Anyone want batteries that never need to be charged?

[CVB]

I saw these guys a few years ago and thought they were full of it but they are really stepping up to the plate to prove their "free energy" technology. i'm an engineer and generally agree that energy cannot be created but can only change form.. if they pull off what their claiming i'm going have to reconsider everything I learned in school. There supposed to have a demo tomorrow so we'll see.

http://www.steorn.com/news/releases/?id=1001

[Alex Boothby]

Opppps... somebody call the big oil lobby. Can't be having none of that there free energy. Better send some good ol' boys with pipes and bicycle chains to give 'em a physics lesson.

[David Battistella]

I saw this a few months ago and I believe it might a hoax.

David

[Kyle Spicer]

LoL, Seems kinda funny that the name is Kinetica. I think that is the name of the fake company for the new DVXfest.

[C.H.Haskell]

I hope it not a hoax and I would not be surprised if it was not, although I am sure big brother would step in accordingly. Standing by...

[Steven M. Bailey]

I got an email yesterday that I won the British online lottery for 1,000,000 pounds.


Who Knows Any thing is possible:tongue:

[PaulClements]

This sounds interesting, I've always thought that magnets are something of an anomoly in the energy world and wondered why that energy couldn't be harnessed to better effect.

[PaulClements]

just tried watching the video and it says:

"Important update on the Kinetica demo:

We are experiencing some technical difficulties with the demo unit in London. Our initial assessment indicates that this is probably due to the intense heat from the camera lighting. We have commenced a technical assessment and will provide an update later today. As a consequence, Kinetica will not be open to the public today (5th July). We apologise for this delay and appreciate your patience."

Oops

[Michael Hastings]

Magnets are used to great effect - they are the key component of virtually every generator and electric motor you use.


This sounds interesting, I've always thought that magnets are something of an anomoly in the energy world and wondered why that energy couldn't be harnessed to better effect.


just tried watching the video and it says:

"Important update on the Kinetica demo:

We are experiencing some technical difficulties with the demo unit in London. Our initial assessment indicates that this is probably due to the intense heat from the camera lighting. We have commenced a technical assessment and will provide an update later today. As a consequence, Kinetica will not be open to the public today (5th July). We apologise for this delay and appreciate your patience."

Oops

surprise, surprise...

[Ace]

IMO, Steorn are nothing but an elaborate hoax. I've been following them for a few years now and they have yet to provide a shred of evidence to the 9000 scientists and researchers that signed up to their so called "challenge".

[Ramesh Jai]

I got an email yesterday that I won the British online lottery for 1,000,000 pounds.


Who Knows Any thing is possible:tongue:
How about $10,000,000 in a bank account which no one knows about and you getting a 10% commission for using your bank account to transfer the money into?

These crooks never quit but surprisingly many people still fall for these scams.

[Paul Hazlett]

to play devils advocate here for a minute....

What did Red look like 18 months ago?

[Jeremy Hughes]

What about the MEG and the Joe Cell? Anybody hear of them?

The only reason I have to disbelieve Steorn is the fact that the oil companies didn't buy them out yet.

[CVB]

Well, the way I look at it is that physical laws aren't laws because they just did a couple tests and decided "lets make it a law" . This from wikipedia:

Physical laws are:

* True. By definition, there have never been repeatable contradicting observations.
* Universal. They appear to apply everywhere in the universe. (Davies, 1992:82)
* Simple. They are typically expressed in terms of a single mathematical equation. (Davies)
* Absolute. Nothing in the universe appears to affect them. (Davies, 1992:82)
* Stable. Unchanged since first discovered (although they may have been shown to be approximations of more accurate laws—see "Laws as approximations" below),
* Omnipotent. Everything in the universe apparently must comply with them (according to observations). (Davies, 1992:83)
* Generally conservative of quantity. (Feynman, 1965:59)
* Often expressions of existing homogeneities (symmetries) of space and time. (Feynman)
* Typically theoretically reversible in time (if non-quantum), although time itself is irreversible. (Feynman)

But one interesting thing is that nothing in that list is definitive. Theres always the opportunity to disprove things like the idea that the solar system revolves around the earth. Even if Steron is a hoax I'm sure there will be many laws that get flipped around as we delve deeper into quantum mechanics etc.

One thing I always like to point out is that our math system is obviously flawed to some degree... We can determine the area of a 2'x2' square to 100% accuracy (4 sq. ft) but when we try to determine the area of a 2' diameter circle we get a number that goes out to an infinite number of decimal places even though we know that it has a definite area just like the square does.

[Chris Nuzzaco]

Sounds interesting. I'm no scientist, but when superconductors were discovered, they found that cooling things down to close to 0 Kelvin radically changed their physical properties. I believe ceramic is one of the best "cheap" superconductors and at room temperature, it doesn't conduct. So I wouldn't be surprised if some of our so called "laws" were flawed, heck, we clearly don't know everything yet anyways, and probably never will.

[Richard Andrewski]

There's this interesting little item too. "Burning water":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI)

The problem with all this though is usually the energy needed to make the reaction is greater than the energy produced.

The really interesting aspect of what I call "Personal Power Generation" which would be the ability to make your own power and no longer need a distribution grid or suppliers, is that it would totally change our world economy--which is, to a large extent, driven by energy production, generation and distribution as we've known it. In the short term, there would be major upheavals, unemployment, perhaps even war, etc.; during the change to a new technology where energy could be produced at the place it's needed rather than transmitted there (wastefully) as is the case today.

Many established fortune 500 companies would die, some would transform and continue on but some others wouldn't make it. Entire infrastructures would become unnecessary. Power stations would become loft apartments, shopping centers and at least one would become my new huge studio complex and Cool Lights factory ;-) where there would be at least 3, self-powered RED cameras in every studio--but that's another story.

The extent of the changes would, of course, depend upon how scalable the technology was. For instance, would it simply be a small device for use in homes, or would there be larger versions to power factories, buildings and other large entities? Would it also work in cars? If the device(s) could work in all these places, then the changes would indeed be huge.

The impact on the stock market would be intense. For instance, while one company or a few companies that might be the inventor(s) of the new solution might see their stock skyrocket; many many more companies that are part of the existing energy infrastructure stock would crash.

No more need for central generators, gas stations, power transmission lines, oil drilling, storage, refineries, no more need for nuclear fuel for existing nuclear power generators. Thus, massive unemployment for all the people involved in that infrastructure.

While the change might seem desirable and interesting, the effects in the short term on unemployment and existing companies would be hard to absorb. When you think about all this, it becomes easy to see why the establishment would mobilize to steal or "disappear" new technologies before they ever have a chance to see daylight...

[Jeff Kilgroe]

There's this interesting little item too. "Burning water":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI)

Heh. What that video isn't showing you is the means by which the hydrogen release process is started. That's typically a few pulses of a low-voltage current at the right frequency. The shot later of the flame turning a Sterling Motor are a hoot... Wheeee. University students are showing what by doing that? Why not build an actual engine that runs off hydrogen? Come on, it's been done before. Isaac De Riva did it in 1820 and used his hydrogen motor to power one of the very first automobiles.

Perhaps I'm being a bit cynical, but IMO Hydrogen is the fuel of the future that will replace natural gas in industry and our homes as well as power our cars. Ethanol / E85 is a complete joke and a desperate attempt by heavy industry to keep pushing a product that needs to be processed and distributed. Hydrogen can be generated locally, in peoples's homes, in your car as you drive, et.. In other words, once vehicles convert to hydrogen, gas stations will be a thing of the past. Big industry, not just oil companies, as well as government agencies are fighting it all the way. Just think about it. No more tax revenue from fuel sales. No more need to process or transport fuel. Refineries shut-down on a massive scale. Thousands of refinery and power plant workers and truck drivers out of work... OTOH, it's only a matter of time before someone unleashes hydrogen powered vehicles, generators, etc.. onto the market. So far, most such attempts haven't been very successful, but with fuel prices climbing at alarming rates and concerns over global warming, the time is right for it.

IMNSHO, I think the hydrogen revolution is going to come from Asia -- like central China. Maybe even India / Pakistan. In the USA, Europe and Japan, there are just too many controlling and oppressing forces of industry and legislation. The only way it will happen in America is if someone with enough financial and industrial muscle develops a viable mass market product (like a mid-sized car) in secret and then uleashes it in full production.

Perhaps I'm a bit sensitive on this subject, but I've got a family member and friends that work together on this very research. They have filed several patents, all of which are continuously met with legal challenges, the government has closed the patent listing, etc.. They no longer file patents or disclose any of their research.

[Richard Andrewski]

See that's my point about how the establishment mobilizes to crush these kinds of things. They know what would happen and how their existing infrastructure would be obsoleted by such a change. Hydrogen indeed could be the fuel that makes Personal Power Generation (PPG) a reality. Talk about a new revolution. The PC was a great revolution and caused a lot of changes--we wouldn't even be here talking on this forum about a Digital Film Camera if it weren't for that. The PC revolution also changed the fortunes of many companies, some for the better, some for the worse. The PPG revolution would be much bigger and would have some more violent overtones to it as entire nations lose their main national product--energy.

I do believe also, its true that the major new changes are going to happen here in Asia. When you have developing countries that are coming into their own and need to create new infrastructures to make their societies more modern, they start to look at the costs involved and sometimes figure ways to skip a step, so-to-speak. One reason wireless phones became more popular over here several years before they were in the USA.

[Jim Arthurs]

Ethanol / E85 is a complete joke and a desperate attempt by heavy industry to keep pushing a product that needs to be processed and distributed.

Ethanol is indeed a joke once you crack the "feel good" veneer surrounding the hard facts...

One tidbit... a study showed that if all EXISTING and POTENTIAL crop land in the US was instantly converted to corn production, the resulting ethanol would only handle 11% of our petro needs.

Sometimes "doing something" for the sake of "doing something" is actually nothing at all... certainly we need to crack the petro strangle-hold, but grain fuels won't be the answer in any meaningful way...

Oh, and Richard... can't wait to check out your upcoming HMI's... :)

[Poi Boy]

The worst part of the ethanol thing is that the corn industry uses mammoth amounts of fertilizer that not only pollute but require lots and lots of oil to produce. It is a losing proposition for the environment.
Aloha
-A

[Richard Andrewski]

Hey Jim,

Very impressed with your 3d mapping technique or poor man's motion control. A really great example of how "existing laws" or conventional wisdom can be changed ;-)

Doing things for "feel good" sake seems to be at an all time high right now doesn't it?

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The worst part of the ethanol thing is that the corn industry uses mammoth amounts of fertilizer that not only pollute but require lots and lots of oil to produce. It is a losing proposition for the environment.
Aloha
-A

Here's another one to consider about the corn industry -- High Fructose Corn Syrup. It's replaced cane and beet sugar in many/most products as a sweetener over the past 15 years or so; because it's cheaper and more concentrated. It also has preservative and anti-bacterial properties that increase shelf-life of the foods it's used in. Sounds great, eh? Well many many medical studies have linked its use to a rise in diabetes and kidney disorders and there may be possible links to increased obesity too. The jury is still out on a lot of that, but I'm inclined to think these small studies are heading down the right track. Sugar may rot your teeth and make you fat if you eat too much of it, but it's still better for you than any of the alternatives that people have come up with.

[Richard Andrewski]

Wouldn't surprise me in the least! Something has to account for the obesity in even children that's been going on for a while now.

[Poi Boy]

Corn lobby BAD...way too much clout; we really need some leadership in Washington.
-A

[Ace]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDPPWyVswMQ

[Finner]

Ace thanks for that. I watched all his vids and they were pretty cool. Am I the only one though that thinks Newman decided to try and invent this motor to run his grow op lights for free? The dude shure looks and sounds like he burns one down on a regular basis.

[Ace]

Well, the hydroponic farms DO use up suspicious amounts of electricity.. Necessity being mother of invention and all.

Love this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEaEuTY-zxc&mode=related&search=

[Finner]

Ya I watched that vid already and it cracked me up. The advantage for hydroponics was exactly what I thought was going through his head. We have a ton of it up here in Alberta and BC (big big operations) in fact I heard the Canadian hydro bud was so full of THC that the Hells Angels up here were trading it with US dealers almost pound for pound for coke. I guess they can cut the Canadian bud with branch and leaves and make it go a really long ways. They actually busted an underground tunnel between BC and the US just a little while ago. I have seen on the news some of the busts they have made on the grow ops and it is crazy how big they are. To bring it back to power it seems like that is often the way the operations are discovered.

[Poi Boy]

This guy is way stoned. Step away from the bong Newman. LOL
-A

[CVB]

omg.. that guy looks like he just got out of a phish concert.

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Anyone want batteries that never need to be charged?

Depends... will they make me sterile?

If so... maybe.

-----

In regards to the webpage: How does it take 6 months and dozens of scientists to figure out if the energy going in is less than the energy going out?

Giving me a $40 radioshack multimeter and 20 minutes alone with the thing and I'll be able to give you a pretty good idea of its feasibility.

[Finner]

Looks like maybe the weed has helped give good old Newman some ideas and inspiration. Maybe the RED team works off the same system (LOL).

Curt your still up? Is this what your typical engineering types use for inspiration?

I have met many a director that are possitive it helps them be creative (LOL).

[Gavin Greenwalt]

"I understand quantum mechanics [...] string theory and all that."

... well we can be sure this guy is a quack.

[Finner]

I would be tempted to say being a quack almost gives him more credibility. Throughout history those that have created or achived the most have often been the quackiest SOB's around.

Or at least thats what I keep telling myself with one of the many voices I hear. In fact the one that sounds a lot like James Earl Jones just reiterated it.

[Chris Nuzzaco]

I would be tempted to say being a quack almost gives him more credibility. Throughout history those that have created or achived the most have often been the quackiest SOB's around.

Or at least thats what I keep telling myself with one of the many voices I hear. In fact the one that sounds a lot like James Earl Jones just reiterated it.

LOL I hear back in the day some dude was like "The world is round you retards!" and everyone thought he was nuts...:)

I watched a few of the earlier videos he posted, looks interesting.

Just to play devils "conspiracy theory" advocate here... maybe its big oil companies and governments making Newman look silly. If he could manage to really get this thing out there and working, totally destroy those billion dollar oil machines.:usd:

[Poi Boy]

I'd say he looks silly pretty much on his own.
-A

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I would be tempted to say being a quack almost gives him more credibility. Throughout history those that have created or achieved the most have often been the quackiest SOB's around.


All dogs like bread. Jim likes bread. Jim is a Dog.

----

If any of these gadgets work I'll see them in my walkman a year or two from now. If they don't work. I won't.

I don't see why there has to be so much drama around these things or why they feel the need for a room full of scientists to prove/disprove the thing before they're willing to commercialize. The fact of the matter is: the day they release the first commercial model (if it works) someone will reverse engineer it and the secret will be out.

[Adrian T.]

Love this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEaEuTY-zxc&mode=related&search=

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/2enw6kw.jpg

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Wow, Chuck has serious issues.

First of all, he's not inventing anything... He's building a Newman motor (aka, The Newman Machine). Which really isn't even Joseph Newman's own invention -- the dude just credited himself with it about 20 years ago or somewhere about then. The guy is a completely wacko religious fanatic, who 15 years ago was preaching that in the year 2000, certain doom and the second coming of a Messiah from God (not Jesus, someone new) would come to pass.

Anyway, the Newman Machine was not Newman's idea or invention and it's not a free energy device, according to it's true inventor, Amos Whitney. ...Amos is the guy who co-founded the Pratt and Whitney company in 1860, which today is one of the world's largest developers and manufacturers of aircraft engines. Newman wasted over $1M in investors' money trying to patent "his" motor design and he was never successful doing so.

Whitney's magnetic motor, is nothing more than a large, slow-spinning electric motor that can produce a lot of torque in comparison to the amount of engergy put into it due to the mass of the magnets used and their positioning. The basic theory is 2 or more very strong magnets are positioned around a central axle so that they assert an attractive force on one another. A wire coil is constructed around the magnet space just like you see in most any electric motor. Once the motor is started, it only needs to draw just enough power to stimulate enough of the magnetic mass to counter gravity and other resistive forces. The mass / inertia of the magnets helps too.

During the '60s and early '70s when voltaics were viewed as an up and coming industry, there was a revival of Whitney's motor. And several people successfully combined batteries, solar panels and these magnetic motors to make a machine that would run indefinitely. Solar panels could keep the battery charged, it in turn could sustain the motor. Many tried to sell these motors commercially for purposes like pumping water.

In the Chuck2na videos, his motor could probably run for days, maybe even a week or more before that battery is drained. Also with some designs, including the design Newman attempted to patent, a brush-style generator is often incorproated to feed power back into the battery system. As the motor turns, some power does return to the battery and it gives the false impression that it could be self sustaining. But once again, the amount of energy expended is still greater than the returns and by feeding generated power back into the system, it probably only gains 10% or so...