When new Mac Pro's?

[Mathieu Ghekiere]

Hi,

I'm in the market for buying a new Mac Pro, but I've heard rumors about new Mac Pro's coming. Now, I know that Apple doesn't announce any upgrades, but just releases it suddenly, so I know that if someone will say what he thinks, it's in the first place an opinion and a rumor, but not a fact.
That being said...

CONSIDERING the HISTORY OF MAC PRO'S, so for anyone who has a bit of experience with Apple and releasing computers (I don't), what would be the biggest bet?
I've heard things between November and January, and I know that's probably the only thing most people know for sure, but is there someone who has some insiders information, or (considering the history) is pretty sure of a certain period?

Thanks,

[Mark Thorpe]

think the only real upgrade was from a 2.4Ghz processor to a 2.6. Apart from that I'm not so sure. Sorry if you knew that though.

[Nick Shaw]

The processor speed bump was for the Macbook Pros. New processors for the Mac Pro towers are expected soon, and there may be other improvements too.

[Gunleik Groven]

We all hope for faster bus'es (especially for RAM) better GPU's and larger Caches.

We pray for more cores and that Leopard truly treats all these cores as one huge computer (and don't limit processes that really need more power to one or two cores)

And some of us really pray that apple eventually lets many computers be seen as one from the system. Real fun clusters...

Gunleik

[Curran Giddens]

next week :matrix:

[Mathieu Ghekiere]

next week :matrix:

Serious or a joke?

(thanks for the replies, keep them coming!)

[C.H.Haskell]

Plenty of rumors floating around about apple having acquired some newer faster chips...here is an interesting one from mac rumors.

"The Inquirer reports on rumors circulating around Tokyo about Apple's interest in high end Penryn processors for their upcoming Mac Pros.

According to the rumors, Apple has "pre-booked" all the top (3.2GHz) Penryn bins for this year, leaving only "minimum quantities" for other big vendors. The 3.2GHz Penryn Xeon ("Harpertown") processors offer a faster 1600MHz bus and 12MB of L2 cache. The quad-core processors could provide Apple with an upgrade path for their current Mac Pro line which has not seen major upgrades since August of 2006. Apple did introduce the 8-core Mac Pro in April of 2007, but left the existing models untouched.

By incorporating these new processors, Apple could increase the top speed Mac Pro to 3.2GHz with a 1600MHz front side bus (up from 1333 MHz). This would not be the first time Apple would have "exclusive" use of an otherwise unreleased Intel processor. The introduction of the 8-core Mac Pro used a 3.0GHz Xeon chip that was otherwise unannounced at that time. Similarly, the Penryn Xeon processors were not expected to reach 3.2GHz based on early reports.

The new Intel Penryn Xeon processors are due in November 2007."


So there you have it. I have also been told by some folks that we should be expecting an update any day now, or perhpas next week as Giddens claims.

Good luck!

[Curran Giddens]

Serious or a joke?

(thanks for the replies, keep them coming!)

No joke. The new processors will be available starting Nov. 12. I'm hoping for at least an announcement. Not sure about shipping dates though....

http://switchtoamac.com/site/mac-pro-update-soon-with-penryn-processors-on-november-12.html

[Mathieu Ghekiere]

No joke. The new processors will be available starting Nov. 12. I'm hoping for at least an announcement. Not sure about shipping dates though....

http://switchtoamac.com/site/mac-pro-update-soon-with-penryn-processors-on-november-12.html

Thanks, I indeed read about the new processors being available, I wast just going to edit my post, but I see you already replied.

[Tim Lüdin]

Yeah new Mac Pros must be around the corner. The current normal product cycle is at the end. So I expect new towers in the next weeks. I also need a new Mac Pro for my RED.
I have a 2 year old Quad non Intel Mac.
So please Apple hurry up.

Cheers
Tim

[Dave Blackham]

Best guess either in a week or so since the Penrhyn processors are supposed to ship tommorow or the next big show which I think is January. Thats what Apple usualy do.

Anyone know for definite when the next big mac show is ?

I read a web report suggesting the quad (8 proccesor) mac should be 45% faster with Penrhyn, if it is then ts worth the wait.

[Bill Goehring]

Anyone know for definite when the next big mac show is ?


Macworld SanFrancisco January 14-18. This is their biggest show of the year.

[Curran Giddens]

I also need a new Mac Pro for my RED.
I have a 2 year old Quad non Intel Mac.
So please Apple hurry up.


My dual 2.5 G5 is 3 years old. I was having trouble booting last week after I installed Leopard and had to call AppleCare support. It turns out my AppleCare support ended 3 weeks ago. Looks like it's time for an upgrade.

[Luke Goddard]

It's always when the warranty runs out, isn't it? :glare:

I'm still surviving with my 1.8 G5 (and my trusty PBG4!), but will probably finally make the Intel transition with the new Mac Pro. Not sure whether the 8 core model is worth the $$$ over 4 core, depends how much encoding and rendering I'll need to do.

[IAN SUN]

No joke. The new processors will be available starting Nov. 12. I'm hoping for at least an announcement. Not sure about shipping dates though....

http://switchtoamac.com/site/mac-pro-update-soon-with-penryn-processors-on-november-12.html

Excellent, birthday present for me, yipee!

[Dave Blackham]

It's always when the warranty runs out, isn't it? :glare:

I'm still surviving with my 1.8 G5 (and my trusty PBG4!), but will probably finally make the Intel transition with the new Mac Pro. Not sure whether the 8 core model is worth the $$$ over 4 core, depends how much encoding and rendering I'll need to do.

Yep, Similar to me with my thoughts for rendering. I have a couple of Quad 2.66Mhz machines, I do a lot of transcoding in Compressor in HD. I have to say the spacial and temporal converts in Compressor 3.0.1 are very good. Now Compressor uses the Shake algorithms for Optical flow it is the only realistic option for doing HD to HD temporal conversions as theres no other Hardware device to do this. It takes for ever to render though. Even 30 minute DV sequence 29.97P to 25P is about 8 hours for acceptable transcodes and when using the higher statistical settings about 38 hours ! for HD media its weeks. The results are good though. If you need to use non Open GL software (which uses the GPU and you need a minimum X1900 card for the sorts of work spoken of on this forum) then a 8 Processor Mac is essential or a render farm.

[Cail Young]

http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac_Pro

This page is invaluable.

[Curran Giddens]

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/07/11/12/intel_says_mac_pro_bound_harpertown_xeons_set_spee d_records.html

[Lexicon]

My dual 2.5 G5 is 3 years old. I was having trouble booting last week after I installed Leopard and had to call AppleCare support. It turns out my AppleCare support ended 3 weeks ago. Looks like it's time for an upgrade.

Put Linux on it and use it as a secondary machine for whatever you want. That's what many owners of older PPC Macs have done. There's not much to get used to that is different from the Mac OS but you'd have to learn some things.

[Paul Hazlett]

Even if mac comes out with a new processor mac pro its achilles heel will still be the graphics card.

programs like motion are throwing more work to the graphics card which is at best 3 year old technology in the form of the ati 1900xt

[Curran Giddens]

Put Linux on it and use it as a secondary machine for whatever you want. That's what many owners of older PPC Macs have done. There's not much to get used to that is different from the Mac OS but you'd have to learn some things.

I'm a geek, but not that geeky. Not sure what I would use Linux for. I usually sell my computer when I get a new one. The longer I wait to sell it, the less $$ I will get for it.

[Jason Francois]

To hell with making them faster, make them cooler. :) My laptops and desktops are just all too hot to handle other than my little 12" powerbook. It's old, but rock-solid and cool to the touch.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

the graphics card which is at best 3 year old technology in the form of the ati 1900xt

Nah, the x1900xt is not quite 2 years old... :bleh:

But you're right. Apple needs to seriously re-think it's process of graphics card selection and frequency of upgraded offerings.

[Lexicon]

Here's an update guys, Intel has pulled the new 45nm quad core chips that were going to go into the MacPro workstations citing lack of competition from AMD and a desire to keep selling their current 65nm chips until they get all the bugs worked out in the production and design of the 45nm chips. The 45nm chips also have issues with boards on the market that should otherwise work with them due to changes having been made by Intel between the prototype/engineering samples and the production line models.

[Joe Vinson]

Yikes, I really hope that's not the case. Come Macworld in January, they really need to announce a new Mac Pro.

[Bill Goehring]

Here's an update guys, Intel has pulled the new 45nm quad core chips that were going to go into the MacPro workstations citing lack of competition from AMD and a desire to keep selling their current 65nm chips until they get all the bugs worked out in the production and design of the 45nm chips. The 45nm chips also have issues with boards on the market that should otherwise work with them due to changes having been made by Intel between the prototype/engineering samples and the production line models.

Nothing on Apple Insider or Mac Rumors. What's your source?

[Lexicon]

Yikes, I really hope that's not the case. Come Macworld in January, they really need to announce a new Mac Pro.

Well they could easily put out a high-end MacPro model (essentially what the HD editing crowd wants) with the existing high-end 45nm chips that Intel is leaving on the market but assuming the boards are different than the current ones in order to work with the 45nm chips and DDR3, it would not be cost effective for them to pay for two different boards made by Intel. The chips that are being held back would essentially be the lower/middle end of the MacPro line and the iMacs that many are likely to buy in retail and from the Apple website.

[Lexicon]

Nothing on Apple Insider or Mac Rumors. What's your source?

News broke on Wednesday from Intel themselves and it's all over the web. Apple is going to continue using the same 65nm chips they have been using since they switched to Intel since they now depend on Intel for everything and Intel has the last word on what they will or will not put into the next MacPro since they have the contract for the hardware design, making the boards, and the chips. Apple is also focusing on mobile multimedia platforms such as the successor to the iPhone which will deploy Intel's latest mobile technology and moving away from desktops which have not been performing well for them in the last few years.

[Bill Goehring]

Sheeeee--it!

[Lexicon]

Sheeeee--it!

Keep in mind this is definitely a good thing as it takes a significant amount of time to optimize video software for the new SSE4 and Apple can certainly still announce a new MacPro configuration at MacWorld in January but it will take longer for it to hit the streets if they are making a platform change to DDR3 (which would be a boon) or the existing board design is not compatible with the new CPUs. If one really wants the best Mac possible with today's CPUs, you can always buy two of the new 45nm chips that Intel is leaving on the market and see if they work in your machine though I suspect one of the Mac websites is going to do that soon.

[Bill Goehring]

Well...okay then:

she-it. ;-)

Now get to work on my fucking MacPro, Apple/Intel!

[Lexicon]

Well...okay then:

she-it. ;-)

Now get to work on my fucking MacPro, Apple/Intel!

The current 45nm Xeon/Pentium shortage is affecting more than just Apple's plans as the new 45nm production line Xeons and Pentiums out are showing serious stability issues with even Intel's own workstation and server boards that have been updated with new BIOS to give compatibility with the new chips. Add to the fact that PC makers are just now latching on to the higher-end 65nm chips as they begin to cater more to multi-media hungry family desktop users and gamers (while AMD's new chips fall flat on their faces) and Intel really has no reason to push full speed ahead with the 45nm line until all the ducks are in a row with their technology. AMD also has to release fixed Phenom processors before Intel is willing to unleash the 45nm beasts on the market otherwise there could be a bit of a disaster in terms of price stability. I'd keep an eye on the Mac tweaker websites in the coming months as I'm sure they will likely attempt to put the new 45nm Xeons (if they can get them) inside a current MacPro machine to see what happens.

[Bill Goehring]

Sounds even worse than I thought.

I'm glad I don't own any AMD stock now and was none too happy with the damage AMD did to my Intel stock over the last few years, but I do recognize the value of having AMD around to keep Intel motivated to move forward.

But this sounds like a no-win situation, both on the stock front AND the user front; ergo, once again:

Sheeeee-it!

P.S. God: Please don't let Apple abandon the creative market that kept it going on the way to consumer gadget bliss!

[Lexicon]

Sounds even worse than I thought.

I'm glad I don't own any AMD stock now and was none too happy with the damage AMD did to my Intel stock over the last few years, but I do recognize the value of having AMD around to keep Intel motivated to move forward.

But this sounds like a no-win situation, both on the stock front AND the user front; ergo, once again:

Sheeeee-it!

P.S. God: Please don't let Apple abandon the creative market that kept it going on the way to consumer gadget bliss!

Apple definitely won't abandon the creative professionals market. They are the only market for the MacPro. The iMac line is floundering despite what Apple lets on in the commercials as their products just aren't appealing to families who are the key demographic one has to reach to be successful. Since most educational software doesn't run on Macs that means they are worthless for a college student who isn't doing a creative arts major. Bootcamp isn't an option for basic users as it's too frustrating for them to setup and use. It also doesn't help that Apple pretty much has a lock on product support with the Apple stores. You're likely to get support for a Mac from either a small computer shop near the local college or the Apple Store. Best Buy doesn't even support Apple products despite selling them and prominently displaying them in their own section. According to information I squeezed from an Apple rep, the only products that have really seen serious sales lately have been the iPod and the iPhone.

[Dane Brehm]

I'd wait till after January for Macworld and see what comes out that might fit your needs better.

[Bill Goehring]

I'd wait till after January for Macworld and see what comes out that might fit your needs better.

No doubt, I'll wait. If I wind up without any other options, I'll probably just wind up getting a MacBookPro to get me through, even with all the Nvidia/ATI madness that goes along with it.

Arrgghh!

[Rob Lohman]

I'd much rather they make more modern graphics cards available with better drivers, full memory support under bootcamp (XP 32-bit) and support to run non server OS versions in a VM together with multiple input support on their monitors :)

Oh... and make some changes to QuickTime and Final Cut Pro ;)

[Lexicon]

In case anyone is interested in the flaws with the new 45nm chips, I'm trying my best to figure out what exactly is wrong with it but in my research so far it turns out that HP actually gave the 45nm chips the thumbs down earlier this year because of the current flaw with existing chipsets they use in their high-end gaming machines (I'm guessing Nvidia mostly) that Intel is just now trying to address with their own chipsets. Looks like they were heading into it thinking they could fix the chipset problems by working with the board makers before launch but that didn't seem to pan out. I'll let you know more as I learn it.

[Rainer Fritz]

I suggest don't buy the quad core Xeon at the moment. have two friends, which have big trouble with it. they got the second machine over warranty and have still hardware problems.

[Jeff Kilgroe]

In case anyone is interested in the flaws with the new 45nm chips, I'm trying my best to figure out what exactly is wrong with it but in my research so far it turns out that HP actually gave the 45nm chips the thumbs down earlier this year because of the current flaw with existing chipsets they use in their high-end gaming machines (I'm guessing Nvidia mostly) that Intel is just now trying to address with their own chipsets. Looks like they were heading into it thinking they could fix the chipset problems by working with the board makers before launch but that didn't seem to pan out. I'll let you know more as I learn it.

...And yet, HP is still selling systems with the new CPUs.

[Lexicon]

...And yet, HP is still selling systems with the new CPUs.

Those machines use the 5400 chipset which was designed specifically for the 45nm platform. The problems are all with pre-existing chipsets from Intel and others (such as the 5000 series that the MacPro is based on) that Intel initially had no problems with until they changed the CPU design. Because most of the processor sales are always going to be upgrades or new builds with what's available on the market in terms of motherboard and memory, it presents a very big problem for Intel when a very small amount of pre-existing chipsets, namely their own, are marginally functional and all but unsupported by Intel for use with these new chips. Conversely, this also means that unless Intel fixes the issues with existing chipsets, it's likely the new MacPro will have a 5400 chipset based board when all is said and done meaning the existing MacPro will be unable to handle an upgrade with the chips, forcing you to buy a new MacPro to get the benefits.