youtube

[djbombsquad]

I just got done shooting and editing directing etc with a AD from san diego and I wanted to know peoples opinion on this. My goal is to reinvest the winnings to get the red camera. It was the youtube heinz contest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ophbWdbiccY
Currently there is a issue as to it being on the heinz section which should be sorted out. Feed back would be great as I am learning and any thing to make me improve. I saw most the videos there and seems to me that me and my friend were doing this as a serious project vs just a CONTEST. I want to add this to my resumé if it wins. I covered all 3 categories which is
(#1) Originality (40%)
(#2) Overall Appeal (30%)
(#3) Likelihood to Motivate People to Eat Heinz Ketchup (30%)


We did not use any of the footage that heinz provided as that I believe would not give me points for #1 which is Originality. I think #2 we hit with punch lines and #3 we made it clear that Heinz is the choice people want.
Please give me as much feed back.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Why is Heinz innovative and fresh?
Who calls the generic rotten?
What does voting for heinz in 08 mean?
Who's the snarky ***** representing Heinz? Why do I want to trust her with anything? The generic is far more approachable and likeable.
Applause sound > enthusiasm of crowd.

The first line is:
"My opponents have run a smear campaign" which usually has the connotation that they're lieing and manufacturing false information. The second line is.... a smear campaign. This immediately robs the reporter of all objectivity and frames her as nothing more than a political shill out working for heinz.

Why does a political candidate come up to the podium, announce that the opponent is using dirty tactics and then immediately begin taking questions, aren't they going to first explain how great they are and then take questions afterwords?

-- You say toemaetoe I say Toemahtoe
-- But heinz is innovative and fresh

Why is she saying "but"? But is short hand for disagreement. Is she disagreeing that one person pronounces tomato differently? If you want to convey that she's ignoring the response to her question as jibberish then consider adding an agreement. "Yes, but..."

If you break down the talking points it comes out to be:

Generic: People are spreading lies about me!
Heinz Shill: You are rotten!
Generic: Jibberish
Heinz Shill: Whatever, Heinz is awesome!
Generic: I can be awesome too!
Heinz Shill: Ewww Old Lesbian
Generic: It was all a misunderstanding! I'm senile and old!
Heinz Shill: Sure glad I already had my mind made up before even asking a question! No convincing necessary!

You need to provide reasons why Heinz is superior. The generic needs to embarass itself on its own without someone provoking it. The audience's connection needs to be someone they can like and identify with. Your reporter is not fulfilling this roll because she's obviously a corporate shill. If a neutral third party were to vote for Heinz (whatever that means.. does that mean voting for Kerry?) then I might go along with it because they're someone I can trust.

You're burning a lot of precious seconds with the smear campaign subplot, it advances nothing favorable to Heinz. Same with "you say tomaeto I say tomahto" and use your audience more. That's who we care about.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

What Gavin said...

The "I'm voting for Heinz in '08" lady isn't likable, she's condescending, she rolls her eyes and shakes her head in a negative manner... The "generic lady" is saucy and fun. Seriously, you should have reversed the Heinz and Generic roles and put a Heinz bottle costume on the lady at the podium. Tweak the dialogue a bit and there's your ad spot. The funny Heinz bottle would have the same attitude, with a fun, lively answer to any question thrown at her. Don't even mention a negative or smear campaign in the dialogue, it's irrelevant, use that brief moment of time for something more constructive. Maybe find a way to out the annoying lady asking questions as a generic ketchup or competitor brand.

All water under the bridge now though, as I suppose there's no going back or doing a new one.

How is ketchup innovative?

[Priyesh P.]

to me, the actress of the journalist is doing too much overacting. Besides that I accede with Walt's points.

BTW, McDonald's or Kraft's Ketchup have their own qualitites.

Edit: To add to Jeff's words, what about using two bottles? Heinz and the generic one? Ads, so far let people present products. What if letting the product speak for itself (latest example for this I've seen is a series of spots for subway where a muppets-like sandwich is the central role)

http://www.lommelludwig.de/movie2.html - only in german

[Jeff Kilgroe]

to me, the actress of the journalist is doing too much overacting.

I kinda thought that too... She has all the acting finesse of a porn set extra. ...That was kinda rude, but that's one of the first things that popped into my mind on my first viewing. But even with overacting, she still could have come across in a positive and likable way, but she doesn't. For this type of production a little bit of cheesy overacting never hurt. :biggrin:

[Priyesh P.]

I kinda thought that too... She has all the acting finesse of a porn set extra.

*LOL*

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Heinz Shill: Ewww Old Lesbian

Lesbian ketchup.... What will they think of next?

But I do have to ask, if I put it on my deluxe cheeseburger, will the flavor still mingle alright with the pickles?

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Bi-Ketchup.

[djbombsquad]

Well 1st I only had 30 seconds so I had to chop 2 min 30 seconds of footage down to 30 seconds. My boss had forgoten that the contest was a 30 second contest so we did not have any time to re write the script.
I am glad you guys are giving me constrictive criticism. I can't re shoot as my funding is out for flying the ladys out from NY. I am in CA. Plus when I saw the other videos most used again as I said before we did not use any of the footage that heinz provided which follows under catagory 1 for the 40% mark. Most footage people shot was pearly just to have fun. If I was to get rated for (#1) Originality (40%)
(#2) Overall Appeal (30%)
(#3) Likelihood to Motivate People to Eat Heinz Ketchup (30%)
Can you rate me. My goal was to be just a slight better than the rest of the contestants.

[John Moores]

Oh.
I thought the ketchup bottle WAS Heinz.

[djbombsquad]

Seriously? It looks as generic as ketchup can be.

[John Moores]

Yeah, I didn't get the whole concept that this was generic ketchup.
We never even see a bottle of Heinz, or a Heinz logo in the spot, which I'm sure is an advertising no no. (not to show your product)
Not sure what you can do about it now though.

I guess I thought going in "Heinz Ketchup", so assumed the first ketchup I saw was supposed to be Heinz. And then I was wondering, "Why is the nice bottle of Heinz being attacked by that snotty reporter?"

[Priyesh P.]

Dear DJBS (sorry, didn't find your real name),
please (please!) don't be offended by my former and this statement. But in my personal rating that spot simply doesn't work well.
I think that cut-down to 30s may have contributed to the damage, but really it looks too chumming up in favor of Heinz - I know that most of all spots do so, but overall it's a better idea to let consumers get interested and attracted by a product rather than trying to push them into it.
A rating by us would be too diffuse and useless for you anyways since it won't help you to pick out the weak points.

[djbombsquad]

I am glad the board is letting me know this. Yes the 30 seconds did totally mess us up but regardless. At the looks of the other videos ( I did look at over 300 of them )though I think ours at least covers all 3 judging categories and even if each category does not meet the 40% 30% 30% All I have to get is above 30% 20% and 20% and I should be good. I broke it down to a science. Over half the people used the directors tools which http://www.topthistv.com/tools.aspx can be found here. That to me takes away from the 40%. That alone should take away from others competing in this.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

(#1) Originality (40%)
(#2) Overall Appeal (30%)
(#3) Likelihood to Motivate People to Eat Heinz Ketchup (30%)
Can you rate me. My goal was to be just a slight better than the rest of the contestants.

#1) 50/100 *.4 = 20%
#2) 30/100 *.3 = 09%
#3) 20/100 *.3 = 06%
------------------------
35%

[Tom Lowe]

LMAO that Gavin was brave enough to actually critique this thing. :)

[djbombsquad]

How does it compare to this http://youtube.com/contests_layout?name=TopThisTVChallenge&v=xwOJF-_7CkM&goto=550 ?

[John Moores]

It's bad. (the link above)
I like 547 and 562.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Don't worry, all my criticism is entirely constructive and said with love. :biggrin:

Anyway, looking at it from the point of view of an ad exec, I would choose the old guy singing about Heinz in the diner. It's annoying, but I only viewed it once and the whole thing is still in my brain several minutes later without trying to remember it. And that's 30 seconds of air time with the product filling half of the screen. In your ad, Other than the shilling reporter lady saying "Heinz" twice, there's no indication it has anything to do with Heinz ketchup at all. Except for the dissolve to the Heinz logo at the end. But as soon as it's in at 100%, bam - off to the next ad spot, hope the network doesn't cut it short.

Did I understand you right... You flew talent from NY to CA and shot less than 3 minutes of footage??? :blink:

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Haha I like the old singing guy. That song is catchy. "MMmmm!" Banjo + Heinz just seems like a perfect mix it gives gravitas and age to the heinz brand. If some old dude is willing to shell out money for name brand ketchup then there must be something to it. I bet he washes and reuses ziplock bags.

#1) 70/100 *.4 = 28%
#2) 50/100 *.3 = 15%
#3) 75/100 *.3 = 22.5%
------------------------
65.5%

[djbombsquad]

It's bad. (the link above)
I like 547 and 562.
As for #547 it is not orginal which is the 40% part. They used the directors tool which imo takes out the orginal part. That alone is 40%.

Now 562 I though was not bad but slow. Never even says the word Heinz. So to me I don't think of the Heinz ketchup till the very end when they show Heinz.

We did fly the ladys out. We have the money.
That is why when RED camera comes out We are going to get one. Time for a upgrade. :)

[Jason Francois]

Unfortunately advertising as well as judging is not really a science.

The first mistake you made was looking at what you thought was inferior product, applying mathematics to it and then jumping into the contest....rather than just focusing on doing the best that you can regardless. Some of the competition may have done just that, but don't have the same skill set as you.

Also, the best is yet to come. Most of the more professional product in contests like this come closer to the end. You should have looked at the best of what you thought was the worst and then said, "I have to compete with something 10-times better than this".

There is a chance that a contest like this will be won by somebody with very little film equipment or resources, but an amazing idea, so if yours isn't quite working get out there and do another one on whatever resources you have.

Just my opinions.

J.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I think you're missing the point of "original". Using corporate iconography doesn't make it more or less original. It's about the concept.

[Eugene]

Sorry djbombsquad, but I am going to do a Simon cowell.
http://www.bizofshowbiz.com/uploads/cowe-thumb.jpg

[Eugene]

The winner will be entry #555, dancing fries. That is what I predict.
All these contests are rigged. You ain't going to win. Remember Lonelygirl15. Suckers thought that was real. This contest is for people that are naive and think that they really have a chance of winning.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I think these contests are brilliant. I'm sure someone will create a great ad. ~$40k for a free TV ad plus additional marketing by people trying to think of ways to like your product in the process. Pure producing gold.

[Eugene]

I like entry #395. I was too harsh on you Dj. Compared to most of the other entrys, yours looks pretty good.

[Eugene]

I watched #407. I can't stop laughing. :w00t:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=512U3Bjk8TI

[Bruce Allen]

I can't re shoot as my funding is out for flying the ladys out from NY. I am in CA.

Maybe I am not understanding something, but did you just say you paid to fly those two women in? You know that the reporter can't act, right?

When we say re-shoot, you know we mean from scratch, right? I think you might find one or two actors within driving distance of you in CA if you are lucky.

Maybe this is some kind of surreal joke that I am not getting. I feel like I have slipped into After Hours or something. But then, I just came back from the Key Arts, where I watched someone get an award for "Best Theatrical Standee" (that is, those free-standing printed cardboard things that they put outside movie theaters to promote the movie...). And after that Rose McGowan. And then lots of drinks. Now I come home and read this. I am afraid to sleep now because I'm afraid I'll miss things even more weird and wonderful!

Anyway, DJ, we look forward to seeing your next entry! Don't let your boss plan it for you, just try to come up with something really original and good.

It's not as if you just filmed a bridge blowing up... you can definitely do this again and budget should not be an issue. But I would work on the concept more.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

[Clayton Harper]

Three words: bad actors talking.

There are obvious technical issues with the piece but if you work hard, you will learn how to make professional images as it is mechanical.

As for the idea:

1) How could you have expressed these ideas visually?
2) How could you have iterated the core idea across different setting?
3) How could you have cut down the talking?
4) Is it supposed to be funny because it's topical? EEK!
5) Could the idea have been transferred to a different setting that gives the characters something to do?
6) How does the setting change the mood of the piece
7) Is it funnier to show a candidate running for office or losing an office? I know which one is more dramatic
8) What is it about the performance of the actors I like? Will other people like it for the same reason?

[djbombsquad]

I like entry #395. I was too harsh on you Dj. Compared to most of the other entrys, yours looks pretty good.

Well like I said most (over 60-80%) was very lame honestly. I mean seriously if mine sucked that bad than the rest sucked even worse. I don't feel that bad any more now that I am looking at all the entrys. Plus I hate the quality of youtube with flash. I wish they would switch over to h264 as soon as possible.

http://www.youtube.com/contests_layout?name=TopThisTVChallenge&v=k6BqC4MZenY&goto=517 Lame
http://www.youtube.com/contests_layout?name=TopThisTVChallenge&v=ey0Z5CE4a7M&goto=521 seriously?

http://www.youtube.com/contests_layout?name=TopThisTVChallenge&v=OB1pUFIif8A&goto=523 yawn.

Well hope for the best of my video and I win.

[C.H.Haskell]

Yeah I put together a quick short for the Nintendo contest, also saving up for my RED reservation.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h-Qw6uZMIdM

We had a lot of fun producing this film and are proud of the result but Nintendo was not I suppose...we never made the cut and I felt most entries were pretty bad.
http://www.nintendoshortcuts.com/launch/

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Yeah I put together a quick short for the Nintendo contest, also saving up for my RED reservation.

I would say you could have accomplished the same thing to greater effect in half the time (or less). It just felt like it was dragging on...

[C.H.Haskell]

I agree, soon after I sent it and reviewed it (in that order) I knew it was way too long, so I cut it in half...less is more, much better. We only had a few days to make it so it was kinda rushed.

[Tom Lowe]

Definitely loved the sound and visuals, Haskell. But yeah, WAAAY too long. Just stick with your best parts.

How did you do that shaking effect, BTW?

[C.H.Haskell]

Thanks tom, the sad thing about youtube is so much info is lost. I guess I should not be working with an HD projector throwing an 8 foot screen for a monitor when it ends up on on a 2 inch you tube window.

Although the beginning was way too long, the black void is actually filled with all kinds of environment elements, ie particles and space dust/clouds that you cant see in the you tube version.

This was my 1st and most likely last post to youtube, but I suppose I have a few things to learn about exporting the best quality QuickTime’s for the web.

I did here Google bought YouTube so I suppose some things may change.

Oh and Tom, I believe its called the “Earthquake” filter in the new FCP 6, under the Distort Tab. I liked it, some hate post frame shake etc but I feel this one is pretty good.

[Tom Lowe]

Dude, I share your pain. My star timelapses at night get totally destroyed by the youtube compression scheme. You should check out Stage 6 and the new Azureus Vuze, if you haven't already.

Stage 6 is pretty awesome quality. You upload divx files, and people can either watch them online ala youtube, or download them directly right from Stage 6, at very high server speeds, all paid for by Stage 6.

I ended up posting my malick video there and am pretty happy with the quality. The little DIVX converter tool took an uncompressed, 15GB, 10-minute AVI at 720x354 and compressed it down to under 100 MBs.

http://stage6.divx.com/user/malickfan/video/1289613/Terrence-Malick-Tribute

And here is a link to Vuze, which is basically a sort of indexing add-on for the Azureus bit torrent client.

http://www.vuze.com

[C.H.Haskell]

Great Tom, I will check it out thanks.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

The problem with "being better than everyone else who is also lame" (besides lowering your own standards) is that it only takes one person with some talent and a great idea to win. You can be better than 99.9% of the contestants and it won't matter in the end if someone actually puts some effort into it.