Base Production Pack Vs Zacuto Rig

[Yean Loon]

With my RED One possibly arriving in 2 months time. I think it's about time to put some serious thought into the essential accessories. Any feedback or reviews of the following systems would be appreciated!

Red Base Production Pack $1250 Vs Zacuto $???.

Any thoughts, anyone?

cheerios,

yean

[Ricardo Mehedff]

yeah, i saw this zacuto rig... it looks pretty cool but don't have any idea of the price...

[Tonaci Tran]

If you go the Zacuto route you will still need to purchase the RED cradle (750) or at least the Red Battery quick plate (500) and top mount so that your RED will have a handle.

Zacuto option estimates (not including rods) based on prices in their online store. I don't know the specifics details of what is included in the configuration you have in the picture):
Z-grips: two = 700
Universal Baseplate: 560
Shoulder Pad = 250

RED option for two handle configuration: Base Production Pack 1250 + additional left handle 250.00, red handle mount 150, universal mount 125.00 = 1775 for similarly configured two handle setup.

Zacuto: $1510.00 not including rods (110.00) or battery plate/cradle so add 750 to that. Also, you will be without a top handle which will also cost an additional 150.00

The Zacuto rig is about 700 dollars more similarly configured. (could be more since I didnt include prices on the little rod adaptors I see in the photo)

[Denis Buhot]

what is an affordable matte box plus follow-focus for a nikon still zoom lens, which I shall begin with... Any answer appreciated !

[Tonaci Tran]

http://www.zacuto.com/Red%201500.jpg
Taking a closer looks at this configuration, it does utilize their own rod system with rod adaptors.. so the price difference could be up to a 1,000. Best way to know for sure is to hit them up directly with a quote.

Zacuto makes great stuff. I put in an order for the Zacuto quick release system (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=5491&highlight=zacuto+abelcine) for the red lcd that Evin devised.

[Paolo Tinari]

I've read somewhere here a handheld rig is coming out from Red.

[planet e]

i've been eyeing the zacuto rig as well...looks outstanding. i think it looks well balanced. i e-mailed their sales manager for a quote, if i hear back, i'll post the info. there's no specifics on the RED package on their website, photos but no specifics regarding either price or available components. we'll see what they say....

[Matt Gottshalk]

I have the zacuto rig for my HVX with 35mm adapter and it is SOLID. Buy in confidence.

[Yean Loon]

So is the Red Base Production Pack useable with other camera?
The Zacuto is after all a universal base.

The price difference would be, like Tonaci, about $1000.
Based on price, the Base Production Pack is very good value. Jim, himself has said that....i can't disagree.

Has anybody used both systems before?

And the new handheld rig i think is coming from Element Technica?

[I Bloom]

The only thing I haven't been happy with on the Red rig is the handles...they slip. I'm not the only one who has mentioned this problem:
http://www.dghagey.com/Director_of_Photography/Toronto_Red_Test_1.html
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=103297
I'm likely to buy the base production pack and then look into the Zacuto grips. I'm hoping Red decides to change that particular part of the design.

IBloom

[Richard Andrewski]

Here's a quote I got from them recently as I've been looking into this as well. You will still need the RED Cradle, RED Top Handle, RED handle mount and I'll probably get the EVF and a RED Drive as well. I am undecided on the battery options but may go for the RED power pack.

Zacuto has an 8" monitor from NEBTek which sounded interesting too for $1850. It will need to be some adaptation done to the RED LCD port output to make this work.

Here's their equipment needed for shoulder mount use:

http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=30&cat=0&page=1

Z-UB3 Zacuto Universal Baseplate Version 3, $560.00

includes 12-inch support rods
Version 3 is 30% lighter then our
Version 1 Baseplate
Adjusts up and down, left and right
to fit all cameras with 1/4 20 or 3/8
16 screws on the bottom.


http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=32&cat=0&page=1

Z-DM3 Zacuto DoubleMount, includes 7-inch rods $235.00

(mounts (2) 3/8 16 and (2) 1/4 20
articulating arms)
holds (2) Zround Mounts for
Z-Release arms

http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=70&cat=0&page=1

Z-ZM Zacuto Z-Mount $144.00

(mount articulating arms to Zgrips
or any 15mm rod with quick-release)


http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=191&cat=0&page=1

Z-ZC Zacuto ZicroMount $95.00

(attach to monitor or hard drive
making them quick-release)

http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=203&cat=0&page=1

Zarm-S Zacuto Zamerican Small Arm $195.00

(Zacuto's Z-Release 6.5 inch
articulating arm, quick-releases on
both end of the arm, also accepts
rod extensions)

http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=269&cat=0&page=1

Z-RI Zacuto Z-Riser (includes 4.5" female rods) $0.00
(Universal Baseplate not included)
(needed for RED Camera & Letus
setups)

http://store.zacuto.com/product.php?productid=222&cat=0&page=1

Z-RE-M3.5 Zacuto 3.5 inch male rod extension, no 2 @ $25.00ea = $50.00

thread on other end (1 rod only)

$1279 total for this part of the quote (just the mounting elements necessary for shoulder config).

Then they quoted a Chroziel follow focus ($1400+$160+150) and matte box ($1399+$120). And some filters too.

[red1225]

I honestly think people give handles to much credit...most professional camera operators hold right onto the matte box. (as long as its not a clip on).

Try it...great control and actually more ergonomic.

Save your money on the second handle.

[Yean Loon]

So the main reason for getting the RED Base Production Pack would really be because it's value-for-money. Even if the handgrips tend to slip. Because, like what most have said, you would still need the RED Cradle, RED Top Handle and RED Handle Mount even if you get the ZACUTO Rig.

Maybe the Zacuto components can be added on to the Base Production Pack as i expand and hone my rig.

AS for LCD, i'm going for siniarch's carrion. I do feel it gives you the best bang for the buck. And it's more versatile...i can use it for different cameras...

Which was initially why i wanted to get the Zacuto rig...Versatility.

While it would be the best scenario that when i receive my RED One that i would use it exclusively for all my jobs...i think realistically, it might not be possible.

So since i am investing in a fair amount of equipment, i should buy the stuff that is useable with different cameras. Right?

Anyone wanna recommend more "universal" accessories?

[Mark Pedersen]

I have a complete Zacutto baseplate/handles, battery plate for my Canon XL H1 rig and I like it for that camera (which is lighter weight), but having held both the Red and Zacutto systems, the Red set up is much more stable and "industrial strength" than the Zacutto gear.

I will probably integrate some components with my Red, but since I plan to go 19mm studio with an Arri MB 20 II in most cases, but 15mm when handheld, I don't really feel the need to use full Zacutto system with the Red.

I would concur the the Zacutto handles slip. IMO, they are "mickey mouse" compared to the Red handles.

[Yean Loon]

I have a complete Zacutto baseplate/handles, battery plate for my Canon XL H1 rig and I like it for that camera (which is lighter weight), but having held both the Red and Zacutto systems, the Red set up is much more stable and "industrial strength" than the Zacutto gear.

I will probably integrate some components with my Red, but since I plan to go 19mm studio with an Arri MB 20 II in most cases, but 15mm when handheld, I don't really feel the need to use full Zacutto system with the Red.

I would concur the the Zacutto handles slip. IMO, they are "mickey mouse" compared to the Red handles.

I thought it was the RED handles that slips???

[Mark Pedersen]

Well that shows to go ya. Handles slip. Agree with Red 1225. Most DPs just grab the rods and go for it. Or us one handle plus the FF.

It's easy to get caught up in accessorizing. I'm learning from experience. Start with the basics. Get what you know you need and go from there.

IMO, the Red gear is made to professional film production standards. It's well designed and machined. They thought things out and did it right.

With anything "universal" you pay a price in the sense that you don't get the same level of optimized functionality that you get with an integrated system.

[Yean Loon]

Thanks for all the input. I think i've just about made up my mind!! Cheers!

[Nick Gardner]

I have only ever "grabded the rods and went for it" out of necessity. Doing a 6 minute take with a thousand foot mag, and a bunch of AKS sucks in the first place, without a good hand held rig it's torture.

The biggest issue is balance. An S4, matte boxx, cine tape, etc all make a camera front heavy, the Red without a Magazine to counter balance that could be kind of nose heavy. Hopefully the Battery will be heavy enough to drag it back on an even keel.

If you are holding the hand held rig so that your elbows are resting on your chest (triangulation), then you are not Lifting the weight, and you are just steering the camera.

Cheers,
Nick

[red1225]

Nick,

I agree...hand holding any camera with a 1000' mag with or without handles is a drag. Having worked with the RED I also agree about the camera being a bit front heavy for hand held use. If you use long rods and back mount the battery this helps and you can still always add more weight to the rear for better balance.

I disagree with the resting your elbows on your chest however. This limits your mobility quite a bit. Lowering the center of gravity with the use of handles actually increases the weight considerably.

In some ways this is akin to using a fluid head and holding onto the mag and not the pan handle. Once again most professional and experienced operators use this method. You have better control and are more at one with the camera.


I have only ever "grabded the rods and went for it" out of necessity. Doing a 6 minute take with a thousand foot mag, and a bunch of AKS sucks in the first place, without a good hand held rig it's torture.

The biggest issue is balance. An S4, matte boxx, cine tape, etc all make a camera front heavy, the Red without a Magazine to counter balance that could be kind of nose heavy. Hopefully the Battery will be heavy enough to drag it back on an even keel.

If you are holding the hand held rig so that your elbows are resting on your chest (triangulation), then you are not Lifting the weight, and you are just steering the camera.

Cheers,
Nick

[Nick Gardner]

Lets just agree that different ops do different things. Some ACs really don't like when Ops grab the mag because it stresses the contacts for the take up motors, and can cause jams. They never designed the mag to take all the leverage applied to a fluid head. Rental gear? no sweat. But I wouldn't do it with my personal camera......

Oh and whats a pan handle? I can't seem to find one on my gear head....:usd:

Peace, and happy new year,

Nick

[Tonaci Tran]

The only thing about this Zacuto handheld configuration that won't fit my needs is the inability to quickly go from shoulder mount to tripod easily. I could be wrong but from the pic, the shoulder pad doesn't look like it has a quick release.

[red1225]

Lets just agree that different ops do different things. Some ACs really don't like when Ops grab the mag because it stresses the contacts for the take up motors, and can cause jams. They never designed the mag to take all the leverage applied to a fluid head. Rental gear? no sweat. But I wouldn't do it with my personal camera......

Oh and whats a pan handle? I can't seem to find one on my gear head....:usd:

Peace, and happy new year,

Nick

Never said anything about a geared head...I said fluid head. Also...I was a pro ac for 15 years and never ever once heard anything about (or had any issues with) the contacts on the mags or jams related to holding the mags. You're certainly entitled to your opinion...just relaying some info as to how the pros do it.

[zak forrest]

I've read somewhere here a handheld rig is coming out from Red.

where did you read this?

[tuki]

The only thing about this Zacuto handheld configuration that won't fit my needs is the inability to quickly go from shoulder mount to tripod easily. I could be wrong but from the pic, the shoulder pad doesn't look like it has a quick release.

yes, the shoulder pad does have a quick release. going from handheld to tripod is pretty quick.

[tuki]

the shoulder pad goes attached to rods, and the rods have the quick release