Local 695's RED Day

[Andrew Walker]

I just got an email from my Local saying that they are going to have a little RED Day in Burbank. Here's what they are going to cover. Of course this is only available to Local 695 members. But I'm sure there are a couple of you on here.

The following topics will be covered:

1) Intro: RED, RED ONE, 4K, REDCODE RAW
2) Demo Reel 1
3) Basic Operation: Including - Resolution options, Framerates, Exposure, Monitoring, Media options (REDDRIVE, REDFLASH, CF 8/16GB, Loading Formatting Media, Recording Modes, Actual Recording of Clips, Playback off Camera.
4) Sound: Setup & Audio Workflow
5) Video Assist: setups with RED, need for down converter if composite video is desired, Timecode / Sync needs. Also, RED RAY and QTakeHD.
6) Q & A

7) Break

8) Data Capture: Transferring of data, On-set workflow, Media used, LUTs, Backup Drives, archival options. REDCINE, REDRushes, RED Alert!, RED ROCKET, 3rd party tools (R3D Manager, Shotput, Clip Finder, Monkey Extract, Crimson, etc.)
9) Follow up Education
10) Future of RED: (EPIC, SCARLET)
11) Demo Reel 2
12) Final Q & A

[Brandon Fraley]

forgive the stupid question, but what the Local 695? I mean I know it's the union, but why is it called the Local 695?

[Andrew Walker]

forgive the stupid question, but what the Local 695? I mean I know it's the union, but why is it called the Local 695?

I think it has something to do with the area, like being out on the west coast and a number picked out of a hat. But they do try and keep it in relation to other locals. Like camera is Local 600, editors Local 700 and grips are Local 80. So I'm not really sure how these numbers get assigned. BTW Local 695 is Production Sound along with Studio Projectionist. 695 also holds the classification for video playback and data storage/backup.

[Brandon Fraley]

yeah, I've heard Local 600 before. I guess the confusing part whether there are Local 600s in other cities? Or is the number different? Then is it no longer "local"?

Anyway, sorry to hijack your thread, I was just curious.

I guess members will have to tell us how it went? :)

[M Most]

yeah, I've heard Local 600 before. I guess the confusing part whether there are Local 600s in other cities? Or is the number different? Then is it no longer "local"?



Local 600 (Camera Guild) and Local 700 (Editors Guild) are "national locals" that were formed a number of years ago through the merger of the East and West Coast locals for each. All other IA locals are regional.

[Evin Grant]

FYI IATSE has ruled data managment and on set workflow is now completely under the jusidiction of local 600 (Camera).
Sorry.

[Brandon Fraley]

FYI IATSE has ruled data managment and on set workflow is now completely under the jusidiction of local 600 (Camera).
Sorry.

Any idea why they call it local? as opposed to just, say, "600"?

[Ethan Cooper]

Any idea why they call it local? as opposed to just, say, "600"?

just a unionism. every union of any type I've been around calls themselves local (insert number here)

[Alan Rosenfeld]

Any idea why they call it local? as opposed to just, say, "600"?

Local union
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A local union, often shortened to local, known as a union branch in the United Kingdom, is a locally-based trade union organization which forms part of a larger, usually national, union.

Local branches are organized to represent the union's members from a particular geographic area, company, or business sector. Locals have their own governing bodies which represent the interests of the national union while at the same time responding to the desires of their constituents, and organise regular meetings for members. Local branches may also affiliate to a local trades council.

In the United States and Canada, locals are usually numbered, e.g. CWA Local 2101

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_union

[Andrew Walker]

FYI IATSE has ruled data managment and on set workflow is now completely under the jusidiction of local 600 (Camera).
Sorry.

That may be the case but my local is still offering the class to 695 members. Not sure how data management got kicked into 600 because 695 has had control over it for sometime now. Maybe they are trying to say that there's a difference between post production and production. If anything it should be apart of local 700 (Editors Guild) as it fits more in that area than it does in camera. I say that because the preparation of dailies and the handling of footage is editorials job, not camera.

[KETCH ROSSi]

As far as I know Local 695 is the Sound department, Local 600 is the camera department, but there is always a battle of you do this I do that kind of thing on Union sets, even so they have specific jobs, like who loads, or who does play back for on set clients, etc. but the budget of each individual project dictates who does what, depending on the number of people on set.

I have seen positions jumping all the time, I'm not Union, but any time I'm on set, I end up just doing a bit of everything, fun and always great learning experiences.

ciao

[Brook Willard]

That may be the case but my local is still offering the class to 695 members. Not sure how data management got kicked into 600 because 695 has had control over it for sometime now. Maybe they are trying to say that there's a difference between post production and production. If anything it should be apart of local 700 (Editors Guild) as it fits more in that area than it does in camera. I say that because the preparation of dailies and the handling of footage is editorials job, not camera.

Tom Short confirmed the jurisdiction as belonging to local 600 on July 30th, 2008. While the letter itself is private, there are some valuable public quotes from the notice... such as this one:

[i]"The downloading and copying of complete digital files including the inputting of meta data on set should remain within the exclusive jurisdiction of Local 600 so long as no editorial functions take place..."

It confuses me that the sound local has training for camera use and digital loading - particularly since it's out of their jurisdiction - but admittedly I don't know much about locals beyond my own. But technically - as I understand it and as it has been explained to me - any 695 member who is serving as a digital loader on a union set is working well outside of their jurisdiction... and presumably can be brought up on charges [?].

[Andrew Walker]

Tom Short confirmed the jurisdiction as belonging to local 600 on July 30th, 2008. While the letter itself is private, there are some valuable public quotes from the notice... such as this one:

[i]"The downloading and copying of complete digital files including the inputting of meta data on set should remain within the exclusive jurisdiction of Local 600 so long as no editorial functions take place..."

It confuses me that the sound local has training for camera use and digital loading - particularly since it's out of their jurisdiction - but admittedly I don't know much about locals beyond my own. But technically - as I understand it and as it has been explained to me - any 695 member who is serving as a digital loader on a union set is working well outside of their jurisdiction... and presumably can be brought up on charges [?].


That quote you had in there was kind of interesting as it seems to be a request to the IA. Also the funny thing is that to join Local 600 as a DIT all one needs is money. But to join Local 695 in any classification one needs to either get 30 days of union work at one studio or one show or 90 days in total. It took me a year an a half to join Local 700, which kicked out projectionist and put them back into 695. To me it seems like a money play because to join Local 600 is at least $5K more than to join Local 695. This is why I have no desire to join Local 600. If they would lower their entrance fee to something reasonable that could be justified I would join.

[Conrad Hunziker]

Joining 600 requires 100 days of paid verifiable non-union work or 30 days of paid union work, in addition to the initiation dues. At one time 600 had relaxed some rules because the DIT position was new and there were not enough members for open positions. However for more than the last year, all rules are fully enforced.

[Brook Willard]

Conrad, it's 30/100 to get onto the roster, but DIT is a non-rostered position [damn producers...]. Joining local 600 as a DIT essentially only requires ~$8,000. That said, a non-rostered DIT is not allowed to bump to other positions or work out of classification.

[Andrew Walker]

Conrad, it's 30/100 to get onto the roster, but DIT is a non-rostered position [damn producers...]. Joining local 600 as a DIT essentially only requires ~$8,000. That said, a non-rostered DIT is not allowed to bump to other positions or work out of classification.

Same thing I was told by Local 600. They were very admit about reminding me that I couldn't change classifications.

[Conrad Hunziker]

Sorry - forgot DIT is non-rostered

[Andrew Walker]

I was going to start a new thread but I figured I would just post the pictures from todays event in here. The event was much bigger than I thought it was going to be and there was a lot more "questions/get on with it already" than I thought there was going to be. Mainly by some of the 695 members that didn't want to learn anything else unless it was specific to production sound. I think the Red team got some good notes, related to sound, on what to have when Epic and Scarlet come out. All in all I thought it was a cool presentation and some of the people that were willing to learn, did.

[Andrew Walker]

Here's a couple more.

[Casey Green]

I posted this in another thread but thought it was worth putting here as well:

Actually, my understanding is, although there has been some recommendation to the IATSE by the former outgoing leadership (as referred to in posts above), this was never officially decided on and is still being worked out by the current IATSE leadership.

What remains certain is that DIT (by true definition - adjustment of live signals for calibrating cameras, monitors, etc.) is Local 600, and Playback for the Director/DP (Video Assist) is 695. Data Capture is not clearly defined...

So productions that would like to have Data Capture + the ability to playback takes for the Director or DP as one operator would need someone form Local 695. (Or they can have a separate Video Assist operator.)

Not trying to start a long debate on the matter, just stating the facts as I have heard them. Hopefully this will all get worked out before too long, but as far as I know, this is still up in the air.

[Zakaree Sandberg]

In my opinion.. any one who touches a camera (except for director) should belong in a camera union.

Does a film loader belong to sound? i dont think so..
so whats the difference?

[Andrew Walker]

In my opinion.. any one who touches a camera (except for director) should belong in a camera union.

Does a film loader belong to sound? i dont think so..
so whats the difference?

Difference is that you don't have a camera loader doing video playback or data management. I'm in Local 695 so of course I think the classification of DIT to reside in 695. There's nothing in the camera local that says Local 600 guys can playback media. I understand the argument that people that touch the camera in anyway should be part of Local 600. But the facts are that many of the digital acquisition cameras are more like computers than cameras. So that requirers people that have a greater knowledge of these cameras, which are typically the DITs. Plus it seems much safer to have the DIT doing the media changes as then there's less of a chance something gets accidently lost. There just seems to be more reason for the classification to be in 695 is all I'm saying.

[Stephen Strangways]

Here's a couple more.

Is that little silver beauty a PL-mount Scarlet, by any chance?

[Blair S. Paulsen]

This is the kind of insanity that makes people dislike unions. IA needs to figure it out and give those who are interested in DIT work a clear path and accept the fact that as the technology evolves some of the existing sub-jurisdictions will no longer make much sense.

For the most part the union leadership is trying to do the right thing, but their policies often seem reactive rather than proactive. They also need to recognize that the economics of the motion media industry are changing pretty dramatically. More channels in TV land, less ad dollars, devolution of the big broadcast networks, IP media delivery, risk averse conglomerates running the studios, more affordable tools of the trade, etc. I contend that the majority of jobs in the modern media landscape will require broader skill sets, smaller crews and creative approaches to delivering content at lower price points.

IMHO, if the union system does not evolve it may find itself reduced to a sliver of the industry:

"It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the most responsive to change." Charles Darwin

Cheers - #19

[Andrew Walker]

Is that little silver beauty a PL-mount Scarlet, by any chance?

That was the mockup that Ted brought to that RED Day...and yes it did have a PL mount.

[Andrew Walker]

This is the kind of insanity that makes people dislike unions. IA needs to figure it out and give those who are interested in DIT work a clear path and accept the fact that as the technology evolves some of the existing sub-jurisdictions will no longer make much sense.

For the most part the union leadership is trying to do the right thing, but their policies often seem reactive rather than proactive. They also need to recognize that the economics of the motion media industry are changing pretty dramatically. More channels in TV land, less ad dollars, devolution of the big broadcast networks, IP media delivery, risk averse conglomerates running the studios, more affordable tools of the trade, etc. I contend that the majority of jobs in the modern media landscape will require broader skill sets, smaller crews and creative approaches to delivering content at lower price points.

IMHO, if the union system does not evolve it may find itself reduced to a sliver of the industry:

"It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the most responsive to change." Charles Darwin

Cheers - #19

Unions in almost every industry shoot themselves in the foot on a regular basis. It would be nice to have a clear definition as to what each classification does and have that updated when things change. But I'm not sure I see that happening anytime soon.

[BigLu]

Interesting so what happens on a Tear 1 union shoot?

When its required to have union 695 audio guys is it required to have a 600 guy for DIT?
Or what is the requirement for DIT on a 1.5mil feature shoot.

What happens if there is a transcoding happening on set does that mess with the editors union?

Any feed back would be cool.
Thanks guys.

[Dustin Cross]

How many DITs do playback? I never do. I play footage for Director and DP as I am doing coloring, but I am not part of video village. On a lot of my shoots the camera op will playback the last take from camera, but never me from my DIT station. I have had a couple ADs tell me to que up take so and so, and I just tell them I am not playback.

Dusty

[Jarred Land]

man this kinda sounds like a bit of a mess...

[David Doko]

The very fact that many DITs don't feel playback falls under their duties to the production, relegates it to 695. I think the video tap recording and playback fell with 695 historically, and that is why it continues under that union class (I could be wrong about that, I'm not in that union).

The odd part is that on many union shoots, depending on the camera, when they want playback it's often the 1st AC or operator who does it because the playback device is technically on the camera, so yeah, defining who does playback is messy if you're trying to pigeon hole it into a union class. I figure it should be the person who has the easiest access to do it without interrupting their duties.


How many DITs do playback? I never do. I play footage for Director and DP as I am doing coloring, but I am not part of video village. On a lot of my shoots the camera op will playback the last take from camera, but never me from my DIT station. I have had a couple ADs tell me to que up take so and so, and I just tell them I am not playback.

Dusty

[Dustin Cross]

The very fact that many DITs don't feel playback falls under their duties to the production, relegates it to 695.

What do you mean by "it"? DITs should fall under 695 because we don't do playback or playback should fall under 695, which I think it does.


Dusty

[Andrew Walker]

What do you mean by "it"? DITs should fall under 695 because we don't do playback or playback should fall under 695, which I think it does.


Dusty

The playback element is just one little thing. Local 695 also as I understand it controls the management of data as well. Which, if true, would place the jurisdiction of DIT right in 695, not 600. I'll look it up and post what I find.

[Andrew Walker]

Okay, the closest thing I could find right on 695's site was this.

The Video Engineer - Data Capture Operator records video and sound when the recording device for the camera is not contained within the camera itself. In the case of the latest generation of High-Definition video cameras, specialized recorders are used in order to sustain the incredibly high data transfer rates that are generated by these cameras.

Now I can see why 600 would try and snag up this classification. But unless you are recording onto the RED Drive or RED CF cards and using them as your archive media this wouldn't work. Because as soon as its backed up on a drive outside of the camera then it would be recorded to something outside of the camera.

Of course there's no clear cut way to really tell if its suppose to be in 600 or 695. I'm sure there will have to be a meeting to sort it out.

[Dustin Cross]

DIT is an odd position.

I go from being the guy on set who knows everything about the camera and makes sure everything is configured correctly with camera and even help the DP understand how to best use the camera (exposure, etc) and am the first person called if there is any problem or if they want to change something with the camera software.

Then I do media management on set, but I hear a lot of DITs in LA are making shows get a digital loader to do this.

Then I am very involved in making dailies. I do quick color correction and atleast set-up the render of the dailes, and most of the time I render out the dailies.

Then I work very close with the post house setting up the post workflow that will work with Red. I start working with post before day one of shooting and on some projects keep supporting them until the project is finished.

So my job crosses Camera (600) and edit (700), but I don't know about Sound (695). I don't do anything like video assist or data capture operator. Although I do archive all of sounds data, verify and sometimes sync it with the footage for dailes.


Dusty