we pay +20% for low #red contract

[john4321]

pay up 20% for a low# red contract
2-3 Red's needed.

[Sam Druckerman]

pay up 20% for a low# red contract
2-3 Red's needed.

Red reservations are Not transferable.

[Steve Gibby]

pay up 20% for a low# red contract
2-3 Red's needed.

RED reservations are non-transferable. Your alternatives are to rent low number REDs, or hire owner/operators who own low number REDs.

[Teague Kennedy]

I think he meant post shipment.

[beatniq]

Not to mention the fact that 20% ain't sh*t...

I wouldn't be surprised if a RED ONE sold on ebay for double its cost once it's released.

[Noah Kadner]

I'd say go 100% or more before you'll get any interest. Low number holders aren't dumb...

[Steve Gibby]

I think he meant post shipment.

IMO it would be a big mistake by low reservation number holders to sell off their cameras after they receive them. I know I wouldn't even entertain the idea. I've waited for RED One since December 2005 and I reserved #8 on the very first day reservations were available. I have a long docket of D-cinema features, HDTV series, stock footage sessions, commercials, etc. scheduled for 2007-08. No amount of money would persuede me to sell off either of my RED One camera systems. In fact, I wish I'd have reserved the maximum of five cameras on the first day of reservations when I reserved #8. I plan to use my RED One camera systems to generate significant income that would dwarf any markup I could receive for them in a sell-off.

[Roberto B]

come on.. they can BUY and anyone can sell.. i won't also because i'm in the middle of a group.. but let's be grown up people.. okay?.. i'm with shawn.. some of this redish wave is insane..

jj is not GOD.. the red customers will be owners of their own equipment because they/we are owners of their/our own money.. this doesn't mean that i will sell mine.. as i said i'll have only a part of one unit.. and i couldn't or wouldn't sell it at all.. but let's stop with this silly fanboyish.. all in life must have some or a few limits..


enough said..

[Nik Manning]

Not to mention the fact that 20% ain't sh*t...

I wouldn't be surprised if a RED ONE sold on ebay for double its cost once it's released.

let the guy make his offer. Whats wrong with that. someone here might need it if they get into a jam.

[beatniq]

let the guy make his offer. Whats wrong with that. someone here might need it if they get into a jam.

In what way am I stopping him from making his offer?

[John Moores]

If it's RED policy that reservations aren't transferable, then that's that, they have the right to set whatever policy they want. Once the camera's ship people can do whatever they want with them.

However, I find it very unlikely that any of the early res holders would ever want to part with something they've been eagerly awaiting for over a year. I certainly never would.
Jm

[Sam Druckerman]

This is Reduser.

Posting a request that is forbidden by Red is rude.

John didn't do his home work before posting.....

Which was a rookie mistake, I understand that... He's excited about RED and wants to use it.

But for him or others to press the point is not right.

You don't come to someones home and disrespect them.

I couldn't agree more with everything Gibby has stated.

[Otto]

pay up 20% for a low# red contract
2-3 Red's needed.
FORGET THIS STUPID IDEA MAN! Nobody will sell! Your dreaming...

[Elijah Kelley]

This is Reduser.

Posting a request that is forbidden by Red is rude.

John didn't do his home work before posting.....

Which was a rookie mistake, I understand that... He's excited about RED and wants to use it.

But for him or others to press the point is not right.

You don't come to someones home and disrespect them.

I couldn't agree more with everything Gibby has stated.

Wait just one minute! I have a RED res and don't plan on selling BUT I thought we still lived in a capitalist society. If we didn't then there would probably be a state controlled electronics board that would forbid Jannard or the RED team from circumventing what is and has been a cash cow to the more popular manufacturers.

So what if the guy wants to reserve a RED from a RED reservee what disrespectful about that. Some people might have rescheduled shoots because of the delay and can wait a little longer now. Get off of this kick you all are on. This is a piece of equiptment used to tell stories not the cure for world disease or hunger. Do what you will with what will be yours and allow the next person to do the same. Stop the madness. Go make a movie.

[PeteCoggan]

pay up 20% for a low# red contract
2-3 Red's needed.
Yep, gonna need to do ALOT better than 20%. Those of us who have had a res (or in my case 2) since NAB '06 are due at least that in interest. Yes, I know where prime is, but you get my point. Ya know what, I'll throw out 25% right now to anyone willing to give me a serial number lower than my 2 (106 and 107) What, NO TAKERS?!

[Jonathan L. Bowen]

I'll sell mine for a 40% markup, and since I just ordered it like two months ago, you're not going to get it very much earlier than if I just place another order right now. ;) But hey a few weeks is good right? haha.

[Michael Hastings]

So what if the guy wants to reserve a RED from a RED reservee what disrespectful about that. Some people might have rescheduled shoots because of the delay and can wait a little longer now. Get off of this kick you all are on. This is a piece of equiptment used to tell stories not the cure for world disease or hunger. Do what you will with what will be yours and allow the next person to do the same. Stop the madness. Go make a movie.

I agree that it is a piece of equipment not the solution to world hunger, and that might be relevant for some fanboy posts, but this is different. It's rude because they are trying to use the red forum to do something red has tried to discourage. If he wants to post a buyer request on ebay, cinematography.com, etc. that's fine and that is what he should do.

I make a product, as do others on reduser, and all of us have tried to be sensitive to the spirit of Reduser. In other words, we try to speak of our products in terms of more general discussion, how it might work, how it might be made better, educating about the design issues, etc. But we try not to make reduser an out an out sales tool. Nobody's trying to censor anyone - just trying to keep reduser an interesting and useful forum - with a certain spirit that stems from the nature of the RED development itself.

[Sam Druckerman]

Wait just one minute! I have a RED res and don't plan on selling BUT I thought we still lived in a capitalist society. If we didn't then there would probably be a state controlled electronics board that would forbid Jannard or the RED team from circumventing what is and has been a cash cow to the more popular manufacturers.


Eleeahoo, chill.

I have not posted anything in regards to what people will do, could or should do with there camera after they receive it.

Of course people have every right to do what they want with the camera after purchase.



So what if the guy wants to reserve a RED from a RED reservee what disrespectful about that.

Jim has made it clear that RED reservations are Non-transferable. And Reduser is the house of RED.

That's why it's disrespectful.

A discussion that disrespects Jim, or Red is not appropriate here. People wanting to have that type of discussion should do it somewhere else.

Now, I've been following RED since December 2005... You might notice that I have Red #81 reserved. That means that I placed my order for Red on the very first day it was available.... Monday morning first day of Nab 2006.

Maybe I've been around here long enough to know what's up.

I would appreciate it if you could express your thoughts in a less adversary way.

Thanks.

[PeteCoggan]

Wait just one minute! I have a RED res and don't plan on selling BUT I thought we still lived in a capitalist society. If we didn't then there would probably be a state controlled electronics board that would forbid Jannard or the RED team from circumventing what is and has been a cash cow to the more popular manufacturers.

So what if the guy wants to reserve a RED from a RED reservee what disrespectful about that. Some people might have rescheduled shoots because of the delay and can wait a little longer now. Get off of this kick you all are on. This is a piece of equiptment used to tell stories not the cure for world disease or hunger. Do what you will with what will be yours and allow the next person to do the same. Stop the madness. Go make a movie.
Haha, sounds like serial number envy.

Like every single one of us doesn't get the fact that this is a tool. Hmmm, must be different from the dozens of cameras we already have in our quiver. Remeber how cool the dvx 100 was 3 short years ago? Yes, we're geeking on this because we all intend to make movies. No you don't need a RED But... Mine are just going to look better than yours for a while...

[Hrvoje Simic]

I think this would be the stupidest way to make $3500 in this occupation.

[PeteCoggan]

Sarcasm my friend. You can have my reservation when you pry it from my cold dead fingers!!!

[David Wyatt]

Without wanting to state the blindingly obvious I'd imagine the non-transferable thing is to stop people buying up swathes of reservation numbers just to make money on it denying people who actually want the camera to make films...kind of like ticket touts/scalpers (BOOoooo!!!...)

[john4321]

Right & Wrong:

#1 Red reservation are Not transferable!
that’s right nothing to add.
wrong:
Nothing wrong with selling something you haven’t got delivered yet. a contract of purchase, with an upfront payment of 20%, is the offer. Anyway, we will see many reds on ebay soon or not as soon most hope.

#2 20% isn’t a lot!
20% can be a lot, or nothing, depending on what kind of risk you can take.
Today is the 15th and nothing really happened. I see some guys slowly freaking out.
Time to bail out for some.
One of the first red in your hand, of course is worth a lot. But time will make this up, and prices will come down again to normal once the market is filled with reds.
BUT AS IS TODAY...!!! things look different!!!!
No Red Schedule! – Means, more delay! Some can afford to wait some can’t .
By the way i already have some serious negotiations.
thx.

[john4321]

Right & Wrong:

#1 Red reservation are Not transferable!
that’s right nothing to add.

wrong:
Nothing wrong with selling something you haven’t got delivered yet. a contract of purchase, with an upfront payment of 20%, is the offer. Anyway, we will see many reds on ebay soon or not as soon most hope.

#2 20% isn’t a lot!

20% can be a lot, or nothing, depending on what kind of risk you can take.

Today is the 15th and nothing really happened. I see some guys slowly freaking out.

Time to bail out for some?

One of the first red in your hand, of course is worth a lot.

But time will make this up, and prices will come down again to normal once the market is filled with reds.

BUT AS IS TODAY...!!! things look different!!!!
No Red Schedule! – Means, more delay!
Some can afford to wait some can’t .

By the way, I’m already in some serious negotiations.
thx.

[Gregory Karydis]

I know I will never be a mother (hey, I am a dude)
but I think this deal sounds like being a surrogate mother and at the time of the birth (when you get your RED One) you get a glimpse of your baby and then it's taken away.
And I ask you, would you give YOUR BABY away for ANY amount after 2+ long years of labour?
Unless (like it's been mentioned before) you really need the money.

[PeteCoggan]

Without wanting to state the blindingly obvious I'd imagine the non-transferable thing is to stop people buying up swathes of reservation numbers just to make money on it denying people who actually want the camera to make films...kind of like ticket touts/scalpers (BOOoooo!!!...)
Blindingly obvious is OK. We are Filmmakers after all...

May want to remind everyone that Sony artificially generating scarcity to say nothing about being a virtually unchallenged monopoly to keep their cameras at $100K a pop is one of the reasons we are so stoked about RED in the first place.

I would go one step further by saying nontransferrable is a good way to keep one of the current monopoly holders from buying reservations and burying them to maitain their market supremacy. A lot harder to buy up thousands of cameras after we crazy filmmakers have them in our hands.

Just a thought

[Keith Nealy]

Jim is not only creating superior digital cinema technology but a new business paradigm for a camera manufacturer as well.

I believe part of the RED strategy to keep prices well below industry standards is also dependant on preventing unscrupulous trafficing in RED products, hence the 5 camera limit and non-transferability.

I wouldn't be surprised if the camera warranty has strick limitations on transferability. You may think you can sell your camera because you own it, but the new owner may not be able to get it serviced.

I would imagine that Jim feels we should honor an unspoken agreement, a code of honor, that in essence says the RED team will create a superior camera system and offer it at prices most everyone can afford and you (meaning us) do your best to help me (Jim) create this revolution by honoring my requests and upholding this new revolutionary business model.

All this talk about hero worship is not far from the truth. Jim is single handedly leading a team that could change the very nature of our business and democratize filmmaking. It may very well be a revolution that shakes the very foundation of the strangle hold that some companies have had over our hard-earned dollars.

RED will have enough problems with piracy and unscrupulous people who want to take advantage by dealing in RED as an investment commodity but it dissapoints me to hear that kind of talk on this forum from people who have been part of this family for a while.

Trust. Honor. Integrity. All go a long way in creating a sucessful business.
Jim and the team can only do so much. We, as the "apostles", if you will, must do our part as well and honor the unwritten code.

I, for one, feel we should do whatever we can do to help him because, like all of you, all I want to do is make good films and put more of the money up on the screen.

Aloha,

Keith

[Patrick Wynne]

Today is the 15th and nothing really happened. I see some guys slowly freaking out.




It's a little early to close the day out yet don't you think? It's about a quarter to one in Jims neck of the woods.

[beatniq]

It's a little early to close the day out yet don't you think? It's about a quarter to one in Jims neck of the woods.

plus, who's freaking out? i don't see anyone freaking out...

[Leo Ticheli]

I wouldn't be surprised if the camera warranty has strick limitations on transferability. You may think you can sell your camera because you own it, but the new owner may not be able to get it serviced.

I can think of a few business practices worse than this, but not many.

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo

[Gbabymogul]

I wouldn't be surprised if the camera warranty has strick limitations on transferability. You may think you can sell your camera because you own it, but the new owner may not be able to get it serviced.


Aloha,

KeithThis is patently ridiculous.

I think people here are going a little bananas waiting. Chill, dudes.

[Gregory Karydis]

Need I remind you that Jim has said you can have your reservation money back +10% if you change your mind AT ANY TIME between now and when you are to receive your camera?
Meaning if one needs the money or has changed their mind a mere 20% over the reservation price sounds kinda weak.

[PeteCoggan]

I can think of a few business practices worse than this, but not many.

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo
Are you freaking kidding? RED has been nothing if not honest and not promissing to delivery before they know they can is down rifht unique to the industry. Have you ever seen Apple, Microsoft, Avid, Sony, Panasonic, Canon, etc., etc., etc., even come close to this level of responcibility and customer respect? In case you are new to the industry and planet earth... "NO" is the correct answer.

[beatniq]

Strange. This thread is listed at the top of the REDUSER.NET section on RED's homepage.

[john4321]

200% net win on a 10% deposit you made isn't a lot?

ralisticly, at the moment all you might have is a serial number, with no schedule. again...once you have a camera in your hands ..the story is different, and on ebay you might get double, but has anyone a cam yet?

Or only a reservation # ? Thats the real deal right!

Sorry if my posting wasnt correct here, yes im newbee at red, but i thought why not posting here? A lot complain about schedule..right?
So something wrong with it?
Something wrong to give someone the chance to bail out?

ok, if you can afford to stay with your #, great, but dont suggest others can do so too.

stockmarket is a great teach!

thx again for the serious offers i got so far.
i might be soon a owner of a "ticket" between 75-185.

the risk to get delivered in 2008 or 2009 i can take, but some others might cant.

thx again to everyone here.

[Gregory Karydis]

Strange. This thread is listed at the top of the REDUSER.NET section on RED's homepage.That is because people slowly start to realize they made a serious mistake :gun:

I am guessing this is not the last we'll hear of people trying to buy their way in the queue.

[beatniq]

Sigh.


200% net win on a 10% deposit you made isn't a lot?

ralisticly, at the moment all you might have is a serial number, with no schedule. again...once you have a camera in your hands ..the story is different, and on ebay you might get double, but has anyone a cam yet?

Or only a reservation # ? Thats the real deal right!

Nice try. I doubt it'll work, but I guess I can't blame you for trying. Unfortunately, I think you're not using the right bait. The type of person who puts money down on this kind of product two years in advance the way people did, my guess, isn't the type of person who will bite on scare tactics, especially over $1,000.


A lot complain about schedule..right?

No. Not right. Again, I haven't seen anyone complain. In fact, it's been just the opposite! People are starting threads worshiping Jim Jannard, for crying out loud! lol... who's complaining?!


Sorry if my posting wasnt correct here, yes im newbee at red, but i thought why not posting here? A lot complain about schedule..right?
So something wrong with it?

Some will tell you yes, some will tell you no. Personally, I don't really care either way. I'm just letting you know that 20% is peanuts, especially if it's true that you can just get 10% from RED themselves.


thx again for the serious offers i got so far.
i might be soon a owner of a "ticket" between 75-185.

Riiiiiiight. That's convincing.

Just curious, do you sell used cars for a living?

[Kenn Christenson]

the risk to get delivered in 2008 or 2009 i can take, but some others might cant.

Borrat? Is that you?:wink:

[beatniq]

The reason is simple. Active threads rise to the topmost slots in the listing.

That's all, folks. No special significance whatsoever.

If that's the case then why aren't the other active threads also listed? Obviously it has something to do with the latest active threads, but I think there also may be someone blocking certain thread titles from popping up on their homepage, because there are plenty missing and newer ones than some of the ones that are on there...

no biggie, either way.... i just found it curious that if there indeed is someone running it that they would leave this particular thread on there...

[john4321]

"Strange. This thread is listed at the top of the REDUSER.NET section on RED's homepage."


yes it is, wonder why?
maybe my posting helps red to get a bit out of crossfire.

my posting shows, there is a buyer.

for me , looks like ,red for the end of 2008 is what most are facing!

picture it. and for me, even if the 1.cam gets deliverd at 2008 red has done a tremendous job.

but for some..thats too late for several reasons, personal, business schedule,budget.

[Rob Lohman]

for me , looks like ,red for the end of 2008 is what most are facing!

And you got this reliable info where?

[beatniq]

"Strange. This thread is listed at the top of the REDUSER.NET section on RED's homepage."


yes it is, wonder why?
maybe my posting helps red to get a bit out of crossfire.

my posting shows, there is a buyer.

for me , looks like ,red for the end of 2008 is what most are facing!

picture it. and for me, even if the 1.cam gets deliverd at 2008 red has done a tremendous job.

but for some..thats too late for several reasons, personal, business schedule,budget.

I bet next you'll tell us that we never went to the moon, castro shot JFK, and the jews knew about 9/11...

[Leo Ticheli]

Are you freaking kidding? RED has been nothing if not honest and not promissing to delivery before they know they can is down rifht unique to the industry. Have you ever seen Apple, Microsoft, Avid, Sony, Panasonic, Canon, etc., etc., etc., even come close to this level of responcibility and customer respect? In case you are new to the industry and planet earth... "NO" is the correct answer.

No, I'm not kidding.

If you had actually read my posts, you would know that I've not accused Red of anything.

I said that refusing to service a product which had been sold to another party would be a bad business practice. I don't believe that is the case; should it turn out to be, I certainly stand by my statement.

By the way, I'm far from new to the planet or the business and I happen to find Apple, Panasonic, and Sony to be excellent in the customer service department. Unfortunately, I can't say the same for Avid and Microsoft, so we are in agreement there.

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo

[PeteCoggan]

And you got this reliable info where?
Sony exec on the RED Forum, run!

[Gavin Greenwalt]

How RED Forums organize topics.

Last topic to receive a reply goes to top.
Under that is the previous topic to have received a reply.

It's not some complicated google metric trying to assign worth. It's just the most up to date topic. So for instance... this post will put it back to the top until someone posts something on another topic.

It's not witchcraft.

[beatniq]

How RED Forums organize topics.

Last topic to receive a reply goes to top.
Under that is the previous topic to have received a reply.

Not really, but whatever...

Maybe it just takes longer to catch up, or it does so at varying intervals, so it seems more randomized to me.

[Steve Gibby]

True Gavin, with the additional observation that only the active threads on the main "RED One" forum are included on the RED home page list. The other RED User forum threads active are not represented there.

[Elijah Kelley]

Eleeahoo, chill.

I have not posted anything in regards to what people will do, could or should do with there camera after they receive it.

Of course people have every right to do what they want with the camera after purchase.



Jim has made it clear that RED reservations are Non-transferable. And Reduser is the house of RED.

That's why it's disrespectful.

A discussion that disrespects Jim, or Red is not appropriate here. People wanting to have that type of discussion should do it somewhere else.

Now, I've been following RED since December 2005... You might notice that I have Red #81 reserved. That means that I placed my order for Red on the very first day it was available.... Monday morning first day of Nab 2006.

Maybe I've been around here long enough to know what's up.

I would appreciate it if you could express your thoughts in a less adversary way.

Thanks.
Sam Duckerman,
And your point about being around means...? Adversarial? Are you an adult? You straight slam a guy about making an offer and I'm adversarial? Let the moderators moderate if your problem is policy but leave the "I'm a REDUSER OOGA OOGA" at home. People are curious and have work to get done. Next you'll be telling other Red One owners not to rent their camera to that guy because he uses sony or panasonic.

It's not that serious. I've made some of my living for the past eight shooting/producing/directing commercials and video programming but I'm not crazy enough to believe that Red is the end all and be all. Albeit I'm elated about the advent of this new technology being made available at this price point but I'm not a die hard that's ready to bash a guy for posting an offer. If you're not selling yours what's it to you?

Go and make a movie.

[Joe Aurili]

I'm still not clear on why buying the camera and selling it for a profit is pure evil, but buying the camera for rental and making a profit is fine...

[john4321]

sorry rob, .i said .."for me it looks like."
should be clear.

but i understand, nothing i should mention, but realisticly and with all the respect i have, to manage to deliver some tousends cameras this year, is not realistic at all. so for me most will face 2008. again only my mind.

[Stephen Williams]

I wouldn't be surprised if the camera warranty has strick limitations on transferability. You may think you can sell your camera because you own it, but the new owner may not be able to get it serviced.


Keith

Hi,

I don't think Banks & leasing companies would be very happy with such restriction.

Stephen

[beatniq]

sorry rob, .i said .."for me it looks like."
should be clear.

but i understand, nothing i should mention, but realisticly and with all the respect i have, to manage to deliver some tousends cameras this year, is not realistic at all. so for me most will face 2008. again only my mind.

oh snap... now you've gone and done it... run!~!

here they come!
:ranting2: :ranting2: :ranting2: :ranting2:

[Steve Gibby]

Eleeahoo and John4321,

I see you're both new to RED User (7 posts and 5 posts) so let me help you out with some longtime member info:

RED User is owned by Jarred Land, and he sets and polices the rules for use of this board.

RED has publicized from the very beginning that reservation numbers are non-transferable.

RED has also publicized from the beginning that they reserve the right to refuse to sell their products to anyone they choose not to sell to.

If someone solicits on RED User for someone else to violate the trade rules RED has set, then the person soliciting such is subject to warning by the moderators, and if they persist, they can be banned from RED User

In prior threads on RED User, before you arrived here, a few reservation holders pitched the board to sell their reservation numbers and were tactfully warned by RED that they could potentially have their reservations canceled if they persisted. As you might imagine, that brought swift "I'm sorry" responses from those reservation holders.


------------------------------------------------------


What reservation holders do with a RED One camera, RED lenses, or accessories will be their business after they have completed the purchase of their equipment, but soliciting on RED User the sales of their reservations prior to their completing the purchase of reserved cameras, or for reservationists to try to transfer their reservation numbers before completing the purchase will lead to cancellation of their reservation and a refund of their deposit - as RED has stated.

Now, you're new on this board and can somewhat claim ignorance of RED policy, right up to the point of reading this post. What I've posted for you above is accurate, so you no longer can claim ignorance of RED's published policy. I don't work for RED, but having been around RED from the very beginning, I feel I can accurately predict that if you or others continue to solicit the transfer of reservations on this board, or even seek to arrange on this board to have reservationists sell you or others their cameras after they have completed the purchase of their cameras, that you could very well be banned from this board.

You have no right to be here - none of us do. Since this board is owned by RED, and RED has set the board rules, and RED has set the rules on selling their cameras, we all must observe those RED rules or suffer the consequences.

I think its great that you're interested in getting a RED camera - tons of people are in the same boat. I've offered you the above info to help you out in planning how to get your hands on a RED camera - and ways not to try. No moderators have been on the board all day, and I’m sure the logged in RED guys are swamped with other work, but I assure you the info I’ve posted above is accurate and they’ll back that up. If you keep pushing along the lines you have I’m sure you’ll hear from them. There’s been many over the past 20 months of RED development who have posted similar things as you have – and each has been called on it by RED.

[donatello b]

i think most are sort of trying to help out anybody that wants to buy a RED ..
as already stated reservations are not for sale BUT camera's can be bought/sold ... perhaps the question should be restated ...

something like ... does anybody with a low reservation # want to sell their camera after the receive it ! how one works out a price/deal is between them ... 10% or 3000% mark up is up to those involved ...

[Evin Grant]

I'd hazzard a guess that if Jim finds out your going to sell your low res immediately for profit he'd refuse to sell you the camera. Although strictly speaking not against the rules it's bad form and against the core respect we hold for all our reservation holders. The only reason I would suspect that an immediate post delivery sale would be acceptable would be a financial emergency. Barring that I'm sure that eventually a used market for Red cameras will emerge, most likely starting right here. That is VERY far in the distance and I would appreciate it if all of us here would not entertain any more of these sales pitches, it demeans the Reservation holders and this board. With that I'm closing this thread.

[Jarred Land]

First Gibby.. Reduser is not owned by Red. Reduser is owned by me, and only me.

Reservations are not transferable. period. Gibby, Evin and everyone else that has said so, is correct. You cannot sell your reservation. Well you can, but whoever you sell it to is going to be very upset.

Jim can do anything he wants too.. He can decide not to sell someone a camera just because. Breaking the rules, is not a good idea.

Im opening this thread back up.

[Steve Gibby]

Thanks Jarred...and thanks for correcting me on the ownership of RED User....and congratulations on the rapid growth and success of RED User. I've edited my post above to reflect the correct ownership info.

It's obvious that lots of people would now like to get their hands on a RED One camera. There's a right way to go about it - and a wrong way to go about it. Obviously going about it the wrong way can bring some consequences.

[Jarred Land]

no problem Gibby.. thanks for your help on the front lines.

[Jay A. Kelley]

I will sell ANYTHING for enough money. As for selling a reservation.. That's wierd. I'd just buy the camera and sell it.

Come on guys, let's not take this thing too far. If my camera is worth more than I can make with it, and I can still buy another one later...

That's a no-brainer and I'd like to think that Jim, being the business man HE is would smack me upside the head if I DIDN'T sell it.

As for Jarred and this board.. This is a worry, so much is becoming Jim Jannard and RED that we are losing some identity of others.

Reminder: Jarred has been running these boards LONG before RED was even a concept, let alone possible. DVXuser is still very popular today. He has done a great job. That deserves a lot of respect.

The way I see it, Mr. Jannard should be very grateful that Jarred allowed him to use the years of contacts he has built on these boards to get his message out.

IMHO

Humility is a good quality people, let's not lose it.. Just because a lot of us have been watching this thing for a while, it's a camera. It won't feed the poor or cure desease. Let's keep our jobs, and our accomplishments, in perspective. Less we all end up being Tom Cruise.

Edit: I feel it nessesary to point out that my post is the result of things I have seen/read for a number of months now.. It is NOT based soley on the posts in this thread. I am not thinking of any one user, just an over all impression I am getting. Hence my post

[Jarred Land]

Thanks for the kind words Jay.

i expect things to get a little weird while everyone is waiting and dying to get their cameras... its human nature, i know i would feel the same way.

just a little more time and we will all be posting about how cool our Red shoot just was instead of attacking everyone and trying to find things to pick at.

[Ivan G]

beatniq, I'll give you 20% and my reserve for yours....

[Andrew Benz]

RED #557 (modified through the decades) will go in the casket with me. I lost five years of revenue due to an on set injury. Never again. I know what kind of revenue that I can generate with a system like RED. If you are thinking of selling your camera because you can generate more money in this fashion, then I must humbly state that you are just a speculator and have no clue as to the income generating potential of this system in the hands of someone who has craft and a mutual respect for the people who live it on a daily basis. Don't let this moment in history slip through your fingers for the short sighted opportunity to make pennies to dollars.

If you are interested in keeping it and you are not a working owner/operator then heed Gibby's and David's posts, they are gold and way more informative than any mentor that I have ever had. What am I saying--- heed Gibby's and David's posts no matter who you are... If you have talent, drive, patience and some money to get in the game-- you stand half a chance depending on your daily investment into the various crafts that make up our motion media industry.

Cheers,

Andrew

[Jay A. Kelley]

RED #557 (modified through the decades) If you are thinking of selling your camera because you can generate more money in this fashion, then I must humbly state that you are just a speculator and have no clue as to the income generating potential of this system in the hands of someone who has craft and a mutual respect for the people who live it on a daily basis.

Andrew,
I don't know if this is aimed at me or not.. If it is, then you have made a rather grand assumption about someone without knowing him, or the circumstances in which he would act.

Jay

[Andrew Benz]

Andrew,
I don't know if this is aimed at me or not.. If it is, then you have made a rather grand assumption about someone without knowing him, or the circumstances in which he would act.

Jay
Do you not have craft and live it on a daily basis, so how DO you feel it was aimed at you. Now....

Jay do not start with me with that attitude... it was not aimed at you-- I do not make grand assumptions and I know all about you, are you not an owner/operator w/ an sdx900, jimmy jib and a trailer etc? It was a word to those people who are thinking of speculating instead of taking advantage of something that rarely happens in our industry. If they have any desire or inkling to work in our industry then take advantage! It seems to me that you are the one assuming things and NEVER communicate to me in that tone again. Jay, where is the mutual respect? You had mine and lost it...

BTW Jay, I did not even read your damn post. I know you just had another kid and congrats and all but why crawl me on Fathers day, did you not get your kitchen sink back pack (said with a smile)... no need for this... This is why I really no longer like to post here, because someone is always at the ready to go off half cocked...

[Jay A. Kelley]

Do you not have craft and live it on a daily basis, so how DO you feel it was aimed at you. Now....

Jay do not start with me with that attitude... it was not aimed at you-- I do not make grand assumptions and I know all about you, are you not an owner/operator w/ an sdx900, jimmy jib and a trailer etc? It was a word to those people who are thinking of speculating instead of taking advantage of something that rarely happens in our industry. If they have any desire or inkling to work in our industry then take advantage! It seems to me that you are the one assuming things and NEVER communicate to me in that tone again. Jay, where is the mutual respect? You had mine and lost it...

BTW Jay, I did not even read your damn post. I know you just had another kid and congrats and all but why crawl me on Fathers day, did you not get your kitchen sink back pack (said with a smile)... no need for this... This is why I really no longer like to post here, because someone is always at the ready to go off half cocked...

Wow.... Breath Andrew..... Breath.......

:)

[Andrew Benz]

Wow.... Breath Andrew..... Breath.......

:)

I do not find your response funny, as a matter of fact it is demeaning. If you are going to wrongly jump on someones case then you should man up and apologise. Frankly, I do not get you or your asinine responses.

[Jay A. Kelley]

Sorry you don't seem happy with my posts Andrew, but I'm not going to debate this any further..

We do not agree with one another and I am cool with that.

Enjoy the rest of your evening.

Jay

[Gregory Karydis]

Oh c'mon guys...
(to quote one of my favourite movies) Gentlemen, please rest your sphincters.
I bet a year from now we'll all look back to the month(s) before the first shipment of a Red One and laugh at how everyine was so picky and trigger happy with eachother's sayings.
So loosen up and the days will fly by faster :)

[Adrian Correia]

my God guys! Relax! We're all friends here....wait...oh it's Jay? Andrew, let him have it!

[Jay A. Kelley]

my God guys! Relax! We're all friends here....wait...oh it's Jay? Andrew, let him have it!

Funny Adrian, very funny....

:)