You Down With R.P.P. ? .. Yea you know me...

[Rick Darge]

Disabled..sorry {h.264 - 1024x576 - 5289 kbits/s - 149MB}

Disabled..sorry {h.264 - 512x288 - 2044 kbits/s - 57MB}

I had the chance to get down to Red HQ this afternoon for some RPP taste testing out in the parking lot. Brought the girl & the dog with me. Nate, BC & Jarred hooked it up today! Thanks so much for the fun!

Not going to repeat everyone else here. Lenses are more than solid. Smooth as butter focus/iris rings. Very sharp. They produce nice flares too! I shot the sun a lot as you will see from the video... My favorite lens was the 35mm. Everything POPS & is quite 3D looking with that lens. Least favorite was the 50 & 85mm to my eye. I favored the contrast in the 25 & 35mm more. Don't know if that's something that can be improved upon in this state or if it was a change in haze/lighting conditions. I need to do more testing with that.. The RR donut may not have been as snug as it could have been on further thought. I need an affordable bellows unit. Either way, I'd like to do more testing, the sun was really bright today and there may have been subtle light leaks. I kept the NDs on the whole time.

I brought my Canon K-35 24mm PL Superspeed with me to contrast/compare. The K-35s are almost identical in look to the Zeiss Superspeeds, Canon's being just a few hairs sharper fully open.

Everything is labeled so you can tell the differences between VINTAGE glass and MODERN glass. Most of this DEMO is RPPs as I don't have my Canon 35, 55 & 85 yet. They are currently being converted to PL by Optitek..

I brought the RR mattebox & Mantis rig to shoot handheld. When I first checked out the RPPs, the first thing I noticed was their weight and bulkiness. Very massive compared to my lightweight K-35s. However, when they were on my shoulder, they were not bad at all.. Your first impression will be, DAMN, THIS THING IS HUUUGE!

All of this footy was shot with 2 Schneider ND filters, no IR. I stacked a 1.2 & a 0.6, cutting out 6 stops of light. Most of this DEMO is shot at T1.8 at around 2-3PM, partly hazy skies.

I cut in FCP, sent to Color, 2k 16x9 Pro Res HQ to H.264 for web. Redspace COLOR - Rec709 GAMMA. Saturation was kept at 1.0. Mild S curve applied to every clip. White Balance was set to 6500 for every clip except for the 100mm close of the eye at the end, that was boosted to 9999.

The last 4 clips are a locked tripod comparison test between the K-35 and the RPP. I did not use a mattebox for this test. The wide open clips were achieved by holding up to two stacked ND filters, directly in front of the lens. Because of this, we had some weird hazing going on. I was looking more at bokeh than anything though..

Enjoyo

:beer:

[Jean Déraps]

All this chatter Richard and no footage! lol

Thanks for the info and the upcoming footage !

Cheers

Jean

[Rick Darge]

Finished uploading... It's a 4min long video of nonsense.

[Jean Déraps]

I'm sure it'll be very welcomed nonsense!

[jonnycom]

Nice, Thanks for posting and making the drive. Did they have a better idea when actual deliveries might began?

[Rick Darge]

No, they still have to do the re-engraving and fix the mount for the ARRI 435s. Hopefully soon.

[jaadgy akanni]

Well, yeah, I'm down with Optimum Performance Products...run the footage!

[Sanjin Jukic]

Great Richard!!!

Looking forward to watch it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Rick Darge]

Picture's up

www.rickdarge.com/RPP.mov

[jonnycom]

Very nice! I like that 35mm as well. Nice flares on all of them.

[Evin Grant]

Good looking stuff, Rick. Who was the song by?

[Rick Darge]

Thanks Evin

Song was Animal Collective
Track was My Girls
Album, Merriweather Post Pavillion

Awesome album

[Jarred Land]

Anyone that starts a thread with a Naughty by Nature reference is good by me :)

Glad to have you down Richard, great looking stuff!

[Rob Gardner]

I'm interested in the K-35's. What can you tell me about them?
Thanks
Rob Gardner

[Steve Sherrick]

I'm interested in the K-35's. What can you tell me about them?
Thanks
Rob Gardner

I've shot with both versions, the superspeeds and the standard speeds. The Superspeeds are really nice lenses. I like the look they give, especially skin tones. The standard speeds I used were pretty soft wide open, and overall I just didn't like them as much.

But, as to the RPPs, nice job Richard. Fun video to watch to see the various lenses intermixed. Ah, one of those times I wish I was living in So. Cal. I never did get a chance to see the RPPs on the projector at the REDUSER event.

[Hans von Sonntag]

I brought my Canon K-35 24mm PL Superspeed with me to contrast/compare. The K-35s are almost identical in look to the Zeiss Superspeeds, Canon's being just a few hairs sharper fully open.



Hi Richard, I never had the chance to shoot with the K35s yet but Zeiss SuperSpeeds have a flare that looks like in the attached picture. I find it quite different to your K35s. Apart from the fact that the K35 are as fast as Super Speeds they are different glas, I guess. Nothing bad about this.

Hans

[C.H.Haskell]

Thanks for sharing richard!

[NormLi]

Awesome! So excited to receive mine.

[Rick Darge]

I'm interested in the K-35's. What can you tell me about them?
Thanks
Rob Gardner

Well, they're awesome for one!

Very unknown glass. Visual Products calls the K-35 prime set, Hollywood's Biggest Secret.. Couldn't agree more. They made them back in the 70s and 80s. Won a technical Academy Award due to their new Aspherical design. They flare nicely. Have a very pleasing contrast and are just slightly softer than a modern lens. They are also full frame!

[Rick Darge]

Hi Richard, I never had the chance to shoot with the K35s yet but Zeiss SuperSpeeds have a flare that looks like in the attached picture. I find it quite different to your K35s. Apart from the fact that the K35 are as fast as Super Speeds they are different glas, I guess. Nothing bad about this.

Hans

The flares do look different, however, the optical looks are so close to identical. Someone did some cross comparison between a set of MKIII SS and K-35s, and I couldn't tell the difference fully open or closed down.

K-35s have a nice round bokeh. I think there are 9+ iris blades in there..

[Dylan Macleod, CSC]

This is good news. I was getting negative reports on the RPP's from NAB saying that they flared horribly and that the coatings might not be up to snuff.

This footage debunks that. Seems like pretty average "milking" of the image when it flares.

Good news and thanks for posting.

[Mark Whatmore]

Thanks for sharing, the footage looks great - the lenses peform really well - but there's a purple hole in the sun over their in CA - I noticed it when shooting down in San Diego with my camera earlier in the year. We don't seem to have that problem so much over here in the UK, but then we hardly ever see the sun, purple or not.

Anyone got any bright ideas as to how we can avoid the purple spot?

[Shane Betts]

I can hear the words, "Aw, Daaaad!" from here.:)

Thanks for sharing Richard. Great comparison and great to see something that shows off the personality of the RPPs. Very worthwhile IMHO.

[Dylan Macleod, CSC]

Thanks for sharing, the footage looks great - the lenses peform really well - but there's a purple hole in the sun over their in CA - I noticed it when shooting down in San Diego with my camera earlier in the year. We don't seem to have that problem so much over here in the UK, but then we hardly ever see the sun, purple or not.

Anyone got any bright ideas as to how we can avoid the purple spot?

Black spot sun - black hole sun - sensor overload. Nothing to be done except "fix it in post".

[Mark Whatmore]

Thanks Dylan - seems a real shame to have that blot on such great material. Let's hope that's something they can sort out on the epic. I'm off shooting in Egypt, and it's got me nervous.

[Lee Saxon]

If that's a sensor problem, I don't understand why I've never come across it on any of the many (even sub-$500) digital still cameras I've shot with. Just sayin'

[Raul Gonzo]

Great stuff Richard, thanks for doing this. I forgive you now for the 'free clip on mb' joke :)
After each lens, I kept thinking- good god!- This one is my favorite, oh wait... no this one...

[Adrian Correia]

12 blades on that iris Mr. Darge....

[Raphael Varandas]

Very nice Richard...i saw the projection in RUPARTY and was completly stoned.
Luck you to play with it.
Congrats

Thanks for sharing

[Rick Darge]

12 blades on that iris Mr. Darge....

Holy crap! 12! Are there 12 iris blades on all 5 lenses?

That would explain that beautiful bokeh you sent me in your recent clip!
.

[Ryan S]

Fantastic video, Rick. Thanks very much for sharing that.

[Todd Anderson]

Thanks for the demo, Richard (especially for shooting some skin tones). The 'look and characteristics' from both sets of lenses looked great depending on the tone one was looking to achieve. Cool.

[Rick Darge]

No problem guys, it was my pleasure sharing this with you. It was a lot of fun getting to play with the set, outdoors finally.

Jarred, if and when you guys get a bigger space for the Red Store, you should make a little stage like Canon/Sony do at NAB, with some dedo lights and kinos to show off your glass/gear... Just a thought..

[Jarred Land]

good idea :)

[Shawn Nelson]

Holy crap! 12! Are there 12 iris blades on all 5 lenses?

That would explain that beautiful bokeh you sent me in your recent clip!
.

On the RPPs? I counted only 7 at NAB

[Rick Darge]

On the RPPs? I counted only 7 at NAB

The K-35s have the 12. The RPPs are 7 blades. RPPs make an out of focus light heptagonal in shape whereas the K-35s produce a near circular shape. Horses for courses. It would be cool to start a thread comparing bokeh of different glass out there on the R1.

[George A.]

K-35 bokeh

out of focus through leaves, quick and dirty jpeg

[Rick Darge]

Nice eastco.. That sums up the k-35 look in a single shot

[George A.]

Thanks. I might load a video clip if people are interested.

[jonnycom]

The new Z compact primes have 14 blades. Twice as many for twice the price.

[dvpixl]

this footage is creamy and buttery all over.

[NateWeaver]

this footage is creamy and buttery all over.

You have to keep the craft service off your ACs cart.

[Rick Darge]

Thanks. I might load a video clip if people are interested.

Eastco I am interested! Would love to see some 35, 55 & 85 if you have it! :)

[Shawn Nelson]

I wonder why the RPPs are only 7. Personally I'm cool with that, but it seems others prefer much more. How many do Zeiss MPs, UPs, SSs and Cooke S4s have each?
/

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The Cooke S4's have an 8-blade iris and they have a somewhat star-shaped highlight bokeh to them before the iris expands far enough to soften into obscurity. Don't know about the new Panchros just yet. I don't recall off the top of my head how many blades the Arri ultra and master primes have.

If memory serves me, the UniqueOptics primes shown at NAB, that a lot of people were saying look just like the RPPs, have a 12-blade iris.

I kinda like the 7 blade iris of the RPPs from what I've seen so far.

[Mitch Gross]

UniQoptics lenses I saw had seven-blade irises. Ultra Primes have nine-blades and are slightly curved to produce a somewhat rounded shape. I can't recall how many blades are on them, but Master Primes are known for their very circular bokeh, although this is not the only element that comes into play with what makes up bokeh.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

UniQoptics lenses I saw had seven-blade irises.

Thanks for clarification on that. I probably read an erroneous report, not much info has really surfaced about these lenses yet.

[Rick Darge]

Sorry guys, I had to disable the video for a bit. My bandwidth is almost gone! I'll see what I can do about hosting a Vimeo version

[Andrew Benz]

Thanks Richard for putting the Video together and hosting it.

Sorry for the offtopic:

As far as relatively light weight primes go... How do the K-35s stack up against the ZFs optically and cost? How do you like the mechanics of the K-35s? I get the difference in operational mechanics between the pl vs. nikon though...

[Rick Darge]

Hey Andrew

To Answer your question, The K-35s are extremely light weight. The 18mm T1.5 lens is beefier than the rest, but I like that. The 24, 35, 55 and 85 primes are about the same weight as the Zeiss T2.1 set of lenses.

There is quite a leap in optical/mechanical performance when compared to the ZF lenses in Nikon form. I am curious to see how the Zeiss Compact Primes stack up against the K-35 set, being Full Frame and with 2 more iris blades. ZFs are great but the K-35s are sharper and have a more pleasing bokeh to my eye. I also prefer the contrast of the K-35s to the ZF lenses as it feels more cinematic. Cost is a bag of peanuts really. 5 lens BNCR mounted K-35s will set you back anywhere between $9,000-$15,000 a set depending on their condition. I heard the early 80s models were better by the way so look for serial numbers that begin with 80 or 81. If you want to convert them over to PL then you'll have a hard time finding someone. Jacek at Optitek is doing my conversion and he's based out of Los Angeles. There is another tech in Europe that does it as well although I forgot his name. Most techs won't touch these lenses because of how complex the conversion process is. But i heard the Visual Products BNCR adapter is awesome, so that's always an option so you don't have to wait long for the conversion. The conversion will set you back another $5,000-$6,000 depending on the work that needs to be done. All in all, you're looking at $14k-20k for a set of K-35 PL lenses depending on the condition. I would put their value a little higher since the PL conversion takes a lot of time and time is money. I would think this number would come down as more modern sets hit the market but I doubt it, as the K-35s are rare and very unique plus they are virtually future proofed for Full Frame 35. Mechanically, they have been buttery smooth. One thing I don't like about them is that the iris ring is at the front of the lens instead of the back. Red Pro Primes have better mechanics though, also a way better looking housing.. But optically, I'm still torn.. I wish I could own both

[Andrew Benz]

Man... I feel like I hit the big bag bonanza! Thank you for the breakdown Richard.

I have a follow up question... but I just read it and it I need to sleep on it so it makes sense with less shorthand so to speak.

Thanks again man...

Cheers,

Andrew

PS- Is your 35mm still for sale? And... have you heard anything about Optitek's sweet Nikon Pro Mount being legal from Red since they make a channel for the i-cable (but I have no clue about what else would be less than cool as far as Red is concerned.)

[oliver imfeld]

Richard,

did you manage to put your video on vimeo ?
cheers, oliver

[Paul Leeming]

Here's a mirror (http://downloads.visceralpsyche.com/RPP.mov) until the vimeo version is up.

HTH

Paul

[Peter Mosiman]

Here's a mirror (http://downloads.visceralpsyche.com/RPP.mov) until the vimeo version is up.

HTH

Paul

Thanks Paul. I appreciate it.

By the way...awesome to watch Richard. Thanks for that!

[Rick Darge]

PS- Is your 35mm still for sale? And... have you heard anything about Optitek's sweet Nikon Pro Mount being legal from Red since they make a channel for the i-cable (but I have no clue about what else would be less than cool as far as Red is concerned.)

Hey Andrew, Yes my ZF 35mm is still for sale!

Can't comment on the Nikon Pro Mount as I haven't seen a working version yet. It looks genius however.

I'll post the RPP test on Vimeo later tonight as I'm helping out with the SALT tests at Keslow all day today.. Excited to see some glass :cool: