delivery schedule

[lpchd]

is it true that the millenium chip is the Canon one from the 24x36 digital eos
as are the lenses also from Canon, that could explain the relatively cheap price of the glasses, but T-Stop should be a must

[Jaime Vallés]

Check this out:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1487

Should answer the basics. The Mysterium sensor is proprietary, I believe. Even if it is manufactured by Canon, nobody is spilling the beans at RED.

[Evin Grant]

I would be very surprised if Canon was making the chip.

[Eugene]

millenium chip
I Googled Millenium Chip"
http://mods.xkill.net/making/Millenium_Falcon_PC/cables.jpg
I think you mean Mysterium Chip, as in it's a mystery who makes it, as in the Red Team ain't gonna tell you if Canon makes it or not. I don't think they do, nor the lenses.

[Poi Boy]

is that the millenium falcon ?
-A

[Emanuel A.]

My $0.2 or €0.2:

http://www.millenniumbcp.pt/

EDIT -- I knew it: my bank is there -- they've always wanted to have my money... :)

[tj williams]

is it the Mysterium Falcon and the millineum chip or.....

For those of us terminally computer dumb... thats a board not a chip right????

[Fergus Meiklejohn]

:whistling: I'd be very surprised too if Canon was making the chip or the lenses. Canon and RED are potentially major competitors. If you think about it: Canon already make great DSLR chips and lenses that they want to sell and they have been in the Indie filmmaking market for some time (xl1.. xl2.. xlh1..) So it's a no brainer for Canon to seek to make a rival for RED. Whether they can solve all the many hurdles to making such a great camera at this price point is another question eh:weight_lift:
I don't care much. RED are designing a wonderful camera package. It's not a just a 4K chip, in it's ergonomics and workflow it seems to have been really well thought out.
But all this pre-June 15th conjecture still leaves the mystery unanswered of the Mysterium chip. I'm convinced they are being constructed by teams of highly trained Chinese mice, and Mr Jannard's last 5% nightmare is getting a system down to remove all their little paw prints from the front of the sensor (they have to push it on you see..):bye2:

[Jarred Land]

Canon makes some bad ass cameras ( my new mark III is a testament to that ) but there real strength isn't in sensor design but in DSP.

[Terry_Lasater]

MKIII, eh? Awesome! What L lenses do you own, Jarred?

[Tom Lowe]

My first guess would be that Forza is the manufacturer of the Mysterium. Their whole company was designed to provide stuff like cutting-edge CMOS sensors to companies with relatively low volume, at least initially.

[Sanjin Jukic]

I think it is a custom made CMOS chip that Jim paid for to a single person or a group of engineers like a chip designers. I think is not any particular company involved. Could be off corporate independent group or a person. It could be like this that Jim had a wish of 4K CMOS chip design and somebody said that could make it. And it happened. This kind of chip you could produce in Taiwan, Korea or California.

[Tom Lowe]

Forza is up in LA somewhere.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Forza is up in LA somewhere.

Pasadena, CA, USA
http://www.google.com/maps?q=Pasadena,+CA,+USA&sa=X&oi=map&ct=image
Forza Silicon Corporation>>have alook on the map
http://www.forzasilicon.com/contact.html

[Tom Lowe]

Any spottings of Jannard's various forms of transportation in Pasadena, people? :)

[Sanjin Jukic]

No way of these sort of "tracking". Mysterium also means a mysterious way of communicating with a chip designer(s). Otherwise competitors would "get an idea" soon about a chip design. It's a sort of high-tech silicon industry thriller. If they would catch you in that way you immediately loose.

[Tom Lowe]

yeah Jim would look a little conspicuous driving his tractor-trailer sized SUV up there. perhaps he rents a Hyundai for the trips? either that or Jim just communicates with them like Lord Sidious in Star Wars, a hologram of a mysterious hooded figure giving out instructions for the domination of world-wide digital cinema. :ph34r:

http://img164.imageshack.us/img164/6658/darthsidiousanddarthmaudk7.jpg

Lord Jannard: Begin the attack.

Forza Engineers: My Lord, is that legal?

Lord Jannard: I will make it legal.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Maybe Ted is doing all wearing a wig like Dustin Hoffman in Tootsie.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/516D3XER97L._SS500_.jpg

[albert rudnicki]

I don't thing it's relevant; with all do respect.
Let it be, just let it be....

[Poi Boy]

I love that mysterium is a mystery... I wonder how long they can keep it that way ? pretty hard thing to do.
Aloha
-A

[tj williams]

I love the idea of eastern European intrigue, escaped Nazi scientists, working with mysterium Russians in an underground bunker, on a small barren hill outside Prague.... "Move the jet under the cover Boris"....

[Poi Boy]

TJ, step away from the Martini shaker.. lol
Aloha
-A

[Sanjin Jukic]

My guess would be that it's developed by UniqueICs in Russia. Hence, the "Boris" and "Natasha" names for the prototypes. Not to mention "Red" for the company.

Then again... "I'm Batman."

If it would be Russian design then it would stay in Russia.
And already they've got it:

KINOR - DC4K - Digital CinemaCamera

http://www.kinor.ru/products/camera/dc4k/

http://www.kinor.ru/files/KinorCam_new2.jpg

[Jonathan L. Bowen]

Wow that's the ugliest thing I've ever seen...

[Sanjin Jukic]

And also don't forget that Jim's favorite pattern is a camouflage.

http://mi.oakley.com/images/catalog/generated/800x650/28/448495740be7b.jpg

http://mi.oakley.com/images/catalog/generated/800x650/4f/45d608f918cf7.jpg

http://mi.oakley.com/images/catalog/generated/800x650/e7/44b40a01aa99a.jpg

More>>
http://oakley.com/search/camouflage/relevance/2

All about Mysterium is camouflaged even the RED tent in NAB has got this flavor.

http://www.sanjinjukic.com/page3/files/red-nab-2007.jpg

[Sanjin Jukic]

Have a look

http://www.kinetta.com/images/12.04-Kinetta-web.jpg

and ask Jeff about shipping, etc...

http://www.kinetta.com/home.php

[Ramesh Jai]

I love the idea of eastern European intrigue, escaped Nazi scientists, working with mysterium Russians in an underground bunker, on a small barren hill outside Prague.... "Move the jet under the cover Boris"....
...And tell Natasha to bring a shot of Vodka..

[Peter Richardson]

I know who makes the sensor :)

[Rocco Schult]

I think it is a custom made CMOS chip that Jim paid for to a single person or a group of engineers like a chip designers. I think is not any particular company involved. Could be off corporate independent group or a person.

I bet on the one person theory :)

[David Wyatt]

I heard the lenses were made by Cooke...made in England :-)

[Brook Willard]

I heard the lenses were made by Cooke...made in England :-)

Speculation is speculation. I bet you didn't hear that from anybody who would actually know such things. As far as we mortals know, the lenses come from the same place that Mysterium does: RED.

[David Wyatt]

"As far as we mortals know, the lenses come from the same place that Mysterium does: RED."

Where they come from and where they're made are two different things ;-)

[Axel Mertes]

WHO cares where they come from?

MOST CMOS sensor companies have no single device to produce a CMOS wafer nor put the dies into a housings and such. So the one man or small team of scientists theory might be real. I do not think the guys are directly on Jim's payroll, because if they don't match the target he will not likely pay for nothing (we all know it is already working on prototypes, so thats out of question). But for such a "sensitive" component I'd expect him to have placed an order to an well suited engineering company with some history in that context. And there are more than you might think...

CMOS design is engineering, mainly. They make design with software and generate the files for lithography, send them off to asian CMOS fabs and get in return their "products". All they need is the software and knowledge of what they do.

Ok, it must not be asia in this case, but it could be and doesn't really matter in the end.

If you have like 500,000 to 1,000,000 US$ you can go to companies e.g. like Cypress / FillFactory and they make your custom chip if you like, from ground up. And there are many others that can do this. But be sure, THEY do not make the Mysterium, not to start something wrong here...

All I hope is that only kind of camouflage like pattern involved in the Mysterium chip looks like a well aligned Bayer pattern and nothing else. Or who wants a 4K sepia tone camera :)) Me not, not in first place...

Axel

[Tom Lowe]

I know who makes the sensor :)

:detective2: oh yeah?

[Tom Lowe]

If it would be Russian design then it would stay in Russia.
And already they've got it:

KINOR - DC4K - Digital CinemaCamera

http://www.kinor.ru/products/camera/dc4k/

http://www.kinor.ru/files/KinorCam_new2.jpg

LMAO, how are you going to buy a 4K cinema camera from a company that presents a photo on its front page of its camera looking like it was taken with a fucking fax machine. hahaha.

[Kenn Christenson]

Camera can double as lunch box.

[Alexander Nikishin]

LMAO, how are you going to buy a 4K cinema camera from a company that presents a photo on its front page of its camera looking like it was taken with a fucking fax machine. hahaha.

Hey now, don't ever judge a book by its cover. :sarcasm:

[Alexander Nikishin]

I heard the lenses were made by Cooke...made in England :-)

I've said it time and time again, the 18-50 displayed at the RED booth at NAB read "Made in the UK" on the bottom, I SWEAR.

[Peter Richardson]

I do, but it would probably be better if I didn't say anything. However, if memory serves, someone on another post got it right. Time to do some digging :)

Peter

[Alexander Nikishin]

I do, but it would probably be better if I didn't say anything. However, if memory serves, someone on another post got it right. Time to do some digging :)

Peter

Sureeee you know. :detective2:

[Joel Kaye]

I just called the psychic hotline and Esmeralda (x216) told me her crystal ball indicates the first RED's will ship August 13th. Should I ask for a refund?

[ATF]

August 13th?! Thats my birthday! NICE!

ATF

[Adrian T.]

August 13th?! Thats my birthday!

...and Sir Alfred Hitchcock's too. :tongue:

[Peter Richardson]

From what I know, I don't think the mysterium maker will be a mystery forever. That is a hard secret to keep :)

Peter

[Joel Kaye]

...and Sir Alfred Hitchcock's too. :tongue:

That would make a pretty good ship date... but I hope it's sooner.

[planet e]

well, that's freaky. that's my birthday as well...

<cue twilight zone theme music>

[reality]

My first guess would be that Forza is the manufacturer of the Mysterium. Their whole company was designed to provide stuff like cutting-edge CMOS sensors to companies with relatively low volume, at least initially.

My guess is it's not Forza. I have a friend that works closely with Forza and he thinks it's not them but most likely IBM instead.

[dj29]

yes forza just makes cell phone chips. Red's sensor team is in house.

Right Jarred?

[Jarred Land]

Red's sensor team is in house.

Right Jarred?

thats correct...our sensor guys have been in-house since way back.

not sure if was supposed to just say that :)

[Sanjin Jukic]

I think that Graeme Nattress is a leading guy in the idea of Mysterium chip design but unfortunetaly he is not a sensor engineer.
Maybe you don't need to be a sensor engineer at all but you know well and clear what you need to achieve with a sensor design.
And all those Russians conspiracy stories are just a perfect camouflage.

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/ww/news/2007/06/15/0615kodakfull.jpg

[Michael Schrengohst]

Проект датчика - одна область, которая КРАСНЫЙ
внутреннее управление задачами. Из-за числа
ненадежные субподрядчики мы имели
нанимать и обучать всех наших высших людей.
Они поклялись allegience КРАСНОМУ
и если они пропускают какую-нибудь информацию они
будет выполнен!

[Sanjin Jukic]

?????? ??????? - ???? ???????, ??????? ???????
?????????? ?????????? ????????. ??-?? ?????
?????????? ????????????? ?? ?????
???????? ? ??????? ???? ????? ?????? ?????.
??? ????????? allegience ????????
? ???? ??? ?????????? ?????-?????? ?????????? ???
????? ????????!


Using Google language tools automatic translation from Russian to English (BETA):

"The sensor is one area that RED internal management challenges. Because of unreliable contractors, we had to hire and train all of our senior people. They vowed allegience KRASNOMU and if they miss any information they will be executed."

One more Russian joke.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Thanks. Frau Regista you rock. A good translation.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Bitte schön, Frau Regista!

[Adrian T.]

BTW... that'd be "Herr Regista" to you, mein führer.

There it is again, Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_Law). :wacko:

[Sanjin Jukic]

Regista is my favorite member of this forum.

Anyway here there is no audience to discuss politics or gender issues.

[Curran Giddens]

are you making fun of Regista's 70's haircut?

[Adrian T.]

Promise to change the pix to a more current one (albeit with a crew cut) once I get my RED.

with a crew cut? You rather mean with a haircut? :)

[Adrian T.]

:poster_oops:

[jbeale]

This is quite old news, but since I hadn't seen it mentioned...

http://www.forzasilicon.com/news.html

"Pasadena, California – June 4, 2007: Forza Silicon Corporation announced today the availability of its groundbreaking proprietary FORZ-HD™ CMOS imaging technology which supports frame rates up to 60 fps, proven at 33.2 Mega-pixel resolution, and features 12-bit on-chip ADCs. FORZ-HD™ technology is targeted for high resolution, high-speed, high dynamic range
digital cameras used in professional photography or digital cinematography, and in medical, biotech, scientific, satellite and defense industries."

Wikipedia's RED article currently claims the Mysterium is designed by Forza Silicon, but I didn't see a source listed for that, so I'd guess that's "speculation".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Digital_Cinema_Camera_Company