RELEASED: Beta Build 20 Firmware (v20.0.2) [Archive]

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Brent@RED

07-22-2009, 12:40 PM

The latest version of RED ONE beta firmware (Build 20 - v20.0.2) has been released on www.red.com/support .

Significant changes since Build 18 v3.6.4 (Beta firmware release):
* Enhanced Color Matrix
* Decreased noise in blue channel, especially under tungsten lighting
* Increased accuracy of skin tones on RED-EVF, RED-LCD, and HD-SDI monitor outputs
* 48V Phantom Power is now maintained over power cycle (Rev B audio boards only)
* Headphone output level now maintained over power cycle.
* Fixed ""audio codec error" on clips with audio played back from RED-DRIVE
* Fixed "green flash" on clips with audio played back from RED-DRIVE
* Fixed camera reboot on clips played back from RED-DRIVE
* Fixed camera reboot following receipt of corrupted lens data from S4/i port.

Note: If camera encounters corrupted lens data it will disable S4/i port until next power cycle.

Note: Cooke S4/i lenses and Birger Engineering interface are not supported under this Build.

Thanks, BC

Simon Blackledge

07-22-2009, 12:54 PM

Brent if S4/i data isnt supported how can you get corrupt data?

Cheers

Si

Michael Hastings

07-22-2009, 12:54 PM

Note: Cooke S4/i lenses and Birger Engineering interface are not supported under this Build.

Thanks, BC

Is this being worked on? and have you investigated a more direct interface with Birger/canon data (i.e. without translation to cooke format)? as I would guess at this point (and more so in the future) that is the predominant use of the i/interface. I suspect you may be able to get a more robust implementation of lens data both to the screen and metadata working with Birger - simply because they have some pretty good engineering and more incentive to get it done both quickly and with a high degree of reliability.

Brent if S4/i data isnt supported how can you get corrupt data?

Cheers

Si

Just saw that. If one were to be a bit snarky they'd say that's how they fixed the reboot problem.:biggrin:

Chosei Funahara

07-22-2009, 01:29 PM

Oh I love it!
During Summer break, I can work on REDONE again, I need it.

Thanks Red Team!

Stuart English

07-22-2009, 01:33 PM

..if S4/i data isnt supported how can you get corrupt data?

It doesn't say that. RED's S4/i based lenses are supported in this Version of Build 20.

There can be a variety of ways of getting corrupted data from the lens, including pinching the lens data cable...

For the record, we do (or at least should) support Cooke S4/i lenses, but there is no spec with regard to Birger.

If the S4/i data port works with that, its a coincidental benefit. We just note that it does not work in this Version.

But the most important message to take away is, the changes in this Build eliminate the re-boot issue.

Chosei Funahara

07-22-2009, 01:36 PM

* Enhanced Color Matrix
* Decreased noise in blue channel, especially under tungsten lighting
* Increased accuracy of skin tones on RED-EVF, RED-LCD, and HD-SDI monitor outputs

I'll tell the result soon.

Very Cool!

Mark Pugh

07-22-2009, 01:37 PM

the most important message to take away is, the changes in this Build eliminate the re-boot issue.

fantastic. appreciate it very much.

MP

Chosei Funahara

07-22-2009, 01:47 PM

2 layer of field-programmable gate array means no one can stop REDONE!
Man, this is sick!
incredible, never stop evolvement.

Cheers

Michael Hastings

07-22-2009, 02:00 PM

It doesn't say that. RED's S4/i based lenses are supported in this Version of Build 20.

There can be a variety of ways of getting corrupted data from the lens, including pinching the lens data cable...

For the record, we do (or at least should) support Cooke S4/i lenses, but there is no spec with regard to Birger.

If the S4/i data port works with that, its a coincidental benefit. We just note that it does not work in this Version.

But the most important message to take away is, the changes in this Build eliminate the re-boot issue.

Point clarified, thanks.

Many customers purchased the REDONE, and more pointedly MOST of my customers and many of the video professionals that I have come to know over the past 25 years, purchased REDONE's based on my recommendation and explanation that Birger and RED had announced the capability of using Canon SLR lenses. For many of us in the video world it was the fact that even if we were given a free Varicam or similar camera we still had to spend almost $20K to get a good HD lens with wide angle capability that pushed us to consider the REDONE. With REDONE we got a "more than HD" camera (with a few aggravations compared to those shoulder mount Sony/Pan cameras) for that $20K and a few extra grand for some Canon lenses with as good or better optics (If we didn't already own some.).

I know that RED never promised lens data or even mentioned it, but it is something that a lot of us customers would really like to have (working reliably) so in the spirit of RED being the customer oriented company, I/we would appreciate RED doing whatever it can (within reason obviously) to facilitate that.

Chosei Funahara

07-22-2009, 02:20 PM

It seems much more sensitive than build 17.
For day light set-up: ISO320 is too hard to control, I brought down to ISO200 and it works fine. Daylight sweet spot has changed to 160-200?

previous version of Build 20 had excellent result under tungsten.

Alex Carr

07-22-2009, 02:29 PM

Does the Skin tone indicator actually read 1 Stop above 18%?? or is it still 1/3 stop???

Mitch Gross

07-22-2009, 02:39 PM

So not to rain on a parade or anything, but when is there going to be an updated RELEASE Build? For insurance reasons most professionals cannot use Beta Builds. RED even advises against this on its own website. How long has it been since a Release Build has been updated? A year?

Brent@RED

07-22-2009, 02:46 PM

Stuart English

07-22-2009, 02:52 PM

Does the Skin tone indicator actually read 1 Stop above 18%?? or is it still 1/3 stop???

Its the same as in Build 17 and 18, no change.

Probably best to measure it yourself using T stop readout or ISO adjustment - it should be closer to 2/3 stop over 18% Grey (green bar)

Chosei Funahara

07-22-2009, 02:57 PM

Any way Result is incredible, ISO200 set up: I can mix tungsten and daylight, no problem.

Santiago Marti

07-22-2009, 02:59 PM

We pc users will have to wait for redcine x to use this build? does it work with the adoce CS4 suite?

Simon Blackledge

07-22-2009, 04:35 PM

Note: If camera encounters corrupted lens data it will disable S4/i port until next power cycle.

Note: Cooke S4/i lenses and Birger Engineering interface are not supported under this Build.

Thanks, BC

How can one get corrupt data from an interface thats not supported? :-/

sorry.. totally lost.

s

Brent@RED

07-22-2009, 05:04 PM

Stuart answered this in post #5 of this thread.

BC

Paul Leeming

07-23-2009, 01:09 AM

We pc users will have to wait for redcine x to use this build? does it work with the adoce CS4 suite?
The footage works fine from build 20 but it's still debayering using the older colour science. Not a problem if you know how to colour correct it as you've been doing up until now with build 17/18 footage.

That said.... bring on the build 20 compatible PC software!!!!!!!!

HTH

Paul

Daniel Reichenbach

07-25-2009, 03:42 AM

This new built has fixed all the issues I wished and the picture quality is incredible. Thanks guys.

Guidofilippi

07-25-2009, 04:31 AM

This new built has fixed all the issues I wished and the picture quality is incredible. Thanks guys.

Yes... that´s great...
But I had issues with B17... went back to B16... please!! B20 official version!!!!
I can´t rent the camera with Beta version...
Guido

Leo Ticheli

07-26-2009, 07:05 AM

I just spent a long, long day shooting with build 20.0.2 and discovered a surprise:

When I first booted up, the EVF was black and stayed that way for quite a while; after changing cables and rebooting, it was flickering so badly that it was virtually useless. Later, I found that going from zoom in and back resulted in a lengthy "black mode." Never experienced this before and suspect that might have been the original problem.

Had no reboot problems and no playback issues; today is sound, so I'll see if the playback issue is indeed solved.

My batteries seemed to drain very quickly; they are nearing end of life, around 200 cycles and it was a bit hot, though not beastly. Probably not related to the new build.

More testing today.

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo

Joe Taylor

07-26-2009, 09:24 AM

The latest version of RED ONE beta firmware (Build 20 - v20.0.2) has been released on www.red.com/support .

Significant changes since Build 18 v3.6.4 (Beta firmware release):

Note: Cooke S4/i lenses and Birger Engineering interface are not supported under this Build.

Thanks, BC

Does or didn't build 17 support the Birger interface? I just bought a Birger mount with the understanding that I would "see" important lens info.

These new developments are going to make a lot of people who own lens other than the Red brand very unhappy... and there are a lot of us out there.

Meryem Ersoz

07-26-2009, 09:36 AM

These new developments are going to make a lot of people who own lens other than the Red brand very unhappy... and there are a lot of us out there.

It is the third party manufacturer's responsibility to keep up with the changes in the camera, not the other way around. There will always be new developments with this camera - even RED's own 18-50mm lens is probably not going to cover 5K - does this mean that they shouldn't build a 5K camera, because the almost $6,000 original RED lens is not fully functional with the EPIC? Of course not.

From reports, Build 17 works well with the Birger, and Build 17 is capable of beautiful imaging. Build 20 isn't compatible with any 3rd-party editing systems yet, we will all have to be patient with the evolving process before all of these breakthroughs are fully functional.

christopher witzke

07-26-2009, 09:47 AM

I just edited a short intro shot in B20 on FCP7 using native RED through L&T.... graded in Color 1.5.... and all went well.

I shot with a canon 35mm f1.4 L on a birger.... but did not set up the menus to see the lens data. The button on the birger worked as they should.

No problems to report..... shot for about 2 hours handheld off batts to CF.

I REALLY love the look of B20! In fact, combined with color 1.5 I'll probably not use magic bullet anymore.

Andrew Wilding

07-26-2009, 09:59 AM

Stuart English

07-26-2009, 10:15 AM

Does or didn't build 17 support the Birger interface? I just bought a Birger mount with the understanding that I would "see" important lens info.

These new developments are going to make a lot of people who own lens other than the Red brand very unhappy... and there are a lot of us out there.

Bottom line is this. RED never promised that you would see or record lens metadata other than with an S4/i equipped lens.

We also have seen cameras randomly crashing since Build 17 - which enabled the lens data port - which people have obviously been upset about.

So it was time to draw a line in the sand and make sure we are offering a lens data interface that both works, and more importantly works reliably.

Which for this Version of Build 20 means RED brand S4/i lenses only.

christopher witzke

07-26-2009, 10:45 AM

Does color 1.5 support the new color science?!?!

does for me.... shot 4k 2:1, L&T ( native RED code ) into FCP7 > send sequence to color 1.5 > grade > render > send back to FCP7.

Michael Epple

07-26-2009, 10:51 AM

Until the new SDK comes out, I don't think anything but Red Alert supports the new color science.

christopher witzke

07-26-2009, 10:58 AM

Until the new SDK comes out, I don't think anything but Red Alert supports the new color science.

ok... then I guess it's just a fluke that it works for me?

Nils Ruinet

07-26-2009, 12:03 PM

ok... then I guess it's just a fluke that it works for me?
No, but it probably uses the "old" color science, not the new debayer algorithms that have been introduced in RedAlert v20 a few weeks ago...

XiaoSu Han

07-26-2009, 09:56 PM

We've had problems with the drive randomly unmounting after installing the latest build.

Alexander Christ

07-26-2009, 10:17 PM

Until the new SDK comes out, I don't think anything but Red Alert supports the new color science.

Try Clipfinder, supports the old AND the new color science.

Luis Ismael

07-27-2009, 06:11 AM

Stuart English

07-27-2009, 08:25 AM

The Red Raid is almost full only 2% available. Could this be the problem?

No, its not very not likely Luis, have sent you a P.M..

Leo Ticheli

07-27-2009, 09:05 AM

Updating my experiences with build 20.0.2; on the second shoot day I experienced no significant problems. Diagnostics on my Anton Bauer batteries has revealed that they are just too old and tired, so I've got a new set on the way.

I'm extremely please with this new build; no playback failure and wonderful image quality.

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo

Rainer Fritz

07-28-2009, 02:35 AM

Looks good the new Build except the problem, that the RED-LCD went into white flickering one time. Had to reboot the camera.....
REC709 looks alittle bit tighter in the blacks since build 20, is that possible ?

Shane Betts

07-28-2009, 06:22 AM

I have newest build 20.0.2 but whend i try to get some playback from camera i get this error:

SATA_TRANS_ FAULT

Then the red drive unmount and after few seconds mounts again.
The camera stays on and funcional.
The Red Raid is almost full only 2% available. Could this be the problem?
On this drive i have 4K HD, 23.96 fps, redcode 36 footage.

Anyone had this issue?

Yes, we're getting similar on a freshly formatted Red Raid - ie: empty. I get the SATA TRANS error but everything stays online, it just won't play the clip.

Unable to test more thoroughly yet. The RED Rockets just arrived, waiting on FCS3 and for jobs to finish so I can install. Waiting, waiting...