View factor studios - FF & RED motors [Archive]

Curran Giddens

07-02-2007, 06:25 PM

Cvb ?

Rsvp, Pdq, Svp!

?

some VFS motor infos I saved from dvxuser last year....

Motor stats (subject to change):
• Top speed at output gear: 200 RPM
• Torque at output: 210 oz-in
• Voltage/Current: 24V@0.6A per motor
• Communications: Serial/Ethernet/Wifi
• Weight: 225g

The system can be configured with the included remote or via a web interface using your laptop/pda. The system can store and recall a large number of preset positions, velocity/acceleration values can be changed easily on the fly, data can be backed up to a computer for later use.

The setup, which will be showing at NAB 07, will consist of 3 lens motors, break-out box, remote control, all necessary cables/gears and storage case.

3-motor $5,500

chuck colburn

07-02-2007, 07:56 PM

Wow... that's quite a torque spec.
13.125 ft.lbs. I think that's more than my Honda fifty had. lol

Mike Prevette

07-02-2007, 09:24 PM

24v ?!?!?!?!?!?!!??

Priyesh P.

07-03-2007, 12:00 AM

?

some VFS motor infos I saved from dvxuser last year....

Motor stats (subject to change):
• Top speed at output gear: 200 RPM
• Torque at output: 210 oz-in
• Voltage/Current: 24V@0.6A per motor
• Communications: Serial/Ethernet/Wifi
• Weight: 225g

The system can be configured with the included remote or via a web interface using your laptop/pda. The system can store and recall a large number of preset positions, velocity/acceleration values can be changed easily on the fly, data can be backed up to a computer for later use.

The setup, which will be showing at NAB 07, will consist of 3 lens motors, break-out box, remote control, all necessary cables/gears and storage case.

3-motor $5,500

Hi Curran,

I've read from Curt that they (VFS) won't be building their own motors any more. But their systems are going to support the Red Motor.
The motors have integrated drivers and don't need a separate box to control them, VFS plans to produce a FF knob that directly interfaces with the motor.

Nick Shaw

07-03-2007, 02:51 AM

I understood that the Red Motor was being built by View Factor, so basically the two products are one and the same.

Curran Giddens

07-03-2007, 04:03 AM

hmm.... I must have missed this info if it was ever posted here on reduser. I hope the system will still be able to store and recall all the data for later use.

Is the VFS Impero remote still in the works?

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/2984/imperosr8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Priyesh P.

07-03-2007, 06:20 AM

hmm.... I must have missed this info if it was ever posted here on reduser. I hope the system will still be able to store and recall all the data for later use.

Is the VFS Impero remote still in the works?

Yes, but they want to finish a few other things first, and as far as I've memorized correctly Curt wanted to open a new thread about the LCS to gain some input regarding specs and ergonomics.

CVB

07-03-2007, 03:59 PM

Yup, the remote is still in the works but we've been cranking on the moco head and few other goodies first. I'd love to hear what people would like to see in the remote... its since changed quite a bit from what we showed at NAB. I'll post a new thread in a bit that will have the newest design for both the matte box and the remote.

BTW, thanks to Curran and the other 24 people who reserved a Mirus. :)

Erik Widding

07-03-2007, 04:33 PM

Yup, the remote is still in the works but we've been cranking on the moco head and few other goodies first. I'd love to hear what people would like to see in the remote... its since changed quite a bit from what we showed at NAB.

Bluetooth, so it can talk directly to our lens mounts.

Blair S. Paulsen

07-03-2007, 05:45 PM

Looks like Curt and Erik are benefactors of the RedOne engineering delays and by extension all of us. With all due respect to the time honored methods of camera operation the forward thinking application of "helper" devices to a camera system like the RedOne are one more reason I feel we are on the cusp of major leap forward.

Perhaps Graeme's magic focus display combined with the super grip will make pulling your own focus viable even with short DoF. For many production situations the operator must do this themselves and may not have the luxury of asking for another take.

Experienced hands have seen the grim results of underestimating the difficulty of holding focus with traditional 35mm optics. Their warnings to the folks who have spent most of their time with low res viewfinders and small chips are real. Here's to hoping that the smart application of advanced tech from View Factor, Birger and others will allow those willing to make the effort to learn, able to drill almost every take.

Mark L. Pederson

07-03-2007, 06:03 PM

BTW, thanks to Curran and the other 24 people who reserved a Mirus. :)

I am thinking about becoming #25 - Mirus looks pretty sexy - when do you expect to ship?

CVB

07-03-2007, 07:57 PM

Mark.. Thanks we are really happy with how it came out. We will have several beta units in early September and will be shipping the first 30 units in late October or early November.

roryhinds

07-04-2007, 02:38 AM

Hi Curt

I seem to remember August being a date the remote might be shipping...

Is this still the case or has it been pushed back till after you ship the Mirus?
So are we looking at next year?

Just trying to work out schedules so I know what to purchase when.

Regards
Rory

Curran Giddens

07-04-2007, 03:44 AM

Any idea on pricing for the remote? Just trying to work out my remaining budget.

CVB

07-04-2007, 03:51 AM

Well, the remote has been pushed out a bit, we'll probably be taking reservations on it in August. We're shooting for a ship date before the end of the year and price will be around $1K or less. That seems to be our favorite number around here :)

Erik.... We are currently thinking about using zigbee for the transceiver because the range of off the shelf bluetooth modules is typically about 100 ft. The zigbee can get upwards of a mile in open air and 300-600ft indoors. If we can track down a high power bluetooth transceiver then I'm more than willing to use that instead.

We have gone away from the flat design and have opted for a more ergonomic setup. It will still be modular and components can be moved around. There is an lcd screen that will display all the lens position data and camera data (TBD). The motors auto-calibrate to the lens limits and will automatically calibrate the position data to the lens data once you select a pre-configured lens. If the lens doesnt exist then you can go through a <2 minute setup wizard to setup a new lens. Future firmware on the remote will allow people to share their lens data online so we can get a database of lenses that you can update periodically via the usb or sd slot. The receiver unit that comes with the remote accepts 12-24V and connects to 3 Red motors. There is a usb connection on the receiver for connection to a computer/pda or the camera (integration issues TBD).

We are also working on a lens breathing compensation mode that will basically eliminate breathing on your lenses. The setup for that is a little trickier and I'd expect that the data would have to come from us by setting up a calibration bench of some sort. Basically you would need two motors-one for focus and one for zoom. As you rack focus, the zoom motor will back off or advance to adjust the zoom and keep the framing same through out the shot. We tried it out manually and its looking very promising on the POS fujinon lens we have here. Once we get to that point of testing we may enlist the help of redusers to donate lenses and hardware to get a decent database for everyone to download to their remotes.

Nick Shaw

07-04-2007, 03:59 AM

Curt, I don't see Viewfactor on the exhibitor list for IBC. Are you going to be there? It would be great to see a working prototype of the Mirus, and your other products.

CVB

07-04-2007, 04:19 AM

Yeah, looks like we are going to opt out.. It's a big undertaking just getting everything over there. Maybe Jim will let us tag along and have a square meter of space in the red booth ;) As soon as we start shipping products towards the end of the year you will see us at many more trade shows.. I promise.

Nick Shaw

07-04-2007, 04:57 AM

Yes, be good to see both you and Erik from Birger showing products on the Red stand. You're both effectively honorary members of Team Red!

Priyesh P.

07-04-2007, 06:32 AM

Curran Giddens

07-04-2007, 06:42 AM

How about saving the lens position/camera data to a computer?

Someone could perform a camera move (at least pan/tilt) and save the data to a computer. Then they could playback the camera move while remotely racking focus (with the lens breathing compensation mode) and save that data to the computer. Once you have it perfect, you could combine the Mirus MoCo data and FIZ data into one file so you can repeat everything with one click. That would be sweet! :biggrin:

We just need a MoCo dolly/jib sometime next year to complete the setup.

Michael Schrengohst

07-04-2007, 08:19 AM

roryhinds

07-04-2007, 08:37 AM

Hey Curt

So FF shipping at the end of the year... do you now when the MB will be shipping.

Just trying to work out timelines here.

Regards
Rory

CVB

07-04-2007, 01:21 PM

This is absolutely fantastic news. I've always dreamed of an LCS with this featureset that doesn't cost the equivalent of a car (the case with Arri & C-Motion).
About calibrationdata, Curt, it'd be great if it could be handled by Viewfactor. C-Motion offers a calibration bench (looks like a collimator bench), but that thing is way too expensive and (more important) would be too time consuming and sort of overkill for something you'll very rarely be using.
Well, the significant differences between c-motion and ours is going to be the price and the screen. Our screen is going to be a lowly graphic lcd but I don't think its going to have any problems displaying everything you will need. We were going to use an OLED but after seeing the new preston remote I'm not very happy with its lack of readability in direct sunlight.

How about saving the lens position/camera data to a computer?

Someone could perform a camera move (at least pan/tilt) and save the data to a computer. Then they could playback the camera move while remotely racking focus (with the lens breathing compensation mode) and save that data to the computer. Once you have it perfect, you could combine the Mirus MoCo data and FIZ data into one file so you can repeat everything with one click. That would be sweet! :biggrin:

We just need a MoCo dolly/jib sometime next year to complete the setup.Yes, When the reomte is used with the moco system you will be able to record the camera movement first, then playback the move while pulling focus and recording that new data alongside the original move data. When you playback you can pick and choose the tracks that you want ot play or play them all. Moco dolly early next year - Feburary-ish.

Hey Curt

So.. do you now when the MB will be shipping.

Just trying to work out timelines here.

Regards
Rory Red is in charge of when the motors will ship and what they will cost. I'm just saying that the remote that controls the motors are going to be out by the end of the year. The matte box is in the concept stage and I'm trying my best to get it finished up to show you guys. I'm hoping to get it out this year as its much easier and inexpensive to manufacture than our moco system. After seeing what the guys at redrock have done we're going to have to make the price and features something that stands out.. more soon :)

BTW, Heres the newest look for the remote...

Brook Willard

07-04-2007, 01:31 PM

Cool, looking good! If this thing is even close to the C-Motion system... I'll love you forever.

Curran Giddens

07-04-2007, 01:34 PM

When the remote is used with the moco system you will be able to record the camera movement first, then playback the move while pulling focus and recording that new data alongside the original move data. When you playback you can pick and choose the tracks that you want to play or play them all. Moco dolly early next year - Feburary-ish.

That is exactly what I was hoping for. Thanks!

roryhinds

07-04-2007, 01:43 PM

Andrew Benz

07-04-2007, 02:03 PM

Cool, looking good! If this thing is even close to the C-Motion system... I'll love you forever.

I would like to second Brook and Curran... Thank you!

CVB

07-04-2007, 02:11 PM

Hi Curt

Sounds amazing and the 3d image looks great.

I guess the biggest thing is delivering, as it seems there is so much hype around products that promise the world but aren't available... one gets overloaded with hype and promises and tied of slick 3d modeling.

I'm sure you can appreciate that the real tangible world is where its at.

Regards
Rory

Well, all I can say is that I hate not living up to my word... I may be off by a month or two here and there but its never due to lack of commitment on my part ;) One thing I can tell you is that all of this stuff is in the works and hardware is going to be sitting on my desk in a few weeks. All the engineering is being done by myself and one other individual so things are a little hectic. We are picking and choosing our battles carefully to make sure we can deliver on what we promise. Some features will be enabled with firmware updates but the main thing is to get the hardware in place to support that additional functionality. This sounds so familiar...

Finner

07-04-2007, 02:18 PM

Looks really nice Curt with great clean lines. I like the zoom system.

Some quick points (As you know most focus pullers are a bit of a quirky breed and when they find a system that works they stick with it). On that note.

1. I would say 95% or higher of focus pullers regardless if they are right or left handed pull focus with their left hand when useing a non remote follow focus (it makes it easier to hide beside the camera and out of the talents eyeline). So thus there are a bunch that perfer the focus wheel on the remote be on the left side (that said the arri version is right hand focus wheel and most focus pullers can adapt quite easily.) So if it is easy for the hand control to allow for left or right focus pulling it would be a bonus, if not I can't see it making much of a negitive impact on your sales.

2. There is something about a simple plastic follow focus wheel that just feels right and is what a focus puller is use to. I would lose the foamy style wheel. It would get sopping wet in wet weather and on those tense big focus pulling shots soak up the focus pullers hand sweat and not only feel nasty but soon smell like a pair of old hockey gloves (For those that have never smelled old hockey equipment, especially gloves I invite you to come visit my basement next time you are up in Canada).

3. A markable white disk or "puck" is a must but I think the only reason it is not being shown is because the clean black render looks so kick ass without it.

4. A spinable lockable focus marking point that physically sticks out and above the hand grip wheel is a must for 2 reasons (1- if a lense motor hops a cog on the lense and the sun is going down the first AD is yelling you have no time to re-calibrate the lense setting so a quick adjustment of the focus mark point is the best option in a lot of situations. 2 The way the focus mark point physically sticks up is actually a tool in an experienced focus pullers bag of tricks. When I pulled focus I would often just before rolling spin the focus to the closest mark the actor was hitting or closest focus I needed to hit for that shot and then place my index finger so it just hit the side of the adjustable focus mark. Then I would spin the focus to the slate and then to the begining focus point of the shot all the while holding my index finger on that "end focus point" of the shot on the focus wheel. This way when I needed to hit the last focus point I did not even have to glance at the lense just watch the talent walk to their final mark and when my finger hit the focus mark I knew I was at the correct focus distance for that point. Also quite often an actor will have a slight lean back and lean in on a shot. In this case I would measure and find my distances for the near and far points and place the focus mark that sticks up between my index finger and middle finger (index on the close focus point and middle on the far) this way the actor could lean as much as they wanted back and forth and I would know exactly where I was on the lense as my different fingers touched the mark point without ever having to look at the lense and possibly missing the movement of an actor. So to sum that up the spinable lockable focus mark that sticks up is very important and I thought you would appreciate knowing why.

Other then those small points the remote unit looks fantastic.

CVB

07-04-2007, 02:44 PM

Thanks for the feedback Daren.
Heres a couple points on the above that I should probably mention...

1) The control inputs are modular. The focus knob can be moved to the left or right and the screen can me moved around as well. The screen actually folds between the handle and the base unit so its fairly compact for storage.
I guess I rendered it the way it is because I'm right handed but I understand your concern.

2) The foam portion is removable and we will have a few options, including rubber and knurled aluminum etc. What ever people ask for the most :)

3) The markable puck might be an issue with this system. Let me explain... Since the red motors are motion control and can goto preset positions there is a problem when we use an input device that has a memory.. when actual motor position is different from what the knob indicates. If we put a markable puck on there then as soon as a preset is used the puck will be out of sync with the motor position. The reason we added the screen is that we are going to have all the lens data pre-configured so you won't have to mark anything or spend anytime calibrating the motor to the knob on the remote. we are going to have a facility on the remote where you can set user positions on the screen and pull focus to those.

If thats a huge turn off to people then we can put in a white focus ring and make the remote simulate the old school way of doing things. In that case the presets would probably need to be disabled so the motor wont be out of syc with the knob position.

4) If all the lens data is built in to the unit then a recalibration would take about 20 seconds... however long it takes the motor to find the limits of the lens. Thats the whole point behind having the lcd screen - so there is no need make marks on a ring to correlate to the lens. I understand your point though. I figure that if we make the unit modular then theres plenty of opportunities to make add-ons that will fit the bill for the way things are currently done.

Finner

07-04-2007, 03:00 PM

Sounds good Curt.

The main reason for a markable puck is not usually to be able to mark the actual distance measurements for each lense as quite often I would have many permenantly marked pucks for various lenses sitting beside them in the lense case. The main reason is many focus pullers will find the focus distance of a natural mark in frame (a tree, car, rock...) and then make a mark on the white puck with a line and a little drawing of the tree or car. I have never seen a remote follow focus without a puck or marking disc before. It may be a bit of a hard sell without one.

CVB

07-04-2007, 03:09 PM

Understood. A question I would have is this... when you have set positions for objects that will definitely hit their marks like rocks and cars that are stationary, why not use the presets? You can get the focus dead on then set the parameters for the max velocity and ease In/out to get it dialed in exactly the way you want it. Then the paranoia is out of the equation... you just hit a button and the pull will look smooth and steady and there is no possibility of overshooting or messing it up. If you have a situation where the objects are moving then thats another story.

The approach that we are taking is this... a large percentage of the guys who are going to be buying these are probably not professional focus pullers. We're trying to hit that point where we won't totally turn off the pros but also pull in the new guys that really want professional shots and don't necessarily have the high end skill set. This is kind of like the mac of the remote FF industry :)

Finner

07-04-2007, 03:41 PM

The thing with pulling focus is nothing ever happens the exact same way twice. An actor or car moves differently or not at the same speed each shot or worse yet in the middle of the shot the director calls out some new direction that throws off everything. A good focus puller can adjust on the fly for any shot as you never know when that cinematic geneius will happen.

You have done such an amazing job with what you have done and designed. I will be a little blunt here as I feel it is the best for your product. It seems like you are over engineering and possibly even trying to re-invent the wheel. Simple most often works best. I am trying to understand your post on why the marking disc "puck" would not work and do not quite understand why it would not work. Heres the thing give the focus puller the full control as seldom to never would a focus puller want the pull to happen automatically as like I mentioned things always happen a little different. I see you having the opportunity to really take a big bite out of the Arri and Preston remote follow focus bussiness. I just see simplifing the unit being a big plus the auto features and eliminating breathing features would be very seldomly used as compared to a simple unit that is budget friendly and works like a preston or Arri unit. These units are very expensive but do a very simple job and cost way to much. The thing is function will always beat features. I may be misunderstanding you a little but it really seems like you are just a few small steps away from a grand slam.

PM me or e-mail me about any questions you may have as I am more then happy to do what I can.

Daren

Finner

07-04-2007, 03:50 PM

4) If all the lens data is built in to the unit then a recalibration would take about 20 seconds... however long it takes the motor to find the limits of the lens. Thats the whole point behind having the lcd screen - so there is no need make marks on a ring to correlate to the lens. I understand your point though. I figure that if we make the unit modular then theres plenty of opportunities to make add-ons that will fit the bill for the way things are currently done.

On a set quite often a recycling of the motor is too long of a time to wait even if it is 20 seconds. A really good Focus puller will try and do their job so that production will never have to wait on them. A spin of the focus mark (2 seconds) is what 99% of focus pullers would rather do then re-cycle the motor (I know this because I use to work with remote FF systems a lot and a quick re-set of the focus mark is a very common thing.

Finner

07-04-2007, 03:59 PM

Understood. A question I would have is this... when you have set positions for objects that will definitely hit their marks like rocks and cars that are stationary, why not use the presets? You can get the focus dead on then set the parameters for the max velocity and ease In/out to get it dialed in exactly the way you want it. Then the paranoia is out of the equation... you just hit a button and the pull will look smooth and steady and there is no possibility of overshooting or messing it up. If you have a situation where the objects are moving then thats another story.

I re-read this and saw what you were trying to say here. When a focus puller grabs a stationary mark like a tree or car it is not to get the tree or car in focus but so that when an actor walks past the tree or car the focus puller will know where sharp focus is for that point.

Curran Giddens

07-04-2007, 04:29 PM

The approach that we are taking is this... a large percentage of the guys who are going to be buying these are probably not professional focus pullers. We're trying to hit that point where we won't totally turn off the pros but also pull in the new guys that really want professional shots and don't necessarily have the high end skill set. This is kind of like the mac of the remote FF industry :)

I appreciate any feature (like the breathing elimination mode) that can help a non-professional (like myself) to pull focus. I think you are taking the right approach....

Finner

07-04-2007, 05:02 PM

I appreciate any feature (like the breathing elimination mode) that can help a non-professional (like myself) to pull focus. I think you are taking the right approach....

But eliminating breathing can be take care of quite easily in post.

Don't get me wrong on this I think features are great. It's just the tried and true methods are most often there because they work. For example a mercedes with every feature on earth but no steering wheel or brakes is probably not going to make the driver that happy even if it has the most advanced GPS system on the market.

I pulled focus for almost 10 years and the best young focus pullers I now work with still use traditional methods they just have a few new tricks and tools they add to them.

I am pretty sure I am doing a really bad job of explaining the small additions needed to make this as good if not better then current high end models on the market. What I am recomending seems to me like it would be a very simple thing to add. I also am in no way undermining what Curt has done as I do not have the skills to achieve what he produces and does. I do however have a long relationship with the follow focus wheel and even though different things about it may seem small I can assure you that many things that seem unimportant are key elements. Think of it this way there are big time proffesional focus puller making over $250,000 a year that spend 12hrs or more a day for possibly their whole career just spinning that focus wheel. Even though it may seem unbeliveablysimple their are key things that seperate a good follow focus from a prosumer one. I understand Curran that you want features that will help you or the focus pullers you hire to do a good job its just you would be suprised at how effective a simple white marking disc or a raised rotatable focus mark will be in the process.

Finner

07-04-2007, 05:12 PM

I uploaded this picture that may help. Having a white disc like this that spins with the follow focus wheel and has a stationary black outside surround with a focus mark point that can be rotated and locked would be perfect. I do not see this being that hard to incorporate.

CVB

07-04-2007, 05:22 PM

Daren,I totally understand what you are talking about and believe me we didn't just say to ourselves " lets get rid of that stupid white thing." I respect that there is a certain way things are currently done but on the same token I want to try and innovate and takes steps forward rather than do what everyone else is doing just because thats the way its always been. If our culture continued to design around the current way that things are done then we would still be hand cranking our cameras. All I ask is that people try out something new and see if it makes their lives easier. I can easily add the ring and thats not a problem. I do think that the time that will be saved by never having to look for a pre-marked ring and never having to correlate lens positions to the focus ring may be a benefit to some people. Getting rid of lens breathing would be huge for the indie guys that can't afford $10K in glass. There is a huge number of non-pros that are buying the red camera and I think a large number of the sales on this system will be coming from them. BTW, the time that it takes to move the lens to one stop and back to the other may not even be 20 seconds.. thats just a guess. It might be 10 seconds, it depends on the lens.

Finner

07-04-2007, 07:36 PM

Thats cool Curt. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. Your new system may very well become the industry standard of the future. I just wanted to explain the little tricks focus pullers do with the current standard configuration.

As far as the recalibration of a motor goes I know exactly how long it takes to run a preston and arri motor through the range and yours may run quicker. I just have run into times in the past on set where that small wait was just a little too long. Mainly due to a grumpy director, star or DP that is looking for blood and you don't want to be the one sticking your neck out at that point.:gun:

When you break it all down I am one of your biggest fans. I am confident from what I have seen of your work you will put out the best matte box going and the look and ergonomics of your follow focus is better then anything on the market right now. I look forward to using your equipment soon and for many years in the future.

I am sorry if I came across harsh or super critical as that was not my intention. Because I am blunt and speak my mind I can tend to come across that way sometimes.

CVB

07-04-2007, 07:38 PM

No worries... I have thick skin :) I really appreciate comments on our stuff, it makes me think more about what we are doing and why. In the end it doesn't do us any good to ignore the customers.

chuck colburn

07-04-2007, 07:49 PM

Nice looking stuff there Curt.
Would it be possible to include one of those little pizeo electric speakers in the unit that says "You blew the split...ASSHOLE!" at the end of the take?

CVB

07-04-2007, 08:11 PM

It may be tough to make it say that but I could have it play that sound like when pac man dies. http://www.digitpress.com/dpsoundz/pacdies.wav ;)

chuck colburn

07-04-2007, 08:18 PM

Hahahaha...
God I always hated that sound. It's so......wilting.

chuck colburn

07-04-2007, 08:24 PM

Curt,

This is probally stupid to even ask but, does the control unit have reversing switches to allow oppisite rotation of function while keeping the direction the knobs turn the same?

Chuck

CVB

07-04-2007, 08:46 PM

Yup. There are reversing switches on the receiving unit on the camera.

Paul Leeming

07-05-2007, 07:55 AM

Curt, I wasn't aware of the Mirus before now but having looked at the specs and photos, it would seem to be a normal style head with the addition of motors and a computer to make everything repeatable, adjustable etc.

I am starting my company with a clean slate as far as equipment goes - instead of buying a regular head AND a moco head, is it possible to use your Mirus as a full time head and if so, will it stack up in quality of movement to the major players' offerings such as O'Connor, Satchler et al? Is there variable damping, a manual override switch or something that allows the electronics to be switched off when not needed, turning it into a normal head until a moco shot is needed?

My reasoning being that it would be better to spend a bit more on one head and get the whole box and dice, than to have to buy and carry two heads around the place for a shoot.

Cheers for your efforts across the board, I'm keeping a close eye on your FF and MB for my two rigs too as well as the Red Motors, SuperGrip and other bits :)

Matt Uhry

07-05-2007, 08:28 AM

Curran Giddens

07-05-2007, 10:48 AM

I am starting my company with a clean slate as far as equipment goes - instead of buying a regular head AND a moco head, is it possible to use your Mirus as a full time head and if so, will it stack up in quality of movement to the major players' offerings such as O'Connor, Satchler et al? Is there variable damping, a manual override switch or something that allows the electronics to be switched off when not needed, turning it into a normal head until a moco shot is needed?

My reasoning being that it would be better to spend a bit more on one head and get the whole box and dice, than to have to buy and carry two heads around the place for a shoot.

I am in the same position here. Starting my company from scratch and I'm hoping to use Mirus as a full-time head.

roryhinds

07-05-2007, 11:18 AM

Where can you find out info on the Mirus and see images?

Viewfactors site has been just a holding page for a year now?

Nick Shaw

07-05-2007, 11:34 AM

http://www.viewfactor.net/

Curt, you should re-direct http://www.viewfactorstudios.com/

You could be losing potential customers.

CVB

07-05-2007, 12:54 PM

Will it stack up in quality of movement to the major players' offerings such as O'Connor, Satchler et al? Is there variable damping, a manual override switch or something that allows the electronics to be switched off when not needed, turning it into a normal head until a moco shot is needed?
Thats the general idea. The head is setup so that you can move it around using the pan-tilt bar and chose to record or not. I'd suggest you just record everything... never know when you might need it. The head has on board flash data storage (4 GB) and that will cover about quite a number of hours of recording. You can also archive the data to a computer to free up space.
The system has user definable attributes for max speed, ease in, ease out etc. that will allow you to make it feel like a fluid head or what ever you like.
As far as disconnecting the electronics goes... nope. The electronics are what makes everything work. The input bar sends an electronic signal to the computer that is used to control the motors... no effort is needed to move the head back and forth. In the coming months we will have some tutorials online so you can see what we're talking about.

Could you explain better the idea of skipping the markable focus ring in favor of having presets ? In the situations where you use a remote nothing is preset, everything is changing all the time! crane, steadicam and hand-held.
We understand that there are many situations where nothing is preset but then again there are situations where things are preset. The idea behind the presets are for the moco side of the motors... say you want to do a motion controlled rack focus, its totally possible using presets because the pull will be exactly the same each time you use it. The red motors are capable of much more than just turning a lens and we have some other things in store that you guys aren't clued into yet :)

Add all the cool features you like, but don't skip anything vital and necessary for frou-frou stuff.
No doubt, we'll make sure that the vital stuff is there.

BTW.... Nick, the website is now forwarding to viewfactor.net. Thanks for the suggestion.

roryhinds

07-05-2007, 12:55 PM

cool, I was not aware of this site.

So is it possible to use the Mirus as a standard Head with tripod as I'm looking at getting a O'connor 2060 and if Mirus will do the same job plus more would be very cool.

roryhinds

07-05-2007, 01:03 PM

So the Mirus needs power so I'm am understanding it correctly that it can't work as a O'connor as you need to plug it in to work or is it battery powered?

CVB

07-05-2007, 01:26 PM

Yes, it runs on 24-48V. We will have a battery pack available for the 48V option within a couple months of shipping. We are going to try and have an accessory power output to run other things besides the head.

Paul Leeming

07-06-2007, 09:13 AM

Thanks Curt, now I get it!

I LOVE the idea of using the electronics to effectively simulate a normal head type, with regard to ease in/out, feeling like a fluid head etc. I guess the only potential gotcha is running out of power for it at an inopportune moment, but then again that can happen with any part of the electronics jungle on a film set and is by no means limited to the moco head!

Consider me interested, will keep a close eye on developments before my cameras ship :)

Brian Broz

07-06-2007, 01:06 PM

I remember seeing the Mirius at NAB 3 years ago and was blown away by the price/performance and what it could do (not that I know much about motion control). It seems they have improved the product and brought the price down even more...can't wait to see the end result!

Daniel Reichenbach

07-06-2007, 01:52 PM

BTW, thanks to Curran and the other 24 people who reserved a Mirus. :)

Thank you! I'm very curious, can't wait, need it as soon as possible ;-)

CVB

07-06-2007, 01:58 PM

Yeah, we've been through a few revisions. Heres the one we showed at NAB 2004.... It ran on windows CE, ran on stepper motors, and had a capacity of 10 pounds. Windows CE was a big mistake, glad were on linux now :)

BTW... We now have a forum up on our site for discussing 3rd party accessories for Red as well as our products. I hate to have two web pages you guys will have to visit daily but it might be a better option than throwing the accessory discussions in the off-topic.
Here's the link: http://viewfactor.net/forum/index.php

Alexander Black

07-07-2007, 11:36 AM

We are also working on a lens breathing compensation mode that will basically eliminate breathing on your lenses.

Curt, that's a big deal. If you need someone to do UI design for the lens data site, I'll trade ya :)

Fantastic.

tj williams

07-07-2007, 07:05 PM

Chris Stout

07-07-2007, 07:16 PM

>>>Just trying to figure out how to spend the remaining $10k that I have budgeted for this year.

I'd buy another lens. You can't rent out with just the 18-50 that's on your site.

Chris

Curran Giddens

07-08-2007, 02:44 AM

>>>Just trying to figure out how to spend the remaining $10k that I have budgeted for this year.

I'd buy another lens. You can't rent out with just the 18-50 that's on your site.

Chris

I think the 18-50 is the only Red lens that will be available this year. Maybe the 50-85 too. The prime lens set probably won't be available until next year.

Here is a quote from the "Madman" himself:

The 18-50mm CF T3 (f2.8) lens will be available immediately with the shipments of the 1st cameras. The 50-150mm T3 (f2.8) lens will likely be available at years' end. The 18-85mm T3 (f2.8) lens is still in the works. We are hoping for mid-2008. The Prime lens set is scheduled for years' end or 1st of 2008. Hope that helps. Remember, all could change tomorrow. :-)

Jim

Steve Gibby

07-08-2007, 08:15 AM

I think the 18-50 is the only Red lens that will be available this year. Maybe the 50-85 too. The prime lens set probably won't be available until next year.

Based on what I've tracked from postings by RED Team:

The 18-50 CF zoom will be ready when the first cameras ship.

The 300 prime will be ready when the first cameras ship.

The 50-150 zoom could possibly be ready by the end of 2007

The prime set could possibly be ready by the end of 2007

There is no 50-85 zoom Curran. I assume you meant the 18-85 zoom, which may be ready in mid-2008

Curran Giddens

07-08-2007, 08:23 AM

There is no 50-85 zoom Curran. I assume you meant the 18-85 zoom, which may be ready in mid-2008

Actually I meant the 50-150 but thanks for the clairification.

Mark L. Pederson

07-08-2007, 06:33 PM

I would expect more lenses from RED announced before the end of the year.

Actually, I expect RED will drop a few more bombs at IBC this year.

Never a dull moment with the RED GANG!

Elijah Kelley

07-08-2007, 08:26 PM

CVB The white disk, and the movable marker on focus controllers is not the car motor crank it is the rim of the steering wheel. The response like Daren's would be overwhelming, if more on this site had pulled focus for a living. Many rental houses are buying the red. Large numbers of these cameras will be used in very high end applications. High end films are focused by experienced professional people. Many indy folks learned to their dismay that when they put the 35mm adapters up, suddenly things got soft. When crewing for my Red camera I would come down on rate for the gaffer (11+ stops) to get the extra money for the 1st.

CVB I'm definately with TJ and Darren especiallay having gone from DV to a RedRock Micro with Zeiss Digi Primes on my last Film. Things went soft and when we had to do an eleven minute stedi walk through the focus puller (Ned the man Smith) had to adjust by mark and eye on the FIZ as he had to jump up over the stedi operator to see the talent because he was shorter than the stedi operator.

Just hoping your remote unit will have the option of a movable marker that would interest me greatly. Hope to be using your remote with my RED. Thanks.

Priyesh P.

07-09-2007, 09:24 AM

Curt, I had a little discussion regarding your system with my brother, who is a dop/photographer. He meant that the Impero at a price tag of around 1ooo dollars is literally affordable for everybody, but he remarked that service and repair could be a bit time consuming if the unit has to be sent overseas.
( I know that it is planned to be as sturdy and un-mechanical as possible, but still, shit can happen all the time, like the trouble we had with the minolta D7 that had to be sent for servicing three times within one year... )

Finner

07-09-2007, 09:52 AM

Easy answer for that kalone. At $1,000 just buy 2 so you have a back up.

Priyesh P.

07-09-2007, 11:41 AM

Easy answer for that kalone. At $1,000 just buy 2 so you have a back up.

Funny, my brother suggested the same, too...
:-)

p.s.: But what if both units fail to some mysterious reasons?
Please don't tell me to buy three units...

CVB

07-09-2007, 01:06 PM

Initially I'd expect that there will be some time involved. We are a small company and can only do so much, but in the long term I'd say that we will have distributors that can handle the repair process. The easiest short term solution that I can think of would be that you could call us directly and we would overnight a loaner replacement unit to you until we are able to repair your unit. When your repairs are complete we could send it along with a prepaid box for return. If that doesn't work then you could just buy three ;)

Priyesh P.

07-09-2007, 02:44 PM

Pierce Cook

07-10-2007, 02:23 PM

Priyesh P.

07-10-2007, 02:52 PM

CVB,

Could you in a few sentences tell us about each product you're developing so we know in whole what you're trying to accomplish? Also if you'd explain what some of the abbreviations in this thread mean if they pertain to your products.

Thanks!

Pierce, Curt and his company has a beautiful forum especially for their systems at www.viewfactor.net (and then follow the links), there you'll find everything about mirus, impero and co.
But it's likely that he'll make a glimpse here and answer directly to you...

CVB

07-10-2007, 03:24 PM

Pierce,

Mirus: A motion control system with pan and tilt. It allows you to record and repeat camera movements. The system is expandable to include zoom, focus, and iris control. Early next year we will have an option for dolly and possibly lift. The base system includes the head, power supply, cables, and input bar.

Impero: A wireless remote system for the Red Motors. It can control up to 3 motors and works with the Mirus system mentioned above. Since the Red Motors have amplifiers built in, the size of the receiver unit is smaller than a deck of playing cards and weighs practically nothing. The base system includes the remote and receiver unit, cables are probably going to be separately.

Matte Box (sorry no name yet): TBD, we're trying to get a couple other goodies into production then we'll tackle this... My goal is to get it out around the end of November.

Casey Green

07-10-2007, 03:45 PM

Hi CVB,

The Remote looks great !

Could you explain better the idea of skipping the markable focus ring in favor of having presets ? In the situations where you use a remote nothing is preset, everything is changing all the time! crane, steadicam and hand-held.

The focus puller needs an easy to read system as their attention is cycling from the camera position to the subject to the focus disk and back again.

It's never going to work like everybody is on the green set of marks, press the green button.

Add all the cool features you like, but don't skip anything vital and necessary for frou-frou stuff.

I'm a huge fan BTW. If you'd like to discuss further and get in touch with some focus pullers / have a set visit etc. send me a PM.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

CVB, the products look great - can't wait for all of this to come together.

I do, however, have to agree with several posts on this thread, that it seems the white disc and moveable mark would be sorely missed. In my experience, things are constantly changing on set with little or no warning, and yet the expectations are that the entire crew will be ready for anything with no down time between takes. (of course this could vary in different project environments)

Is the FF / motors product meant to be used as a complete solution, or would it be one of your tools in the toolbox for specific shooting styles?

Also, can you describe how the ff would be used in situations where you need to make adjustments on the fly?

thanks - keep up the great work,

Curran Giddens

07-10-2007, 03:55 PM

Mirus:

Impero:

Matte Box

Count me in for one of each....

Jay A. Kelley

07-10-2007, 04:09 PM

Curt,

Very excited about the mattebox.. My only suggestion would be this: Looking as CAvision (We're working with one on a feature now) they clearly made it cheaper by building it cheaper. Not impressive at all. I would suggest building a GRADE-A swingaway mattebox and trying to keep it reasonable.

The MB-20 is running around $5,600 with eyebrows, filter trays, etc.. Why not see if you can make something equally impressive for 1/2 that cost.

Lord knows I'd buy it..

My two cents
Jay

CVB

07-10-2007, 04:17 PM

Casey, I don't think I ever said we wouldn't put the white disk on the remote, I was just pointing out what that means in the context of the system that we are making. Its not difficult to put it on there but I'm just trying to understand why someone would rather spend a two minutes writing marks on the disk rather than just hitting a button will automatically map the lens positions to the "virtual disk" on the lcd instantly. If thats what everyone is used to doing then I will throw the white disk into the design. I see no reason why both systems can't coexist :)

Jay - Just because we're making things affordable doesn't mean they're going to be cheap. I don't think its worth our time to make a crappy product just to make it... I want to make things that look like they cost an arm and a leg but only cost an arm, or maybe a few fingers.

Adrian Correia

07-10-2007, 04:28 PM

in regards to the mattebox and the remote...count my fingers in....

Finner

07-10-2007, 04:37 PM

I've had a few camera companies charge me an arm and a leg that I would still like to give them a finger or two.

Casey Green

07-10-2007, 04:43 PM

Casey, I don't think I ever said we wouldn't put the white disk on the remote, I was just pointing out what that means in the context of the system that we are making. Its not difficult to put it on there but I'm just trying to understand why someone would rather spend a two minutes writing marks on the disk rather than just hitting a button will automatically map the lens positions to the "virtual disk" on the lcd instantly. If thats what everyone is used to doing then I will throw the white disk into the design. I see no reason why both systems can't coexist :)

OK, gotcha. Yes, that does make sense. thanks. (I also agree both systems could coexist, and perhaps that is the best option).

Finner

07-10-2007, 05:16 PM

Casey, I don't think I ever said we wouldn't put the white disk on the remote, I was just pointing out what that means in the context of the system that we are making. Its not difficult to put it on there but I'm just trying to understand why someone would rather spend a two minutes writing marks on the disk rather than just hitting a button will automatically map the lens positions to the "virtual disk" on the lcd instantly. If thats what everyone is used to doing then I will throw the white disk into the design. I see no reason why both systems can't coexist :)

Good news. Your new focusing lcd concept will be interesting to see. I am sure it will spur on new focus pulling techniques for some 1st AC's but many do live and die by the little white marking disc. Especially when on a crane and setting hard natural focus mark points on the disc which is one of the most often uses of a remote follow focus.

John V

07-10-2007, 07:49 PM

Finner

07-10-2007, 09:23 PM

I know i am not an expert by any means but dont blast me for the comment. The white disk is used to mark real points correct? Now if there is a virtual marking lcd why does it matter if it is there or not. Also remember the focus assist is completely motion control based meaning it remembers point regradless of anything else. Almost all others are plain dumb remotes in that that just know the start and stop points of a lens..nothing in between. Thats my simple minded comment.

With a disc you can place your hands and fingers at 2 Oclock or another position like that that your brain remembers and allows you to pull focus without hardly looking at the lens or focus puck and just viewing the action in front of the camera. I was a focus puller for 10 years and some people think it is a simple job but I assure you it is not. I feel like a broken record trying to help people see how important the disc is for many focus pullers, its just focus pullers develop a system and the white disc is a critical part of that system for many many reasons from small to big help do the job. Lets put it this way if you were not a doctor and were about to get an operation would you really say "hey doc that machine doesn't seem like it does a whole lot so how about you don't use it." If the doctor told you it was very important would you really argue with him? Trust me the white disc and raised marker may seem like a simple device that does not achive that much but it is very important for multiple reasons and does more then you may think in the hands of an experienced focus puller.

Bruce Allen

07-10-2007, 11:00 PM

Curt, from my limited experience, it is the tactile feel of the disc that is so important.

I really think you need that white disc. All that a lot of people want is something a bit cheaper and a bit better than current systems. We don't really need fancy new focus inventions that we won't use and which add to the cost and complexity of the system.

Seriously, just aim to beat the Bartech in price/performance, like you aim to beat the Arri MB-20, and you'll have a winner.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

Priyesh P.

07-11-2007, 03:00 AM

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something.
But could it be that both sides are missing each other?

I mean is it correct Finner, that you like to have a disc for focus marks - that means markings for distances to certain points on the set? Or do you you mean focus marks in term of lens scales - that means the calibrated markings on the lens barrel?
What I would like to understand is if those of you who need a white marking disc need it to make intermediate marks or to tranfer the whole set of markings of a lens?
(hope I've made my question clear enough. I'm not a native english speaker)

Bruce Allen

07-11-2007, 03:32 AM

True. Let me try another angle - what I'd love is for the designers of this gear to actually spend a few days on set watching someone pull focus. Maybe spend a few days trying to pull focus themselves. There seems to be a slight disconnect between the engineering and the filmmaking reality.

To be honest, most of the problems have already been solved - if you look at the Arri, CMotion, Preston and even Bartech systems, they work and they are accepted by the industry. They all have big white discs. The fact that Curt's render didn't have a big white disc is scary to us because is suggests that he hasn't examined the industry standards closely and is trying to make some weird new system instead from first principles. It might be a new system of great genius, but the problem is then everyone's going to have to re-train for it, and that will suck.

If Curt created an amalgam of the current industry-standard systems or just a simplified version that is responsive and easy to use and at a good price I think most people would be perfectly happy.

Personally I think that the extra fly-by-wire preset buttons, LCD systems etc are a distraction and a hindrance from just making a simple, good, cheap follow focus that doesn't require much training and works in an industry standard way. If you do go the fancy LCD way, then do it the way Arri, Cmotion, etc. do it - that way people don't have to learn yet another system to operate the Red...

To me, all of this weird stuff is kinda like voice recognition in the Red. Yes it would be cool as heck if the thing started rolling automatically when I yell "Action" but if it put up the price or distracted the team from the primary purpose of making a good, cheap camera that people can use easily, that feature should be cut.

I say this with the utmost respect for Curt's engineering prowess!

EDIT: I should also mention that even the upcoming $500 RedRock has a white disc:
http://www.redrockmicro.com/microRemote.html
And browsing Cmotion's site, I see that the focus of their marketing is on the ergonomics of the unit. They talk about ergonomics before fancy features and that's the way it should be. Things like balance, adjustable torque, exchangable marker rings, the sensitivity of the knob, the good placement of everything, even the goodness of the neck strap! This is the right attitude to take and incredibly important. Because they talk about ergonomics first, we understand that they have their priorities straight and we trust that they have spent time getting it right.
http://cmotion.eu/cms/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=18&Itemid=31

So, my vote for the Impero is to ditch all unnecessary features and just make something simple that works beautifully. The most important thing is the ergonomics - it should get out of the way and let the focus puller do their job.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

CVB

07-11-2007, 04:10 AM

I understand everyones aversion to nixing a standard... I already conceded that the marking disk will stay. Maybe I should cover the reasoning behind the "complexity" of the system. We believe in giving value to the customer, and as such we would rather spend our time building one product that kicks ass rather than three or four and milking you guys for your hard earned cash. This isn't going to just be a remote for the lens motors, its also going to work with our moco head and a couple other goodies that are on the drawing board. When you are using it with our moco head it will control any axis, including pan and tilt. There are a number of settings that are at your disposal, from easing rate, max velocity, presets etc that might not necessarily apply in a non-moco setting but they will be important if you are doing a motion control shot with the remote. Its hard to adjust parameters if you cant see them. ;)

I could easily make a version that controls one axis and has no smarts... it would just have a knob and the white disk with a couple buttons... basically a BFD without the bulk or the price tag. I really hate making things that don't advance technology at all but if thats what everyone wants then who am I to change a standard.

I want to design this right and thats why I come to this forum to get feedback. I really do appreciate the everyones comments but try not to get too upset with me when I ask if something is an absolute necessity or if its just there because its how its always been done. The camera is revolutionary, why not make the accessories revolutionary too :)

Sorry Bruce, just saw your edit. One thing I'd like to reinforce is that this is in development.. nothing is in stone. We're going to make Impero as good as possible but in the end my priorities are 1) It won't break, 2)Its EASY to use, 3)It doesn't suck, 4)Its inexpensive.

Priyesh P.

07-11-2007, 06:17 AM

Curt, is it way too complicated to write two softwares?
Keep the hardware, but bundle it with these two:
1.Classic: Remote focus capabilities, nothing else, LCD is disabled.
2.Special: Remote focus capabilities and everything else (and the LCD works, of course)
;-)

edit: After I've thought about it a bit more, it kinda makes sense to me. Why don't integrate a little function into the software that simply disables all advanced feature and extra buttons? I mean that way even the cautious or sceptic users have a chance to test the extra functions and look if they work for them (maybe in special situations, who knows).
And the others don't have to forbear them.

Finner

07-11-2007, 09:20 AM

We believe in giving value to the customer, and as such we would rather spend our time building one product that kicks ass rather than three or four and milking you guys for your hard earned cash.

This is why I feel you guys will do so well Curt and probably one of the big reasons Jim picked up your motors to the red line up.

I want to design this right and thats why I come to this forum to get feedback. I really do appreciate the everyones comments but try not to get too upset with me when I ask if something is an absolute necessity or if its just there because its how its always been done. The camera is revolutionary, why not make the accessories revolutionary too :)

We all appreciate your openness to feedback as well.

Sorry Bruce, just saw your edit. One thing I'd like to reinforce is that this is in development.. nothing is in stone. We're going to make Impero as good as possible but in the end my priorities are 1) It won't break, 2)Its EASY to use, 3)It doesn't suck, 4)Its inexpensive.

One more big priority/request for #1) It won't break. A lot of the current remote FF units are fairly sensitive to water and however you try and cover them rain always seems to get in a little. So water resistance would be high on the list for me.

One more thing Curt I hope you did not take my post to Johnvon12 directed to you. As I had seen earlier that you were going to be incorporating the disc and that post of mine was only directed to johnvon12's question. By the way johnvon12 is not your brother is he?

donatello b

07-11-2007, 09:22 AM

"the designers of this gear to actually spend a few days on set watching someone pull focus"

WHY ??? they are only going to see somebody turning a knob with a white disc that has human made focus marks on it ... that system has work for the past X years and they will not describe any new way ...

if RED had gone out to sets before they showed the basic RED design - everybody would have described a camera between a arri and panavision .. IMO those that have been in the business know what works and have very little vision on a totally new CONCEPT ...
also you don't have to look back too far to see that the majority of those that work in the business 1st reaction to a new design ( as in RED) was a "won't work , can't be done , vaporware, this is the way we do it why change = a big NO ... ??? you don't hear any complaints these days about RED design !!

i say show me something NEW ( and i do like what i've seen ) ...
if it works better they will follow ...

Finner

07-11-2007, 09:42 AM

WHY ??? they are only going to see somebody turning a knob with a white disc that has human made focus marks on it ...

If you did not ask any questions or talk to the 1st AC this is all you would see but there is a lot more happening then you may think. Heck if you visit a film site Donatello probably what you will see is a lot of people standing around doing nothing. What things appear to be on the surface are often much different then what is really going on.

IMO those that have been in the business know what works and have very little vision on a totally new CONCEPT ...

I would have to completely disagree with this. Most people in the industry are always trying new things as it is what helps you improve and get better. The secret though is combining what is proven and works with what is new. This is exactly what red did. They essentially took what works (shutter, PL lenses, view finder, cine accesories) and added a new hi tech sensor, digital memory for storing and a few other cutting edge things. Pretty much though the RED camera looks very similiar and has most of the same features as a traditional film camera. Like I mentioned its all about combining what works with new technology and not about throwing the baby out with the bath water.

By the way Donatello what does a Ninga Turtle really know about filmaking anyway? :bleh:

Casey Green

07-11-2007, 12:26 PM

...what I'd love is for the designers of this gear to actually spend a few days on set watching someone pull focus. Maybe spend a few days trying to pull focus themselves. There seems to be a slight disconnect between the engineering and the filmmaking reality.
www.boacinema.com

Yes, I second this. What I would recommend is shadowing a focus puller on a feature, which would probably provide feedback in the most pressurized of production situations.

IMO, this will show the differences in how tools are used, and why they are developed the way they are. For example, on a non-union indy film, you might have the luxury of more time in between takes and more total takes ... perhaps a little more rehearsal time. Whereas on a union feature, you might be working under more strict time allowances, more intensity, and only have a couple of takes to work with . (Of course this can be true for any type of production... I'm just using these as examples... time requirements might be more strict on any particular production).

If watching a pro focus-puller in action in a real-world high stakes situation is possible, I think it would be extremely valuable to development regardless of which features end up in the final product.

Thanks for listening to our feedback.

CVB

07-11-2007, 12:45 PM

One more big priority/request for #1) It won't break. A lot of the current remote FF units are fairly sensitive to water and however you try and cover them rain always seems to get in a little. So water resistance would be high on the list for me.

Yeah, the water resistance was on my list on our site...
Wireless (Zigbee) and Wired control options - wireless range: 1Mile in open, 300 ft indoors
Encrypted transmission - avoids radio interference and no addressing is necessary (no dips to set)
Mono Graphical LCD - full user interface with numerous features that are easily upgraded
Modular design - all control axis are assignable to any of the three input devices (Force sensor, Knob, or Capacitive slider), right or left handed operation
Solid construction - water resistant magnesium case, o-ring seals, minimal mechanical components
3 channel simultaneous control
Motion control functionality - **record and repeat moves, goto preset positions automatically, settings for speed and easing
Removable battery pack, rechargeable via usb connection
Lens database - choose a preset lens to auto calibrate the motors to a given lens. Fully upgradeable via usb or SD card.
Receiver unit accepts 12V-24V power source and connects to three motors, includes usb connection for use with certain digital cinema cameras
Receiver unit dimensions are approx. 3.0"x2.0"x0.75"
**Lens Breathing Compensation (LBC) - during a rack focus, zoom motor compensations for breathing to keep framing consistent
**Works with Mirus motion control system - Record FIZ tracks separately or during a moco shot

** This functionality may not be in place at time of shipping but will be enabled through future software releases.

chuck colburn

07-11-2007, 02:29 PM

Wow, impressive!

Casey Green

07-11-2007, 03:02 PM

sounds great!

Finner

07-11-2007, 03:21 PM

Wow the list is great

[LIST]Removable battery pack, rechargeable via usb connection.

Will the battery pack come with a standard wall plug charger?

CVB

07-11-2007, 03:25 PM

The battery wil be 3.3V so the way its going to be charged at the moment is using the mini-usb port. There are a number of phones on the market that use that same form factor so the chargers are really inexpensive. I'm going to go ahead and add that to the list, whats $5 among friends ;)?

Alex Boothby

07-11-2007, 06:57 PM

Obvious / dumb / earth-shatteringly innovative, give the man a technical academy award for even thinking it ... question:

Has anyone thought to combine a traditional remote follow focus unit with a "focus worthy" LCD monitor - such as the 10" Bruce is designing. Sort of like a clamshell and Preston rolled into one. That way the 1st could watch a quality video tap as he/she pulls focus, and perhaps benefit from Red's magic focus assist.

At the moment I'm sure this would require tethering to the camera, but I've heard that transmitter / receivers are getting more powerful and I do believe there is a wireless product that will transmit 720p.

This begs an obvious question - is it better to pull focus to what the camera lens sees (EVF, OVF, LCD) or to the physical scene played out before the camera? I think I know the answer, but still....

Curran Giddens

07-12-2007, 08:43 AM

http://www.mrmoco.com/index2.htm

browse to: Products>Hardware>Mimic Hand Wheels

Also check out the MSA-20 Remote Head system link at the top of the page.

These LCD monitors don't look very "focus worthy." Also, it only says "Optional wireless communications can also be catered for." It doesn't say if it includes wireless video tap.

I Bloom

07-15-2007, 10:23 PM

Hey someone should merge my thread about the follow focus monitor into this thread.

I posted this on your forum too Curt, but I think your design for Impero should look a little more like Red cage and include some mount points for LCD, wireless video receiver, lights (might we need them) and sunshade. Plus someone might want to mount this thing somewhere rather than holding it on occasion. Plus we all love the whole construction toy vibe of Red and you should capitalize.

I really like the LCD marks idea, though I can see how it isn't quiet as tactile as the white ring. I think really good focus pullers have a very tactile relationship with focus and the ring with the marks is part of that. The slowness of marking on the ring, is part of the mental process, so speeding it up with technology might take some of the craft out of it. That being said, the LCD marks make a lot of sense. I think you need both and a way to disable any feature that might take the ring out of sync.

As I started to discuss in another thread, I think the future of focus is using image analysis (the magic focus) to view which parts of the image are in focus. We're still going to measure, but the magic focus is going to tell us if we got it right and also if we are having a problem with a lense.

But unfortunately it seems like the person who really needs that feed back isn't going to have it if we are focusing remotely. And unfortunately these are usually the most difficult times, because the camera is moving independantly. The person pulling the focus isn't going to have the benefit of the magic focus because they might not be close enough to see the LCD. Any thoughts on solutions to this problem.

Since RED lenses have the /i tech built in I'm wondering if the View factor system can get that info or if it just uses motor calibration to figure the focal distance. In either case it would be great to have that info off the lense handy to the AC because it takes the place of a witness cam.

IBloom