Anyone using FLanders Scientific LM-2461W for 4:4:4 3Gb/sec SDI monitoring?

[Andrae Palmer]

If so can you list your Decklink settings and monitor settings? I'm getting funky colors on the FSI when it's set to Video: SDI Format: Auto.

When switched to Video: SDI Format: 4:4:4 RGB... I get no video signal. Davinci Resolve is set to output RGB 4:4:4 Single Link.

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5027/5695714804_aa8dbdc8f4_o.png

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5262/5695731540_99d4694181_o.png

[Christopher Barrett]

Oh drag... Just got my 17" two days ago and looks beautiful connected through Rocket. BTW, Lovin my Sekonic TYVM!

[Andrae Palmer]

Looks like the problem is that Decklink HD Extreme 3D+ is not SMPTE 425 compliant. This royally sucks. The 3 Gb/sec SDI on the Flanders Scientific LM-2461W is Level A SMPTE 425M-A or Level B SMPTE 425M-B.

[A.Fetchko]

Have you confirmed this with Flanders??????

[Andrae Palmer]

Well I communicated with FSI via email and God bless them, they tried to help me to their best ability but the problem really lies with Blackmagic. Looking at the spec of the Decklink Extreme 3D+ and the FSI LM-2461W monitor it's clearly apparent that they are not the same SDI standard. Of course if someone on here has it working in (3G) mode "properly"... I would love to know how. Waiting until the morning to call Blackmagic due to offices closed over weekend.

[Frank Glencairn]

So called "standards".... yeah

Frank

[Paul Nordin]

hmmm. Well that sucks Andrae! If it is of any help, I've got the FSI 2470 10 bit monitor and have no problem displaying 3G out of the Decklink Extreme 3D+ card. So if FSI has shifted thier standard implementation of the 3G SDI, you can let them know that what they did for the 2470 worked fine with the BM card.

[Tom.Wong]

is it just the 3g sdi not working or dual link doesn't work either?

[Paul Nordin]

FYI- I was just on the phone with Dan at FSI and asked him about this. He said they were expecting to come out with a firmware update sometime very soon (this week) which addresses this. Since they learned of the problem a couple of days ago, I'd say this is pretty responsive customer service.

[Jamie Metzger]

Flanders Scientific has some amazing customer service.

[Jason H]

yes, i can second that! great customer service!

[Andrae Palmer]

hmmm. Well that sucks Andrae! If it is of any help, I've got the FSI 2470 10 bit monitor and have no problem displaying 3G out of the Decklink Extreme 3D+ card. So if FSI has shifted thier standard implementation of the 3G SDI, you can let them know that what they did for the 2470 worked fine with the BM card.


FYI- I was just on the phone with Dan at FSI and asked him about this. He said they were expecting to come out with a firmware update sometime very soon (this week) which addresses this. Since they learned of the problem a couple of days ago, I'd say this is pretty responsive customer service.

Yeah these guys are rocking. I found out directly from Blackmagic that they do not support SMPTE 425M Level A. Strangely they reported that SMPTE 425M Level B is supported. Of course that's probably what's causing all my issues.

Johan is sending me a new firmware update for Level A support only... with the news from BM don't know if this will do any good... but about to test it.

[Andrae Palmer]

hmmm. Well that sucks Andrae! If it is of any help, I've got the FSI 2470 10 bit monitor and have no problem displaying 3G out of the Decklink Extreme 3D+ card. So if FSI has shifted thier standard implementation of the 3G SDI, you can let them know that what they did for the 2470 worked fine with the BM card.

Was it reporting (3G) on the OSD? Got an email from Blackmagic stating that they they don't support SMPTE 425M Level A. I don't know why they would support Level B and not A. Pretty darn strange.

[Andrae Palmer]

is it just the 3g sdi not working or dual link doesn't work either?

This issue is just related to the single link 3Gb/sec 4:4:4 RGB. The FSI LM-2461W does not support dual link. For the last six weeks I thought I was getting a proper 4:4:4 single link 3 GB/sec. Recently I was told that if it doesn't say (3G) on the OSD... then it's not a 3 Gb/sec signal. Since I had Davinci and the Blackmagic card set to push out a 3gb/sec, I spent the last 6 weeks thinking I was good to go. It's only when curiosity got the best of me and I wanted to compare the color quality of 4:2:2 vs 4:4:4 that I found out all this time I was only getting a single link 4:2:2 signal. Don't know why a proper image still displays when Davinci and BM are both set to push out a 4:4:4 single link signal.

[Chris Ratledge]

Great thread. Sorry for the headaches but this is the kind of stuff good BBS communities are all about.

And FSI does in fact rule. I've got to pick up another one of their monitors....

[Andrae Palmer]

Folks unless FSI can come up with a firmware to switch a SMPTE 425M Level B signal into a Level A... I'm screwed. I will have to get an AJA adapter to convert the signal... unfortunately the adapter cost $1000. It's really amazing how incompatible these devices can be... you would think it would be a standard.

[Christian Berg-Nielsen]

I also talked with FSI yesterday, and they will release a firmware this friday. The panel will then accept level b signal from the decklink extreme 3d.

[Andrae Palmer]

Any word on the firmware release?

[Andrae Palmer]

Just got an email from FSI with beta firmware 0.9.40-1708. The firmware has a new "Overlay" option in Menu\System\3G Level B. This pretty much solves the issue of Blackmagic cards not outputting a 3Gb/sec SMPTE-425M Level A signal. I've asked Johan if there's any quality loss using this method. Still awaiting his response.

Update:

Official firmware release due later this week. They are quality checking the current build so no word yet on the quality of this overlaying method versus a normal SMPTE-425M Level A signal.

[Kirk.Attard]

HI Andrea

So you managed to connect the Flanders to 4:4:4 SDI?... That's always in 10 bit right...

Glad to know its working well.. Would you be so kind to do a little round up of your setup once you settle it.. Really interested in a similar setup.
Thanks in advance

[Andrae Palmer]

My setup consist of a Blackmagic Decklink HD Extreme 3D+ (Driver version 8.0) connected via single SDI cable to Flanders Scientific LM-2461W monitor with beta firmware (0.9.40-1708)... which is not available publicly as of yet. These are the settings for BM card:

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5027/5695714804_aa8dbdc8f4_o.png

These are the settings for Davinci Resolve (make sure RGB 4:4:4 single link is selected):

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5262/5695731540_99d4694181_o.png

These are the settings for the FSI LM-2461W monitor (beta firmware 0.9.40-1708 or higher):

After the firmware update:
- reboot the monitor (power cycle)
- go to Menu\System\Load Profile and load the default profile
- in Menu\System\3G Level B select "Overlay".
- in Menu\Video\SDI Format force the monitor into 4:4:4 RGB mode.

You will know everything is working once the monitor reports (3G) on the On Screen Display. If your monitor does not say (3G) you are not getting 3Gb/sec signal no matter if the colors look proper to your eye.


-----

I've asked a few experts why the BM card does not support SMPTE 425M-A and the more plausible reason that was stated is that it was cheaper to build a card that muxes SMPTE 372M signal 'as is' into a SMPTE 425M-B format.

Fortunately it was reported by said experts that there is no loss in quality by muxing the two signals in an overlay. Of course I would love for BM to come out with a card that supports SMPTE 425M-A.

[Kirk.Attard]

thanks - Andrea

Printed those out in case I go for the flanders option.

Glad you are getting a great signal.

Would love to see some of your work!

[Johnny Friday]

GREAT THREAD and thanks for updating the community Andrae.

....unfortunately i have NO PCI slots available or I'd go the BM route. I'm screwed and going to have to get the AJA dual to single link adapter so i can go from rocket card dual SDI to Flanders Single link 3G.

Thanks for all those updates Andrae!

[Bram Desmet]

We have a lot of people that come across this thread and then email us expressing concern that perhaps 4:4:4 3Gbps SDI over Level B has not yet been implemented as an official firmware release on FSI monitors. Let me assure anyone coming across this thread that whether you feed the monitor 4:4:4 over 3Gbps SDI Level A or over 3Gbps SDI Level B that all FSI monitors with 3Gbps SDI inputs will fully support these signals and allow you to monitor them accurately. This has been included on all monitors since May 23rd of 2011 and is available as a free firmware upgrade to anyone that purchased a monitor before that date.

[Johnny Friday]

As a side-note, i've been feeding my fSI 2461w from RedRocket card - dueal link to an AJA converter that then goes out Single link 3g...works great here.

[Eric Santiago]

As a side-note, i've been feeding my fSI 2461w from RedRocket card - dueal link to an AJA converter that then goes out Single link 3g...works great here.
Mr Friday sorry for the late post on this thread. How is everything with your above set-up going to date?
Reason Im asking is that I ran into issues with the RED ROCKET BOB (breakout box) and Flanders LM-2461W.
I guess I forgot to check the specs on the 3G SDI not supporting Dual-Link SDI.
Did you happen to run your Flanders using the supplied SDI plate that came with the ROCKET?
I got that to work but honestly not experienced enough to tell (or check) if I was getting proper signal.
I can see the footage well from RCXPro but again not sure if I was getting my bang for the buck.
Now my tests were YUV422 8 and YUV444 8, again not sure how to check if Im set-up at max capability.
We ordered the AJA 3GM so we can use the BOB.
We like using the SDI and HDMI option.
Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[Johnny Friday]

Eric, once you have any AJA, Blackmagic or Matrox device that allows you to come in with dual SDI and then go out single link (3g) SDI you'll be set and can run dual link from your RR card to your Flanders...but you can also run single link out of side A on the rocket SDI to your Flanders...that will give you 8 bit color....and works just fine.

Bottom line is there are number of conversion boxes out there that allow you to come in Dual Link SDI and go out from that box HDMI, component, Single link (3g) SDI and more....so should be an easy and relatively affordable fix.

[Eric Santiago]

Eric, once you have any AJA, Blackmagic or Matrox device that allows you to come in with dual SDI and then go out single link...Thanks Johnny. How are you able to do it with the BM card from RCXPro? We do have the Extreme 3D in the CUBIX but using that for Resolve only (using SDI2 on Flanders).
We're ordering the AJA 3GM so we can use the BOB.
Odd that most REDUSERs dont use that BOB box.
We purchased it back when we go the whole package with RED MX.

Thanks again for your input :)

[Johnny Friday]

Blackmagic makes converter boxes as well....that was actually what i meant---i didn't mean to suggest using their card...but you just need a hardware converter and those are probably the biggest guys on the block doing hardware conversion boxes.

[Eric Santiago]

Blackmagic makes converter boxes as well....that was actually what i meant---i didn't mean to suggest using their card...but you just need a hardware converter and those are probably the biggest guys on the block doing hardware conversion boxes.
Well thanks Im gonna give AJA a try.
Pricey little buggers :)

[Johnny Friday]

If you don't already have one...i believe i have one in La Paz (my office) one that i no longer use...that i'd be glad to sell affordably.

[Eric Santiago]

If you don't already have one...i believe i have one in La Paz (my office) one that i no longer use...that i'd be glad to sell affordably.
Thanks Johnny, if I was private Id be on it but I work for a corp that doesnt purchase used :(