The FCP Workflow

[Mark Allen]

I could not find a simple workflow explanation for FCP, so I thought I would write one since I'm in the midst of a RED post project right now. If anything her is incorrect - I'm sure someone will mention it.

The assumption is that one is shooting 4k since most people will want the depth of field from 4k. However, the assumption here is an HD finish since very few people will be doing film outs.


PRODUCTION...

Shoot to CF Cards
Load CF Cards into your Computer - good idea to duplicate to a back up (or two) as well.



POST-PRODUCTION...

Put away your back up drive(s) in a safe place.
On your work drive you will have for each shot an R3D file and several Quicktime movies which are lower rez versions of your R3D.

From here there are two options. Option A is to edit in your "finishing" codec - ProRes. Option B is to use the proxy Quicktimes to make your edit.

Option A:

The first step is sort of a file management bummer and I'm sure things will be better in the future, but it's worth it to have you high quality images.

A01. First thing is to Load up every clip individually in Red Alert and then save it out as a 2k TIFF. If you want to make some major adjustments to the color and look - this is a good time to do it. You're color control is best at this stage.

A02. Next you will want to load these image sequences into QTpro and then export them out as QT movies. Why did you bother going through the step of Red Alert when there is a 2k QT movie sitting right next to your R3D file? It is known that the QT references are not as high quality as your the output from Red Alert. Set 444 filtering on and then select 1920x1080 and "crop if necessary" - export away! You can keep exporting new ones while the old ones are exporting. Keep the names the same as the original files.

A03. Okay that wasn't fun - but now it's worth it because you have great images sitting in ProRes on your computer ready for editing AND finishing.

A04. But wait - you have a green screen shot and you are doing it in after effects and need the 4k full rez to make sure the details are perfect. That's fine, you still have your R3D masters. You know which file you need because you didn't change the name. You just open that R3D version of that file up - export as DPX at 4k (or TIFF - if you want the same color interpretation). Bring it into AE and do your dirty work, render it out ProRes and drop it into Final Cut.

A05. When your edit is done. you're done, take it into color, do what you like. Sountrackpro for finishing it, you know the whole Apple thing.


Okay - so what if, though, you have tons files and your project is really just not that long. Like hours of footage for a 30 second spot. Okay - well, you sound like a good candidate not to do all that translation work. So, you will use option B....


Option B:

B01. You can immediately start editing with the provided reference footage in Final Cut. It drops right in. You'll use the 1k or .5k versions.

B02. When you finish you're edit, you can make an EDL and it will tell you all the files you actually ended up using. In theory - it's many less than you had originally. At this point, you will need to create The Reference Quicktimes will actually play in Final Cut - so you can use them and begin to cut immediately. When you're finished, you can create an EDL which will tell you all the files you need.

B03. Use Red Alert to export 2k Tiff's of your needed files. If you want to make some major adjustments to the color and look - this is a good time to do it. You're color control is best at this stage.

B04. (same as A02) Next you will want to load these image sequences into QTpro and then export them out as QT movies. Why did you bother going through the step of Red Alert when there is a 2k QT movie sitting right next to your R3D file? It is known that the QT references are not as high quality as your the output from Red Alert. Set 444 filtering on and then select 1920x1080 and "crop if necessary" - export away! You can keep exporting new ones while the old ones are exporting. Keep the names the same as the original files.

B05. Media manage your FCP sequence and then replace the footage with the newly created footage. Proceed from here as usual with Color Correction and Sound.


Additional Notes (AE):

After Effects reads dpx files and 4k - so you could always do a 4k finish in After Effects. There are some color correction tools available for AE which are not so bad for the average user. With Automatic Duck, you could send your entire edit to After Effects. You could then replace your footage files either by fooling AE by simply dropping them over your "old" files or by "replace footage file". Change your comp size and you're good to go.



Note that I'm currently doing an entire greenscreen project and I will be using this last technique for my project. :ninja:

[Craig W. Bickerstaff]

I prefer Option C, Shoot 4k stick the redcode files in a quicktime wrapper via whatever does that probably RedCine or whatever it will be called.
Throw these files into final cut pro and cut the files natively.

[Mark Allen]

I prefer Option C, Shoot 4k stick the redcode files in a quicktime wrapper via whatever does that probably RedCine or whatever it will be called.
Throw these files into final cut pro and cut the files natively.



I think you're absolutely right in the future - maybe even 2 weeks from now there will be different workflows. I'm sure of it. I'd like to keep an updated Apple workflow that is always useable right this moment though. Even if an investor/producer/executive is shooting something 3 months down the line - the want to know there is a currently functioning workflow.

This workflow is meant for people who are shooting something right now or next week and need to be sure they can finish a project. There are many projects not using Red simply because the post workflow isn't clear yet. Option "C" is exactly what they're fearful of - "whatever does that probably...."

[jimhare]

Good stuff Mark. So many people are stating that there is no RED work flow. I've never understood that. It seems very clear, and you have proven it again. Everyone should read this. They can think what they want about whether each step is the right one, but they certainly can't say their isn't an established work flow.

Good job.

Jim

[jimhare]

Oh, and let us know how your green screen comes out. I've heard that it's a dream to work with using RED.

Jim

[Sanjin Jukic]

Thanks Mark.

A great FCP6/RED workflow.

[Vico Martin]

Excuse me, first post!

we are waiting our red camera on next march, we are a little bit frightened about workflow. Why Red have not a manual of the camera in the web?.

A simple quiestion for anybody: ¿If I produce a 1080p spot and use the hd-
sdi out direct link to a Blackmagin decklink MacPro 8core FCP system. I obtain at least a 1080 capture?

Excuse my english and thanks in advance

[Vico Martin]

I forgot to thank Mr. Allen the first real workflow options I reed.

[Noah Kadner]

Bravo- I fourth the thanking of Mark for starting this thread.

There's also the side trip to Scratch via Boot Camp on a PC. This is nice because it handles the auto conform step automatically which is the most time-consuming part.

What is desperately needed is a batch version of Red Alert so we can at least run a bunch of shots to TIF sequences overnight. As it is now you have to manually load each R3D. Red Cine promises to do batches but we're not sure when this will surface. Perhaps we can get some command line instructions?

-Noah

[Mark Allen]

There's also the side trip to Scratch via Boot Camp on a PC.

Scratch is not officially supported on Boot Camp - but... that doesn't mean it wouldn't work, you just wouldn't get tech support.

This is definitely an option... that would be the true Option "C."

Follow Option "B" until you get to exporting the the edl to "see what files you need" - then, instead, import the edl into scratch and finish your project there.

My questions:

Isn't Scratch relatively expensive? I can't find a price online.

Don't we think that Color will eventually support R3D? Any word on that?

[Stuart English]

Why Red have not a manual of the camera in the web?.


Its at www.red.com/support But its restricted at the moment to camera owners as there is so much change on the firmware and software builds.

[martijn76]

hi vico
from the site :
Video Preview HD-SDI and HDMI
1280×720 progressive, 4:2:2

so no 1080p im affraid.

[Irri]

Some question on this workflow:



...The assumption is that one is shooting 4k since most people will want the depth of field from 4k. However, the assumption here is an HD finish since very few people will be doing film outs...

Does shooting 2K/4K affect the DoF? Surely the lens is still focusing the same image onto the sensor.



...First thing is to Load up every clip individually in Red Alert and then save it out as a 2k TIFF. If you want to make some major adjustments to the color and look - this is a good time to do it. You're color control is best at this stage...

Are you doing a TIFF sequence step before ProRes to get a purer file to colour correct?



...Why did you bother going through the step of Red Alert when there is a 2k QT movie sitting right next to your R3D file? It is known that the QT references are not as high quality as your the output from Red Alert...

The Camera QT wrappers are different to the RedAlert ones, even with the same settings?

[Curran Giddens]

Why Red have not a manual of the camera in the web?.


The manual is now available on the web....

[David Didato]

Irri, My understanding is that 2K currently uses a smaller portion of the sensor. Red is still planning to enable what they call scaled 2K later on, which will shoot with the entire sensor.

[Irri]

Hi David

Surely that would result in the same depth of field though. You just have a "cut out" of the larger 4K image. The Len isn't being focused on to a smaller area of the sensor.

[motivitypictures]

Hi David

Surely that would result in the same depth of field though. You just have a "cut out" of the larger 4K image. The Len isn't being focused on to a smaller area of the sensor.

My feeling is the same Irri so if someone can solidify this answer that would be great. I shoot 720p...using adapters on an HVX and my DOF is as shallow as I want it to be depending on the lenses I use. I can't imagine how the resolution would impact this.

[M Most]

Hi David

Surely that would result in the same depth of field though. You just have a "cut out" of the larger 4K image. The Len isn't being focused on to a smaller area of the sensor.

Depth of field is determined by 2 things: lens length and aperture. So if you shoot the same field of view with the same lens at the same stop, what you say would be true. However... if you use the same lens and keep the camera the same distance from the subject, your field of view on the "full frame" vs. the "windowed" image will be different. So to keep the same field of view on the windowed image, you would either move the camera back or use a wider lens. If you move the camera, your DOF will remain the same. But if you use a wider lens, it won't be. Now, in most cases, you would likely not move the camera - in part because you would have to double the distance from the subject to keep the same field of view, something you often can't physically do. Not to mention that it's going to affect the image in terms of aesthetics (the distance of the camera and the lens used affect the perceived "closeness" to the subject in very noticeable ways). So the usual choice would be to go to a wider lens, thus affecting the DOF.

Does that make sense?

[Mark Allen]

I'm going to state this another way which I think might make more sense for some people - correct me if I'm wrong.

If you are in 4k mode and compose a head and shoulders shot and then switch to 2k mode without changing anything else, you are suddenly in very tight on your subject you have something like and eye mouth shot now. You have created a cut out of your original image. So, if you then widen your lens to compensate then you are effectively increasing your depth of field (a deeper focus range).

(Which, by the way, is one of the reasons if I'm ever shooting on an HVX I lean heavy on keeping the camera far from the subject and shoot in telephoto.)

[M Most]

I'm going to state this another way which I think might make more sense for some people - correct me if I'm wrong.

If you are in 4k mode and compose a head and shoulders shot and then switch to 2k mode without changing anything else, you are suddenly in very tight on your subject you have something like and eye mouth shot now. You have created a cut out of your original image. So, if you then widen your lens to compensate then you are effective decreasing your depth of field.

You were correct until you said "decreasing." If you use a wider lens, you increase depth of field - as you also do if you close the aperture (i.e., go to a higher stop, i.e., go from 2.8 to 4.0). In terms of compensations, the lens change will affect the field of view (so you might have to move the camera) and the stop change will affect the exposure (so you will likely have to adjust your lighting).

[Paris Remillard]

"Depth of field is determined by 2 things: lens length and aperture"

"If you move the camera, your DOF will remain the same."

Actually, DOF is determined by Focus Distance also. The closer you are to the object you are focusing on, the less Depth of Field you'll have. So if you move the camera back to maintain the same FOV at 16mm(windowed sensor 2k) as 35mm(4k) then the DOF will be greater in that situation as well as in changing to a wider lens to do so. So either way, to maintain the same framing on a smaller sensor or a smaller portion of the sensor, the DOF will be greater.

[M Most]

Actually, DOF is determined by Focus Distance also. The closer you are to the object you are focusing on, the less Depth of Field you'll have.

While that's basically true, it's not really something that's a determinant of the depth of field characteristic. The hyperfocal distance and the actual distances of various focal planes is still determined only by lens and stop. How "in focus" or "out of focus" any element within the frame might be is constant given a particular lens and stop combination. The front falloff and back falloff at any particular focal point is, to be sure, a bit different. But it is primarily determined by the design of the lens. Not to mention that by changing focus, you're essentially changing the focal length of the lens. So what you're saying is true in the practical sense, and what I'm saying is true in the technical sense.

[zak forrest]

I can't wait for this thread to get back on track, viva Mark Allen and thank you for posting this. What's the word on Color and R3D.

Sidenote: I have color corrected TV spots before with After Effects without Automatic Duck. I just worked from the final single movie file and used keyframes on my levels and color filters etc. It was a pain but for such few edits it worked beautifully.

Mark have you ever experienced any errors or anything with Automatic Duck?

[ChristopherKenworthy]

I can't wait for this thread to get back on track, viva Mark Allen and thank you for posting this. What's the word on Color and R3D.

Color and RD3 would be good. So would Color and the QT wrappers, but no joy.

The only way I can get Red footage to work in Color at all, is to export a sequence from Red Alert or Redcine - DPX, ProRes, whatever. It's painstaking, but it works.

I edit the QT proxies in FCP and select Send To Color. The clips just don't show in Color. So there's no simple way to send to color, grade and roundtrip - we have to export from FCP, Redalert or Redcine.

So, will the RD3s or the QTs ever work in Color? It would make life a lot easier.

[Charles Angus]

How "in focus" or "out of focus" any element within the frame might be is constant given a particular lens and stop combination. The front falloff and back falloff at any particular focal point is, to be sure, a bit different. But it is primarily determined by the design of the lens. Not to mention that by changing focus, you're essentially changing the focal length of the lens. So what you're saying is true in the practical sense, and what I'm saying is true in the technical sense.

Design of the lens does not enter into depth of field. Front falloff and back falloff define the depth of field, which is what range either side of the focal plane is acceptably sharp (small circle of confusion). Depth of field is determined by *4* things - lens focal length, aperture, subject distance, and what circle of confusion you are willing to accept.

But in any case, interesting workflow. Scratch seems to be essential for anyone shooting anything of any length, unless skilled interns abound to fulfill the tedious tasks...

[Mark Allen]

Mark have you ever experienced any errors or anything with Automatic Duck?

There have been a few oddiities, but I'm not experienced enough with it to really make any public comments because they could have been simply user error / user expectation problems.

With AE, if you're doing color correction, you should cmd-shift-D split your layers at least so that you don't have to mess with keyframes. also easier to copy/paste your effects in bulk that way.

At some point I will provide some follow up experiences in this thread which will include REDcine - right now I'm working on a few non-RED shot projects, so I've not really had a chance to explore anything.

[Mark Allen]

So, will the RD3s or the QTs ever work in Color? It would make life a lot easier.

Are you doing 4k? I don't think Color accepts 4k. I could be wrong.

[Sverker Hahn]

While that's basically true, it's not really something that's a determinant of the depth of field characteristic. The hyperfocal distance and the actual distances of various focal planes is still determined only by lens and stop. How "in focus" or "out of focus" any element within the frame might be is constant given a particular lens and stop combination. The front falloff and back falloff at any particular focal point is, to be sure, a bit different. But it is primarily determined by the design of the lens. Not to mention that by changing focus, you're essentially changing the focal length of the lens. So what you're saying is true in the practical sense, and what I'm saying is true in the technical sense.
I have learned that DOF is depending on:

a) scale
b) aperture

Example: the DOF at the scale 1:1 is 2 mm at f/11.

If this is correct, then the focal length is of no importance. When you change focal length you change the scale, and the same applies to when you change focus.

Am I totally wrong here?

/Sverker

[Charles Angus]

What does scale mean? Scale of what?

[Sverker Hahn]

What does scale mean? Scale of what?
Image size / Real size.

[ChristopherKenworthy]

Are you doing 4k? I don't think Color accepts 4k. I could be wrong.

Finishing in 2K. Distributors not interested in anything above, yet, from what I can gather. I'll shoot 4K, and if I need to do any reframing I'll go After Effects-DPX.

And if there's no simple way to get Color to take the QT's from FCP, I might just do the Redcine DPX pull list and go to Color that way. Not ideal, means I have to wait a day or so for the DPXs to render out, but at least I'm then in Color with exactly what I need.

[Anders Brandt]

Hi,
I'm new on the forum, and I'm here cause I'm seriously considering buying a RED ONE. However there is a couple of things that I haven't worked out yet in the work flow. I think I get the general idea, but when I'm done editing I do not have my Digibeta original tape to put in my archive. Have any of you considered how to archive the original material?

Kind regards

[Hans von Sonntag]

Hi,
I'm new on the forum, and I'm here cause I'm seriously considering buying a RED ONE. However there is a couple of things that I haven't worked out yet in the work flow. I think I get the general idea, but when I'm done editing I do not have my Digibeta original tape to put in my archive. Have any of you considered how to archive the original material?

Kind regards

Hi Anders,

LTO3 or LTO4 ist the way most will go. We do that for archiving projects already. IT-industry standart, very reliable and considerably long lasting.

Hans

[Mark Allen]

Hi Anders,

LTO3 or LTO4 ist the way most will go. We do that for archiving projects already. IT-industry standart, very reliable and considerably long lasting.

Hans

What is the quick headlines on that medium? We're still loading everything to SATA drives and putting that in storage because so often clients come back within the year and need something from a project.

By headline I mean:

Unit costs: _______
Cost per gig after unit purchase (i.e. tape cost per gig):_________


(SATA are about 30 cents per gig)

[Eric Maran]

I played around with the 4k R3D files this weekend and discovered that from 4K R3D to editing in quicktime took exactly 1 minute.

Popped the R3D file into RedAlert (didn't have the quicktime reference file the camera makes), clicked on Create Quicktime Reference (High) and dragged the newly created (SUPER FAST! Like 1 second to create) into Final Cut Pro.

I'm Using Final Cut Studio (not 2) and it worked like a charm.

Now my question is... once you've finished cutting your entire show, can you just export a quicktime reference file of the film that will reference the 4k footage? Or is it a matter of media managing and "onlining" the footage in whatever your finished format is?

Red would be smart to develop a way to "online" the footage in REDCine or REDAlert from a final quicktime reference movie or EDL exported from Final Cut, then immediately output a 2K or 4K DPX.

Then we could load them onto a drive, head over to Technicolor/Deluxe and color time. (Or for the DIYers, drop down to uncompressed HD or ProRes and color yourself).

I still can't believe how absolutely painless it was to go from .R3D to editing. No wonder Soderbergh, Carnahan etc are excited... BEYOND the acquisition capabilities of the camera, which we're all by now very aware of.

We're contemplating shooting a project on RED in the near future, and I'd just create an Automater script to take footage, create reference clips, sort them and drag them into Final Cut. Even easier!

Thoughts?

[ChristopherKenworthy]

I played around with the 4k R3D files this weekend and discovered that from 4K R3D to editing in quicktime took exactly 1 minute.

Popped the R3D file into RedAlert (didn't have the quicktime reference file the camera makes), clicked on Create Quicktime Reference (High) and dragged the newly created (SUPER FAST! Like 1 second to create) into Final Cut Pro.

I'm Using Final Cut Studio (not 2) and it worked like a charm.

Now my question is... once you've finished cutting your entire show, can you just export a quicktime reference file of the film that will reference the 4k footage? Or is it a matter of media managing and "onlining" the footage in whatever your finished format is?

Red would be smart to develop a way to "online" the footage in REDCine or REDAlert from a final quicktime reference movie or EDL exported from Final Cut, then immediately output a 2K or 4K DPX.

Then we could load them onto a drive, head over to Technicolor/Deluxe and color time. (Or for the DIYers, drop down to uncompressed HD or ProRes and color yourself).

I still can't believe how absolutely painless it was to go from .R3D to editing. No wonder Soderbergh, Carnahan etc are excited... BEYOND the acquisition capabilities of the camera, which we're all by now very aware of.

We're contemplating shooting a project on RED in the near future, and I'd just create an Automater script to take footage, create reference clips, sort them and drag them into Final Cut. Even easier!

Thoughts?

All that is easy, and a good solution for some projects, but not for film-out, or even a really high quality HD master (depending on who you talk to). My understanding is that the QT refs partly decode the wavelet and therefore if you edit in FCP and Export, even if you Export 2K DPX, you're not getting the same quality as you would by exporting the DPX directly from Red Alert or Red Cine. So, although you can get into FCP easily and edit easily, what's the point? Well, soon you'll be able to send a Pull List to RedCine, output the DPX frames you need... and well, it gets complicated and there are lots of threads out there about this.

What many of us would love is that ease-of-use all the way through. Load all your footage, edit away, move over to Color, back to FCP and output without losing image quality along the way. At present, we're all using workarounds. I'm sure this ease of use will come eventually.

[John Tissavary]

I played around with the 4k R3D files this weekend and discovered that from 4K R3D to editing in quicktime took exactly 1 minute.

Popped the R3D file into RedAlert (didn't have the quicktime reference file the camera makes), clicked on Create Quicktime Reference (High) and dragged the newly created (SUPER FAST! Like 1 second to create) into Final Cut Pro.

I'm Using Final Cut Studio (not 2) and it worked like a charm.

Now my question is... once you've finished cutting your entire show, can you just export a quicktime reference file of the film that will reference the 4k footage? Or is it a matter of media managing and "onlining" the footage in whatever your finished format is?

Red would be smart to develop a way to "online" the footage in REDCine or REDAlert from a final quicktime reference movie or EDL exported from Final Cut, then immediately output a 2K or 4K DPX.

Then we could load them onto a drive, head over to Technicolor/Deluxe and color time. (Or for the DIYers, drop down to uncompressed HD or ProRes and color yourself).

I still can't believe how absolutely painless it was to go from .R3D to editing. No wonder Soderbergh, Carnahan etc are excited... BEYOND the acquisition capabilities of the camera, which we're all by now very aware of.

We're contemplating shooting a project on RED in the near future, and I'd just create an Automater script to take footage, create reference clips, sort them and drag them into Final Cut. Even easier!

Thoughts?

This is possible now. For conform just generate an EDL and anyone with Scratch (including me - pm me for details) can provide conform & color services via Scratch, then send it on to Technicolor, eFilm, or whoever's doing your filmout (or tape master).

cheers,

jt

[TCurren]

My understanding is that the QT refs partly decode the wavelet and therefore if you edit in FCP and Export, even if you Export 2K DPX, you're not getting the same quality as you would by exporting the DPX directly from Red Alert or Red Cine.


In our testing this bears out. The reference QTs are very noisy and the DPX rendered out files are much cleaner.

[Benjamin Rowland]

This is possible now. For conform just generate an EDL and anyone with Scratch (including me - pm me for details) can provide conform & color services via Scratch, then send it on to Technicolor, eFilm, or whoever's doing your filmout (or tape master).

cheers,

jt

Will this be possible to do without Scratch in the near future?

[John Tissavary]

Will this be possible to do without Scratch in the near future?

You can do it manually with RedCine or RedAlert now, but there's no automated (i.e. conform) way.

It has been stated by Red that there will be improvements to the QT wrapper decode in FCP, but it is not clear whether that will equal the quality of Scratch/RedCine/RedAlert.

It is also part of the plan for RedCine to get 'pull list' features, but I haven't found official word on exactly now this pull list will work and what it will do.

So, for the time being, Scratch is the best way to: 1) get the best images from .r3d 2) manage .r3d conversions (especially on longer form projects).

Right now one alternative is to manually enter each cut into RedCine or RedAlert for file export, which might work for very short material, but would be nearly unmanageable for anything longer or with a large number of cuts.

The other way to do this is export 'selects' up front, prior to editing, then online from those. But there are two drawbacks here - 1) more stress on processing, network, & storage for longer duration 2) Doing the color correction in Scratch allows the debayer process to happen as the last step, which, as I understand it, ensures the highest quality image output.


cheers,

jt

[JoakimZiegler]

What is the quick headlines on that medium? We're still loading everything to SATA drives and putting that in storage because so often clients come back within the year and need something from a project.

By headline I mean:

Unit costs: _______
Cost per gig after unit purchase (i.e. tape cost per gig):_________


(SATA are about 30 cents per gig)

We also use LTO-4 for archiving projects. The unit cost is a bit variable, 4500 dollars should definitely get you one, there's a Tandberg LTO Ultrium 1640 on Amazon (of all places) for about that, we use a Dell SAS model which I think was slightly more expensive, but we bought it a few months ago too.

You also need to figure in the costs of a controller and a server to run it on, probably, and work out what software to use to backup/restore. Most backup software is not really suitable for the sort of thing you need for long-term project storage. We hacked up some scripts using tar on a Linux box ourselves.

As for the tapes, it seems going price is about 125 dollars per 800 GB tape right now, at least in quantities of 5 or 10. That translates to about 16 cents per gig. Beware, though, that 800 GB in this case is 800,000,000,000 bytes, which is what your filesystem would report as about 745 GiB. Standard storage disclaimer.

[Falkenberg]

I am planning to use a Pro Res HQ workflow; Convert my R3Dfiles to ProResHQ and do all my further work in that format. I will use a MacPro with a AJA IO HD.

My question is: Can I work from Firewire 800 disks?


Christer -
Film Faktisk

[Adam Levins]

A01. First thing is to Load up every clip individually in Red Alert and then save it out as a 2k TIFF. If you want to make some major adjustments to the color and look - this is a good time to do it. You're color control is best at this stage. :ninja:

Hi Mark,

This aspect interests me. As a DP one often gets time booked in for the grade after the edit. At this stage the film is in somewhat of a finished stage as far as the cut is concerned. With this work flow do the Colorist and DP need to make there decisions on the look very early on?

I guess it worries me because it seems like allot of work, at this early stage not knowing what footage will make it into the cut.

Thanks Mark for the post, very informative.

[Kwan Khan]

good info

[Tar]

I'm surprised there isn't a mention of a CineForm workflow in here. I haven't shot a RED project in a few months (which means I'm probably lights years out of the loop) but I was reading over CineForm NEO 4k and it looks pretty promising. Is it too good to be true? any drawbacks to the NEO 4k workflow vs. the ones described in this thread?

[Stephen Ruiz]

Hey guys,

I'm working on editing a feature film. I've never dealt with the RED before, and I have very, very limited knowledge of the terminology. So the first post in this thread was mostly helpful, but I'm still trying to figure it out.

1. Edit reference files in FCP.
2. Export EDL.
3. ???

What do I do?

[OneLung]

This is the workflow that seems the least complicated in terms of data wrangling, in my mind making it the most efficient. It's processor entensive on the frontend and the backend but will save you HOURS of grief during editorial.

1)Export 1920x1080 HD ProRes QT's from REDRushes at whatever resolution suites your fancy. The thing is that you shouldn't in 99% of cases edit at full res because it's overkill. I like REDRushes over FCP's import because you have more resize options and also generally with most projects I like to burn-in the TC/TOD below the letterbox as a safety measure.

2)When finished editing Export a CMX 3600 EDL and send to Monkey Extract.

3)Use Monkey Extract to export only the DPX frames needed. Use these frames to conform from in whatever system makes sense for your project. The DPX files give you the latitude you need to do real color work on your choice of systems and if you need it back in FCP just can create quicktimes from the DPX sequences and replace the media in FCP.

[Loren White]

Any advice for this situation?

The editor, edited in FCP using the Proxies. He has at times 4 layers of video. Apple Color does not like this. Do I burn these into Pro Res 422 HQ? Wouldn't that create some inconsistency between working off the r3d's and prores for final output? What should I do, knowing that I need to burn in.