Intercutting Red ONE with Red ONE MX

[Joe Taylor]

I'm going to be working on a feature this winter in India where we will be shooting with two Reds, one a standard Red ONE and the other, a Red ONE MX upgrade. We will try to have both cameras set up as closely as possible, but I am still apprehensive out of concern about how the footage from the two cameras will match, especially if and likely when we have two camera scenes.

This is a low-budget film and this is what we will have to work with. Can anybody help alleviate these anxieties?

[Chi Ying Chan]

Thats exactly what we'r doing.
U can see the differences between them under low light situation,in daylight under correct exposure,little difference.
With good grading,issues solved.

Regards
Chan Chi Ying
DP HK

[Joe Taylor]

Nobody?

[Joe Taylor]

Thanks Chan! I know that low-light comparisons really equate to 'no comparison,' so far I do not know if we will be doing any low light shooting.

And sorry about posting over the top of your reply. We must have replied at about the same time.

[Rob Ruffo]

It's not just low light, it's any situation where bright and dark areas exist in the frame - like a sunny day with an awning, and you want to see detail under the awning. With Red 1, that shady area will be very noisy, that or you clipped your highlights. with Red MX no problem

[Chi Ying Chan]

Not from my case.Shooting lots of exterior sunny scenes with bright harsh sun light and shadows,with chinese ancient buildings,deep brown wooden interior with small windows,
under correct exposure,noise is not an issue.
Actually i'm shooting a low budget film with one MX and one M Red One about volleyball in a beach with a restaurant,its summer here,burning sun,high temperature and humidity....... no noise issue,both Red One perform perfect.

Regards
Chan Chi Ying
DP HK

[Joe Taylor]

BUMPED... because surely somebody on Reduser has some extensive experience with both cameras by now. You have 8-pages of our Redusers ripping apart Arri's Alexa but nobody has much to offer in a constructive way regarding mixing and matching ONE with the ONE-MX?

[mikeburton]

Not sure what exactly your looking for but I just recently mixed and matched on a feature and here were my observations after posting the film in Scratch recently. The M sensor when set with the same color temp color space and identical settings seems to feel cooler than the MX. Day exterior shots seem to have little difference in noise comparisons but the MX has a little more latitude to push and pull the image in post. MX could be shot at 1200 iso but seemed to exhibit noise in the film that was better when dropped back down in the metadata in Scratch to 800iso. M sensor was never pushed over 500 iso but looked good with just a fair amount of noise introduced. MX noise pattern is much more flattering when there is noise introduced into the picture where M sensor was not as flattering to the image. Overall, we added grain to the MX stuff in post to add texture to some scenes but I would consider shooting at higher ISO's to achieve the same effect potentially on MX for stylized scenes. I would not consider pushing the ISO on the M sensor as the noise pattern generated from the camera would not be as flattering.

[Joe Taylor]

Thanks Mike. This is the sort of info I'm looking for since I have not yet worked with an M-X Red and hope to learn as much as possible in the few months I have before we go into production. Such as what ISO best compliments each camera when working together. Although I will not be involved as much after post, I hope to have the cameras setup in the most efficient way so as to have the footage match as closely as I can.

[Rob Ruffo]

Not from my case.Shooting lots of exterior sunny scenes with bright harsh sun light and shadows,with chinese ancient buildings,deep brown wooden interior with small windows,
under correct exposure,noise is not an issue.
Actually i'm shooting a low budget film with one MX and one M Red One about volleyball in a beach with a restaurant,its summer here,burning sun,high temperature and humidity....... no noise issue,both Red One perform perfect.

Regards
Chan Chi Ying
DP HK

Sure, but it really depends on how much you are boosting the shady areas. If you want to see a LOT of detail there, like enough to read someone's facial expression, you will need to create a mask and boost at least 2 stops, bringing an otherwise 320 iso shoot to 800 iso, and with Red Mysterium One, for my taste, that is beginning to be a bit noisy. I say this, but would add that before MX, I found Red to be the best extreme contrast cam I had ever shot with (excluding film) Now MX is that cam. MX is nuts. If you are clever with post, it's almost edging into HDR.

I would agree that the noise patterns are different. If you are at ISO 320 and not boosting Flut too much and not using a high brightness gamma, then MX and One will cut just fine. If, however, both are above 500 iso (through ISO, Flut, high gamma curves or any other means) then the Red One's noise will be noticeably different from MXs, not just more plentiful, but a totally different (and less nice looking) texture. The MX's noise is so smooth you can use it as a film grain effect deliberately. I have tried this as an experiment, but not yet on a paying gig.