Flash Bulbs / Paparazzi Scene

[Tim Naylor]

I have a feature starting soon, where I've got to shoot a red carpet scene. Need to know what is the best prop camera /flash combo plus RED settings that would avoid the CMOS split exposure. I'm sure there's a lot of info on this, but have failed to find it.

Anyone have experience with this or can steer me to the right forum?

Thanks all.

[David Mullen ASC]

I have a feature starting soon, where I've got to shoot a red carpet scene. Need to know what is the best prop camera /flash combo plus RED settings that would avoid the CMOS split exposure. I'm sure there's a lot of info on this, but have failed to find it.

Anyone have experience with this or can steer me to the right forum?

Thanks all.

I had a similar scene in a Red movie -- I tested every flash unit I could, the only one that was less prone to the half-frame artifact was the old-fashioned flash cube due to the much longer decay time.

In the end, we just went for it, figuring we'd fix any objectionable half-frames in post. I don't recall having to do much work in the end, either the half-frames were not too objectionable or we added some white flash frames or lightened the dark half of the frame to match the overexposed half, etc.

[edmoore]

I've had the same experience as David - I was worried about it; there definitely were a few frames that had split-strobe; but in the end it goes past so quickly it just becomes part of the "crazy paparazzi chaos" feel.

[Erik Bien]

Various kinds of flashbulbs are still available from Cress Photo (http://www.flashbulbs.com/index.shtml).

[Larry McKee]

I shot a project a few months ago where strobes were an important part of the story. We were able to adjust the duration to cover 1/24th of a second. That way, no matter when the shutter opened, we had a solid frame of light. Worked perfectly.

[David Mullen ASC]

I shot a project a few months ago where strobes were an important part of the story. We were able to adjust the duration to cover 1/24th of a second. That way, no matter when the shutter opened, we had a solid frame of light. Worked perfectly.

What flash units create a flash that lasts for 1/24th of a second?

[Costelloe Michael]

I recently shot a car spot on Red, a Vauxhall Astra launch for the UK, which ended in a 'Red carpet' scene with the car being photographed by Papparazzi. I talked to the director about the flash issue, we looked into old flashbulbs also but on the day it was all too pressured and the producer got a load of real Pap's with modern flashguns to do the shoot!

The director loved the half frame flashes that resulted! I didn't see that coming and expected more work in post to white out the frames. No way says he, is their any way we can get more of them??!


Mike Costelloe

[Larry McKee]

What flash units create a flash that lasts for 1/24th of a second?

You would ask me that. ;-)
I'm out of town for a funeral and don't have my laptop with me. They were 2k strobes if I am remembering right. They were adjustable from a few microseconds to about a second. Again, based on my faltering memory. I'll get you a better answer in a few days, but, I think they may have been from a company called High End Systems.

[Tim Naylor]

Thanks for all the advice. Keep it coming.

[Larry McKee]

What flash units create a flash that lasts for 1/24th of a second?

OK, got the answer. They were Martin Atomic 3ks. Flash duration from 0-530 ms. DMX controlled.

[David Mullen ASC]

OK, got the answer. They were Martin Atomic 3ks. Flash duration from 0-530 ms. DMX controlled.

Thanks, that will come in handy someday. Of course, it doesn't help with the electronic flash units that are on the still cameras in the shot, visibly flashing.

[NateWeaver]

Again, based on my faltering memory. I'll get you a better answer in a few days, but, I think they may have been from a company called High End Systems.

Larry, would they have been Dataflashes?

Dataflashes were one of the the most popular DMX controllable strobes back in the 90s, they've since been surpassed by other strobe units from Martin.

At any rate they're cylinders about 10 inches in diameter and 10 inches deep. Not something you can put on a prop camera, they were made to be hung on trusses for rock/theatrical shows. But you of course could sell the effect of paparazzi.

They're xenon bulbs so by default the flash is just like others, some thousandth of a second. But the controller in the unit could pulse up to 60 times a second (directly piping the power of 60HZ into the globe, in a way), so you could get maybe 2-3 seconds of what looked like continuous light out of them (really 60 pulses/sec) before they'd go into thermal protection. Control this the right way by DMX and you could get a 60hz pulse out of it that lasts maybe 2-3 frames. Sounds like what was done on your shoot Larry?

[Larry McKee]

Thanks, that will come in handy someday. Of course, it doesn't help with the electronic flash units that are on the still cameras in the shot, visibly flashing.

True, but you could experiment with limiting the flash duration/power for the on camera units so you don't get the half frame problem and add the 3ks off camera. Just a thought.

[Dylan Macleod, CSC]

It's been mentioned before on this site - Papparazi flash units by Lightning Strikes have a flash controller that allows manual control over the duration.

As long as you hold your finger on the trigger for a brief moment (as opposed to "zapping" it as fast as you can) you should get a solid flash.

[Larry McKee]

Sounds like what was done on your shoot Larry?

Hey Nate. No, it was the Martin Atomic 3k.

[NateWeaver]

Hey Nate. No, it was the Martin Atomic 3k.

Aha. The functional replacement for the Dataflashes. Same drill with those, as far as I know. I shot a concert with about 60 of them on stage, they seemed to pulse at 60hz when "pegged continuous" as well; I say this because sometimes I had freeze frames with "2 exposures" (a ghost image) when they were on solid. Also had minor rolling shutter weirdness when on continuous as well.

I think that 520ms spec is how long they can go 100% power flashing at 60hz continuously before they need a rest.

As I understand it, Lightning Strikes doesn't have this problem, they actually do long true continuous bursts (no pulsing at line freq)

[Harry Clark]

Dylan beat me to it.
We did a job last week that featured a Paparazzi scene. We used the Lightning Strikes Paparazzi strobes on camera, in addition to the traditional Lightning Strikes units off-camera. I will say that the LS Strobes are more like studio strobes, so from an art direction standpoint, they look a little out of place, but worked for us.
We also had regular on-camera strobes in the deep background working, pointing straight at camera, as it were; since the actor was in the foreground, most of the illumination from the on-camera strobes was blocked by the actors in the foreground. When I looked at the footage frame-by-frame on the computer, there were very few split-frame flashes that were noticeable. It worked pretty well...
The only thing I can say is to be careful with the Lighting Strikes units; sometimes too long a duration can look really weird and fake.
Larry, good tip about the Martins... I'll file that one away for next time.
Cheers,
Harry

[David Bowsky]

Sorry to dig up the old post, but I have a shoot coming up with a single photographer character who flashes the scene from time to time while taking pictures. The split-frame stuff sounds easier to hide during a 'paparazzi' scene - but with a flash coming from a single character, I fear it's going to look pretty bad.

Sadly, we probably don't have the financial resources for things like "lightning strikes," even if I knew where to source them in NorCal.

Still on the hunt for a variety of older style single-use type bulbs to see if we can rig something. Sadly, there is a dwindling number of those remaining in existence, so they seem hard to come by locally. If anyone has suggestions on ones that work well for this so I can narrow down my search, that would be excellent.

I talked to some local photogs about strobes and the general consensus is that units in the 800+ "watt-second" range might have long enough decay to fill more (hopefully all) of the frame. Has anyone tested similar devices? Thoughts on having a smaller strobe/flash on the prop camera (to sell the gag) working with strobes off camera (to actually generate the light output)?

Also, are there any adjustments that can be made in camera that reduces the split-frame effect or makes it easier to correct in post? For that matter, does the post correction look solid and believable? I'd like to be able to do this in-camera, but if it's not possible given our limited resources, then we go with plan B, right?

Thanks!

[Larry McKee]

I haven't done a lot of still photography with an on camera strobe in a long time. But, the old Vivitar 285 strobes had a fairly long burst when set to full power in manual mode. I would think the same would be true of modern strobes. You might try one of those and play with your shutter speed to see if you can consistantly get a solid frame.