What do DPs wish their Directors would know?

[Shawn Nelson]

For those DPs out there, what things do you find yourself repeatedly wishing that directors would know?

My goal is to be a good Director, albeit a very visually inclined one. I prefer to be a strong collaborator with DPs, and not one that the DP rolls his eyes at the moment he turns around.

So what do DPs wish their Director would know? Or, is this a silly question with no real answer?

[ibloom]

For those DPs out there, what things do you find yourself repeatedly wishing that directors would know?

My goal is to be a good Director, albeit a very visually inclined one. I prefer to be a strong collaborator with DPs, and not one that the DP rolls his eyes at the moment he turns around.

So what do DPs wish their Director would know? Or, is this a silly question with no real answer?

I think the best directors have a really good sense of the pacing of their project. Sometimes this is in seconds, other times this is in scenes.

I also really appreciate directors that have a strong knowledge of film grammar and speak the language of composition and lenses very precisely.

Finally, it's great when someone understands the power of great blocking. Not only creating interesting grammar with interesting blocking, but also how to use a blocking session effectively as a tool to communicate with your entire crew. (And how not to confuse blocking with rehearsal.)

It's funny Shawn. Driving home from set tonight, I had a long talk with my director about this very subject: What a director needs to know.

IBloom

[Sanjin Jukic]

Somebody in Wikipedia collected very good thoughts about FILM DIRECTOR>>>

"A director is a person who directs the making of a film.
A film director visualizes the script,
controlling a film's artistic and dramatic aspects,
while guiding the technical crew and
actors in the fulfillment of their vision.

--

Responsibilities

A film director is responsible for overseeing every creative aspect of a film.
They develop a vision for a film, decide how it should look, what tone it should have,
and what an audience should gain from the cinematic experience. They are responsible
for hiring a strong, creative team of people to work with production, lighting, cinematography,
and costumes. Film directors are responsible for approving every camera angle, lens effect, lighting,
and set design. They coordinate the actors moves, determine camera angles, and may be involved in the writing,
financing, and editing of a film. The director works closely with the cast and crew. They listen to the cast and crew,
take some suggestions, and give out some of their own. They meet with the cast before each scene to do a run through.
This tells them how the actors are going to play the scene, which enables them to make changes accordingly.
A film director is also responsible for television production."

MORE>>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_director)

[karapetkov]

Good wikinitions!


IMHO, the director is responsible for saying the heaviest "YES" to every aspect of the film-making process.


1. Reading the script and saying "YES, this script will work" [responsibility].


2. Rehearsing and directing the actors:

"YES, that's the character we seek".

"YES, that's the expression, movement and gestures we need".

"YES, that's the way to deliver this line".

[responsibility]


3. Directing the visual aspects of the movie:

"YES, that's the set design we want". [colors, shapes, mood, style,]

"YES, these are the costumes that best depict the character and the story".

"YES, that's the necessary make-up".

"YES, this is the composition\lighting\camera movement that I had in mind" [for every shot\scene\sequence].

[responsibility]


4. Directing post:

"YES, this is the final cut we're after - emotion, rhythm, pace".

"YES, the color grading is what me and the DP agree on".

"YES, the sound works that way".

"YES, the music is [finally] fitting".

"NO, that trailer sucks and ruins everything".

"YES, now the trailer is tolerable" :)

[responsibility]


-----

I'm sure missing a lot of "YES" steps there, but the point is that the director has the almighty power\responsibility of "YES"-ing everything in the movie.

The way I see it, there are no rules in art, except one:


Impress and win your [target] audience. Make them say the big "YES" at the end of your movie.


The fun and power aspects of directing seem to appeal to everyone, but it's the responsibility side that makes most people frown.


Responsibility for the success of what is being filmmade.


That's tough.

It's heavy intellectual and psychological labor [and responsibility :) ].

And, in the end, you have to be really crazy to actually want to be a director. :biggrin:

But,.. aren't we all... :sorcerer:

My 2c.

[Kevin Halverson]

One of my greatest wishes for any director that I work with is for them to know, I mean really know, what it is that they want from a scene. Not only shot line, lens choices, but also exact coverage and most certainly performance. I hate it when a director (and for some reason more often writer/director) sort of 'feels' their way around when shooting a scene. If they know what they want (and need) then more time is available to work on setups and things that other departments would like to have more time to work on.

I am not bagging on directors; I know that their job is very very difficult. About the only thing that I would rather be even less than a director is a UPM. Their job seems to be the worse as everyone's problem is their problem!

Just my $.02 on the subject.

[David Mullen ASC]

When I first saw the post, my cynical response was that I wish more directors knew how to direct...

Yes, I think understanding pacing, tempo of a scene, is key -- it's a subset of understanding how the scene will be edited, how the whole movie will be edited. That's a great trait for a director to have.

Knowing story and how to talk to actors, recognize a good performance on the set or in the editing room, or a poor one and knowing how to fix it, is also key.

There are many others that are important as well but these stand out.

Being able to handle stress is key as well. Being good at hiring your collaborators, casting, picking a project in the first place, finding financing...

[Stephen Webb]

As a Director I wish DP's knew how to get a move on :biggrin:

[Erik Bien]

As a recovering theatre major, I'll offer my two cents.

Perhaps I'm prejudiced, but I think it should be mandatory for every director to take an acting class (or several). Most behind-the-scenes types (myself included) are uncomfortable in the limelight, but the insights you can gain from watching a good teacher/coach shape an unconvincing performance into a better one are (IMVHO) well worth the emotional discomfort.

Beyond that, I think directing requires very different skills at each stage of production. In pre-production, you're kind of painting ideas in broad strokes, making sure all departments agree on look, feel, pacing, tone, etc. This is the time to do your homework, solicit input and make a game plan.

It's very different when the production clock is running: you need to make a daunting series of decisions quickly, and you need to tell people what to do. The what to do part is really important. I love a director who unhesitatingly says "use the red napkins" or "wait a beat after you enter, and go a little faster when you cross." Conversely, the single least-helpful bit of direction I ever received was a college production in which the director asked me to "be more magical." Being a young smart-ass, I shot back, "Could you be more vague, please?" A zen master can 'be,' but an actor must 'do.'

[mmost]

...the single least-helpful bit of direction I ever received was a college production in which the director asked me to "be more magical." Being a young smart-ass, I shot back, "Could you be more vague, please?" A zen master can 'be,' but an actor must 'do.'

Well, a major part of directing is knowing what each of your actors needs from you, and it's not always the same thing. Some might want what you did - a bit more of a specific adjustment. Others might want exactly what your director gave to you - more of an emotional adjustment. A good director must understand each actor's particular process and deal with it on its own terms. The best directors I've worked with have the ability to analyze this in rehearsal based on a combination of the questions each actor asks (and how many) and their reactions to different types of direction. By the end of their first scene with each cast member, they understand what each of them will need in order to elicit their best performances.

[Rudi Herbert]

Great thread!

For me, the first thing every director needs to know is what are the motivations (yes, the dreaded phrase) or thematic premise, or better yet, the NEED, of every character through the story. Understanding what a character does in general, how he/she is, how he/she is boud to react to many situations, even those the character is not faced with in the script, is of paramount importance. It's a lot easier to tell an actor why on a particular scene the character would act like this or like that, then just say "walk slower, or cry harder, or don't laugh so much". Arbitrary direction based on a particular scene is not conducive to actors doing their best work. Direction is about feeling not about gestures or actions.

Directors should spend time discussing the script with their actors, analyzing what each of them feels or thinks are the reactions of their character to each particular scene or challenge throughout the script, and once both director and actor agree on who and why the character is, the rest follows rather easily, so I agree that "be more magical" is about the worst thing an actor can hear.

And unless you are Ridley Scott or some other visual director, the best thing a director can tell his DP is what emotions and results, from a dramatic standpoint, he wants from the scene, and let the DP suggest angles, lenses, framing and lighting, this is true collaboration. Based on those options offered by the DP, the director can then choose what he feels is the best, but telling a DP "let's frame this like this or that" ir also counterproductive. Then again, that requires a DP with artistic capabilities, not just a skilled camera operator, which is what many DP's truly are. That's what I've always tried to do when directing.

Lastly, if you haven't yet, read Judith Weston's book "Directing Actors", it is a great read.

[Mike Prevette]

EDIT in their head. To be able to cut up a scene and understand what it needs. All my favorite directors and DP started as editors.

[Casey Green]

is that what you are doing in your avatar? :)

[Shawn Nelson]

Great comments everyone, keep them coming!

Rudi, I would disagree with you about something. It is the Director's responsbility to choose framing/composition. He can choose to get the DPs input, and even delegate it if he wants, but it is his job. And yes, I have read 'Directing Actors', it is a good book.

[Casey Green]

All great comments...

Of course, each Director will bring certain individual talents and styles to their projects based on their experience and preference.

As a Director and crew member on many productions, here are several things I have experienced that come to mind that I believe DPs appreciate their Directors to know:

1) Communication. Even if a Director has the most brilliant ideas, if he/she can not effectively or precisely communicate them with the DP (and crew/talent) then so much is lost. Also, having to do with communication is Psychology. There are so many things going on socially on a set. Many times, people are working together for the first time and are feeling their way through the production in the early going. Having a good understanding of how to deal with the challenge of these new relationships, personalities, dealing with egos, creative brainstorming, making compromises, etc., is very important. Being an effective communicator to your cast and crew can be the difference between huge success and dismal failure.

2) Understanding the Process. This includes what many people have already commented on. The knowledge of proper terminology, equipment, workflows, how changes impact schedules, and of course pacing and continuity. Also, understanding a little of each other departments needs and challenges goes a long way. I personally believe that having in-front-of-the-Camera experience is also a great advantage to have.

3) Organization and Punctuality. Many Directors have very specific systems that help them keep all of their scenes and shots organized. Some have used techniques such as shot lists and story board cards, and others even go so far as to have a list of all the various components that make up individual shots and sequences, such as tone, color, space, line, shape, movement, rhythm, etc. And being punctual sets a good example for the rest of the cast and crew.

4) Onset Presence / Dealing with pressure. Things are bound to go wrong or at least change into something less desirable at some point during a shoot. It's how Directors deal with this when it occurs that can have a dramatic effect on the production schedule and overall morale of the cast and crew. In my experience, there really should never be a situation that requires the Director (or anyone else for that matter) to lose their temper or get too distracted by their emotions that they cannot perform their job. Of course, it's not always that easy to know what challenges are around the next corner and how you will react to them, but if the Director knows going in that they will consider them just that, challenges, then things will be on the right track form the start. Having the social skills to deal with the incredible pressure that comes along with the schedule and budget requirements of a production are very important. And rather than focusing on the negative, remaining open minded, positive, and keeping a creative approach may often allow for a solution to the problem, or even many times offer a better idea than the original.

5) Loving your work and loving the collaborative process. This doesn't hurt. :)

[Adrian T.]

One of the most important skills of a good director is his sense of telling a story visually.

Too many directors nowadays don't have a clue about the power of angle of view, framing, camera movement, rhythm and editing. They rely heavily on full coverage because they simply don't know what they want.

[Rudi Herbert]

Rudi, I would disagree with you about something. It is the Director's responsbility to choose framing/composition. He can choose to get the DPs input, and even delegate it if he wants, but it is his job. And yes, I have read 'Directing Actors', it is a good book.

Shawn, I guess I wasn't clear enough, you're right of course, but not obviously so. I mean, I always have a very good idea of how I want each scene to look like and how each character action and reaction should be framed, which in my case (I write and edit all of my stuff) is a given since I come to the set with that proverbial picture in my head. But I remember telling a DP that for a particular scene the female lead was in total disbelief and panic and I wanted her in close up to experience her reaction full on, and then he came up with some suggestions for alternate framing that ended up working better than my original idea.

So, before telling DPs what my thoughts are regarding framing, I've resorted to first telling them what is the emotional impact I want to achieve with every scene and ask for suggestions. If what they offer matches up or improves my ideas, great, if not, I can always go the "let's do it this way" route and be done, but asking for suggestions before announcing my ideas has worked better the couple of times I've worked with experienced DP's.

[Charles Angus]

I have to second the comments about editing. The director has to have a clear idea of pacing and which shots cut together and how the whole will emerge from the parts. This confidence will trickle down to the crew. One of my directors said, "Film sets are simple Reaganomics - everything trickles down from the director."

Confidence, articulation of ideas, trust, and really wanting the project to be good all are felt by the crew and influence their work ethic.

Describing the "point" or desired impact of a scene or shot to the DP is a good way of getting good ideas out of them. When a director does that to me, I can often come up with a couple of ideas that I think will work with what I've been doing for the project. The key then is for the director to pick one - its so frustrating to say, "We can do this or this or this, they are all equally easy for my crew, it's just a storytelling decision," and have the director throw the question back in your face. The director is the boss, but sometimes it seems like the director is afraid of that responsibility.

Take charge without being a dictator.

[Charles Angus]

EDIT in their head. To be able to cut up a scene and understand what it needs. All my favorite directors and DP started as editors.

I find that interesting. When I'm editing a project, all the actual editing is done away from the computer, in my head. It makes sense for a director to be doing that before the footage is shot - presumably he already has a good idea of what it should be.

I agree wholeheartedly that editing is key to DPs and directors.

Editing is filmmaking - it is the only uniquely cinematic craft.

[mmost]

I agree wholeheartedly that editing is key to DPs and directors.


I'm not so sure I do.

As important as editing is to the ultimate product, each phase of production has its own needs and concentrations. To come to the set with a rigid idea of what the final scene is going to be is to cut oneself off from the input of a lot of valuable collaborators - actors, cameraman, etc. - in favor of a preconceived notion about how it should turn out. Scenes are often "found" at various stages of a picture's development. Sometimes they are found to a great extent during rehearsal, when everyone is together on the day with sides in hand for the first time. Sometimes it's found when a great idea for lighting or coverage following the rehearsal influences how the scene will ultimately feel. Sometimes it's even dictated by the circumstances present at the time it's shot - the 5 shot scene that becomes a one-er because you went long on the previous scene and need to make the day. And often times it's found in the cutting room, when either the editor or the director or both will restructure what they thought they had into something different and better than they had previously imagined. Sometimes the picture will be restructured and scenes juxtaposed to create a narrative that seems very different from what might have been originally intended.

To me, the job of the director in preproduction is different - albeit related - to the job of the director during production, which is itself different from the job of the director during post. In preproduction, that which can be decided ahead of time is ironed out - production design, locations, wardrobe, general look and feel, and, of course, casting. During production, the primary job of the director - at least as I see it - is to direct the actors, to get the best and most appropriate performance by earning and retaining their trust, and helping them to find the right tone for each scene and create the characters with depth, truth, and nuance. In post, the job is to work with the editor to find and define the actual movie, and then to work with the sound crew and the composer to help bring it to life. To do all of these jobs requires someone with talent and vision, to be sure, but to do it really well also requires someone who's open to others' ideas and open to embracing changes and happy accidents that inevitably happen along the way.

[karapetkov]

The very essence of film editing:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=hCAE0t6KwJY

[Mike Prevette]

I wasn't saying they should be rigid, in fact the opposite is true. Reacting to things and adapting to how a scene should play out is key to on set filmmaking. That being said a director that can cut that scene together in their head, and make sure they have all the coverage they need makes me happy.

[Shawn Nelson]

Continuing in this thought, what is a polite way for a Director to tell the DP that the way he lit a scene is completely unacceptable (the director stepped out and came into the scene lit)?

[Mike Prevette]

Director: "Umm this wasn't what I was thinking at all, I need it more natural"


Good DP: "No prob. Hey guys lets shake it up, move the key out the window, kill the strobes. . . ."

Bad DP: "Well it looks totally natural to me, See how the chartreuse rim light really accentuates that "bar" feel"

Director: " were in a kitchen"


Just "use your words" so to speak. Say what you have to say any way you can. You might suck at it at first, but thats the trick to communicating in any language. You get bettar as you go.

[Charles Angus]

I'm not so sure I do.

As important as editing is to the ultimate product, each phase of production has its own needs and concentrations. To come to the set with a rigid idea of what the final scene is going to be is to cut oneself off from the input of a lot of valuable collaborators - actors, cameraman, etc. - in favor of a preconceived notion about how it should turn out. Scenes are often "found" at various stages of a picture's development.


Yes - I didn't mean to say that there must be a plan to be rigidly adhered to.

Knowing how to edit (not the same as knowing how to use FCP or Avid...) will inform the decisions made while "finding" the scene, whenever that happens.

Knowing how to edit will ensure that when you make the 5-shot scene a oner will work in the final film, and isn't going to need a re-shoot.

That said, I believe in having a well-conceived plan - it will probably not survive first contact with the enemy, so to speak, but having a plan means you have considered the material, you know what you want, and you are going to have a framework into which new ideas can be placed.

But yes, you are right, editing is a post process that is its own thing. It shouldn't be done on set, but keen knowledge of editing will ensure that you won't be killing yourself in the cutting room.

[Charles Angus]

Continuing in this thought, what is a polite way for a Director to tell the DP that the way he lit a scene is completely unacceptable (the director stepped out and came into the scene lit)?

Hopefully good communication beforehand will prevent this...

Also, sometimes lighting will look different to the eye than it will to the camera (eg. adding fixtures to get deeper shadows on the film can look bright to the eyes). This is a common one. With RED, and well-calibrated onset HD or 2k monitoring, this should be less of an issue. The DP can just say, "Look at the monitor, thats what its going to look like."

Shooting film, then maybe the DP has a plan - ask what it is, and if it makes sense, then consider trusting him.

That said, at the end of the day, the director is the boss. Just say, I don't like this lighting, and here's why. Give concrete examples.

"The backlight is too much, where's it coming from?" is a good criticism, this can be changed.

"This doesn't look very good," is not good criticism. The DP can't light it "better", he can only make concrete adjustments to the exposure, fixture placement, colour balance, etc.

[HOLLYWOOD SCHMOLLYWOOD]

All if this is good stuff but in the end the director must have a vision and the ability to execute it through other creative individuals. Shaun, none of these are rules and there are great directors that don't dictate camera angles. Many in fact. However they will inspire or communicate to you to pick the "right" ones. That being the shots that feel more like a force of nature dictated by the story and directors vision of telling it rather than, "lets do a jib shot because its cool looking like big movies" mentality.

Storymuthafuckin tellin. A good director can share an experience through a combination of all the other art forms. They are hard to find and often critical to a DPs success. Wally Pfister on Memento being a great example.

This is a great link for anyone interested in making movies.(its not what you think it is)

www.cinegear.com

[Dean Bull]

Every great director should know that every great director they admire is not who he/she seems...

Every great director should know that most directors who are labeled "great" are not that great.

Every great director knows he/she is made great by their appeal to the audience, and in larger part to their access to financing!

Every great director should know what their last paycheck was for directing.



Every aspiring great director should read some of the below the line blogs around the net to get a candid POV of what the director job looks like (in a professional setting) from below the line.

[mmost]

All if this is good stuff but in the end the director must have a vision and the ability to execute it through other creative individuals. Shaun, none of these are rules and there are great directors that don't dictate camera angles. Many in fact. However they will inspire or communicate to you to pick the "right" ones.

I agree with that. In fact, I would go a bit further and suggest that a good director "directs" everyone on the crew just like he or she directs the actors, by giving them what they need to hear in order to elicit what the director has in mind. In other words, asking them for something in a manner that makes each crew person feel that it's their own idea. That's a very good way to deal with people in general, but it's an especially good way to deal with people in the creative crafts.

[Mardi_Gras]

I agree with that. In fact, I would go a bit further and suggest that a good director "directs" everyone on the crew just like he or she directs the actors, by giving them what they need to hear in order to elicit what the director has in mind. In other words, asking them for something in a manner that makes each crew person feel that it's their own idea. That's a very good way to deal with people in general, but it's an especially good way to deal with people in the creative crafts.

Agree totally. And adding to that, for me, a good director on a set, is like a well written thriller with a strong hook. The director keeps the crew "hooked" onto his style, flair, sense of purpose and most of all a killer eye for fine details in composition; one that keeps even the most indifferent crew, "tuned-in. I love the art. Working with an equally talented DP brings it all home for me.

[Joe Carney]

Several years ago I read a book by John Boorman (I think that is his name)about editing. He claims the movie you end up with is always different then the one you started out on.
He did a case study of "All the Presidents Men". What started out as a high concept politcal thriller turned into a movie exploring why people talk to the press. All this happened during the editing process. It wasn't planned.

Something to think about.

[Paul Leeming]

Here's a copy of a questionnaire about directing I was sent by someone this year, with my answers in point form. Whilst this isn't strictly to do with the Director/DP relationship, I think it has some useful points to make, so I'm uploading it on the off chance it inspires someone or gives them something new to think about:


What are some significant tips that are needed to be aware of to direct?

Know your story inside and out. Why are you telling the story? What does it mean to you personally?
Don't be afraid to put your emotions into the movie. If you are not emotionally involved, your audience won't be either. Again, why are you making the movie?
Know yourself. Know your REAL limits. Be confident and be in charge, but don't be a tyrant.
Take all opinions but know how to filter out the ones that don't serve the story.
Look after your actors, physically and emotionally. They are putting themselves on the line for you. Respect them for that.
Don't surround yourself with people who love your work and won't criticise you. You need objective eyes watching over you because you won't be. Then see the fourth point about taking all opinions...
Feed your crew. Well.
Did I mention know your story?!What are the necessary aspects a director should apply when directing?

Focus. Not the camera's, but your own. What is this shot about? Is it serving the story the right way?
Motivation. It's 3 am. Your crew has been working sixteen hours straight. It's raining. They want to go home and sleep. You need to inspire them. How?
Willpower. This is your movie. YOU are the Director. You know the story and what you are trying to say better than anyone else (right?!). So don't let anyone else change, dilute or otherwise mess with it. You will be given a thousand reasons why things can't be done, have to change, no money, etc etc. Be strong of mind and don't let them tell you how to make your movie.
Emotion. Understand your own emotions. Then understand your characters' emotions. Finally, understand your actors' emotions. Know how to synchronise all three to put your internal emotions on screen without changing them. Do this right and your movie will be a success. People go to movies to be moved and entertained. Show them your emotions through your movie and they will love it even if they don't understand exactly why.What sort of equipment is needed? – In general terms

Movie camera. Anything from MiniDV to 35mm Hollywood level. Tapes or film stock, or anything in between depending on the camera format.
Sound recording equipment. Microphones. Boom poles.
Lights. And a gaffer (lighting technician) who knows how to use them properly.
Editing system. These days that means digital even if you initially shoot your movie on film stock, as it's usually put through a digital telecine to get it into the computer as a Digital Intermediate (DI).
Sets or locations in which to shoot your movie. Tools to build them if necessary.Let me add here that all the best equipment in the world won't save you if your story isn't up to scratch. Know it. Love it. Breathe it.

What makes a good director?

If you figure out the answer to this you'll make a LOT of money! (Then tell me so I can make some too!)What are the top 3 qualities a ‘good’ director should have?

Knowledge. Know your movie. Know the processes that go into making a movie. Know the different jobs on set and what they can and can't do. Know your actors. Know your crew. Know what makes them tick and how to motivate them.
Emotion. Understand that emotion is what makes a good movie. Know how to translate your own internal emotions in a way that gets them on screen unchanged. Don't be afraid of exploring your darker side. It's sometimes scary to be really honest with yourself but it will make the movie infinitely better if you can overcome that and run with it anyway.
Willpower. It's hard out there in the movie business. It's easy to give up. Don't.What advice/feedback would you give to an amateur/first time director?

Watch lots of movies. Which ones do you like best? Why? Note down the styles you like, the shots, the dialogue. Figure out how to use these in your own film.
Don't be afraid of making mistakes. You will make them. Thousands of them. Learn from each and every one of them and you'll grow in leaps and bounds. Never stop learning.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Pick your favourite directors' works and copy them. Experiment. Your own efforts will necessarily deviate from the copied works due to your own story and ideas so don't worry about making exact copies - it won't happen.
Believe in yourself. Believe in your story. Trust your actors.
Remind yourself every day WHY you are making this movie.
Story, story, story.Would there be any directing experiences that you would like to share?

The first day of the first movie I ever directed (“Eve”) was the hardest, longest and best day I've yet had on a movie set.
It was the hardest because I was asking two actors I barely knew to trust that I knew what I was doing in shooting the opening scene, which involved some full frontal nudity, as well as a crew who were looking to me to guide them, knowing it was now totally up to me as I was in charge.
It was the longest because every moment I was making decisions for a hundred people who needed to have absolute confidence that I, a first time director, wasn't going to let them down. It was fifteen hours that felt like a week, but I got there and then didn't sleep a wink that night just thinking about it all.
It was the best because I found a calling that has to this day given me utter joy when I'm doing it - I had become a film director!!Paul Leeming
Director
Visceral Psyche Films
Cheers,

Paul

[James T Mather]

good directors know what they want, bad directors know what they don't want.

I couldn't give sixpence if a director understands lenses or lighting etc - in many ways it can be a disadvantage if a director knows a little (a little knowledge is a dangerous thing etc) as opposed to a lot - it can become an inhibitor as they often mis-use terms, mis-understand equipment and create confusion

EG:

Him: I want a beam of light -
ME: sure - (orders a smoke machine) -
HIM: no. no smoke -
ME: I thought you wanted a beam of light -
HIM: Yes, but no smoke -
ME: ??? - (ten minutes of discussion (and watching some video on his ipod) and we get a cookie or charliebars to break up light on a wall)

OR :

HIM: lets steadicam in this scene.
ME : Sure. (twenty minutes later come out with the rig on) ready!
HIM : yes move in a dead straight line and then hold on this macro shot of an eyeball for ten minutes.
ME: (taking off the rig and getting a hybrid and nailing the actor to the floor)


These are clearly spoofy examples but things like this happen every day. Its better when the director who is not technically minded attempts to use clear terms to describe the effect he's going for rather than lob catchphrases like "triple reverse zoom" or "give me a 8mm wide shot of the garage here and blow the background out of focus" (Simply put : You can't blow the background out of focus) . Much muttering from technicians comes when directors are attempting to get people/equipment to do something that it wasn't designed for - often making the technician look like he doesn't know how to do his job.


NB : Also: please USE A VERB - phrases like edgy, slick, etc don't mean anything and often cause head scratching.

[David Mullen ASC]

Common problem I've come across:

Director: I want to completely silhouette the actor.

So I light the scene so the actor is in silhouette. Director comes back to set:

Director: Isn't the actor kinda dark? Can we throw some light on him?

Me: A "silhouette" is an unlit subject framed against a brighter background so their solid outline in black stands-out.

Director: Oh, I just wanted the actor to be backlit with just a little fill light.

Me: Then why didn't you ask me for that?

This is why when a director says "I want the scene to be dark" we have a discussion as to what "dark" means to him in this particular case, since it could mean generally underexposed soft, dim light or it could mean shadowy light with large black areas and small areas of brighter highlights.

[James T Mather]

myself - same conversation - many, many times.

OR:

HIM: can we silhouette him?
ME: sure, no problem.

(ten minutes later.)

HIM: Great. what about that light at the back?
ME: what about it?
HIM; I didn't realise you were going to use it - I want the room to be completely dark - not even practicals. can we turn off that light?

(we turn off the silhouette wall light. the set plunges into complete darkness - might as well film it on radio)

HIM: I can't really see him now. What can you do about that? James? James?

ME: (to the barman in the local bar) - A pint of beer please.

[Erik Bien]

My art department equivalent is the director who asked me to build a platform "of one by eights with a plywood top" ... then complained when it wasn't twelve inches tall! :blink:

[Kinosaur]

LOL See what youve started Shawn. The key to all of this for me has always been to strive to give the Director what he or she wants, which is not necessarily what he or she has asked for specifically. all Lighting cameramen / DOP's wince when faced with a Director who says ' I want the camera here, pointing this way, lit with a specific light source positioned exactly here'. If this happens, it's important that a discussion takes place to work out what is actually 'wanted'. IMO the most important thing is that people have confidence in each others abilities and that can only be achieved through working together and developing a relationship.

[krd]

I don't know, guys.... No one will remember, but the last time someone here claimed that directing CAN BE a highly skilled profession, but rarely is -- witness all the movie stars, celebrities and relatives of celebrities who manage to make first movies with excellent production values and more or less convincing dramatic content, Ben Afleck being only the latest genius of the week -- he was deemed to be an idiot.

You can make all the lists you want, but in the end a "director" today is somebody who managed to attract enough money to make a movie. Including guys who want all the lights turned off because the scene should be "dark", and whose major contribution to the performances is repeating "I mean, you're like...." or supplying 17 different explanations of what the scene "is really about".

Some might argue that Ron Howard, Clint Eastwood and Sophia Coppola are at the top of their profession today thanks to unique abilities, rare intelligence, magical on-set skills and hard-won knowledge. However, famous parents or prior acting fame usually don't help anyone write string quartets or epic poetry, play the violin, become DPs or film editors, perform higher mathematics or win the Nobel in medicine. So why film directing?

Could it be that the directing skill set required for this sort of success is really quite minimal? That opportunity, a decent script, good casting, passably good taste, and, of course, a highly trained crew, is what determines many of these outcomes? Just asking....

[SJD]

Best thread all week............!

cheers

[Dan Blanchett]

Could it be that the directing skill set required for this sort of success is really quite minimal? That opportunity, a decent script, good casting, passably good taste, and, of course, a highly trained crew, is what determines many of these outcomes? Just asking....

To some degree, but a strong vision combined with the ability to effectively realize it through managing a large creative team separates the good directors from the "good enough" or bad ones. Plus you have to be incredibly determined and motivated to take on such a mammoth responsibility that will (unlike most other people involved) suck a year or more of your life away. Not many people have that quality, or want that job.

[krd]

To some degree, but a strong vision combined with the ability to effectively realize it through managing a large creative team separates the good directors from the "good enough" or bad ones. Plus you have to be incredibly determined and motivated to take on such a mammoth responsibility that will (unlike most other people involved) suck a year or more of your life away. Not many people have that quality, or want that job.

Nobody's disputing any of that. The argument here isn't that directing is easy or a sham, but that much of what passes for Hollywood "directing" is the working of a highly developed industry, not a unique directorial talent.

[Dan Blanchett]

Which is why good movies are rare. :wink: (of course good scripts are too)

I think trusting and respecting your cast and crew is a big part of being successful. Letting people do their jobs while keeping the desired result in mind and the ship on course. It helps when you surround yourself with good people.

[ChrisLyon]

As a director, my biggest fear is inadequacy in communication. I know some terms in lighting ad cinematography but the DP I work with gets me really well. He is in all the meetings between myself, the writer and consultants from conception through pre-production. He listens, understands the mood of the scene and gets context clues from our general conversations. Sometimes he will remember more details than I off the top of his head whereas sometimes I have to refer to notes the night before about what I had decided. So I get on set and he knows every scene as well as I do. I feel like if I ever use another DP, I'll have my right arm chopped off.

My next project, for example, I want to use another DP. I love my DP friend, but I want to work with someone else just to see the way other people work and what their lighting might be. My DP friend would likely be a consultant and camera operator, but I'm always afraid of people not knowing what I'm going for even though actors tell me all the time that I give them plenty.

I'm a beast editor if I do say so myself. I get down with the footage and can mentally remember every take of every scene and have the damn thing roughly edited faster than you can say "chocolate chip cookies." I've just got everything already in my head which seems to be a good quality to have according to these comments.

I think my biggest problem will be communication with people who are more experienced than myself. I worry that things haven't been properly communicated and, sometimes, I have to tell people "no" or "that's not right" and I feel like one of those asshole directors people think about when they think of snob hollywood.

Any suggestions, DPs, for a director in need of better technical communication skills? I'm not exactly working with a completely guild crew yet but I will be. Help!

[Charles Angus]

Try working as a grip or electric or camera trainee on some indie stuff that has experienced people. I know in Toronto there is the Canadian Film Centre; they are often doing medium-budget shows with volunteer crews that are a mix of union, non-union, and less experienced folks. One of the best ways to get experience. Or, help out in technical departments on shows that friends direct.

I've worked with a few directors in grip and lighting who were trying to get a better understanding of the technical departments, and a better feel for what its like in the trenches.

Be prepared to be treated brusquely, to be expected to learn fast, and to remember everything. If you ask what something is once, thats fine, but try not to ask again. The technical crew is used to working quickly with experienced people, and while many are very gracious about training and guiding beginners, they have a job to do.


For the more chair-inclined, read Ansel Adam's book on the zone system, read some of those cinematography books that interview real cinematographers, there are a few good articles in the ASC bible. Watch movies shot by great cinematographers, and analyze the lighting decisions they've made.

If you want to get into the nitty-gritty:

Learn about depth of field, field of view on different formats, incident and reflected light metres, waveforms and histograms, characteristic curves, the output of different fixtures, colour temperature, the difference between soft and hard and how specular and diffuse relate to that, broad approaches to lighting scenes such as high and low key, effects of different diffusion filters, effects of different colour correction filters, the advantages of filtration vs. colour correction, the possibilities of colour correction, the use of dollies jibs cranes steadicam, the difference and intricacies of same, the differences between different film stocks, differences between HD and D-Cinema cameras, differences between film and HD and D-Cinema, the magic of rigging, the name and use of different flags, diffusions, nets, scrims, and light modifiers, power consumption...

I'm a believer in knowing the departments that work for you inside and out.

Now, before people jump on me for this, I'm not saying directors should be too specific - it's not fun to hear, "use a 1.2 over there with quarter straw, fill in with a long 4 kino, and we'll get the 16mm up." But it is good if the DP says that and the director knows what that means.

[ChrisLyon]

A level-headed understanding is what I want. I want the DP to say that and then I can confidently say "Make it so."

[Charles Angus]

Shooting stills is another good thing; try to keep in mind the limitations of motion picture, though. An interesting experiment would be to shoot stills of your DPs lighting setups with the same settings as the motion picture camera. Compare this to the dailies.

During lulls in the action, you could ask your DP specific questions about the setup. Make sure he knows you're just curious, and not second guessing.