Epic Meets Leica

[Tom Lowe]

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/5473/leicaepic.jpg

:w00t: :w00t: :w00t:

One piece of advice: if you are in the market for primes and have the money, put your order in now for these Leica Summilux-C primes. Wow.

I'm gonna be shooting on these lenses all week. I will give my impressions here. My first impression = :drool:

I will ask if I'm allowed to share framegrabs.

Thanks to Jim and Jarred for helping me to be involved in this shoot.

[Justin O'Neill]

Oh wow I have been looking forward to seeing this combination! If you can post framegrabs you will make a lot of redusers very happy. ;)

[Tom Lowe]

The framegrabs will NOT disappoint. These lenses are sick.

[C.H.Haskell]

He he...and the fun begins. Yeah agreed, I would not hesitate to buy a set if I could...now Tom post something that will make me rob a bank. ;)

[Tom Lowe]

Dude, the waiting list for these lenses is gonna be a mile long when word gets out. It's already a year. Now that I have sipped from the Holy Grail, bank robbery might be the only option for me, too, Clay. ;)

[bradvr]

Those lenses are beautiful. Been a fan of Leica glass on my still cameras for years. Love that we will have more options for the Epic. Thanks for the post Tom.

[David Mullen ASC]

I'm curious as to the flare characteristics, this was the main concern about the prototypes that were shown around last year, that the coatings still needed some work.

[Tom Lowe]

Tonight, we were shining flashlights right into the lens, and it's damn near flare proof. I was extremely impressed. I'm planning lots of shots pointing straight at the sun and the moon, so I will let you know. The thing that impresses me most is how much thought has been put into every aspect of these lenses. It seems like they set out to build the perfect set of lenses from the ground up.

[David Mullen ASC]

What I like is their size for T/1.4 lenses, compared to Master Primes.

[Blair S. Paulsen]

Holy crap. My drool just fried my key..b..oar.....

[Peter Moretti]

:001_tt1: Okay, I hate you... in a good way.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Tom,

I'm glad that you are excited working with the new Leica Summilux-C lenses.

And to those of you at the forum who would like to know more about the full story behind the design of these extraordinary lenses can download and read more here:

Film & Digital TIMES Leica Report here>>> (http://www.fdtimes.com/articles/leica/Leica_Report_10-10HighRezPrint.pdf)

[Roberto Lequeux]

Epic + Leica screen grabs Tom? Hurry!

:emote_happyhappy:

[Andrew clemson]

mmm, luvverly

[Imran Farouk]

would love to own a set...but guessing they cost a damn fortune with the way they look and the images I've seen around the web...

[Sven Seynaeve]

Would like to get a set, unfortunately waiting list is that long,and I need optics sooner. if anyone would like to sell their reservation, just pm me....

[Shane Betts]

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/5473/leicaepic.jpg

This picture is like Megan Fox and Jessica Alba; naked in a spa together - only it's my next door neighbour's spa - and he hates me.

[Barry Gregg]

Do we have any information on how much these will cost?

[Rudi Herbert]

This picture is like Megan Fox and Jessica Alba; naked in a spa together - only it's my next door neighbour's spa - and he hates me.

You can still take a peep over the fence, no harm in that...

[AnthonyFlores]

Well, I'm seriously considering putting a deposit down in the next 30-60 days. I mean, it's "only" $9,000 ... and the long waiting list gives me another 12-18 months to come up with the remaining $171,000 ... LOL.

By then, we'll hopefully have the chance to put these badboys to use with the Monstro sensor.

I would love to shoot something on a mix of S35 Epic + FF35 Epic + Leicas :)

Anthony

[Tom.Wong]

Do we have any information on how much these will cost?

180k USD for what i believe to be a 8 lens set? somewhere around there. give or take a lens.

and at the moment they aren't gonna sell any sets smaller, or individual lenses. From the rep I talked to at band pro, they make a complete set all at once, and that's that for now. Hand made by several individuals, with multiple points of quality control. These aren't gonna be cranked out like canon glass. Gonna be a long wait for everybody. Whoever got their pre order spots on the top 20 are gonna be very happy people indeed.

[Peter Strietmann]

Group buy anyone? As of last week Band Pro is projecting an order to be delivered the second quarter of 2012 at a cost of $178,000 for an eight lens set, 18mm, 21mm, 25mm, 35mm, 40mm, 50mm, 75mm, and 100mm.

[Tom Lowe]

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9522/heavenn.jpg

I have died and gone to heaven.

[Solomon Nero]

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9522/heavenn.jpg

I have died and gone to heaven.


Ohhh man, I cant wait to see the results from this!! :w00t:

[Tom Lowe]

David, apparently the coatings were completely changed. I tried to get the lens to flare this morning and it was damn-near flare resistant.

[Roberto Lequeux]

Once you do see the flares (saw them with a flashlight directly at the lens in a very dim lit room), they look yummy. That little handle extender never felt more out of place. :)

Any word on grab posting permission? Tom, you would be the first to post samples of this combo... and that is a smart move. Let 'em rip! The natives are restless. :emote_happyhappy:

120fps? Or did you get a sneak preview of the timelapse features.

[AnthonyFlores]

David, apparently the coatings were completely changed. I tried to get the lens to flare this morning and it was damn-near flare resistant.

This is good to hear. Can't wait to see anything you do with these -- whether it's frame grabs, a vimeo test ... anything!

Thanks for doing this Tom :)

Anthony

[Sanjin Jukic]

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9522/heavenn.jpg

Tom,

some grabs in 5K and a footage in 1080p online ASAP from that HEAVEN.

[AnthonyFlores]

I wonder if ... from say 25mm and up ... these cover the FF35 image circle?

Given that Leica has a 21mm Summilux-M at 1.4 -- it's possible that even the 21mm does .... any way for someone to confirm this?

Would be quite awesome news if they did ...... :cheers2:

Anthony

[Nikolay Spasov]

The Leicas can cover 34mm.
It is not a problem with the Epic.

[Roberto Lequeux]

They gave all the Leicas the same exact image circle. Not big enough for FF35, but huge.

[Seth Emmons]

This is good to hear. Can't wait to see anything you do with these -- whether it's frame grabs, a vimeo test ... anything!

Thanks for doing this Tom :)

Anthony

The footage that Tom is currently shooting, as well as footage shot last week in New York by Harris Savides, ASC will be screened in the Band Pro booth at NAB (#C10308). We're exploring the option of having a larger, proper screening in Los Angeles sometime in May or June (maybe around Cine Gear) if there are enough folks interested.

Seth Emmons
Band Pro Film & Digital, Inc.
www.bandpro.com (http://www.bandpro.com)

[Sanjin Jukic]

The footage that Tom is currently shooting, as well as footage shot last week in New York by Harris Savides, ASC will be screened in the Band Pro booth at NAB (#C10308). We're exploring the option of having a larger, proper screening in Los Angeles sometime in May or June (maybe around Cine Gear) if there are enough folks interested.

Seth Emmons
Band Pro Film & Digital, Inc.
www.bandpro.com (http://www.bandpro.com)

Hi Seth,

I have a question: On which camera system Harris Savides, ASC is shooting with Leica SC lenses?

[Seth Emmons]

Hi Seth,

I have a question: On which camera system Harris Savides, ASC is shooting with Leica SC lenses?

Hi Sanjin,
Harris shot with the Alexa recording to Codex. And in addition to Tom's Epic material currently being captured, we'll also show footage taken with the Sony F35. However, the intention is not to compare camera performance as much as to show lens performance utilizing the current top digital cinema cameras.

Seth Emmons
Band Pro Film & Digital, Inc.
www.bandpro.com (http://www.bandpro.com)

[Sanjin Jukic]

Hi Sanjin,
Harris shot with the Alexa recording to Codex. And in addition to Tom's Epic material currently being captured, we'll also show footage taken with the Sony F35. However, the intention is not to compare camera performance as much as to show lens performance utilizing the current top digital cinema cameras.

Seth Emmons
Band Pro Film & Digital, Inc.
www.bandpro.com (http://www.bandpro.com)

Seth,

thanks for reply!!!

[Roberto Lequeux]

We're exploring the option of having a larger, proper screening in Los Angeles sometime in May or June (maybe around Cine Gear) if there are enough folks interested.

Sign me up Seth!

[AnthonyFlores]

Sign me up Seth!

+1 ... I will be there. Hopefully there will be a Reducation right around that time in LA so I can kill 3 birds with one stone -- CineGear, this Leica Demo and Reducation.

Thanks!

Anthony

[Tom Lowe]

Now if the weather would just cooperate... arrr!

[Lee Saxon]

My problem with $25,000 lenses is diminishing returns.

[Tom Lowe]

Okay, here's the first framegrab from the Leica 75mm Summilux-C on the Epic. Shot at T3, 5K full sensor, 5:1 compression this morning near Mt. Whtiney.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/7411/leicaepicmoon5k2560.jpg

Larger image link: http://img856.imageshack.us/i/leicaepicmoon5k2560.jpg/

These lenses are absolutely insane. The sweet spot is from T2 - T5.6, but they are scary sharp wide open.

I want to say a huge thank you to Jeff Cree and Randy Wedick at BandPro. It was great hanging out with them!

Edit: Here is a 5K tiff: http://timescapes.org/LeicaEpicMoon5K.tif

[randywedick]

Here are some pics from yesterday's shoot of this wicked combo.

Shot on a FGV modified PL mount Canon 7D with a 21mm Summilux-C @ T/1.4. 320 ASA, Adobe RGB 1998 color space.

Thank you to Clairmont Camera for the LMB-5 & the NDIR filters (pictured on the Epic)!

These lenses are ahead of their time.

More to come.

Enjoy,

Randy Wedick
Technical Consultant
Band Pro Film & Digital

PS Lee, if it makes you feel any better, the lenses were designed to work with a sensor in the range of 32-128 megapixels, so they might be useful for longer than you imagine.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Amazing picture Tom!!!

Those Leica lenses will really make Epic as an EPIC!!!

Also other Leica lenses can be used like a vintage Leica R.

Unfortunately Leica M NOT that are excellent stil photo lenses also pretty lightweight and small...btw, RED MX can have it...

It's all about a famous photographic Leica Look that Panavision was selling to us for decades with Primos.

Now a dream comes true.

Leica has finally its own cine prime set.

To be honest that I was expecting about four years ago that Jim could jump in partly financing of development for Leica Summilux-C lens set.

But RED went to make their own lenses but now we all realized that they are a bit heavy for Epic.

Also with some other things that I was suggested before actually the main thing is that RED never took me serious.

[Roberto Lequeux]

Sharp corners, eh? :-)

[Tom Lowe]

Sanjin, you have always carried the banner for Leica, and now I understand why! :w00t: :cheers2:

[Sanjin Jukic]

Tom,

I'm glad that you've finally got it!!!! :cheers2: :beer: :thumbsup:

[Roberto Lequeux]

That is one MOFO of an unforgiving subject Tom. Thanks for posting the hard stuff first!

Great shot BTW, as usual.

Forgive me for taking the liberty, but here is a mildly sharpened 1:1 crop.
It is the bottom left corner of that 2.5k JPG, once again saved as a JPG.

Being shot on 5k M-X, this goes BEYOND the S35 area of the image circle!

http://www.crowinglakes.com/DELETE/leicaepicmoon5k2560_corner.jpg

SJ should get a small life-time discount on all Leica products. :)

[Tom Lowe]

BTW, the 75mm is the softest of the set, I think. ;)

[Roberto Lequeux]

From my short impressions, I would strongly agree. The 21mm and 35mm seemed significantly sharper. Though we didn't pull back the chart projector far enough to my liking.

But it still seemed like the wides were sharper, insane-sharp, clearly needing more than 200 lines at the corners of S35 to properly gauge their resolving power, wide open!

I can't wait to see that 18mm!! thanks again for posting that grab Tom. Goes without saying that we want to see MOAR! (please) :thumbup1:

[albert rudnicki]

Sanjin, you have always carried the banner for Leica, and now I understand why! :w00t: :cheers2:

yap
I am not always in tune with Sanjin, but this one goes to him:cheers2:

[Sanjin Jukic]

yap
I am not always in tune with Sanjin, but this one goes to him:cheers2:

Albert,

let's tune it :cheers2:

[Tom Lowe]

The day I have to give these Summilux lenses back to BandPro is going to be a SAD, SAD day!!! :crying:

I am in love with these lenses. I never bought into the idea that you need really expensive lenses to get great shots, but with the massive resolution of the Epic, it's becoming more and more important.

Epic + Leica Summilux-C is going to be the deadly combo that every DP wants. Right now I am in 100% shooting mode, but once I give the lenses back, I will have time to sit down and post about them some more.

[Zakaree Sandberg]

Tom you do really pretty landscape and skyscape work. Will you be doing any shots of people? or are there others out there with the leica glass shooting footage for the demo?

[Sanjin Jukic]

Tom you do really pretty landscape and skyscape work. Will you be doing any shots of people? or are there others out there with the leica glass shooting footage for the demo?

Here is one report related to shooting people on Alexa with Leica SC primes:

Leica/Harris Savides, ASC - Test Shoot >>>> (http://www.facebook.com/album.php?fbid=190785074290607&id=124383994264049&aid=35421)

[Tom Lowe]

Yes, Harris Savides, ASC shot all the people stuff, in New York, I think.

[AnthonyFlores]

Tom you do really pretty landscape and skyscape work. Will you be doing any shots of people? or are there others out there with the leica glass shooting footage for the demo?

Hey Zak ... If you look on Tonaci's Epic-M thread, it appears as though he's getting a set to test for one of his shorts. (Correct me if I'm wrong, Tonaci!) And it definitely involves very high quality acting talent from big features.

So I think you'll be seeing the Epic + Leica combo on people very soon :)

Anthony

[James Brundige]

The day I have to give these Summilux lenses back to BandPro is going to be a SAD, SAD day!!! :crying:

I am in love with these lenses. I never bought into the idea that you need really expensive lenses to get great shots, but with the massive resolution of the Epic, it's becoming more and more important.

Epic + Leica Summilux-C is going to be the deadly combo that every DP wants. Right now I am in 100% shooting mode, but once I give the lenses back, I will have time to sit down and post about them some more.

Tom, you are almost as much a tease as Jannard, except we can afford the gear he gets us excited about.

[Shane Betts]

Hi Sanjin,
Harris shot with the Alexa recording to Codex. And in addition to Tom's Epic material currently being captured, we'll also show footage taken with the Sony F35. However, the intention is not to compare camera performance as much as to show lens performance utilizing the current top digital cinema cameras.

Seth Emmons
Band Pro Film & Digital, Inc.
www.bandpro.com (http://www.bandpro.com)

I'll certainly be dropping in to have a look at NAB but I have to say it would make much more sense if there were a range of images shot with the same camera, rather than a variance. We all know Alexa skin tones are different to Epic. Having changed cameras might muddy the waters a little IMHO.

[Seth Emmons]

I'll certainly be dropping in to have a look at NAB but I have to say it would make much more sense if there were a range of images shot with the same camera, rather than a variance. We all know Alexa skin tones are different to Epic. Having changed cameras might muddy the waters a little IMHO.

Don't worry Shane, this is just the beginning. We'll be shooting more, and others have been shooting with them as well.

For example, the Summilux-C lenses were also used in parts of the Single Chip Camera Evaluation, sponsored by Zacuto and executed by a shadowy organization calling themselves The Image Quality Geeks. Footage will be screened at NAB. Cameras used (with Leicas) include F3, F35, Alexa and Weisscam; however, the lenses were used predominately for charts and graphs. Zooms were the predominate lenses of choice so they could adjust focal length and match viewing angle for the range of sensor sizes being tested. Not sure what all will be included in the presentation though. Our level of involvement was providing gear. More info on the screening here: http://bit.ly/gucHrr

Here's a BTS shot from the SCCE. http://bit.ly/dYuF3u

[Kian Marandi]

Forgive my lack of knowledge...

I am trying to learn as much as I can about lenses. What aspects of that mountain/moon shot indicate the higher quality of the lens? What is it that the Leica is able to do, that a lesser lens may not? My eyes are not trained to see the advantages yet.

[Tonaci Tran]

Nothing terribly exciting (random shots inside warehouse) but here are some Epic + Leica stills. I agree with Tom..these are the dream lenses.
http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?56242-Tonaci-Tran&p=744456&viewfull=1#post744456

[AnthonyFlores]

Forgive my lack of knowledge...

I am trying to learn as much as I can about lenses. What aspects of that mountain/moon shot indicate the higher quality of the lens? What is it that the Leica is able to do, that a lesser lens may not? My eyes are not trained to see the advantages yet.

Hi Klan,

I'm FAR from an expert on this, especially relative to others here, but there are quite a few things that separate top lenses from others -- including ...

- Sharpness
- Color rendition
- Contrast/Micro-contrast
- Performance across all aperture settings
- Quality/beauty of bokeh
- Lack of chromatic aberration and other distortions

Also, there is something often referred to as "character" which is more subjective.

What everyone is freaking out about these Leicas is basically they win on every single criteria.

Historically, Leica has made the very best still lenses and this is not just an opinion -- I've seen
review after review from reputable experts about the exceptional performance of Leica M glass,
their R line, and recently their S line is believed to be the very best MF glass in the world.

Now, with the Leica Summilux-C's you get flawless quality across the board -- potentially beyond
what madePanavision lens performance legendary (Leica made the glass in Primos) ... you get the
incredible wide open performance Leica has always been known for ... and you get the "3D-like"
character people often praise Leica for.

And on top of all that, they are smaller than high-end Cine lenses like the Master Primes, they are
light, and they are the same size across all the focal lengths, making them easier to work with in
many ways.

Film making is many art forms rolled into one -- with photography obviously being a big part of it.
And just as lenses always make a big difference in the subtle quality and beauty of photography,
they also make quite a difference to DP's and directors expressing their vision on the screen.

Sorry to be rambling, I'm sure others can do a better job of explaining why Leica lenses are
technically superior -- but I just wanted to make sure you got at least a basic answer so you could
understand why all of us are freaking out.

Anthony

[Kian Marandi]

Hi Klan,

I'm FAR from an expert on this, especially relative to others here, but there are quite a few things that separate top lenses from others -- including ...

...

Anthony

Thanks Anthony for that post. Appreciate it.

As an example, what would have been/looked different in that shot of the mountain range had it been taken with a lower quality lens?

Is there something in that picture that popped out at you and you thought, "wow, those ____ looked so _____" ? =)

[Kian Marandi]

Just saw this picture, and I laughed a bit.

Overkill?

http://www.fdtimes.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Mike_Curtis_Leica50mmDSC0791_1080.jpg

How many Sony NEX-5's could you buy for the cost of that one lens? hehe...

[Brian Broz]

Does anyone know the book rental rate is on these lenses?
Curious what the approximate return on investment could be (seemingly the early adopters are more likely to benefit).
As RPP or Zeiss Compact Primes are around $400/day I'm assuming these are in the area of $2000/day or more (?)

Many thanks,

Brian Broz
DIT Underworld 4 3D

[Lee Saxon]

Zeiss Compact Primes are around $400/day

Why?!

They're $137/day (at most) at lensrentals.com.

[Lee Saxon]

Just saw this picture, and I laughed a bit.

Overkill?

http://www.fdtimes.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Mike_Curtis_Leica50mmDSC0791_1080.jpg

How many Sony NEX-5's could you buy for the cost of that one lens? hehe...

To say nothing of breaking your NEX-5 in half if you let go of the lens!

Hilarious.

[AnthonyFlores]

Does anyone know the book rental rate is on these lenses?
Curious what the approximate return on investment could be (seemingly the early adopters are more likely to benefit).
As RPP or Zeiss Compact Primes are around $400/day I'm assuming these are in the area of $2000/day or more (?)

Many thanks,

Brian Broz
DIT Underworld 4 3D

Hey Brian,

Well, given that their retail price per lens is pretty much on par with Master Primes ... I would expect a somewhat similar price. The only
wild card is demand could be higher because of the buzz, and also supply much more scarce than MP's or Cookes.

Given that, with Master Primes often going for around $1200-1500 per day (set of 5) ... you would expect to pay around $2000 for the full
set of 8 Leicas.

The more I think about it, however, the early buyers will probably charge a premium to get faster ROI before more sets hit the market. So
could be easily be $2500 per day.

Too much higher and it probably start to get ridiculous ...

Not sure if BandPro rents, but Otto Nemenz in LA will (from what I hear) and they are probably one of the few that will have matched
sets for rental this year. Here's their info:

Otto Nemenz Los Angeles (http://www.ottonemenz.com/Contact.html) >>>

(that's my best attempt at a Sanjin-esqe link!)

Btw, what lenses are being used in UW4 (if you can say, of course) ... ?

Thanks,

Anthony

[Erich Roland]

Aparently Otto gets the first 25 sets, so they will tie up all rentals for sometime as these sets are hand made and will roll out slowly. Ive heard from sales dept at Band Pro that if you put in an order today you wouldn't see the lenses for at least a year if not longer. Plus they began taking pre-orders almost a year ago so many other rental operations have put in orders behind Otto's 25 sets, so possibly its a year and a half back ordered by now or more. But maybe if they get enough orders Leica will hire more hands to grind and assemble.

Its the perfect lens set.... but that's a lot of cash!

Anybody want to go in on a set? contact me, ideally east coast US

[AnthonyFlores]

Hey Tom, I hope the weather is cooperating and you can shoot something fantastic. Really can't wait to see more of what you can do with the best camera and lenses in the world :)

Anthony

[Tom Lowe]

Weather has been very difficult all week! It's been the worst weather for filming since last April. BUT... we've been working really hard and driving all over the state to get some good stuff. Shooting on these lenses, with the Epic, is such a dream. It's going to be difficult to give them back to BandPro today!

Soon I will have some time to post more sample images from the lenses, and some behind-the-scenes photos from our shoot this week.

I want to thank BandPro again for putting their trust in me this week.

We drove all the way to Mono Lake yesterday. It was beautiful up there...

http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/6073/leicamono.jpg

[Jarred Land]

It's going to be difficult to give them back to BandPro today!

Dont forget to drop off my Lucky as well... I miss her :)

[Roberto Lequeux]

Tom, no more evil BTS shots of that 18mm untill you post a grab please. :)


Thanks Anthony for that post. Appreciate it.

As an example, what would have been/looked different in that shot of the mountain range had it been taken with a lower quality lens?

Is there something in that picture that popped out at you and you thought, "wow, those ____ looked so _____" ? =)

I am not a lens connoisseur either, or a DP, but the easy one would be CA, lack thereof. Most lenses shooting at T3 would have been plagued with CA on all the abrupt dark-to-bright edges, so pretty much the entire face of the mountain with dark trees and bight snow would have needed some post clean-up. But good lenses, and there are many, wouldn't have had that much of a problem with CA. These however, didn't introduce any noticeable CA, and wouldn't have done so wide open either which is wild. If you try to compare how well these perform wide open --at T.1.4-- then not only are they beyond comparison for those lenses that aren't as fast, but also will probably best all others in terms of how clean of an image you will get, other than perhaps MPs that will be close or right up there with them. All of this of course only based on what I saw and others are reporting thus far... but, all things considered these are most likely going to be the best all-around cine primes. A little pricier than MPs, but also a heckuvalot smaller and lighter, and probably even cleaner and sharper despite how incredible/unnecessary that sounds. 0.0002

[Sanjin Jukic]

It's really a pity that EPIC can't get Leica-M flange focal distance of 27.95mm for installing Leica-M bayonet mount.

Why?

Because it would be a killer photographer/cinematographer camera combo that could offer the smallest 5K digital cine camera together with the smallest and best FF35mm manual focus still lenses.

Btw. with Noctilux on Epic in low and available light you would't need HDRx...

But to repeat again that RED didn't listen to me...

http://www.imx.nl/photo/leica/lenses/lenses/page57_files/page57_6.jpeg
MTF Summilux-M ASPH at 1.4,

Read More>>> (http://www.imx.nl/photo/leica/lenses/lenses/page57.html)

[Tom Lowe]

Wide open, at T1.4, these lenses are only 10% off maximum resolution, I've been told.

I'd love to shoot a resolution test against 65mm 5-perf using an Epic and these Leicas.

[chuck colburn]

Yeah it would be nice to see the Zeiss M mount 15mm lens on a RED. Probally the greatest wide ever made.

[Sanjin Jukic]

Yeah it would be nice to see the Zeiss M mount 15mm lens on a RED. Probally the greatest wide ever made.

Chuck,

that's for sure. I tried it once in the shop but on RED1 or any other s35mm sized sensor would vignette.

I had Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 that is even much slower than Zeiss M 15mm f/2.8 and it was vignetting on RED1.

Have a look at the picture and a short test clip below.

Maybe Leica Summilux-M 24mm f/1.4 ASPH it could be the last wide lens that would not vignette at s35mms sensors.

The main reason I didn't try out that lens on my RED1 before is that the lens is still not available to buy just because Leica is too busy almost two years

to finish project of Summilux cine primes and they can't make so much of still lenses at the moment...

That's why stocks of Leica still glass are almost empty and vintage Leica glass have got the highest prices ever...

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/Voigthleander15mmHelier2.jpg
Shot handheld on RED1 with Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 @ wide open @ f/5.6 (vignetting of the lens is pretty much obvious).

A short test clip with Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 on RED1>>>> (http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/Voigthleander15mmHelier2.mov)

[spaulgal]

I'm looking forward to using my Leica R's again -- on an Epic.
Was considering selling, but have just re-considered.

[Sanjin Jukic]

I'm looking forward to using my Leica R's again -- on an Epic.
Was considering selling, but have just re-considered.

Me too.

And today I just bought Leica Vario-Elmar-R 21-35 f/3.5-4.0 Asph a small light-weigh zoom.

Awesome!!!

[spaulgal]

I have my eye on that lens too. It will cover a gap I have in my prime set.

How will you mount to your Epic?

[AnthonyFlores]

I have my eye on that lens too. It will cover a gap I have in my prime set.

How will you mount to your Epic?

Easy. With the Canon mount for Epic, and then attach the lens using the Leica R-to-Canon adaptor from someone like Leitax, Fotodiox, or Novoflex :)

Here's a link for reference:

http://www.pebbleplace.com/Personal/Leica_db.html

Anthony

[spaulgal]

Yeah I use Novoflex adaptors now to mount to Canon cameras. But I was wondering if there is another preferred method for Epic, A-mount for example.
If its all the same I'll stick to the Canon mount.

[Kian Marandi]

I am not a lens connoisseur either, or a DP, but the easy one would be CA, lack thereof. Most lenses shooting at T3 would have been plagued with CA on all the abrupt dark-to-bright edges, so pretty much the entire face of the mountain with dark trees and bight snow would have needed some post clean-up.

...

0.0002

Thanks for that Roberto! Now I know a bit more... :)

[Tom Lowe]

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/2350/mobiusperson.jpg

Ah, isn't this lovely... I'm going through my footage right now and just realized that this person (in the photo above) was standing in most of my best takes from the Mt Whitney sunrise the other day. From where I was operating, on the left-hand side of the camera, I could not see this person, as she was hidden behind that rock!... ha.

Luckily, she stepped out of frame several times during the best light. :)

[Jonathan Stevenson]

Ah, isn't this lovely... I'm going through my footage right now and just realized that this person (in the photo above) was standing in most of my best takes from the Mt Whitney sunrise the other day. From where I was operating, on the left-hand side of the camera, I could not see this person!... ha.

Luckily, she stepped out of frame several times during the best light. :)

Rotobrush? haha

[Tom Lowe]

I have plenty of takes without her in the frame. I just thought it was funny.

[Michael Schrengohst]

Those damn people!!!

[Tom Lowe]

There were literally about 35 people at the arch that morning! Ridiculous! Luckily, we were the first ones there, so I was able to set up my slider and Epic and stake out the best vantage point. ;)

[Pawel Achtel]

There were literally about 35 people at the arch that morning! Ridiculous! Luckily, we were the first ones there, so I was able to set up my slider and Epic and stake out the best vantage point. ;)

You should come to Tasmania, Tom :)

I can feel for you. Have you managed to get ANY wide angle landscape shots without human made structures, cars, airplanes or people in the shot over night time? I find it difficult even in Australia...On coutless of occassions I need to go frame by frame and remove them.

[Daniel Reichenbach]

Okay, here's the first framegrab from the Leica 75mm Summilux-C on the Epic. Shot at T3, 5K full sensor, 5:1 compression this morning near Mt. Whtiney.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/7411/leicaepicmoon5k2560.jpg

Larger image link: http://img856.imageshack.us/i/leicaepicmoon5k2560.jpg/

These lenses are absolutely insane. The sweet spot is from T2 - T5.6, but they are scary sharp wide open.

I want to say a huge thank you to Jeff Cree and Randy Wedick at BandPro. It was great hanging out with them!

Edit: Here is a 5K tiff: http://timescapes.org/LeicaEpicMoon5K.tif

This picture is very soft, I would say: out of focus (5k TIF). Did you missed the sweet spot, Tom? If this is the quality out of a LEICA lenses, I'm absolutely happy with my REDs ;-)

[KETCH ROSSi]

Nice shots Tom, good to see you have fun with the Leica's however the fact of the 75mm my most used Focal, is a bit of a concern, and for this I absolutely love the Master Primes.

But we'll give serious consideration to the Leica's...

[JD Holloway]

must buy lottery ticket...

[Roberto Lequeux]

Remember that this is a JPG. And I am pretty sure Tom likes to leave samples un-sharpened so we can judge for ourselves, same goes for RED, nice and smooth un-sharpened images that allow you to bring where you want them to be. We all love that. But don't forget to make sure to apply a gentle dose of sharpening before making up your mind entirely. These types of images leap forward with a touch of sharpening. I added 65 points (out of 500) of unsharpening at one pixel wide in PS (I took the liberty here --it is a JPG (http://www.crowinglakes.com/DELETE/leicaepicmoon5k2560_sharpened.jpg)). Also, I may be wrong about this, but being that this had to be at infinity (shot at T3) with the tree-covered mountain WAY closer than the bare mountain in the back, and a touch closer than the moon... :) wouldn't there be a very slight touch of a softer focus on in the foreground? I know infinity means all objects after a certain distance are in focus, but "in focus" is a subjective term after all, which really means "acceptably in focus". I'd like to know more about this.

All that aside... I was wondering, why would Leica let the 75mm be noticeably softer than the rest? I think it might be plenty sharp for me, especially for what I would use it for, mostly close ups. But why not sharper? There should be no compromise on a no-compromise set. And those times when 75mm is the right choice will present themselves; Tom's shot used as a POV for example. I am not saying lens design is easy, but if they can do all that other magic stuffs, then I could only assume they can pull that off as well. Is it that they expected the lens to be used for CUs and thought, hey, people will like their CUs like this anyway? 'Cause that makes no sense, and I wouldn't think Leica would accept it that way... And finally, could this be a coating? Chances are they applied all the coating magic they had already, so it would most likely be an optical design change that would be needed, right? And one more thought... are these FINAL final? Did Otto Nemenz get any of their sets yet (which we all guess are the first production sets)?

[Sanjin Jukic]

Leica Summilux-C Prime Set:

The most advanced Prime Lens EVER!
The first sets will be found ONLY at Otto Nemenz.
Each lens's focus rotation, marks, weight and size are virtually identical.
This makes lens changes and rembering the "feel" of the lens that much easier.
Add a Titanium lens mount with the built-in net holder and you a have a lens unlike any other in the world.


http://www.ottonemenz.com/

Also below are some of the shots with Leica lenses I took yesterday just walking and shooting video with one of the most advanced handheld cameras today...

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/russian_girl_01.jpg
Russian girl in Vienna.

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/korean_girl.jpg
South Korean Superstar girl in Vienna.

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/blondie.jpg
British girl in Vienna.

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/3girls_Leica_VarioElmar21-35mm_01.jpg
Three Italian girls in Vienna.

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/brunette.jpg
French girl in Vienna.

Have more girls from yesterday but that's enough for this time.

All the images were taken from the movie/video files.

[Roberto Lequeux]

You are right SJ, it is a bit cheaper for me to call. :) I did:

No production sets delivered yet. Leica is still adding to the mountain of quality.

From what I was told it seems they are working closely with Leica, giving them feedback, sending lenses back, getting new samples... exactly what we want to hear. Some sets have already been sent out on actual jobs to get the sort of feedback you can only get that way, so on, so forth. It seems everyone involved is very much on the right track --unwilling to compromise.

So, I am hereby offering to take anyone's bet. I say the production 75mm will match in resolving power. PM me for details on how to fork over your money. :)

SJ, your paparazzo-style shots of random girls make me worry you will get slapped and drop your Leicas. :) Please be careful.

[Tom Lowe]

This picture is very soft, I would say: out of focus (5k TIF).

Are you looking at it 1:1 pixel? Remember, this is a Bayer-pattern camera. It's going to look "soft" to you, just like a Canon or Nikon RAW frame would at 1:1. You need to downsample a Bayer image by at least 25% before it's going to look sharp.

I don't have any more Epic framegrabs on my PC here right now (files are at LightIron), but here is an astro-timelapse framegrab from a PL-converted Canon 1D4 on the Leica 18mm:

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/4417/leica1d418mm.jpg

This was shot at T3.2 in 70mph winds. :hand: What amazed me was the lack of distortion at the edges.

Here is a larger version of that wind turbine shot: http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/4417/leica1d418mm.jpg

BTW, I have been at LightIron for the past two days grading these Leica shots. Michael treated me like a king, and the colorist there, Ian, is awesome. Below are some iphone shots I took while we were grading. The final shots will be at the BandPro booth at NAB (possibly on a 4K monitor), and a few of them will be in the Red 4K reel, for closer inspection. ;)

http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/7021/leica2.jpg

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/4837/leica1.jpg

[Roberto Lequeux]

Are you looking at it 1:1 pixel? Remember, this is a Bayer-pattern camera. It's going to look "soft" to you, just like a Canon or Nikon RAW frame would at 1:1. You need to downsample a Bayer image by at least 25% before it's going to look sharp.

Am I missing something? Did you post a 5k TIFF somewhere?

Edit: Ohhh... I didn't see that you added it to that post. Thanks!


Edit: Here is a 5K tiff: http://timescapes.org/LeicaEpicMoon5K.tif

I'll have an other pixel-peeing go at it if you don't mind Tom. Thanks for providing such a beautiful shot to analyze. Very generous of you.

Here is an other off the 5k TIFF, downscaled by 50% to 2.5k and saved as a TIFF (http://www.crowinglakes.com/DELETE/corner_75mm_leica.tif). I sharpened at two levels, at 5k then again at 2.5k, which I feel gives you a bit smoother results. But in the rush I did push it a bit much, so here it already begins to show the "evil" sharpening edge on the bright edge moon against the sky, though that is just about the easiest sort of thing where you'll notice sharpening edges.

How about a 5k TIFF of the 18mm and 21mm Tom? :greedy smile:

[Daniel Reichenbach]

Are you looking at it 1:1 pixel? Remember, this is a Bayer-pattern camera. It's going to look "soft" to you, just like a Canon or Nikon RAW frame would at 1:1.


Agree, this turbines are REALY in focus, amazing, great work Tom ;-)

[Tom Lowe]

With these kinds of resolutions (Epic + Leica) a 5-inch monitor is not enough to really nail focus, IMHO. Especially not for a noobie like me. ;)

[KETCH ROSSi]

With these kinds of resolutions (Epic + Leica) a 5-inch monitor is not enough to really nail focus, IMHO. Especially not for a noobie like me. ;)

No worries Tom, you are not alone, focusing at 5K on a S35 Sensor 30x15, on a Master Prime at T*1.3 with girls moving all over is not easy either... ;)

Love your work, keep them coming...

[Sanjin Jukic]

Y

SJ, your paparazzo-style shots of random girls make me worry you will get slapped and drop your Leicas. :) Please be careful.

Roberto,

Last year early in winter I have been attacked by some of younger night clubbing funs stoned and drunken when then they also were damaged a bit the front ring of my Leica Summilux-R 50mm on 7D here in Vienna city center ...

Later then I was sold that lens...

Paparazzo-style shots it's not so easy to do and when you try to make it becomes almost a sort of hard struggle to get right shot...

[Jon Fauer, ASC]

Hi David -- the coatings are new and I think you'll be impressed -- I was. You may have seen these framegrabs of Leica Summilux C on an FGV 7D PL and report, but if not: http://www.fdtimes.com/news/band-pro/leica-summilux-c-in-ny/

I'm looking forward to seeing Tom's tests, and all the others, at NAB.

[Tom Lowe]

The footage I shot for BandPro and Leica is being played at NAB on a 103" plasma at the BandPro booth, as well as footage from Harris Savides and Randy Wedick. They also have the new lenses there if you want to check them out. :)

[Christian Munoz D]

The footage I shot for BandPro and Leica is being played at NAB on a 103" plasma at the BandPro booth, as well as footage from Harris Savides and Randy Wedick. They also have the new lenses there if you want to check them out. :)

Any chance to see 1080 footage online...after NAB?

[Mike McEntire]

The footage I shot for BandPro and Leica is being played at NAB on a 103" plasma at the BandPro booth, as well as footage from Harris Savides and Randy Wedick. They also have the new lenses there if you want to check them out. :)

That stuff you shot was awesome. I got to see all of the stuff Band Pro was showing. Have to say that your stuff smoked the other offerings. Nice work.

[Roberto Lequeux]

Is there a chance that the full line could be expanded shortly after its release, with a 28mm T1.4 Leica prime? I am very serious about this request.

But since I am asking, perhaps later on, could there be a matching 24-290mm T2.8 Leica zoom, at about 300mm in length and weighing in at around 15lbs? :emote_happyhappy: Sounds impossible, but leave it to Leica to do it one day. If mathematically attainable, that would be the most incredible lens, ever. The barrel alone would be a world wonder. But I'd take a little longer and a little heavier with a big fat whooping smile.

Where is that cigar smoking photographer? Jannard, sir, I am so happy to hear about Red, Leica and BandPro. It sounds like a very strong move in the perfect direction. :sifone:

This is a great announcement. Perhaps the biggest yesterday; along of course with the Red 4k projector which will also have a major impact on distribution, and therefore acquisition. EDIT: Seems like the projector from Red is for home use. Well, it still makes 4k acquisition stronger, perhaps even more so! I would have preferred 4k at the theater and 2k/1080p at home, but that's just me.

Yesterday was a very good day.

[Tom Lowe]

Any chance to see 1080 footage online...after NAB?

Yeah, let me see what I can do.

[Tom Lowe]

Here is the footage I shot on the Leica Summilux-C lenses for BandPro on the Epic M: http://vimeo.com/22868788

[Jonathan Stevenson]

Amazing. I had no idea Epics were enabled for time lapse yet. Great work as always, Tom. Peering through the crap-pression that is Vimeo, those lenses look insanely sharp.

[Raphael Varandas]

Here is the footage I shot on the Leica Summilux-C lenses for BandPro on the Epic M: http://vimeo.com/22868788

HI Tom...I saw it at BandPRo Booth and right now @ BAndPro Vimeo...
Congrats matte.
Impressive work...
Cheers from Brazil

[Tom Lowe]

Amazing. I had no idea Epics were enabled for time lapse yet. Great work as always, Tom. Peering through the crap-pression that is Vimeo, those lenses look insanely sharp.

All of that "timelapse" was shot at 24fps or higher. On the wind turbine sunset shots, I actually shot those at 96fps! Those clips are nearly an hour long each played at 24fps.

[AnthonyFlores]

Great stuff Tom. I've watched it a couple times now. The level of detail and sharpness is simply stunning ... and I'm not even viewing the 4k version :)

Anthony

[AnthonyFlores]

... could there be a matching 24-290mm T2.8 Leica zoom, at about 300mm in length and weighing in at around 15lbs?

Now we're talking! Like one of the legendary Panavision zooms, but smaller and lighter. Hey, if they achieved it with the Primes, why not a zoom??

24-290 would be awesome, though I must say that a new Leica Cine zoom in ANY focal range would have my mouth watering -- and I doubt I'm the only one.

Anthony

[Sanjin Jukic]

Tom,

thanks and great shots at BandPro Vimeo page from all cameras Epic-M, Alexa , Sony F35 and Canon 1Dmk4.

Also you were shooting night sky time-lapse with Canon 1Dmk4, right?

I'm still a guy with Leica SC/BandPro T-shirt and in meantime using other Leica lenses with a kind of "revolver" camera.:laugh:

More about girls, horses, "revolver" cameras, wine and Leica lenses soon.

Stay tuned.

http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/leica_bandpro_tshirt_01.jpg
http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/leica_bandpro_tshirt_02.jpg
http://homepage.mac.com/sanjinjukic/RED/leica_bandpro_tshirt_03.jpg
Shot with GH2 (a "revolver" camera) and Leica 21-35mm Vario-Elmar R f/3.5-4 Asph.

[Seth Emmons]

I'm still a guy with Leica SC/BandPro T-shirt and in meantime using other Leica lenses with a kind of "revolver" camera.:laugh:


Sanjin,
Nice shirt!