How in the world are we going to Post our 4k footage?????

[Daniel Gourley]

I was thinking about the first screen grabs and clips that will be posted...

Is everyone going to post in 1k format like the RED Team and maybe include a 4K still???

I remember the beginings of the HVX200 when it demoed. Was like a madhouse for new footage and some posters were even asking for the MXF's to be posted online so they could import them to FCP. I almost fainted at that thought with 1080, I can't even imagine about 4K.

What do you guys think?

[Jarred Land]

remember.. the 4k REDCODE files open in quicktime natively, and play back extracted in realtime.

[Daniel Gourley]

So we are talking about putting REDCODE straight up on the web or is it that we have the Easy-sounding ability to encode to a QT H.264 codeq for web viewing???

[Craig W. Bickerstaff]

until the 4k displays come out I think we should stick to 2k quicktime h.264 at the most.

Or maybe even 1080p

[Jaime Vallés]

Shoot 4K Redcode RAW
Edit on FCP at 1K resolution
Export from FCP at everything from 1080p to iPod size.

Or am I missing something?

[Daniel Gourley]

Shoot 4K Redcode RAW
Edit on FCP at 1K resolution
Export from FCP at everything from 1080p to iPod size.

Or am I missing something?

I am talking about posting footage online. Not a "Post Workflow..."

[Mark K.]

I think 1k footage will be fine for the purposes of viewing. The "Crossing the Line" footage showed everything clearly enough to judge its quality, who's going to have 4k monitors to view the footage on anyway?

[Jonathan L. Bowen]

If you take 4K footage and downsize it to 1080p it's going to look really amazing still. I mean that'll be adequate for almost any purpose.... in the future if you have the 4K files for something, and you somehow wanted to show it in a theater with a 4K projection system way down the road, of course you'd be able to do that. That's the beauty...

But I understand the original poster's question. I'm really not good yet with figuring out what to export my files as using compressor. It keeps making files I don't really want, I'm still familiarizing myself with what is best. I know perfectly what I want to make a DVD, I've been doing that for a long time, but figuring out what's best to put it up on the Web or whatever is what I'm having more trouble with. I also personally think it's retarded that it even has an option of exporting 16:9 footage in a 4:3 format, because there's NO REASON anyone would ever want to do that. If you take that footage and crunch it into 4:3, which is what compressor does to you sometimes when you have no idea it will do that, it ends up looking horrible. If you were going to make it for 4:3, which nobody would do anymore anyway, you would at least not do that to it. So I don't get it...

[Petr Dvorak]

4K will be fine :wink:

1080p is minimum

[Justin Anderson]

I was thinking about the first screen grabs and clips that will be posted...

Is everyone going to post in 1k format like the RED Team and maybe include a 4K still???

I remember the beginings of the HVX200 when it demoed. Was like a madhouse for new footage and some posters were even asking for the MXF's to be posted online so they could import them to FCP. I almost fainted at that thought with 1080, I can't even imagine about 4K.

What do you guys think?

YouTubePlus+

[oldphart]

4K will be fine :wink:

1080p is minimum

The only sensible thing is to post it as a .torrent file. It is easy on the server and robust against temporary faults - and the bandwidth expense is fairly divided.

[Shane Betts]

Shoot 4K Redcode RAW
Edit on FCP at 1K resolution
Export from FCP at everything from 1080p to iPod size.

Or am I missing something?

I see no need to downsize in FCP. Redcode RAW is small enough to play fine as it is. It's only for playback in a cinema (where they will have players, not edit machines and so lack the CPU power to decode on the run) will the Redcode RAW be unsuitable.

There are currently solutions from Blackmagic and AJA that display 2k on a 30" Cinema Display but any (24fps capable) monitor will show you the whole image, just not pixel-for-pixel.

Not being able to see the footage natively on 4k screens is an issue but it's never stopped anyone shooting films on 24fps 35mm and cutting on Avid, at compressed SD at 29.97 or 25! You just need to schedule and budget for a final check process for focus/dust & scratch before you order a print.

Until the 4k monitoring solutions appear, (probably a year away or less and probably before most of us are in post on our first Red feature) specific work like SFX and dust & scratch can be done by zooming into the frame to see (parts of it) at native size as it's done in post houses around the world now. No problem - it's just time and remember, you're doing it in your bedroom, not at a post facility at thousands of bucks a day.

Of course, there's no doubt it's going to be very very cool when we can see it pixel-for-pixel. Anyone who's seen 35mm transferred to uncompressed 1080p 10 bit on a 23" Cinema Display will know what I mean. 4K is going to be awesome!

But Jaime's dead on for posting on the net, I don't see the reason for the confusion. Doesn't matter what you're coming from, so long as you have a Quicktime you just whack it into Compressor and specify what size you want it out at.

Only question I have Pretopost is, if you're intending to only publish on the net, what do you want with 4k anyway? - why not just shoot on mini DV and save on focus hassles?

[Mark L. Pederson]

I'd love to be able to stream a 1/16th extraction over the web without a transcode, so someone off-site could view footage without the need for a rendered proxy -

[P Andersson]

I'd love to be able to stream a 1/16th extraction over the web without a transcode, so someone off-site could view footage without the need for a rendered proxy -

This would be a very good feature on the RED

Dslrs allows you to capture both a raw file and a jpg at chosen quality at the same time, clients can have a preview of the entire material with this smaller file. The automatic website builder in photoshop is quick with small jpgs.

Since it seems the RED's raw files will play a smaller resolution without any rendering, it would be great if it was also possible to get that information with a simple drag and drop kind of thing. Or if REDCINE could export a smaller file for web purposes much faster than realtime.


remember.. the 4k REDCODE files open in quicktime natively, and play back extracted in realtime.


For the purposes of showing stuff here on REDUSER it would be great to have both a couple of frames of the original 4k REDCODE and then a little longer version that streams easily over the web, whatever that is.

[Stephen Gentle]

The only sensible thing is to post it as a .torrent file. It is easy on the server and robust against temporary faults - and the bandwidth expense is fairly divided.

I don't think that will really work - torrents only work well if you have (at least) a few seeders.

Although I reckon it would be a good idea to have a server seeding it, so it would be like a normal download if there were no other seeders, and then like normal bittorrent once a few people had got the file and started seeding it.

[Jeremy Hughes]

Encode in ProRes 422 at 4K.

Hey, why not post some of that uncompressed 2540p60 too? But debayer it first. :)

[Jaime Vallés]

I am talking about posting footage online. Not a "Post Workflow..."

Oh. Duh! Nevermind. These aren't the droids you're looking for... Move along.

[Fix]

Many people jumped at the HD revolution many years ago and are stucked with 720p res TV (LCD/plasma). Even a lot of folks have 1680x1050 res monitors and cant "see" 1920x1080 in its full glory. Most laptop users do not have the chance to see 1080p without external monitor (many of those guys).

So...Sum up, I think most people prefer 1k from the internett. Easy for light computers, pleasant for the eye if coded right, and ok download time.

1080p is nice if you have a 40”+ tv. If you want to show 2k+, than use a projector or go for the cinema.

Test:
Sit 4m in front of a 37” screen and compare 1080p-720p… There’s not that much difference in most cases from that distanceIMO. Download trailers from quicktime for reference and check it out. Put your mother in front of the screen and ask her after what difference she saw. (PS! I haven’t tried this, but I can imagine the result hehe) “OMG that is a fri*** high res picture! I Can see every pixel in there!... Is that from RED by the way?” Love my mom.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

until the 4k displays come out I think we should stick to 2k quicktime h.264 at the most.

Or maybe even 1080p

For some stuff, yeah... But a lot of us are dying to work with actual 4K redcode footage. It would be a shame if we had to look at down-sampled, re-encoded 2K/1080p stuff for the next several months until our cameras showed up. :)

But I think you're right for just showing off a lot of our works. Bandwidth considerations alone would necessitate some downconverts, I would think.

[Daniel Gourley]

Only question I have Pretopost is, if you're intending to only publish on the net, what do you want with 4k anyway? - why not just shoot on mini DV and save on focus hassles?

It is not for web distro but I was alluding to those of us who grew up on DVXUSER with the online posting of DVX and HVX content.

I guess since I haveno footage to post, I guess dreaming of how to out it is the next best thing :whistling:

[Rocco Schult]

I'd love to be able to stream a 1/16th extraction over the web without a transcode, so someone off-site could view footage without the need for a rendered proxy -

Problem is that the realtime proxy generated by quicktime is in no way meant to be streamed. What you see on the screen is actually an uncompressed picture coming from the CPU to the graphics.
I am also trying to figure out a way to do it. Got a concrete idea, but still has to be tested.

[GFOX]

4K for web? Just for tests proposes.
1K or 720p will look amazing to delivery for web! Even 1080p I think is too much for web delivery.

But for test proposes I think 4K footage should be avaible. At least something about 10 clips.

Chromakey clips inclusive