new sensor

[Poi Boy]

Check this out, sound promising.
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2007/06/prweb530613.htm
Aloha
-A

[Sanjin Jukic]

Forza Mysterium 2.
RED TWO.

[Ben Ponce]

Here I am trying to deal with spending $25+k just to get a Red one...there's always something better on the horizon.

[Tom Lowe]

Are Forza the ones making Mysterium now?

What is the size of this new sensor?

[Sanjin Jukic]

Are Forza the ones making Mysterium now?

That is Jim's biggest secret. You can only guess.


What is the size of this new sensor?

33.2 Mega-pixel resolution, and features 12-bit on-chip ADCs.

Official web link
http://www.forzasilicon.com/

[PaulClements]

I think he means physical size Sanjin, if it's huge then of course 33.2 MP isn't that great in reality.

[Sanjin Jukic]

That's all we know now>>the official press release>>
http://www.forzasilicon.com/news/2007.06.04.FORZ-HD.pdf

[PaulClements]

Not sure the following are correct, but it'd give an indication of the difference in physical size if someone could do the math:

Red = 0.29 micron
Forza's = 0.18 micron

[Tom Lowe]

That is Jim's biggest secret. You can only guess.



33.2 Mega-pixel resolution, and features 12-bit on-chip ADCs.

Official web link
http://www.forzasilicon.com/

I mean what is the physical size?

[Paris Remillard]

It says 35mm format in a little link down to the right of the press release, under "Attached Files". I don't know if that means cine or stills 35mm though.

[jaadgy akanni]

Something tells me that the imminent release of RED ONe is forcing(scaring) many in the "sensor business" to rethink their evil plans to play the trickle-down-technology games and just come out with what they've got now before it's too late for it to matter. Did I say that right? lol

[Poi Boy]

I think that may be partially true but also I think the sensor market is developing very rapidly at this moment in time.
Aloha
-A

[Tom Lowe]

It says 35mm format in a little link down to the right of the press release, under "Attached Files". I don't know if that means cine or stills 35mm though.

I can't imagine packing 33 megapixels into a DLSR-crop-size sensor. It's gotta be 35mm still size.

[Tonaci Tran]

This aint gonna be cheap.

[J. Bernard Vallon]

Not sure the following are correct, but it'd give an indication of the difference in physical size if someone could do the math:

Red = 0.29 micron
Forza's = 0.18 micron

I don't think those numbers refer to the size of pixel wells, otherwise I get a sensor size of 3.25mm, and something totally incorrect for RED. Unless the actual pixel well represents very little real estate on a sensor's surface, (like mines in a minefield, lots of space in between), those numbers or my math are wrong.

I saw that .18 microns was taken from the press release. It might refer to something besides pixel well size. I dont understand sensor-magic as much as i'd like to.

[PaulClements]

I agree John, I tried to do the math last night and couldn't even work out how they got 29sq Micron for RedOne, though it was very late and I couldn't stay awake too well!!! :)

The closest I came is this:

square root of 29 = 5.3851648071345040312507104915403 (Which gives the width or height of the area on the sensor capturing a single pixel)

1000 / 5.3851648071345040312507104915403 = 185.69533817705186314657622384622 (Ammount per mm)

185.69533817705186314657622384622 x 24.4mm = 4530 Horizontal pixels
185.69533817705186314657622384622 x 13.72mm = 2548 Vertical pixels

So each pixel is captured on the Mysterium sensor by an area approx 5.4 Micron wide and high (I think lol). Theoretically therefore, if you know the size of the area of the sensor capturing a single pixel on a sensor and you know how many MP that sensor can capture you ought to be able to reverse the math and find out the physical size. But my brain hurts and this is probably all wrong lol :)

[Chuck T.]

There are several 4K+ imagers in the market today… but they are not cheep. I know of a sensor (CCD) that can run @ 30fps and better dynamic range than Mysterium sensor… but costs (only for the sensor) ~$50,000.

[J. Bernard Vallon]

Paul, if your right, and they accidentally put .18 microns when they meant 18 microns, and it describes the area of a pixel (not the height/width), than i get a sensor that is 32.6mm x 18.3mm

Assuming its a 16x9 sensor (safe assumption, it says HD in the name), it has a res of 7683x 4322

I get 4.24 microns width and height per pixel. Math says thats 32.6mm x 18.3mm, which is about 35mm still full frame. Awesome. Put it in my nikon. As compatition for red? people will have enough trouble focusing 4k on S35 sized sensor. 33mpxl on something that big would be suicide (your mad man!)

[Paris Remillard]

It's still smaller than Scope, in terms of format size real estate. So focusing shouldn't be any harder than on Scope.

I was just thinking. For a sensor with that kind of resolution, would it be possible or practical to make a bayer mask with ,say, every other pixel having an ND filter in addition to it's RG or B filter. Like an NDed offset of 4k. Then in the debayer, it could shift the image back that 1 pixel offset and give you in camera HDR @4k. If output was 4k, which really is gonna be enough for cinema for a while, wouldn't it be better to get in camera HDR to get a few more stops of highlight exposure, finally outperforming color neg film, than get 8k resolution which is overkill anyway? Just a thought.