New Panasonic 3D HD camera...

[Pedro Guimaraes]

Well looks like they finally finished it.

http://blog.digitalcontentproducer.com/briefingroom/2010/01/07/panasonic-unveils-world%E2%80%99s-first-integrated-full-hd-3d-camcorder-at-ces-2010/

Fixed IO, dual recording....pretty cool.

But looks like they copied Jason Goodman's "optical axial offset" he has on his 3DVX camera. I guess he should of patented it....

Should be a good camera for lower budget productions, corporate presentations and the hours and hours of 3D TV programming that will have to be shot.....

http://blog.digitalcontentproducer.com/briefingroom/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/ces2010-image-fullhd3dcamcorder.jpg

http://blog.digitalcontentproducer.com/briefingroom/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/ces2010-image-fullhd3dcamcorderleft3-4.jpg

[Samuel Martin]

It seems the suggested retail price of $21000 is just about ok. Only for studio work, close ups, mid shots.... We'll see if it takes off.... it seems great as it is easier and quicker to operate, corporate work will definitely benefit, but you will still need a side by side rig and potentially a mirror rig, depending on what you have to shoot....

[Sally Shamas]

what are the fixed lenses on the camera ?

[GPSchnyder]

No raw recording, only 1080p, No two cameras to use when only shooting 2d?

I'll stick with a fixed Lens 3d Rig then, thank you.

Non the less a cool thing that I would have bought directly if there were no scarlets...

[Ben Holmes]

The 3d TV world only want 1080 video - what use is 2k or RAW on a camera destined for made for 3DTV world? RAW is pretty much the last thing most TV production wants, they want quick turn-around footage properly exposed in-camera.

I'm not sure this Panny will be as popular as the single-lens Sony for live production (who want as simple to rig a solution as possible) and it's a bit cheap for the high-end 3d corporate. I expect this will open a whole new market for lower cost 3d content - a good and a bad thing. Expect badly made 3d to be a serious headache...

[Andreas Hellebust]

Wow CES turned out to be a big surprise this year :D

From being a sceptic, I actually think 3D will be the next big thing! It's been tried so many times before, but this time it seems all players are in :)

And the Scarlet too! woooow :)

[Stuart English]

RAW is pretty much the last thing most TV production wants, they want quick turn-around footage properly exposed in-camera.

There is nothing about RAW that prevents quick turn around editing and proper exposure.


If you want to argue TV producers want to use what they have always used, fair enough.

But please don't paint RAW into a "difficult to use" corner. See Vegas Pro 9 as an example.

http://library.creativecow.net/articles/harvey_jim/sony_vegas_pro9.php

[Ben Holmes]

There is nothing about RAW that prevents quick turn around editing and proper exposure.


If you want to argue TV producers want to use what they have always used, fair enough.

But please don't paint RAW into a "difficult to use" corner. See Vegas Pro 9 as an example.

http://library.creativecow.net/articles/harvey_jim/sony_vegas_pro9.php

Here's the point Stuart - as good as RAW is (and I've been working with it for 2 years now) there is an entire market that does not want to one light, or grade anything - they want the video solution they have always used. Not just because it's what they've always used, but because it's quicker.

I'm in the middle of editing over 10 hours of HD CAM content for broadcast distribution - that's final edit, there's hundreds of hours of footage. So far, only a handful of shots have even needed colour correction, they were so well shot. Working in FCP, I could not have achieved this - in the same timeframe - with RED footage. It would have needed looks applied, and individual shots graded.

I'm entirely comfortable with the RED workflow - but sometimes 'baked in' is just better.

[Ben Holmes]

By the way - I appreciate the advances the color science has made towards a 'hands off' ingest of RED material, but you can hardly blame the market if they treat RED material on basis with which it was released and used for a considerable period of time. Also, where you unwittingly create a 'fix it in post' attitude with some camera operators who either should know better, or just don't know the right way to work. Like it or not, a RAW workflow DOES create this attitude sometimes. I also appreciate how much RED are doing to educate people not to work this way, and simplify things for the operator.

I look forward to a future filled with well-exposed Scarlet footage!

[Sally Shamas]

what are the fixed lenses on the camera ?
???

[Aric Mannion]

Well looks like they finally finished it.

http://blog.digitalcontentproducer.com/briefingroom/2010/01/07/panasonic-unveils-world%E2%80%99s-first-integrated-full-hd-3d-camcorder-at-ces-2010/

Fixed IO, dual recording....pretty cool.

But looks like they copied Jason Goodman's "optical axial offset" he has on his 3DVX camera. I guess he should of patented it....

Should be a good camera for lower budget productions, corporate presentations and the hours and hours of 3D TV programming that will have to be shot.....


http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachments/3d-stereoscopic-production-delivery/15796d1262873806-panasonic-unveils-worlds-first-integrated-full-hd-3d-camcorder-ces-2010-conv3dsys.jpg
This image suggests that this camera is not a simple side by side camera... Does anyone know for sure?

[Richard N. Metzker]

This panasonic camera I am sure will be a great Camera for Porn... but there will be depth of field issues, the costs of repairing the camera if it's broken, etc... etc.. etc.. A Red One with a couble batteries and two CF cards is about the same price.

[Pedro Guimaraes]

it uses 6 cmos sensors, when asked yesterday they did not give us the size of the sensor.

they did not talk about the lenses that much.

It is small and light.

[Barend Onneweer]

...there will be depth of field issues...

If you're referring to a large DoF, that's actually something you want for stereoscopic. Stereo works best on images that are reasonably sharp and allow the audience to explore the depth of the scene. If the depth of field is shallow the stereo effect is less effective and also limits the 'freedom' of looking around in the scene.

[GPSchnyder]

If you're referring to a large DoF, that's actually something you want for stereoscopic. ...

That's why I thought from the first time I heard about the Scarlet that it would be the perfect cam for 3D. The Lens should be fast enough to record in low-light situations, and can be stopped down when there is more light available. the 2/3" Sensor will give a hint of DOF wven when stepped down, to focus the view of the viewers a tittle bit (like really near stuff in front of the cam and the slightlx blurry background when recording in studio) but not to much. And if you want to you can archive a nice shallow dof with them if doing 2D or "talking heads"

[GPSchnyder]

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachments/3d-stereoscopic-production-delivery/15796d1262873806-panasonic-unveils-worlds-first-integrated-full-hd-3d-camcorder-ces-2010-conv3dsys.jpg
This image suggests that this camera is not a simple side by side camera... Does anyone know for sure?

Where does it suggest that? It just shows the difference between a mirror rig and the Panasonic...

[Aric Mannion]

Where does it suggest that? It just shows the difference between a mirror rig and the Panasonic...

Is that what it looks like to you? It has a huge arrow that suggests to me that the mirror rig is "integrated" into the panasonic. I assumed the mirror rig was only necessary because the lenses were so huge, and was hoping that it wasn't a necessary setup with such small lenses.
Panasonic also claims that you can adjust the convergence point, I wonder if that is a physical adjustment since the lenses seem to be cased by this accordion style frame. If so it's at least a step above the locked down side by side camera rig.
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachments/3d-stereoscopic-production-delivery/15797d1262873806-panasonic-unveils-worlds-first-integrated-full-hd-3d-camcorder-ces-2010-convpoint.jpg

I think those images are all misleading if they are meant to suggest what the camera is NOT, rather than what the camera is.

[Noah Kadner]

I don't get it- $21K for a fixed interocular? I could make my own DSLR rig for 1/4 that with a variable interocular. They're going to have to do a little better than that...

Noah

[Barend Onneweer]

I don't get it- $21K for a fixed interocular? I could make my own DSLR rig for 1/4 that with a variable interocular. They're going to have to do a little better than that...

For regular stereo a ca. 65mm interocular is advised. You only deviate from that for effect - so it makes sense for a 'run and gun' stereo setup to have a fixed interocular.

How do you get an interocular of 65 mm with DSLR cameras (without mirror rig - because the rolling shutter on a mirror rig will kill the stereo)? And how do you jam-sync the shutters?

Also, from what I can tell is that the Scarlet body is too big to get a 65mm interocular without mirror rig.

The Panasonic wouldn't be for me, and it's not a cinema solution. But it's the first real move into for instance ENG style stereo.

Barend

[Pedro Guimaraes]

Panasonic also claims that you can adjust the convergence point, I wonder if that is a physical adjustment since the lenses seem to be cased by this accordion style frame.

Nothing moves, your just shifting the image over the sensor. It's an image shift. Exacly what the 21st century 3D camera (3DVX) does. It's actually far supirior way of "converging" because you don't actually have any keystone issues because the lenses stay parallel.

It will be a good camera, very useful for what it's intended for. No more no less. No point in comparing this to any RED setup. Apples & oranges.

One is ENG/TV style and the other is cinema style.

[Aric Mannion]

Nothing moves, your just shifting the image over the sensor. It's an image shift. Exacly what the 21st century 3D camera (3DVX) does. It's actually far supirior way of "converging" because you don't actually have any keystone issues because the lenses stay parallel.

It will be a good camera, very useful for what it's intended for. No more no less. No point in comparing this to any RED setup. Apples & oranges.

One is ENG/TV style and the other is cinema style.

oooooooookey dokey. I had higher hopes based on Panasonic's confusingly vague information, oh well.

[Barend Onneweer]

Hi Dino,

Thanks for chiming in. Single-camera stereo would definitely seem like a very suitable technique. Would you mind sharing info on your rig? I've only seen some images of cheap-looking systems. Counting the general cost of a good mirror rig, a second camera and the electronics to get them synced, it would seem like there would be a good market for high-end single camera dual-lens systems.

[Aric Mannion]

I would think a side by side camera is the only reasonable option for sports, surfing and docs. But can you do real close ups with that? It seems like one would need a mirror rig for some shots if you are making a movie, or even tv show.

[vsv]

3D camera RED4K (http://sunday3dblog.blog53.fc2.com/blog-entry-8.html) :idea:

http://blog-imgs-19.fc2.com/s/u/n/sunday3dblog/20091004143941bc5.png

[Chosei Funahara]

will be out this September with New panasonic, 3D HD monitor will 2 HDSDI and HDMI 1.4. to 3D Bluray player.

2 lenses with auto sync electric govern unit (with optical and computer: one is the master lens and the other one will be slave), 2 sensors for right eye and left eye, 2 algorism, 2 H264 compession and sound recording will be simple as used be, recording media are 2 SD cards.

P2 will follow.

For easy use and affordable, no hassle trouble free, that's all.
It's not big deal, it's only beginning. You guys remember Pany did it with DVX around 2001 to 2002.

I hope you can hear this one:
http://www.pronews.jp/column/nobuyoshi-kodera/1001211100.html

GOOD LUCK

[Chosei Funahara]

Oh, and there is no competition here with 1080P H264 and 4K RAW.

[brian hanson]

panasonic is starting to try and make some power moves, i got an email this morning about their new varicam 3700 trade in program

[Joe Calabrese]

The only problem I see with this is those 2 fixed lenses. James Cameron and his DP created a 3D camera system out of two F350s. They sat on a system that moved the cameras similar to the human eye. If the object in focus is closer, then the cameras moved further apart and were at a steeper angle from each other. As the object in focus moved further away, the cameras came closer together and at some points, touched each other. The problem with the Panasonic is that it may have trouble with objects that are within 5 feet? of the lens. Thats just my $0.02. Otherwise, I like the AVC Ultra idea.

[Pedro Guimaraes]

BTW , avatar was shot on F950's, 1500's and a bit on F23

[Brian D. Goff]

Here's the point Stuart - as good as RAW is (and I've been working with it for 2 years now) there is an entire market that does not want to one light, or grade anything - they want the video solution they have always used. Not just because it's what they've always used, but because it's quicker.

I'm in the middle of editing over 10 hours of HD CAM content for broadcast distribution - that's final edit, there's hundreds of hours of footage. So far, only a handful of shots have even needed colour correction, they were so well shot. Working in FCP, I could not have achieved this - in the same timeframe - with RED footage. It would have needed looks applied, and individual shots graded.

I'm entirely comfortable with the RED workflow - but sometimes 'baked in' is just better.

I think if you want quick turn around with RED footage, then all you have to do is be sure you have made your white balance and exposure right during the shooting (like you would have to do with any ordinary cam), and from there on just work with the proxies - results are just as good as any HDCam I've ever worked with:)

my 2 cents