audio
400 MBPS Net

Well I must say that this system is completely wrong.
From beginning to the very end.
Don't know where to start...

First of all, forget about AMD opterons for SCRATCH DI RT system.
They are slower than current intels, especially the 2.3ghz model You wrote,
and comparing to the newcoming gen of intels, they are very slow.
Also, almost all of current DI systems, have been tested and certified with INTEL platforms.
This doesn't mean that they won't work with AMD, but there might be some things which will work slower or not good as You would like to.
IF You want real time debayer 2k/hd sdi output from 4k with 24fps,
it must be octo Intel.

I never liked the idea of too many hard drives in single case.
Too big risk to gamble with.
IF You need 48 TB, make a second storage only server, and conect it with 10gb ethernet of IB.

Also, I don't recommend Hitachi drives. Never liked them, since IBM days. Too many models with big problems.
Also, WD RE drives have been designed to work in big raid systems.
They have some very nice features so they can work better when You have many of them.
Seagate also have some good models, but latest series have really big firmware problems.

Supermicro H8DAE MB is wrong. It uses 8131 chipset and can work only with 200 series opterons and not 2000 opterons.
Also it does not have any pcie slots. only pci-x slots.
Also it uses ddr I 400 ram.
Maybe it should be H8DAE-2, MCP55 chipset, pcie slots, ddr2 800.
If You want this MB, than You should buy ddr2 800 and not 667 as You have wrote.

Kingston Valueram in this highend system ?
Looks like a joke. Ask for some real server memory. it's only a few dollars more.

30us$ 80gb seagate for a system drive ?
Not a chance.
Put some SSD for system drive, Intel, Mtron, Memoright, ...
If You think to charge x00us$ per hour, and work on some serious jobs,
there is no place for mistake. Don't try to cut a few dollars on critical places.

Quadro 5800SDI is still not yet officialy certified in Scratch.
You should contact them to see when it will be supported.

Almost forgot, there is no mention of which RAID controllers are being used ?
This is of critical importance for getting performance and reliability from storage subsystem.

Reading Your posts and configuration, and thinking,
I think You should most definately contact someone who knows how
to setup a highend DI/Storage system.
Not an easy job, and asks for many years of experience.

Sometimes, paying more, is paying less in a long run.

Regards

stephan orlandic

01-31-2009, 02:07 PM

Thx! i planned use REDCINE to transcode 3rd to DPX files and Color Correction in Strach finish.
I can use 800 mbps Raid system?

For 4k RAW REDCODE 36, the name tells You everything.
Why would You buy Scratch if not for using it's REDCODE native capabilities.

For uncompressed 4K 16bit Tiff playback You need at least 1300MB/s
sustained on the last sector of Your drive.

For uncompressed 4K 10bit DPX playback You need at least 850MB/s
sustained on the last sector of Your drive.

That means that Your storage needs to be 50-60% faster when it is empty.

RRafael

02-01-2009, 09:12 AM

Hi thx for your Post, im help a lot, but i dont feliing im wrogn in my way.
Many Intel Mobo with PciEx16x is hard to find, with space to dual slot Quadro Video Card and indepent PCI ex 8X (Raid System) and Xena 2K Video IO optional.
Hitachi vs Segeate is a large discussion like Samsumg HD, all companies has bad HD and God Hradisk is a med user discussion for years, only need 24-7 server disk certificate and choise SATA or SAS technologies, big money diferencen.
But remember this is a Red user forum and we are know all details about workflow, im see this hardware info is a Companies and sponsors user forum Taboo (some mac user problem), and see Red Storage and Scratch Workstaion like 40K$!!! spot here and im find Server custom Companies with years experience give this service only need your specific Software Minimal requierement, like 17K-20K$
In last case.. The Red One Camera is a Computer, with Raid Disk, Video Card SDI and Ram Memory, all red user need know detail about this.. really people has many experience.. like cameras too.. color correction .. and workflow.. and do you not need know nothing, only pay!. this way is very hard to me.
Im belivie Red user forum need a special link about hardware, really workflow and hardware is like same way.. not is mac or pc disscusion.. or DPX and redcode opinion is about hardware and money. is my opinion. and thx again.

Orlando soon post new configuration, i need your opinion, 5500 chipset in supermicro MObo for new Intel Xeon CPU, im wait this update, for speed and memory family (server memory)
Soon out 1.5 and 2 Terabyte Server SATA II hardisk, i can only replacement thist Harddrives? i see Raid Controller manage 2Terabyte by volumen is right?
Do you recomend.. Raid 5 or Raid 6?
Quadro SDI and Xena 2K card both in same Case is to much, im thing edit in premiere CS4 and CC in Strach to DPX film out, all in same server, is posible?
Im looking for and remote work system like dell server to work far server (noise room), in this way im lost too.
And what cooling system do oyu know (im use liquid system but is horrible lost in drop case), globalstore use air system for example.
What so you thing about overlok cpu to workflow.. is sure? many people talk about overlock .. not is a game?

Pls Helpme, sorry my english.. :)

Well I must say that this system is completely wrong.
From beginning to the very end.
Don't know where to start...

First of all, forget about AMD opterons for SCRATCH DI RT system.
They are slower than current intels, especially the 2.3ghz model You wrote,
and comparing to the newcoming gen of intels, they are very slow.
Also, almost all of current DI systems, have been tested and certified with INTEL platforms.
This doesn't mean that they won't work with AMD, but there might be some things which will work slower or not good as You would like to.
IF You want real time debayer 2k/hd sdi output from 4k with 24fps,
it must be octo Intel.

I never liked the idea of too many hard drives in single case.
Too big risk to gamble with.
IF You need 48 TB, make a second storage only server, and conect it with 10gb ethernet of IB.

Also, I don't recommend Hitachi drives. Never liked them, since IBM days. Too many models with big problems.
Also, WD RE drives have been designed to work in big raid systems.
They have some very nice features so they can work better when You have many of them.
Seagate also have some good models, but latest series have really big firmware problems.

Supermicro H8DAE MB is wrong. It uses 8131 chipset and can work only with 200 series opterons and not 2000 opterons.
Also it does not have any pcie slots. only pci-x slots.
Also it uses ddr I 400 ram.
Maybe it should be H8DAE-2, MCP55 chipset, pcie slots, ddr2 800.
If You want this MB, than You should buy ddr2 800 and not 667 as You have wrote.

Kingston Valueram in this highend system ?
Looks like a joke. Ask for some real server memory. it's only a few dollars more.

30us$ 80gb seagate for a system drive ?
Not a chance.
Put some SSD for system drive, Intel, Mtron, Memoright, ...
If You think to charge x00us$ per hour, and work on some serious jobs,
there is no place for mistake. Don't try to cut a few dollars on critical places.

Quadro 5800SDI is still not yet officialy certified in Scratch.
You should contact them to see when it will be supported.

Almost forgot, there is no mention of which RAID controllers are being used ?
This is of critical importance for getting performance and reliability from storage subsystem.

Reading Your posts and configuration, and thinking,
I think You should most definately contact someone who knows how
to setup a highend DI/Storage system.
Not an easy job, and asks for many years of experience.

Sometimes, paying more, is paying less in a long run.

Regards

Fredrik Harreschou

02-02-2009, 04:41 AM

Quadro SDI and Xena 2K card both in same Case is to much, im thing edit in premiere CS4 and CC in Strach to DPX film out, all in same server, is posible?

Rafael,

you get 10 bit SDI monitoring directly out of Premiere CS4 with the Quadro FX SDI when you work with R3D-files.

So for a RED workflow, the Xena isn't necessary.

RRafael

02-02-2009, 05:29 AM

Thx Frederick, but you work with both (scratch and Premiere) in same server, is posible? Edit Offline in CS4 and export EDL to Scratch for Color Correction and Scratch Export DPX Files.?

Rafael,

you get 10 bit SDI monitoring directly out of Premiere CS4 with the Quadro FX SDI when you work with R3D-files.

So for a RED workflow, the Xena isn't necessary.

Fredrik Harreschou

02-02-2009, 06:02 AM

Thx Frederick, but you work with both (scratch and Premiere) in same server, is posible? Edit Offline in CS4 and export EDL to Scratch for Color Correction and Scratch Export DPX Files.?

It works like a charm, actually.

The only downside would be that you cannot work on the SCRATCH system while editing. But if you are a one-man-band or a very small company, that might not be a problem. Bigger post houses would never let you book a DI room to edit.

Fredrik

RRafael

02-02-2009, 08:28 AM

Yeah! you are right, im not rental room for outside proyect for now! im a small filmaking company, use Edit and CC room to own proyects, but this reason buy a redone system.