REDCODE RAW 42 - Framerates [Archive]

severin schultze

03-02-2010, 08:10 AM

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-02-2010, 08:16 AM

Hello,

anyone out there who could tell me if RC 42 is just an option to capture in 4K (HD, ANA, 16:9, etc.) or can i use it to capture at any of the given resolutions? Furthermore i'd like to know which storage solution is supported at what kind of framerates (CF, RED-Drive, Red-Ram)?

Details are greatly appreciated.

Cheers,
Severin

I'd like to know this as well.

In the MX test I did a couple of weeks ago we were unable to shoot at RC42 at 23.98 at 16:9 with a Hard Drive. We didn't spend that much time messing around to see if there was something else we could do to make it work, but it did make me wonder...

Jamie Havill

03-02-2010, 08:24 AM

I'd like to know this as well.

In the MX test I did a couple of weeks ago we were unable to shoot at RC42 at 23.98 at 16:9 with a Hard Drive. We didn't spend that much time messing around to see if there was something else we could do to make it work, but it did make me wonder...

Same. We were unable to use Redcode42 with the camera set at 4K 2:1 and 25fps. We were using a HD also. Maybe its limited to CF cards?

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-02-2010, 08:25 AM

Same. We were unable to use Redcode42 with the camera set at 4K 2:1 and 25fps. We were using a HD also. Maybe its limited to CF cards?

Usually the drive is the media that is most likely to work. We didn't try a 16GB card.

Jamie Havill

03-02-2010, 08:29 AM

Usually the drive is the media that is most likely to work. We didn't try a 16GB card.

I only deduced that because we didn't try the cards either. Hopefully someone will chime in soon and let us know for sure.

Nick Shaw

03-02-2010, 08:36 AM

There's a table of supported combinations in the manual (http://www.red.com/support/download/180)

Mike Burke

03-02-2010, 08:40 AM

In the MX test I did a couple of weeks ago we were unable to shoot at RC42 at 23.98 at 16:9 with a Hard Drive. We didn't spend that much time messing around to see if there was something else we could do to make it work, but it did make me wonder...

My research shows that RC42 does not support shooting 4K 16:9, only the following: 4K 2:1, ANA, HD & 4.5K WS. I have found the same limitation with our camera, with no explanation. This includes using REDFLASH, RED-DRIVE, or RED RAM.

severin schultze

03-02-2010, 08:47 AM

There's a table of supported combinations in the manual (http://www.red.com/support/download/180)

Great! Thanks a lot.

- Severin

severin schultze

03-02-2010, 08:54 AM

I'm still missing information about frame rates. The table just shows which base frame rates are working with the RC's and the media. I was looking for actual frame rates.
Anyone?

- Severin

Mike Burke

03-02-2010, 08:59 AM

I'm still missing information about frame rates. The table just shows which base frame rates are working with the RC's and the media. I was looking for actual frame rates.
Anyone?

- Severin

Those are maximum frame rates possible, based on RC, resolution, & media. P.69.

severin schultze

03-02-2010, 09:42 AM

Those are maximum frame rates possible, based on RC, resolution, & media. P.69.

Those are base frame rates. But have a look on p.40.
That's what i was looking for :001_smile:

- Severin

Mike Burke

03-02-2010, 10:30 AM

Those are base frame rates. But have a look on p.40.
That's what i was looking for :001_smile:

- Severin

Oh, I see now.
You're interested in "Varispeed" rates.

Mike Burke

03-02-2010, 10:53 AM

Same. We were unable to use Redcode42 with the camera set at 4K 2:1 and 25fps. We were using a HD also. Maybe its limited to CF cards?

This is interesting. Jamie, are using an M-X or original Mysterium sensor?
I've just confirmed the ability to record RC42, 4K 2:1, 25fps, Build 30, RED DRIVE, on an original sensor camera.
I wonder what has changed?

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 09:09 AM

Those are maximum frame rates possible, based on RC, resolution, & media. P.69.

According to that table you should be able to shoot 24fps 4K 16:9 at RC42.

My assistant is prepping today and was unable to format the drive with this set up. At RC36, no problem.

Can we shoot 24fps 4K 16:9 RC42?

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 08:11 PM

Hmmmm. No comments huh?

So I guess my first day on set tomorrow with MX will be RC36...

David Battistella

03-10-2010, 08:24 PM

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 08:28 PM

Graeme has stated that rc 28 is plenty of resolution for almost any situation. Rc36 can help in high detail scenes (foliage,etc). Rc 42 it seems is there to boost resolution on formats that record less vertical resolutions 2:1 or 4.5ws to maybe make up for the vertical pixels you give up shooting those frame sizes.

As an aside there is far to great a fixation on these 28 36 42 stuff i have yet to see a test showing descernable differences between them. Could some gfx person do this test. The perception of more quality because the number is higher gets boring.

David

Yeah. I'm not too worried.

Just think it is funny that it says you can do it in the manual and this thread has been up for a week and no one from RED has offered any input.

Hopefully they are busily installing new sensors. My camera is sitting it it out tomorrow while it waits for the upgrade call.

:-(

David Battistella

03-10-2010, 08:36 PM

Yeah. I'm not too worried.

Just think it is funny that it says you can do it in the manual and this thread has been up for a week and no one from RED has offered any input.

Hopefully they are busily installing new sensors. My camera is sitting it it out tomorrow while it waits for the upgrade call.

:-(

Too bad. The R 1. Looks absolutely fantastic with build 30. Ifeel that it is much less noisy than ever an you can easily push the images much furthur. I've done a few shoots on the new build and I am very happy with it.

I'm waiting for the call but with R1 to R1-mx ratio about 700 to one right now I'm surprised you are loosing rentals already.

David

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 08:42 PM

Too bad. The R 1. Looks absolutely fantastic with build 30. Ifeel that it is much less noisy than ever an you can easily push the images much furthur. I've done a few shoots on the new build and I am very happy with it.

I'm waiting for the call but with R1 to R1-mx ratio about 700 to one right now I'm surprised you are poising rentals already.

David

The MX sensor is far superior to the "old" sensor. No question.

It would not be in my best interest to use the old sensor (my camera) from a "DP" standpoint. Although the "business manager" in me is cursing.

David Battistella

03-10-2010, 08:49 PM

The MX sensor is far superior to the "old" sensor. No question.

It would not be in my best interest to use the old sensor (my camera) from a "DP" standpoint. Although the "business manager" in me is cursing.

Funny thing is this. Not many post houses are equiped to actually equiped to use the new color science and chances are that while the capture may be better the image pipeline is the same because no sdk has been released with redline.

Weird. Effed if you do. Effed if you don't.

4k just ain't what it used to be. Well lit is well lit. It's a creative choice. R1's still rock.

David.

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 08:57 PM

Funny thing is this. Not many post houses are equiped to actually equiped to use the new color science and chances are that while the capture may be better the image pipeline is the same because no sdk has been released with redline.

Weird. Effed if you do. Effed if you don't.

4k just ain't what it used to be. Well lit is well lit. It's a creative choice. R1's still rock.

David.

Seems like Pablo and Baselight can?

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=40222

In the test I did, MX footage out of REDCINE X had more dynamic range than the old "M" sensor.

David Battistella

03-10-2010, 09:10 PM

Seems like Pablo and Baselight can?

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=40222

In the test I did, MX footage out of REDCINE X had more dynamic range than the old "M" sensor.

Fair enough but you can't tell me you'd stake your career on the sensor alone. Would you rather have a package truck and an R1 or a much smaller lighting package with an M-X.

The r1 is by no means dead and I think that in well lit graded finished scenes it would be hard to descern. I found the m-x a tad softer.

Either way. I know you'll light it well and do a great job. Whether it's m, mx or film or HD.

David

Dylan Macleod, CSC

03-10-2010, 09:17 PM

Fair enough but you can't tell me you'd stake your career on the sensor alone. Would you rather have a package truck and an R1 or a much smaller lighting package with an M-X.

The r1 is by no means dead and I think that in well lit graded finished scenes it would be hard to descern. I found the m-x a tad softer.

Either way. I know you'll light it well and do a great job. Whether it's m, mx or film or HD.

David

It is the sum of the parts.

I get asked that about lenses all the time. "Will it really look that different if we use Zeiss High speeds versus S4's?". It is all of that - the lighting, framing, lenses, format, etc.

But I hear what you are saying.

We digress...

David Battistella

03-10-2010, 09:21 PM

It is the sum of the parts.

I get asked that about lenses all the time. "Will it really look that different if we use Zeiss High speeds versus S4's?". It is all of that - the lighting, framing, lenses, format, etc.

But I hear what you are saying.

We digress...

Yeah. Gimmie the lights and you can make almost anything look great...all this in a world where there is still SD delivery! sheesh!

late nights, early call times.

peace...out...

David

Nick Shaw

03-11-2010, 02:12 AM

Seems like Pablo and Baselight can?

But talk to the post facility first before assuming that. The current release version of Baselight does not support M-X. There is a build out there which does, but not everybody will be using that build though

David Battistella

03-11-2010, 05:36 AM

But talk to the post facility first before assuming that. The current release version of Baselight does not support M-X. There is a build out there which does, but not everybody will be using that build though

Great point Nick. Not everyone is ready for "perpetual beta" software and it makes many people nervous.

WHen I told people I filmed a pretty big shoot on a test pilot build of build 30 they just about freaked. I got the Software the night before and decided to go with it. pretty freaky to some people build I had build 21 on a CF card at the ready.

The big focus is on RC-X but REdrushes, QT codec, REDLINE and many other important tools are NOT implemented as of yet.

I know RED works hard at this but there is always a lag time between a new build and it's implementation in post facilities.

The Apple Color update was a godsend.

David

David