Element Technica!!!

[Billy Summers]

Brothers and Sisters of the RED Faith! I would like to share with you my findings...

"Element Technica!!?"
What is this, you ask...
They are a company (that I happened to stumble upon) that is actually making some really cool product solutions for RED.

For instance:
The Element bridge plate allows for all the standard Arri 15mm or 19mm AKS (mattebox, follow focus, lens support, etc) to line up just like they do on the 435/535/35III/BL systems.

The other "Sick" thing about these bridgeplates is the fact that they integrate seamlessly with Oconnor heads whilst reducing height.

check them out @
www.elementtechnica.com

[Babu Kantamneni]

Brothers and Sisters of the RED Faith! I would like to share with you my findings...

"Element Technica!!?"
What is this, you ask...
They are a company (that I happened to stumble upon) that is actually making some really cool product solutions for RED.

For instance:
The Element bridge plate allows for all the standard Arri 15mm or 19mm AKS (mattebox, follow focus, lens support, etc) to line up just like they do on the 435/535/35III/BL systems.

The other "Sick" thing about these bridgeplates is the fact that they integrate seamlessly with Oconnor heads whilst reducing height.

check them out @
www.elementtechnica.com
And they are selling thru red their web sie says.

[Steve Gibby]

Yes, da boyz at Element do some seriously good design and fabrication...

GibCor bought a couple of those bridge plates from RED and we've used them extensively on shoots since 9/1. In fact we used the two RED/Element ARRI bridge plates that I bought with RED #8 at the first RED Day on 8/31 to mount RED #8 and RED #13 (Billy's camera) on the Paracam at Paradise FX for the first RED 4K 3D tests we did the very next morning (9/1). Those bridge plates are well built...

[Adrian T.]

This is the same bridge plate which can be ordered through red.com.

http://www.red.com/store/product_detail/45
http://www.red.com/store/product_detail/43

[Michael Ragen]

Thanks dude! I remember seeing "Element" engraved on a piece of Red gear in a photo from a while back. Keep us posted on other gear developments from them.

ps- November equals Bugs. Not camera bugs.

[Jarred Land]

Yes.. Element makes our Arri 15/19mm adapter plates, they are good people with good product.

[JD Holloway]

Looks good. I hope eventualy there will be a RED.com list of third party products so shopping is easier. There are lots of third party vendors that are going to make fantastic products with RED in-mind.
I like the idea of a RED.com "one stop shop" so that we dont have to use search engines to find product solutions to things my cam system needs.

(hope people are listening)

[Evin Grant]

How much more does one of the element plates weigh than the Red 19mm bottom plate? Do the rods pass all the way through?

[Alexander Nikishin]

Does the RED shoulder dovetail screw onto the bottom end of the arri plate or does it need to be removed first?

Also, are the CF rods available yet?

[Michael Ragen]

Good question Alexander. Billy do you know? Also, is there any chance of 15mm handles and Supergrip mount? Thanks.

[Billy Summers]

Element makes some 15mm to 19mm adapter rings/spacers for fitting 15mm rods into 19mm holes as well as a sick little shoulder padded dovetail that slides into the Arri baseplate and has adjustable Arri style grips on it...

I don't know if all the stuff I've inquired about is available yet...

But...it's on it's way!


Best,

[Michael Ragen]

That sounds even better. I just hope you can remove one of the grips and replace it with a Supergrip.

[Chris Burket]

They also have underwater housings.

[eltech]

I would like to start by saying thanks to Billy, Gibby and Jarred for the nod. We couldn't do what we're doing without the feedback and support of RED and the RED faithful.

We currently make two different bridge plates for the RED One. A 15mm rod version and a 19mm rod version. While we would have preferred to build one style, Arriflex unfortunately has perpetuated two different accessory standards depending on your geographic location. 15mm in the western US and 19mm on the east coast and Europe. The rest of the world seems pretty random from my personal observation. For new RED owners with an existing Arri camera package the choice is pretty simple; pick the bridge plate that matches your current system. Here in LA it is 15mm only. Either way, by using the Arri standard you can integrate your package with gear from other users, formats and rental houses.

Once you have the right bridge plate you'll find that any Arri accessory of the same rod system will line up on the RED just like it was made by Arri. The bridge plate also interfaces with any Arri-style dovetail of which there are tens of thousands world-wide (including ours). Chrozeil makes Arri-style dovetails as well. Ours is handy for the O'Connor users since the bottom is machined to go directly into the top of the fluid head without the Ronford-Baker adapter. This gives you all the fore-aft adjustment with a minimum of interconnects and a low stack height. Our dovetail can be used with other systems as well thanks to the 3/8-16 threaded inserts along the center.

Our hand-held kit (currently being tested) is made up of a shoulder pad which has a shorter Arri-style dovetail machined into the top which slides and locks into the bridge plate letting you find the sweet spot for balance. The other major component is a pistol grip (with record on/off push button) which mounts to the rosette on the right side of the bridge plate.

To go from hand held to studio, you unlock the shoulder pad (one lever), slide it out of the bridge plate and slide the whole camera onto the dovetail waiting on the fluid head. It is fast and secure.

To answer Evan's questions; the bridge plate weighs about 1.5lbs and shouldn't add any weight regardless of the final configuration.
The rods do indeed pass through.

Sorry for the long post but I'm glad to see the discussion.

We recognize RED for the revolution that it is and are hoping to have some small part in helping it to reach it's potential. If anyone recognizes a need and can't find the right tool; give us a shout.

Thanks,

[Mike Prevette]

Wow this seems like some seriously solid stuff. Can't wait to get my hands on your shoulderpad baseplate. I've rigged up some pretty funky shoulder gags before, and I'd love something like this. How soon can I get one?

A lot of the reduser viewership has never spent much time in the trenches of real shooting, so I think a lot of them miss th importance of little things like this. The fact the Red is fully compatible with film style accessories is the #1 reason I'm getting one. Once I heard PL mount/ and arri accessories I was sold. Hell the camera could shoot standard deff and I'd probably still buy it. Working with proven cinema style tools changes how you work, and I personally work a lot better with good tools.

Thanks again for busting out with these cool new toys.

p.s. how does your locking lever work on you sliding baseplate? how is the baseplate secured (push button like arri?)?

_mike

[Matt Uhry]

Hey Stephen,

Glad you are on-board early with this, the 15mm Red plate looks very nice and I'll be buying one, and probably one of your dovetails too.

Can you look into making a simple / lighweight top plate for the Red that holds the battery transversely, accepts the Red handle and would provide some mount points for the LCD and the EVF ? For me the 19mm top rails are too cumbersome and too complicated just to hold the battery and maybe the drive.

The EVF mount is another area that could use a re-think. It needs to rotate fluidly and lock in one axis and have an extension piece for tripod / dolly use.

I'd love to have a look at the handle system you are planning. We are shooting nights at the moment so if you are in LA I can stop by mid-day. I've been considering Tango's blue handles, nice, but really expensive !

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

[Finner]

Hey Stephen,

Glad you are on-board early with this, the 15mm Red plate looks very nice and I'll be buying one, and probably one of your dovetails too.

Me too!


Can you look into making a simple / lighweight top plate for the Red that holds the battery transversely, accepts the Red handle and would provide some mount points for the LCD and the EVF ? For me the 19mm top rails are too cumbersome and too complicated just to hold the battery and maybe the drive.

This would be great to have and would be a definate purchase for me. Having these items on top will allow for easy access to the back of the camera


The EVF mount is another area that could use a re-think. It needs to rotate fluidly and lock in one axis and have an extension piece for tripod / dolly use.

This EVF mount may be something that could be an attachment to the top plate that you build. The red arm is going to be a big hastle to deal with when attached to the EVF and one of the first things I would like to get out of the system. The simple one axis rod/arm would be perfect. It would also be good if it could telescope in and out or have an extension quick attach system. I think the extension quick attach may be the better then the telescope option.

[Michael Ragen]

I would also be interested in a lighter weight top plate for the battery (I don't need the drive). Howabout a top handle with record start?

Can you post any pics of the prototype handheld system?

I will be placing my order for accessories soon and I am very interested in what you guys are doing, and I could wait a while for some items.. I will also be using an OConnor tripod.

[Anthony Gratl]

Our hand-held kit (currently being tested) is made up of a shoulder pad which has a shorter Arri-style dovetail machined into the top which slides and locks into the bridge plate letting you find the sweet spot for balance. The other major component is a pistol grip (with record on/off push button) which mounts to the rosette on the right side of the bridge plate.
Thanks,

Thanks for your initial posts! Technical question for you based on my experience as a documentary one man band using HVX and DVRig Pro. Don't know if you know DVRig Pro, but it basically allows one to have one hand on one of the two grips to steady the shot, and therefore be able to fully focus on the interview itself. It does this because of the spring loaded "post" that connects the rig to the body (the post extends from the grips to a waist belt), which acts both to offload the weight and provide stability and a fluidity to the look. I wonder if you guys are developing something along those lines for us docmakers using RED?

[Salem Kapic]

Thanks Stephen Pizzo

When do you expect that the other product like mattebox, follow focus...will be shown? Any hints regarding the price?

thx

[eltech]

Mike,
Glad to hear you like the gear. I fully agree with your setiments regarding industry standard accessories. I worked as a focus puller/camera assistant for 12 years before going to work at Wescam/Pictorvision. As an AC I was constantly faced with the task of integrating cameras, lenses and AKS from Panavision, Arri, Angenieux, etc. Many times I've been forced to work with a BL, 35III and Pana GII all on the same show. (especially in the middle east) At Wescam/Pictorvision I was responsible for the electro-mechanical integration of all the different cameras and lenses available at any given time. I spent countless hours trying to design a single set of hardware that would allow as many different cameras to interconnect with the various Wescam aerial and ground products.

Hector Ortega, the other half of Element Technica is one of the founders of SL Cine, the company that helped create the thriving after-market accessory industry. The film magazines they designed were so successful that Arri actually copied some of their designs. They are also responsible for a lot of Hydroflex's underwater housings and underwater HMI's. SL Cine also has their own line of deep-water housings for their SL Cine camera as well as the Arri 235. It was this housing we used as the basis of the new RED deep-water housing.

Ever since MiniDV and desktop NLE's hit the market, there has been talk of the democratization of filmmaking. We recognize that RED will be remembered as the most significant catalyst of this movement. Our goal is to use our 35 years combined experience to create professional quality, reasonably priced accessories for this new army of filmmakers. We want to make it possible for a RED to be slipped into the professional on-set workflow where formats are hardware are often mixed.

As for our bridge plates they function exactly like the Arriflex units. The dovetail brake is controlled with a single lever on the left side of the bridgeplate. Forward is locked, to the rear is unlocked. The bridge plate is compatible with the safety on all the existing dovetails. The safety on our dovetail is a spring actuated button.

Matt,
We are working on a very configurable EVF mounting system. It will allow pivoting when tilting but can also be quickly locked into place for hand-held work. You can also set the amount of drag so that it stays where you leave it but can be easily re-positioned. It can be extended for work on a geared head and will be compatible with most standard eyepiece levellers. We will likely offer our own leveller as part of the EVF mounting system at some point.
As for the top plate I would be interested in hearing more of your ideas. We like the functionality and robustness of the top rod mount from RED so we plan on using it as much as possible as an anchor point for our various accessories. Billy mentioned the eccentric 15mm bushings which converts the top mount to 15mm rods with 100mm rather 104mm center spacing. This allows standard 15mm accessories to go up top as well.

We are in Los Angeles just west of Culver City.

Again, excuse the rambling post.

[Andrew Benz]

***A lot of the reduser viewership has never spent much time in the trenches of real shooting, so I think a lot of them miss th importance of little things like this.***
_mike

Really Mike... If you look around at our membership you will find that a huge majority have "spent alot of time in the trenches of real shooting". Maybe you should change that to "some".

Hey Mike--- I suggested that RED look into the very thing that Element is now doing--exactly six or seven months ago... I could even point to the post but it got nuked by the mods.

Not trying to start a fight, I do agree completely with the rest of your post... :)

I also completely agee with Finner... the first thing I am getting rid of will be the way the EVF interfaces with the RED.

"We are working on a very configurable EVF mounting system. It will allow pivoting when tilting but can also be quickly locked into place for hand-held work. You can also set the amount of drag so that it stays where you leave it but can be easily re-positioned." I am really very happy that Element may have a workable solution soon." Quote by Stephen Pizzo Element Technica.

I really like the post above by Stephen... Please count me in for both as soon as they are available. You guys are solving the two big problems that I had w/ the RED design.

Thank you,

Andrew Benz

[Sebastian Cramer]

Hey, does anyone knows if the Arri style brigdeplate is still compatible with the side handles of Red One?

[Brian Ferguson]

Hey, does anyone knows if the Arri style brigdeplate is still compatible with the side handles of Red One?

The Element 19 mm baseplate that RED sells is compatible with the side handles. I have checked it out. It makes senses because the center of the rods to the lens center has to be the same for matte boxes etc.

[Sebastian Cramer]

Thanks for that answer, I thought so the same, but I wanted to make sure before I get the pieces.

[Mick van Rossum, NSC]

Mike,
Matt,
We are working on a very configurable EVF mounting system. It will allow pivoting when tilting but can also be quickly locked into place for hand-held work. You can also set the amount of drag so that it stays where you leave it but can be easily re-positioned. It can be extended for work on a geared head and will be compatible with most standard eyepiece levellers. We will likely offer our own leveller as part of the EVF mounting system at some point.
We are in Los Angeles just west of Culver City.

Again, excuse the rambling post.

Great to hear. I had the same problems using the EVF. One suggestion, if possible; I love the possibility of the Arri SR3 that you can rotate the image in the viewfinder. Any possibilty you could integrate this into the RED EVF ?
This mounting system is defenitely an update I'll purchase.

Cheers

Mick van Rossum NSC

[Michael Ragen]

Hey guys, any chance of getting a rough price estimate on your handheld system and dovetail? Will it be sold as a package or individual parts? Maybe some idea on timeframe? Thanks.

[Alexander Nikishin]

Billy mentioned the eccentric 15mm bushings which converts the top mount to 15mm rods with 100mm rather 104mm center spacing. This allows standard 15mm accessories to go up top as well.

Again, excuse the rambling post.

Hi Stephen,

Thanks for building a great 19mm base!

I have two questions,

1. Does the 15mm Arri Base have 100mm spacing?

2. I thought RED's 19mm base had 105mm spacing?

[Emmanuel Cambier]

Hi Stephen

Wich dovetail to choose for a Panther X15 fluid head?

Thanks

Emmanuel

[zak forrest]

I have an Arri-FF2, can I use this with my Red production pack, or do I need to get this Element Arri deal?

Sidenote: has anyone compared the RED shoulder pad to the ZACUTO shoulder pad?

[david farland]

Just learn't from Red technical support (huge thank you to Kevin) that the rod spacing and optical axis height of the Red bottom plate height is identical to that of the Red Arri bridge plate, i.e. rod spacing = 104mm; optical axis height = 120mm.

Cheers,

Haven't got both in my hands but that sounds encouraging.


Cheers,

[zak forrest]

Haven't got both in my hands but that sounds encouraging.


Cheers,

so an Arri-FF2 would be fine with the Red production pack then?

What are the other pros to getting the Element Arri plate then? Is it just what people are used to, or something else I am not realizing... I'm confused as to why the Element Arri plate and the Red bottom plate.. what is the difference? Or does this not apply to someone like me who only needs to make sure the FF2 will work and doesn't care about anything else.

[david farland]

On paper it would but without actually fitting it I'd ask someone who has.
I'm assuming the FF2 takes 19mm rods....!

Find out what Arri FF that Red use, check for yourself that they've used this with their Bottom plate and then ring Arri and ask if both FFs are interchangeable.

The advantages of the Arri plate is for Stephen to answer but on paper it seems it fits directly onto a range of tripods i.e 'oconnor and has the dovetail lock/adj.

Dave,

[Alexander Nikishin]

What are the other pros to getting the Element Arri plate then? Is it just what people are used to, or something else I am not realizing... I'm confused as to why the Element Arri plate and the Red bottom plate.. what is the difference? Or does this not apply to someone like me who only needs to make sure the FF2 will work and doesn't care about anything else.

There are alot of advantages to the 19mm Arri Base....

- The base has a machined bottom that slides right onto an O'Connor dovetail allowing for easy balancing

- It has a lower optical center than the RED bottom plate.

- It's a quick release plate.... pop the lever back, slide it off the dovetail, leave the dovetail on the head, slide the camera with the Arri base back on, you're ready to shoot again.

- If you're going from tripod to hand-held, just slide in an Arri shoulder dovetail onto the bottom end of the Arri base, slide it out, pop it back onto the head and you're ready to shoot again.

The only bad thing I've noticed is that the RED shoulder dovetail does not slide into the bottom of the Arri Base plate, would've made it so convenient if it did..

[Alexander Nikishin]

Haven't got both in my hands but that sounds encouraging.


Cheers,

If the Arri base is indeed 104mm spaced, then that must make the RED Bottom Plate 104mm as well......

I can slide the RED universal mount directly onto the Arri Base without a problem.

Can someone in the know confirm these measurements?

[Greg M]

How does it attach to the Red? Are those threaded screws on the top?
can you post a pic?

do the 19mm rods only come out the front of the plate or do the extend back too?

[Alexander Nikishin]

How does it attach to the Red? Are those threaded screws on the top?
can you post a pic?

do the 19mm rods only come out the front of the plate or do the extend back too?

It screws directly onto the bottom of the RED camera.

The rods do indeed come out both the front and back of the Arri Base just as they would on the RED bottom plate.

[Greg M]

how much more does it weigh than the red bottom plate?

[Alexander Nikishin]

how much more does it weigh than the red bottom plate?

It believe it weigha a bit less than the RED bottom plate with shoulder dovetail attached.

[Michael Morlan]

I have an O'Conner 1030 which predates the dovetail mount so the ARRI dovetail is of little use at present. Does the RED shoulder dovetail have screw mount underneath so I can attach the O'Con tripod plate?

edit: Nevermind. I only had to take a look at the RED One hero shot on my computer desktop to see the RED shoulder dovetail mounted atop the O'Con 2060HD dovetail.

:whistling:

M

[Greg M]

I have an O'Conner 1030 which predates the dovetail mount so the ARRI dovetail is of little use at present. Does the RED shoulder dovetail have screw mount underneath so I can attach the O'Con tripod plate?

M
\\yes it does, but its a single screw

[Adrian T.]

Once you have the right bridge plate you'll find that any Arri accessory of the same rod system will line up on the RED just like it was made by Arri. The bridge plate also interfaces with any Arri-style dovetail of which there are tens of thousands world-wide (including ours). Chrozeil makes Arri-style dovetails as well. Ours is handy for the O'Connor users since the bottom is machined to go directly into the top of the fluid head without the Ronford-Baker adapter. This gives you all the fore-aft adjustment with a minimum of interconnects and a low stack height. Our dovetail can be used with other systems as well thanks to the 3/8-16 threaded inserts along the center.

So I have an OConnor 2060HD head.
I mount the OConnor 2575-210 Arriflex Dovetail Slide Plate (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/261498-REG/OConnor_2575_210_2575_210_Arriflex_Dovetail_Slide. html) on top of it.
Then I slide the Element Technica Arri baseplate right onto it.

Can anyone confirm that this is correct?

[Greg M]

correct...I will have both on Tuesday and post pics.

BTW- Element Technicia makes an Arri dovtail that fits directly on the OConnor if you dont have the 2575-210 yet.

[Adrian T.]

correct...I will have both on Tuesday and post pics.

Cool. Thanks.


BTW- Element Technicia makes an Arri dovtail that fits directly on the OConnor if you dont have the 2575-210 yet.

So it's essentially the same as the OConnor dovetail? What would be the advantages? Is it less expensive?

[Greg M]

Cool. Thanks.



So it's essentially the same as the OConnor dovetail? What would be the advantages? Is it less expensive?

I'll let you know Tuesday when my OConnor arrives. I ordered the 2575-210, and just found out about ET's plate. I am sending Stephen at ET some images and I'll have the answers. It appears that the ET plate is lighter and cheaper but otherwise the very same.

[Greg M]

I received my OConnor today and the 2575-210 Plate is exactly the same as Stevens's Dovetail plate.

Order from Element Technica and save about $175

[Alexander Nikishin]

I'll definitely be ordering the Element sliding plate for my 2060, cheaper, lighter, and comes in black! :greedy: