RED Alert!

[Jannard]

Since REDCINE is being rebuilt and won't release for a week or two, RED Alert! will be the mini-app of choice. At some point we will post it with sample footage. Be advised that it is a Mac app only (REDCINE will be both Mac and PC). You will need RED Alert! and the REDCODE node (you will put the REDCODE node in HD/Library/Quicktime folder). This mini-application will open .r3d files (REDCODE RAW), allow you to view the file, select DI mode or Standard mode, and output to Quicktime wrapped files in 2k, 1k, and .5k for ingest into FCP or viewing in QT. You can also output to DPX 2k, DPX 4k, 4k TIFF, 2k TIFF, in Linear, REC 709, or Log. You can make some corrections prior to output. We will help you choose settings depending on what you are trying to accomplish.

More to come...

Jim

[Álex Montoya]

W-o-w

Just a Q: ¿"At some point we will post it with sample footage" means tomorrow? ¿Or maybe the first owners will get it with the camera and the rest of us in some point in the future?

[Steven Parker]

Excellent. Tomorrow will be an interesting day...

Congratulations to you and the entire Red team!

[Dominique Grenier]

Great! But I thought this was the purpose of RedQuick? Maybe I got it wrong...

EDIT: Ok, I've red this post (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=73988&postcount=11) where it is all explained...

[Álex Montoya]

For the users out there, IMO the best format for us PC users to see the footage would be log 4K DPX, though I just cannot imagine the size of them... Wll, in fact, I can, they would be around 32 MB per frame

Dunno, maybe a few frames.

[Jannard]

Here is a screenshot of RED Alert!

Jim

http://www.reduser.net/forum/uploaded/9_1188491250.jpg

[Harmonica]

That is insane, Mr. Mad Scientist. The floodgates are about to open...

[Álex Montoya]

Lol... I love it... It's pretty much self-explanatory for those who use RAW files.

[Jaime Vallés]

Awesome. Can't wait to see lots of 1K and .5K quicktime clips available for download! The screenshot looks great. I wonder what y'all have cooking up in REDCINE land...

[Álex Montoya]

As far as I understand it you cannot watch the quicktime wrapped files if you don't install the redcode node and you are in a MAC, right?

[Daniel Reichenbach]

C'est magnifique! Just terrific, great, bombastic, insane, there is design and functionality. Daniel is happy...

[Pol Turrents]

I want it now! xD

and what about red quick? :whistling:

[Tonaci Tran]

insaaaane. Thanks Jim.

[RPMpost]

You will need RED Alert! and the REDCODE node (you will put the REDCODE node in HD/Library/Quicktime folder).

Jim,

Do you need any beta testers? .... we'd be happy to put Red Alert! through it's paces both on our MacPro machines and Scratch systems .... let us know.

Don't forget that we were the first to see your 959 Porsches in glorious 4k this time last year .... our sister company Hollywood-DI graded the orginal RED footage for IBC 06.

You've come a long way in such a short time - well done!

Neil
RPMpost
LA. CA.
Red Post Masters

[Greg M]

What happens to those w/o a Mac?

[Steve Freebairn]

Will the PC users be able to download a codec so that we can see the .5k, 1k and 2k proxy files that others release in quicktime?

[Cory Schulthies]

looks like us windows users are left out in the cold for a while longer.

[jbeale]

Very interesting screenshot of Red Alert! I think I understand just about all the controls except for "matrix", what does that do?

Edit: I assume when "matrix" is checked, it applies the selected luma standard in the pulldown menu at left, for example calculating luma (Y') from gamma-corrected primaries R'G'B' using the older CCIR 601 formula as Y'=0.299R'+0.587G'+0.114B' or the newer Rec 709 as Y'=0.2126R'+0.7152G'+0.0722B' as described in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminance_(video) (?)

[Emanuel A.]

For those @PC side and who shall wait for their cameras on October or November, we don't need RED Alert app, right? Or am I missing something?

[Sanjin Jukic]

PC guy is too fat and at the moment is not recommended and heathy for him to ingest and digest REDCODE.

http://images.apple.com/mac/images/2007/06/whymac_pcmac_20070622.png

[Craig Bowman]

For those @PC side and who shall wait for their cameras on October or November, we don't need RED Alert app, right? Or am I missing something?


Correct. Mac = Red Alert for now.
PC = SOL for at least a few weeks or longer as software development can never be guaranteed to a schedule.

Not all lenses will be available till end of year at earliest and 4k displays and projectors to acutally see what you're working on in 4k are still just wistfull concepts on someone's CAD file. Time and patience will sort everything out.

[Justin Kirchhoff]

Badass screen shot. Looks like RED Alert! is pretty user friendly and 'simple' in terms of changing things around. Good work.

[Brook Willard]

Hey Jim, will it run on my G5... Or am I SOL?

[Thom Steinhoff]

It has been some time since Intel mac requirement has been discussed. When I spoke with Graeme at NAB he said it may be possible to compile it universal but time would tell.

Since my number isn't up until Nov, I have been waiting to upgrade my G5 to a mac pro until the last possible moment to maximize its features, but I don't think I can resist playing with the footage.

Intel Mac only or can it run on a G5 as well?

[Billy Summers]

We're always getting so much MORE than expected with RED.
In other words "Dat chit look Powerful mang"


Thanks to the people "who care"

B-

[laguun]

PC guy is too fat and is not so heathy for him to ingest and digest REDCODE.


No pun intended, third man, but
a) red need osx x86 pc operation system - it wont run on the discontinued apple/ibm powerpc.
b) windows and linux play back 4k with several systems.
c) OSX/Fcp doesn´t plays back 4k. 2k is the maximum resolution which the OS handles in realtime as of now.

So, in order to view 4k, a windows or linux system like DVS Clipster / Hydra is mandatory.
Or an additional discrecorder as the ones from Quvis or Keisoku Giken.

Im my humble opinion, its half a miracle that red indeed is able to ship -before- IBC.
Congratulations from everyone at laguun and redrental!

That said, i sincerly hope that we won´t only have to rely on our single FCP here as primary editing system. We have one FCP seat, and many other Windows NLE and DI systems, and these workflows can do 2K and 4K.

However, with RedCine and Redquick around the corner for windows, the other applications should get the necessary support soon.

On OSX, as far i understand, the 4k workflow would be 2k FCP edit -> EDL -> RedCine -> 4k online on Adobe Premiere pro?

[Steve Freebairn]

Let's not turn this thread into an Apple Macintosh v. Windows PC debate. (not saying you were, but lets just make sure it doesn't happen)

What I think is important is to find out the questions people have so far

1. Will Pc people have access to the codec so that we can view other peoples qt proxies?

2. Will Red Alert require a Mac always? or will it be on PC in the future?

3. Is red alert Permanent or just to hold us over until Redcine is done?

4. Will Red alert run on a G5?

[Don King]

Correct. Mac = Red Alert for now.
PC = SOL for at least a few weeks or longer as software development can never be guaranteed to a schedule.


This is not what I could read right on the front page: ONE OR TWO WEEKS tops.

[Kevin Halverson]

2. Will Red Alert require a Mac always? or will it be on PC in the future?

3. Is red alert Permanent or just to hold us over until Redcine is done?


Both these questions are of extreme interest to me as well as I won't be using either a Mac nor FCS for my work flow.

[Mr. Paul White]

Same concern here.

[Roberto B]

Both these questions are of extreme interest to me as well as I won't be using either a Mac nor FCS for my work flow.

is it necessary to say there are a lot of people worried and worrying now..

we're seven people here.. at least

[Eirik Tyrihjel]

What I am most curious about concerning RED right now is what speeds it will transcode from RED RAW to another resolution like 1080p (prores), I have never seen any figures. Will a minute of RED RAW take an hour to transcode, or maybe just 2 minutes... I am so curious to get some feedback on speed from the inital users.

[Dominique Grenier]

For those not on a Mac, there's light for you either, according to Jim in this post (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=73988&postcount=11):


[...] RED Quick is moving from a mini-app directly into the camera. It wraps .r3d files (our REDCODE RAW format) in a Quicktime wrapper so they can be played and ingested into FCP.

It is speculation on my part, but if you've got QuickTime installed, you should be able to play it, right? Not sure about editing, but for basic playback, you should be alright.

Might depend on when this feature will be enabled, thought...

[Kevin Halverson]

For those not on a Mac, there's light for you either, according to Jim in this post (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=73988&postcount=11):



It is speculation on my part, but if you've got QuickTime installed, you should be able to play it, right? Not sure about editing, but for basic playback, you should be alright.

Might depend on when this feature will be enabled, thought...

This really isn't an acceptable work flow when your editorial is a completely separate entity from your production. Having to have another camera body sitting around to handle conversion from raw to an editable format doesn't seem like a viable concept at all.

[Gabriel Beaudry]

Since REDCINE is being rebuilt and won't release for a week or two,

More to come...

Jim

So where is the problem? Unless you got one of the first 50 cameras and you are only on PC, I don't see what the problem is.

Relax and take a deep breath.

[Dominique Grenier]

This really isn't an acceptable work flow when your editorial is a completely separate entity from your production. Having to have another camera body sitting around to handle conversion from raw to an editable format doesn't seem like a viable concept at all.

I don't think that's the point of REDQUICK. I think that the QuickTime wrapper will be done in-camera, on the set. So, once you get the media in your working station, you already have the wrapper on hand. No need to bring the camera. Or at least, that's the way I understood it...

[Steve Freebairn]

I think the camera automatically produces the qt wrappers.

We will need a codec for download on the PC though, otherwise the files won't play.

[Ken K]

Since REDCINE is being rebuilt and won't release for a week or two

Jim, if you guys need some formal QA work on REDCINE, just let me know. I was recently laid off from Intel (as a QA Analyst for Viiv - their media center app) and I'm just sitting around reading the Reduser forums all day. Feel free to put me to work. :)

[Gordon Prince]

2. Will Red Alert require a Mac always? or will it be on PC in the future?

3. Is red alert Permanent or just to hold us over until Redcine is done?



With the RED CINE, is this RED ALERT! necessary for what?

[Poi Boy]

So where is the problem? Unless you got one of the first 50 cameras and you are only on PC, I don't see what the problem is.

Relax and take a deep breath.

yeah, what he said.
Aloha
-A

[Steve Freebairn]

Jim, if you guys need some formal QA work on REDCINE, just let me know. I was recently laid off from Intel (as a QA Analyst for Viiv - their media center app) and I'm just sitting around reading the Reduser forums all day. Feel free to put me to work. :)

I saw VIIV the other day and it was quite nice. Good job :)

[Kevin Halverson]

So where is the problem? Unless you got one of the first 50 cameras and you are only on PC, I don't see what the problem is.

Relax and take a deep breath.

In as much as I am in the middle of planing the post work flow for an episodic pilot (and hopefully series) this is a big concern for us. Accurate information is essential if I am going to make intelligent and informed recommendations.

I will be following this very closely and will "take a deep breath" when I know what I am going to be dealing with.

[Keith Nealy]

Congratulations to Jim and RED team for doing the impossible. Your vision, hardwork and dedication is going to change the lives of many people and change an entire industry.

The PC issue is important here also, as we have not used Apple computers since the "Lisa."

Maybe they polled the first 50 and found out they were mostly Mac users so that gave them a little more time to get it right.

That's fine with me. I can be patient... sort of. It would be nice to be able to see the first clips rolling off the initial cameras though.

Either way, Friday is the day the earth stood still... and watched the RED sunrise.

Aloha,

Keith

[Simon Smith]

So where is the problem? Unless you got one of the first 50 cameras and you are only on PC, I don't see what the problem is.

Relax and take a deep breath.
With the RED CINE, is this RED ALERT! necessary for what?

That's what I thought. Seems to me the RED Alert! is only a mini-app to outdate in the future with the RED Cine release.

[Ken K]

I saw VIIV the other day and it was quite nice. Good job :)

Heh, thanks! They actually canceled the media center app product, so that's why I got laid off. But, it was a great experience and my area of testing was the transcoding portion (codec -> codec), which was pretty cool.

[Casey Green]

That's what I thought. Seems to me the RED Alert! is only a mini-app to outdate in the future with the RED Cine release.

unless they plan on giving RED ALERT away and eventually selling REDCINE... ?

[Simon Blackledge]

Is exporting a RAW file from a raw camera app such as Lightroom the same theory? in which case it's pretty quick.. though I could be well wrong..
s

[Corey Culp]

Good times!

[Jared VanLeuven]

Ditto, that'd be helpful to me as well.


Hey Jim, will it run on my G5... Or am I SOL?

[david farland]

No pun intended, third man, but
a) red need osx x86 pc operation system..............

Laguun,

Warning: Sanjin is famous for his PC/mac baiting so don't get sucked in by him!

Dave,

[Antoine Fabi]

You're crazy ! Something new almost every week !

Do you sleep sometime ?

Can't wait to receive my camera.

Best of luck for tomorrow !

Antoine

[Sanjin Jukic]

I think the camera automatically produces the qt wrappers.

We will need a codec for download on the PC though, otherwise the files won't play.

Attention>>Automatic reply:


PC guy is too fat and at the moment is not recommended and heathy for him to ingest and digest REDCODE.

http://images.apple.com/mac/images/2007/06/whymac_pcmac_20070622.png

[hsr]

congratulations for RED team members for bring out such sophisticated camera with really incredible features...thanx a lot...wish u all the best and success.......here we go redmaniacs...

[Benjamin Epps]

So can Red Alert wrap files for Mac based Avids? Or just FCP?

[Ronnie Silos]

Where is the "Auto Level" or "Enhance" magic button? 8-)

[Roberto B]

yeah.. PC worries aside.. let us kid a little bit with our own concerns.. where's the mojo button?

[laguun]

Laguun,

Warning: Sanjin is famous for his PC/mac baiting so don't get sucked in by him!

Dave,

i see.
We are pretty immune to platform wars and are pretty OS agnostic - as probably anyone with many years industry experience.
However, i have to share the impression, that most existing 4k houses, top-end VFX studios and -any- 4k D.I. facility use not only one OS.

If they are working on 4K, to be precise, there is one OS who is rather rare - i hope that will change in the future.

We like to use discreet flame/inferno/toxik/combustion/smoke/fire, quantel eQ/iQ/Pablo, sony vegas/xpri, dvs clipster/pronto/hydra, adobe cs, apple fcs, iridias speedgrade/framecycler, assimilate scratch, avid ds nitris/xpress pro, davinci and filmlight.

We own some of the above. So do several interested clients for shooting with red. Therefore i suppose we should invite them to test their workflows, schedules and budgets once redcine is ready.

[Graeme Nattress]

Very interesting screenshot of Red Alert! I think I understand just about all the controls except for "matrix", what does that do?


Matrix allows you to turn on or off the colour correction matrix. Matrix does colour space conversion, white balance, saturation etc. Choices for colour space are camera RGB (native camera space) and REC709.

The linearity of the output data is a seperate choice - you have linear light (no curve - straight line) REC709 (the gamma curve of the REC709 standard) and RED Log, which is a log curve. For 10bit DPX output, I'd recommend the LOG or the REC709. If you go out 16bit tiff, linear light is useful as then there's no curve, and being 16ibt, no precision loss either.

Graeme

[laguun]

Matrix allows you to turn on or off the colour correction matrix. Matrix does colour space conversion, white balance, saturation etc. Choices for colour space are camera RGB (native camera space) and REC709.

The linearity of the output data is a seperate choice - you have linear light (no curve - straight line) REC709 (the gamma curve of the REC709 standard) and RED Log, which is a log curve. For 10bit DPX output, I'd recommend the LOG or the REC709. If you go out 16bit tiff, linear light is useful as then there's no curve, and being 16ibt, no precision loss either.

Graeme

Hey Grame,

first of all: big congratulations!

if you find the time, i would like to ask 2 questions:
1) am i right when i understand red alert basicly as a redcine without edl-support?
2) redquick will be on windows and osx or is it osx exclusive?

[Graeme Nattress]

REDAlert!, for those who are asking, is Mac Intel only. REDAlert! is an extension of the app we've been using internally since the days of Frankie, which is why we're able to put it out now, when other apps and tools we're working on are not finished yet. I fully understand the concerns of the PC and Linux users out there. It's just like when people were asking about why the 300m prime first? Answer was, it was the first we had ready :-) Similarly with RedAlert - it's the first we have ready and the rest will follow.

Graeme

[Graeme Nattress]

REDQuick functionality is being built into camera so that that app will no longer be necessary. In the meantime, REDQuick functionality is also inside REDALert! (Thanks Rob).

REDAlert is quite different to REDCINE. REDAlert is CPU based, not GPU based for instance. There are many other differences, but they, with the camera, share the same raw conversion algorithms.

Graeme

[laguun]

I fully understand the concerns of the PC and Linux users out there. It's just like when people were asking about why the 300m prime first? Answer was, it was the first we had ready :-) Similarly with RedAlert - it's the first we have ready and the rest will follow.

Graeme

Good to know!
I really like one-stop workflows without off/on-line, and i suppose this IBC will be to early to choose our next 4K D.I. then :)

However, i am -really- grateful to be forced to to have to choose a new 4K D.I. by you folks! So far, 4k was really rare for us - and i hope once we get delivery of your cameras we will be able to have more and more producers going the 4k road.

[Antoine Fabi]

Graeme,

First, ...congrats ! really.

When do you think the litterature about all these possibilities specific to RED will be ready ? Will it be included in the owner manual ?

Just think about the average user ...hee hee ! ...Oh...

Time to read... i suppose.

thanks !

Antoine

[Adrian T.]

REDQuick functionality is being built into camera so that that app will no longer be necessary. In the meantime, REDQuick functionality is also inside REDALert! (Thanks Rob).

I hope that REDQuick functionality will remain in REDAlert (and later REDCINE). We don't want to go back to the camera to rebuild any missing QuickTime wrappers for r3d files.

Anyhow, congrats Graeme and RED team!

[Graeme Nattress]

I'm sure we'll always keep around the ability for you to remake reference Quicktimes if needed - would be silly not to as we know some people are going to loose them! As for the form of this ability, I don't know.

Graeme

[Luke Boyce]

When the PC/Linux versions of the RED apps are ready, will they also be Mac PPC compatible? Or is RED supporting Intel Macs exclusively? A lot of inquiring G5 users want to know! Thanks!

[explosive]

Since REDCINE is being rebuilt and won't release for a week or two, RED Alert! will be the mini-app of choice.
Jim

You called the program "RED Alert!"?? AHaha...

For that, you must be PUNished. ((boom kssh))

[Graeme Nattress]

REDCINE is Mac / PC intel only. It won't ever be PPC on mac. As for our other apps and utilities, I can't predict what will happen with regards to PPC. Your comment is noted though, but don't hold your breath in the meantime.

Graeme

[Michael Schrengohst]

Will we at least be able to see RED footage on our G4 laptop?

[number6]

REDCINE is Mac / PC intel only.

Graeme

Just curious... does this also rule out PC with AMD processor?

[Graeme Nattress]

I don't think so - Rob would have a better idea on that.

Graeme

[Mr. Paul White]

REDQuick functionality is being built into camera so that that app will no longer be necessary. In the meantime, REDQuick functionality is also inside REDALert! (Thanks Rob).

REDAlert is quite different to REDCINE. REDAlert is CPU based, not GPU based for instance. There are many other differences, but they, with the camera, share the same raw conversion algorithms.

Graeme

Will the REDAlert! be necessary after the REDCINE release?

[Tom Tomlinson]

I'm waiting for the Red Alert App to be accessible by post production facilities so we can test Red footage ourselves and the conversion abilities of the app.

Red did contact me and said I should use the app provided by the client (camera owner) and that Red was working on a game plan to distribute the software to the right people.

[Graeme Nattress]

REDAlert! is where I'm doing my R&D.

Graeme