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Jannard
04-15-2012, 11:56 PM
OK... it begins.

Jim

http://www.redgrabs.com/up/1334611910.jpg

Alex Mills
04-15-2012, 11:58 PM
wowwww

Yannick Sadler
04-15-2012, 11:58 PM
he he he.

6K$! :-)

Same sensor size?

Joseph Coleman
04-15-2012, 11:59 PM
Fuck yes!!

Ryan Nichols
04-15-2012, 11:59 PM
Bring on the Dragon!

Danai Chutinaton
04-15-2012, 11:59 PM
Awesome!!!!!

Eirik Tyrihjel
04-16-2012, 12:00 AM
WOW! THAT kickstarted my day for sure! 6K, 15 stops and ONLY 6000$, I LOVE THIS RIDE!

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 12:00 AM
What are the Scarlet specs Jim?

Patrick Grossien
04-16-2012, 12:01 AM
Oh wow! Just what the doctor ordered! ;) awesomeness.

Scarlet pricing will be interesting ;)

Antonio Forjaz
04-16-2012, 12:01 AM
here we go.... AGAIN....

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 12:01 AM
Also, is there a RED ONE Dragon upgrade?! : )

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:02 AM
We are not sure yet of the specs for 6K but it will be at least 85fps. Scarlet specs and numbers have not been determined.

Jim

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:03 AM
There is no path for Dragon to the RED ONE. That upgrade path was RED ONE to EPIC.

Jim


Also, is there a RED ONE Dragon upgrade?! : )

Jeremy Neish
04-16-2012, 12:04 AM
Oh yeah. Count me in!

Detlev Eller
04-16-2012, 12:04 AM
:-) ... very cool

Paul E. McCarthy
04-16-2012, 12:04 AM
Rgamma3 & red color 3 for red one??? Maybe???

Philipe Ratton
04-16-2012, 12:05 AM
15+ gotta love this number !

John Allardice
04-16-2012, 12:05 AM
Will it be a physically larger sensor?.. Or more densely packet photosites on a S35 sized sensor?

Trevor Meeks
04-16-2012, 12:05 AM
Very cool. I assume EPICs will get upgrade priority, then Scarlet.

Great work, guys, Looking forward to seeing what you have up your sleeves on this one :)

Brad Allen
04-16-2012, 12:06 AM
15+ native? - wow!

So many things to save for!

Bob Gundu
04-16-2012, 12:06 AM
Great news guys.... Just curious why this news wasn't unleashed at the party?

jacob.schwarz
04-16-2012, 12:07 AM
Jim, well we be able to see some footage from the Dragon tomorrow at NAB?

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 12:07 AM
Well hey, I can swing it! How will the upgrades be conducted? Serial number/purchase date or first come/first serve?

Josef Gatti
04-16-2012, 12:07 AM
Looks like Scarlet will finally get some high frame rate 4k! Nervous about price though...

SUNILPREM
04-16-2012, 12:07 AM
WOW...................WOW......................... ..........You are great....................I love RED

Detlev Eller
04-16-2012, 12:09 AM
i like the design of this ... :-)



OK... it begins.

Jim

http://www.redgrabs.com/up/1334611910.jpg

Philipe Ratton
04-16-2012, 12:09 AM
03:07 here now, bye bye for my sleep!

Fabio Aguiar
04-16-2012, 12:09 AM
bring it on!

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:10 AM
Just so we are clear... this year means upgrades begin before the end of this year. Late in the year.

Jim

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 12:11 AM
That gives us all time to save up for all of this JIm!

Yannick Sadler
04-16-2012, 12:11 AM
We are not sure yet of the specs for 6K but it will be at least 85fps. Scarlet specs and numbers have not been determined.

Jim

Are you targeting a least 6K@24FPS on Scarlet or is it a too far stretch for the engine?

Patrick Grossien
04-16-2012, 12:11 AM
I wanna see some lowlight and extreme DR pix so bad! :)

Pawel Achtel
04-16-2012, 12:12 AM
What is the size of the sensor?

Philipe Ratton
04-16-2012, 12:12 AM
nice, time enough to scratch the surface on my scarlet capabilities

Cüneyt Kaya
04-16-2012, 12:12 AM
i am so glad i am a red customer. wow.
are the 6k FF or in the size of the MX sensor (S35)? (hope my question doesnt confuse)
will it be date of delivery? starting from M moving to X etc.?
super price!

Josef Gatti
04-16-2012, 12:12 AM
Safe to guess (price aside) Scarlet at 6k will be similar to current performance (comparative to epic) around 12fps 6k, 30fps 5k, 48fps 4k? Maybe?

Jeff Whitehurst
04-16-2012, 12:13 AM
RED is taking no prisoners :-) Any news on when an Epic with installed Dragon will be available? Before or after the upgrades?

Trevor Emmerson
04-16-2012, 12:13 AM
Will there be an option to buy a new 6k Epic or is this just for sensor upgrades first up?

Trevor Meeks
04-16-2012, 12:15 AM
Are you targeting a least 6K@24FPS on Scarlet or is it a too far stretch for the engine?

I'm gonna guess at least 5K 24fps or 30fps, for finishing in 4K.

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 12:18 AM
What now happens to Epics and Scarlets bought online from today? Will they have Dragon pre-installed? I've just bought a Scarlet... and it's gone back in to very probably have it's sensor replaced, only 3 weeks old; I hope I don't have to pay more for an upgrade than I would for buying it on the store as a whole Scarlet. *sigh*

Steve Sherrick
04-16-2012, 12:19 AM
What now happens to Epics and Scarlets bought online from today? Will they have Dragon pre-installed? I've just bought a Scarlet... and it's gone back in to very probably have it's sensor replaced, only 3 weeks old; I hope I don't have to pay more for an upgrade than I would for buying it on the store as a whole Scarlet. *sigh*
Doesn't look like the program gets going until end of the year.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:19 AM
Dragon upgrades will not begin until the end of this year. EPICs are 1st.

Jim

Kevin Marshall
04-16-2012, 12:20 AM
What now happens to Epics and Scarlets bought online from today? Will they have Dragon pre-installed? I've just bought a Scarlet... and it's gone back in to very probably have it's sensor replaced, only 3 weeks old; I hope I don't have to pay more for an upgrade than I would for buying it on the store as a whole Scarlet. *sigh*

Considering the upgrade process doesn't start till "late this year," I doubt we'll see cameras with pre-installed Dragon sensors till sometime next year...

EDIT: Well Steve and the man himself beat me to it. Nevermind

Trevor Meeks
04-16-2012, 12:20 AM
Plenty of time to save up :)

Malvin Ng
04-16-2012, 12:21 AM
Can't wait to see the footage :D

Jan Reiff
04-16-2012, 12:24 AM
will the dragon update program run for us european via london red UK?

i hope because of avoiding the custom issues again ...

Michael Millichamp
04-16-2012, 12:24 AM
Awesome!

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:24 AM
We are working on that...

Jim


will the dragon update program run for us european via london red UK?

i hope because of avoiding the custom issues again ...

Cüneyt Kaya
04-16-2012, 12:25 AM
would be super with europe!

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 12:25 AM
Dragon upgrades will not begin until the end of this year. EPICs are 1st.

Jim

If you can tell me that the Scarlet that I've bought, plus the Dragon upgrade later this year will be roughly the equivalent of the full price of Scarlet with Dragon in 2013 (i'm guessing), then my heart won't be in my throat until then. At the moment I'm biting my nails hoping buying the Scarlet just now hasn't just cost me more money.

Matthew Richard Harris
04-16-2012, 12:26 AM
Hey Jim. Good job man. Just knowing that my Scarlet has an upgrade path makes me feel sound in my investment with you.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:28 AM
Scarlet upgrades won't begin until 2013. 1st EPIC upgrades begin end of this year.

Jim


If you can tell me that the Scarlet that I've bought, plus the Dragon upgrade later this year will be roughly the equivalent of the full price of Scarlet with Dragon in 2013 (i'm guessing), then my heart won't be in my throat until then. At the moment I'm biting my nails hoping buying the Scarlet just now hasn't just cost me more money.

Mike Lary
04-16-2012, 12:29 AM
Dragon upgrades will not begin until the end of this year. EPICs are 1st.

Jim

Sounds great. I have plenty of 5K shooting to do in the meantime.

Phil Holland
04-16-2012, 12:30 AM
Hey! It's not midnight!

Kevin Marshall
04-16-2012, 12:30 AM
If you can tell me that the Scarlet that I've bought, plus the Dragon upgrade later this year will be roughly the equivalent of the full price of Scarlet with Dragon in 2013 (i'm guessing), then my heart won't be in my throat until then. At the moment I'm biting my nails hoping buying the Scarlet just now hasn't just cost me more money.

Well, for the MX sensor in the Red One, people upgrading their cameras had an advantage - both getting a camera with the new sensor before it could be bought off-the-shelf, and paying a little less (camera+upgrade) than the eventual Red Ones with the MX preinstalled.

Point being, I'd hang on to your camera and not worry too much.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:30 AM
It is midnight somewhere!

And we aren't late.

Jim


Hey! It's not midnight!

Kevin Marshall
04-16-2012, 12:31 AM
And we aren't late.
Progress!

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 12:31 AM
Scarlet upgrades won't begin until 2013. 1st EPIC upgrades begin end of this year.

Jim

Kk, well at this time I'm just going to be happy that I've got my Scarlet, and happy that the dragon is coming. Thanks Jim, it's everything I've hoped it would be, can't wait to boast about what's coming to everyone.

Erich Ocean
04-16-2012, 12:33 AM
Is the pixel size staying the same (0.0054mm)?

Tehben Dean
04-16-2012, 12:33 AM
It is midnight somewhere!

And we aren't late.

Jim

Hahaha gotta love it!

I will add to the question, is Dragon the same physical sensor size?

Jan Reiff
04-16-2012, 12:34 AM
Jim that would be more than great. we really would appreciate this, many of us here of the european red customers have 2 or more epics to upgrade ;-)
would make the things much easier.

Kevin Marshall
04-16-2012, 12:35 AM
Is the pixel size staying the same (0.0054mm)?
Doing a little math - assuming it is the same pixel pitch, 6K would neatly get you 36mm across. I'm not usually a betting man, but that's where my money would go.

If it turns out my money was smart, question would be Red's usual 2:1 aspect, or traditional 3:2?

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:36 AM
The Dragon sensor is slightly larger than the Mysterium-X sensor and the pixel size is slightly smaller. The pixel design and sensor design makes all the difference in the world.

Most all of your current lenses will work.

Jim

Ketch Rossi
04-16-2012, 12:36 AM
Ha ha, I sware no one at RED had given away any info, but on the Script I had wrote last week that the Epic was been shot at 120fps full 5k, I guess I knew it... ;)


We can't wait to bring M8 under the knife Jim, and oh, great seen you and the boys and girls at the REDUSER PARTY, YET AN OTHER GREAT EXPERIENCE!!... ;)

Malvin Ng
04-16-2012, 12:37 AM
I wonder how the low light performance is compared to the MX :)

Kevin Marshall
04-16-2012, 12:37 AM
Well, so much for betting! Guess I'll stick to waiting and listening...

Alexandros Tsoupras
04-16-2012, 12:38 AM
Jim what is the size of the Dragon sensor? Full frame or S35?

Brad Allen
04-16-2012, 12:38 AM
The Dragon sensor is slightly larger than the Mysterium-X sensor and the pixel size is slightly smaller. The pixel design and sensor design makes all the difference in the world.

Awesome - can't wait to see some images Jim :)

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:39 AM
Much better than M-X.

Jim


I wonder how the low light performance is compared to the MX :)

Phil Holland
04-16-2012, 12:39 AM
I'm guessing it's going to land in the 6.14K-ish range. I need to save up for an Epic!

Chris McKechnie
04-16-2012, 12:39 AM
I'm guessing low light performance will be significantly improved. Can't wait for the end of the year!!! BRING ON THE DRAGON!!!

Erich Ocean
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
Man, I'm really excited about the Dragon sensor. Spec's look just about perfect, and the price is awesome. Thanks Jim and everyone else for making this happen.

Dave Blackham
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
What are the noise figures and sensitivity ?

Uli Plank
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
The Dragon sensor is slightly larger than the Mysterium-X sensor and the pixel size is slightly smaller. The pixel design and sensor design makes all the difference in the world.

Most all of your current lenses will work.

Jim


That's so important! We have invested more into lenses than into our stage 3 Epic.

SUNILPREM
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
There have any sensor crop in various resolution?or line skip?........?

Timur Civan
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
Great news guys.... Just curious why this news wasn't unleashed at the party?

:) oh well. Still awesome news.

brett ogden
04-16-2012, 12:40 AM
great seen you and the boys and girls at the REDUSER PARTY, YET AN OTHER GREAT EXPERIENCE!!... ;)

Ketch great to Meet you @ the Party see you tomorrow :-)

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:41 AM
Incredibly low and high.

Jim


What are the noise figures and sensitivity ?

Robert Berger
04-16-2012, 12:41 AM
he he he.

6K$! :-)

Same sensor size?sensor size? +1

Sergio Perez
04-16-2012, 12:41 AM
Yay! :) I was expecting this price point, to be honest! What are the other advantages we will see with the Dragon compared to current MX? Low light, for example? Will it bring a new redcode compression to the table?

Also, please, please push for 100fps in 6K (would love full range, but WS will do too) Maximum! We PAL users love 100fps ! :)

I'm so glad on being on the red boat! :) !

Sergio Herencias
04-16-2012, 12:42 AM
WOHOO, amazing news, thank you again RED - just awesome!!

Zeb B
04-16-2012, 12:42 AM
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5345/6919373458_1bd9b1782a_c.jpg

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 12:43 AM
Jim BTW does this mean Red One is Dead....ish? given that Scarlet will overtake it?

Petri Teittinen
04-16-2012, 12:44 AM
Much better than M-X.

Jim
That's what I wanted to hear. Thank you.

Jan Reiff
04-16-2012, 12:44 AM
15 stops, ... okidoki, means, with hdrx landscape shots with 21 stops possible ...

or soft use of hdrx with 1-2 stops means 17 stops, ...

any questions? hehh hehh

Petri Teittinen
04-16-2012, 12:45 AM
$6K for 6K. Someone has a sense of humor.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:46 AM
Sensor size is 30x15.8mm. Pixel size is 5 micron.

Jim

Paul Nordin
04-16-2012, 12:48 AM
Very good news. Looking forward to seeing some demo footage. Is any Dragon footage playing at NAB? If so I'm psyched to see it!

Gavin Greenwalt
04-16-2012, 12:49 AM
Rolling shutter improvements too?

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:51 AM
Didn't really think there was a problem with rolling shutter and EPIC with M-X sensor... but yes, read-reset is faster.

Jim


Rolling shutter improvements too?

Erich Ocean
04-16-2012, 12:51 AM
Sensor size is 30x15.8mm. Pixel size is 5 micron.

Jim

That means that at 1.25 oversampling, Super16mm lenses now deliver a pristine 2K master within the standard Super16mm imaging area!

Timur Civan
04-16-2012, 12:51 AM
The Dragon sensor is slightly larger than the Mysterium-X sensor and the pixel size is slightly smaller. The pixel design and sensor design makes all the difference in the world.

Most all of your current lenses will work.

Jim

So glad my panchros will cover........ :). Just might have to watch out for the 18mm......

Evan Starkey
04-16-2012, 12:52 AM
Good god this is all to much way to go guys....now wheres my doctor

Jannard
04-16-2012, 12:52 AM
The good news is that if you have a lens with limited coverage... you just might be limited to 5.5K... :-)

Jim

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 12:54 AM
5.5k? Too much! Can’t WAIT!

Lorenzo Straight
04-16-2012, 12:54 AM
Sweet Friction!

Yannick Sadler
04-16-2012, 12:55 AM
The good news is that if you have a lens with limited coverage... you just might be limited to 5.5K... :-)

Jim

Bummer... I knew there was a catch somewhere. It was to good to be true... :-P

Ketch Rossi
04-16-2012, 12:56 AM
Sensor size is 30x15.8mm. Pixel size is 5 micron.

Jim


2:1 LOVE IT!!

noah newtown
04-16-2012, 12:57 AM
WOW...what is the max. framerate at 4k and 2k ?

Erich Ocean
04-16-2012, 12:57 AM
The good news is that if you have a lens with limited coverage... you just might be limited to 5.5K... :-)

Jim

The sensor/pixel size tweaks are huge! Now you should be able to get a 5K recording with a standard Cooke S4. :-)

Ketch Rossi
04-16-2012, 12:58 AM
Ketch great to Meet you @ the Party see you tomorrow :-)


Likewise Brett... ;)

Pawel Achtel
04-16-2012, 12:58 AM
The good news is that if you have a lens with limited coverage... you just might be limited to 5.5K... :-)

Jim

Wow! 6k underwater. I'd like to see that. For the first time ever!

Jim, what do I need to do to get a beta implant of this reptile to put it inside the DeepX or 3Deep to see the first underwater footage that resolves 6k corner to corner (and unlike terrestial lenses placed behind optical ports that create field curvature and chromatic aberrations limiting the edge sharpness to about 300 lines).

Hans Magnus Kvåle
04-16-2012, 12:59 AM
Sweet! What a way to begin our day with news like this :-)

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:00 AM
I'd love to know where this leaves the Red One, will you guys just stop selling them?

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:01 AM
Strictly a math problem. Think EPIC M-X speed. But with more resolution and dynamic range.

Jim


WOW...what is the max. framerate at 4k and 2k ?

Yusuf Thakur
04-16-2012, 01:01 AM
Jim,

Since the upgrade is not for the RED ONE, can I upgrade the Epic to Dragon and the Red One to MX from the Epic.
The RED ONE is still ahead of all the other 4K, and I want to continue using it for another 5 years.
Thanks for listening I had posted this yesterday I am 12 hours ahead and had a blast on the FUN post.

Yusuf Thakur
VFX.DUBAI
www.vfxme.com
VFX

Peter Karlsson
04-16-2012, 01:05 AM
Mmmmm 15+ stops and faster read reset.. That would bring something close to 22 stops in HDR mode right? :) My chrome spheres will get a new camera gazing at it hehe

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 01:05 AM
6k, more DR and higher FPS, I called it last week

Tehben Dean
04-16-2012, 01:05 AM
With the increasing sensor resolution etc. and the short lifespan of HD, do you see the world settling on 4k as a lasting standard or do you think we will keep climbing. At some point resolution will no longer be noticeable, is 4k the future?

Joel Arvidsson
04-16-2012, 01:07 AM
To me the best upgrade for the Scarlet would be to not have the "cropped sensor" at 25fps. Will this stay the same with the dragon upgrade? and yes I se the dilemma to not make a the Scarlet an Epic.
Then again it will cost more to upgrade.

Mike 'Fireman' Ross
04-16-2012, 01:07 AM
Last year at NAB I got all excited when I was allowed to fondle a Scarlet Fixed.

Now I'm an EPIC owner and I have to say, 6K for $6K sounds a heck of a lot more useful than 3k for $3k ;-)

High DR / low noise / low light... That thing is made for me. I'm in line!

Mike

Lorenzo Straight
04-16-2012, 01:09 AM
Red seems to be staying at minimum, 2K ahead of everyone else. Great strategy guys. It takes about 2 to 4 years for everyone to get the smoke out of their eyes.

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:13 AM
If Scarlet is even $10k for the Dragon upgrade that puts the package price of Scarlet up at the price of a Red One. Red One is gonna have a price drop and make our Red Ones worth next to nothing huh?

Tony Rudenko
04-16-2012, 01:15 AM
I have been waiting for this for a while, but I feel compelled to say I'm a little bummed that there is no upgrade path for the Red One, even if it were still only 4.5K at standard Frame Rates (would have made a Great B Cam like it does with the MX).... (Paraphrasing) "Those of you who hung on to their Red One's will be really happy they did" & "Everything is upgradeable"... But hey, I'm excited none the less!

Filip Christensen
04-16-2012, 01:15 AM
Thank you RED!

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:15 AM
David Fincher shot "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo" on RED ONE M-X. So your RED ONE is worth nothing?

Jim


If Scarlet is even $10k for the Dragon upgrade that puts the package price of Scarlet up at the price of a Red One. Red One is gonna have a price drop and make our Red Ones worth next to nothing huh?

davidtorres
04-16-2012, 01:15 AM
Epic-M will be in first position in the line for up grade ?

Ryan Nichols
04-16-2012, 01:17 AM
My R1 is still a beast. I love it so much.

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:18 AM
I have been waiting for this for a while, but I feel compelled to say I'm a little bummed that there is no upgrade path for the Red One, even if it were still only 4.5K at standard Frame Rates (would have made a Great B Cam like it does with the MX).... (Paraphrasing) "Those of you who hung on to their Red One's will be really happy they did" & "Everything is upgradeable"... But hey, I'm excited none the less!

yeah I always kinda hoped there would be something behind that old quote. Wish there was something left in store for the Red One, sad to just see it lose value every month.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:19 AM
The RED ONE had an upgrade path to EPIC.

Think of what options you had with any other camera company.

Jim


yeah I always kinda hoped there would be something behind that old quote. Wish there was something left in store for the Red One, sad to just see it lose value every month.

Asif Limbada
04-16-2012, 01:25 AM
Sign me up guys

Tim van Dammen
04-16-2012, 01:26 AM
I'm selling my Red MX - I missed stage 3 by 3 days due to confusion with the seller... oh well.

I'm only selling the MX so I can move up to Epic anyhow.

My question re the dragon sensor is: is the extra latitude in the direction of the highlights or the darks or both?

I'd love to see the Red get even more see-in-the-dark.

Zeb B
04-16-2012, 01:26 AM
yeah I always kinda hoped there would be something behind that old quote. Wish there was something left in store for the Red One, sad to just see it lose value every month.

joking right? R1 has been off the chart for upgrades and manufacturer loving. I have never seen else like it in any industry. Do the annual depreciation to zero . . . if you R1 guys haven't been able to cover that annual cost then find another career! That is not an insult - it would be true if it was a farm tractor or airplane.

James Mccloud
04-16-2012, 01:26 AM
humana humana humana SHAZAAAAM!

Sergio Perez
04-16-2012, 01:27 AM
I'm in if there's already a waiting list!!! :)

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:27 AM
Don't get me wrong Jim, I love my Reds. I'm happy that I'll at least be able to upgrade my Scarlet to Dragon. I'll be buying an Epic later this year. Just my second handy Red One MX has lost so many dollars in the last few months, I fear that with the pricing of a Scarlet with dragon upgrade will force my One MX's price down even further.

James Mccloud
04-16-2012, 01:32 AM
DOPE!!!

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:34 AM
joking right? R1 has been off the chart for upgrades and manufacturer loving. I have never seen else like it in any industry. Do the annual depreciation to zero . . . if you R1 guys haven't been able to cover that annual cost then find another career! That is not an insult - it would be true if it was a farm tractor or airplane.

Mine was bought second hand for what I figured was a fair price, but it dropped drastically quickly. I'm ok with it, it's just money, but a person can hope can't they. No need to be like that.

Phil Holland
04-16-2012, 01:34 AM
Hopefully Scarlet can get 6k at speed. Maybe 30fps. Fingers crossed. I call dibs on being first in line for the Scarlet upgrade :)

Trevor Meier
04-16-2012, 01:35 AM
This is fantastic! Love it...

Zeb B
04-16-2012, 01:36 AM
Hopefully Scarlet can get 6k at speed. Maybe 30fps. Fingers crossed. I call dibs on being first in line for the Scarlet upgrade :)

No one would deserve it more. You are a huge resource to the entire RED community

Mike 'Fireman' Ross
04-16-2012, 01:37 AM
Don't get me wrong Jim, I love my Reds. I'm happy that I'll at least be able to upgrade my Scarlet to Dragon. I'll be buying an Epic later this year. Just my second handy Red One MX has lost so many dollars in the last few months, I fear that with the pricing of a Scarlet with dragon upgrade will force my One MX's price down even further.

Are the images it makes any worse than they were yesterday?

Are the images it makes vastlty better the images needed - still - for some reasonably large percentage of jobs?

Quit griping man.

Mike

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:37 AM
Everything you buy in technology goes down in value the minute you buy it. We have provided a way to mitigate that loss with upgrade programs. The real way to win this game is to put your tools to work.

Jim


Mine was bought second hand for what I figured was a fair price, but it dropped drastically quickly. I'm ok with it, it's just money, but a person can hope can't they. No need to be like that.

Patrick Grossien
04-16-2012, 01:38 AM
The RED ONE had an upgrade path to EPIC.

Think of what options you had with any other camera company.

Jim

I know it's your baby so I fully understand you have to defend it. Its just sad that every time you have to do it over again. Everybody should know by know what the deal is.

No one else would be as calm repeating himself over and over again! No one else would answer at all. Not Sony not canon. No one

Yusuf Thakur
04-16-2012, 01:38 AM
Don't get me wrong Jim, I love my Reds. I'm happy that I'll at least be able to upgrade my Scarlet to Dragon. I'll be buying an Epic later this year. Just my second handy Red One MX has lost so many dollars in the last few months, I fear that with the pricing of a Scarlet with dragon upgrade will force my One MX's price down even further.

Hey guys what are you talking about. I have both an Epic and RED ONE, I now have two cameras that shoot 4K, so the B Unit has been upgraded from HD to 4K.
Can you buy any other 4K camera YET even after this NAB(Except a RED), there will be nothing that will be a better 4K camera price/performance wise, that has
internal 4K recording, raw, and host of other stuff. The world has yet to catch up with 4K Projection, let alone Broadcast.

Do not be mistaken that you NOW have dud with the RED ONE, you can still go out there and shoot incredible footage.

Yusuf Thakur
VFX,Dubai
www.vfxme.com

Chuck Z
04-16-2012, 01:39 AM
Any new RED Rocket announcements to mitigate all the extra data wrangling with 6K coming off the sensor?

Sergio Perez
04-16-2012, 01:39 AM
No one would deserve it more. You are a huge resource to the entire RED community

+1 to Phil and all the help he has given to the community!

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:40 AM
Everything is being looked at... including the Rocket.

Jim


Any new RED Rocket announcements to mitigate all the extra data wrangling with 6K coming off the sensor?

Rob Ruffo
04-16-2012, 01:41 AM
Hey guys what are you talking about. I have both an Epic and RED ONE, I now have two cameras that shoot 4K, so the B Unit has been upgraded from HD to 4K.
Can you buy any other 4K camera YET even after this NAB(Except a RED), there will be nothing that will be a better 4K camera price/performance wise, that has
internal 4K recording, raw, and host of other stuff. The world has yet to catch up with 4K Projection, let alone Broadcast.

Do not be mistaken that you NOW have dud with the RED ONE, you can still go out there and shoot incredible footage.

Yusuf Thakur
VFX,Dubai
www.vfxme.com (http://www.vfxme.com)

Many high end prods are being shot TODAY with cameras far less capable than a One MX and they are getting away with it. It still does more TODAY than a Scarlet, it is still rock-solid TODAY.

Trevor Meeks
04-16-2012, 01:42 AM
Meanwhile... Canon C300 customers are kicking themselves after seeing their cameras become obsolete barely after they've been delivered.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:43 AM
They were obsolete at the announcement.

Jim


Meanwhile... Canon C300 customers are kicking themselves after seeing their cameras become obsolete barely after they've been delivered.

Chuck Z
04-16-2012, 01:43 AM
Everything is being looked at... including the Rocket.

Jim
That's good to hear!

Also, hopefully a new Rocket will allow users to select their own debayering methods like in REDCINE-X [Pro]!

Phil Holland
04-16-2012, 01:45 AM
They were obsolete at the announcement.

Jim

I can't fathom a company announcing something that was EOL prior to be released. Who's buying them in 2012? Reason #1 I purchased the Scarlet X instead.

(and thank you gentlemen)

Demetri Zuev
04-16-2012, 01:45 AM
I was sure that you guys will deliver beyond 4K and I was right.

Good luck to Sony, Canon and everyone else with their "cutting edge" cameras.

Really hope that Scarlet's upgrade details will be determined soon.

Gary Paul Walker
04-16-2012, 01:46 AM
Hopefully Scarlet can get 6k at speed. Maybe 30fps. Fingers crossed. I call dibs on being first in line for the Scarlet upgrade :)

Dibs...? DIBS???? Since when did that ever work? ;)

It would be great to see 6k @ 30fps... but then, I was under the impression that Scarlet would be going through a board upgrade as well.. maybe I misunderstood....

Rob Anderson
04-16-2012, 01:47 AM
David Fincher shot "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo" on RED ONE M-X. So your RED ONE is worth nothing?

Jim
As they say...
BOOM.

Tom Gleeson
04-16-2012, 01:48 AM
Good news on the Dragon sensor and I am excited to see actual images. At 15 stops I expect the camera will outperform film. Was hoping for a larger physical sensor size but even the 1mm increase is a plus. Bring on some images.

Adam Michael Carr
04-16-2012, 01:48 AM
They were obsolete at the announcement.

Jim

HAHAHA I love it. Thanks for a great party tonight Jim and Red Crew. I had a blast!!! I really liked the way you started your speech with "Red is the color of passion,The color of anger, and the color of war......freakin epic man!

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 01:49 AM
Hey guys what are you talking about. I have both an Epic and RED ONE, I now have two cameras that shoot 4K, so the B Unit has been upgraded from HD to 4K.
Can you buy any other 4K camera YET even after this NAB(Except a RED), there will be nothing that will be a better 4K camera price/performance wise, that has
internal 4K recording, raw, and host of other stuff. The world has yet to catch up with 4K Projection, let alone Broadcast.

Do not be mistaken that you NOW have dud with the RED ONE, you can still go out there and shoot incredible footage.

Yusuf Thakur
VFX,Dubai
www.vfxme.com (http://www.vfxme.com)

No you're totally right, I am in no way disappointed with my Red One MX, it will be an awesome camera until the day it dies. I was mainly querying the prices and state of the Red One as an asset. That's all. I never said I don't like it, I LOVE IT.

Jannard
04-16-2012, 01:50 AM
Actually... Red is the color of life. The color of passion. Aggression. War.

Jim


HAHAHA I love it. Thanks for a great party tonight Jim and Red Crew. I had a blast!!! I really liked the way you started your speech with "Red is the color of passion,The color of anger, and the color of war......freakin epic man!

RyanDean
04-16-2012, 01:50 AM
I only just got my head around 5k now you're telling me I'm going to be able to shoot 6k?? Wow. Simply wow.

Jason Wingrove
04-16-2012, 02:02 AM
6K for 6K .. two soccer moms in a hot tub
j

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:02 AM
Is Dragon at the stage where we could see screenshots or video tests in the near future? How good is it's low light ability and highlights?

Mike Halper
04-16-2012, 02:06 AM
Will Epic-X (and Epic-M) owners get to upgrade to Dragon before new Epics start shipping with Dragon already installed?

Zeb B
04-16-2012, 02:06 AM
Actually... Red is the color of life. The color of passion. Aggression. War.

Jim

and love and success in many cultures

Hey Jim & Jarred, as much fun Nov 3rd was . . . this flurry of releases just blows that date away.

Cheers and goodnight!

Justin O'Neill
04-16-2012, 02:09 AM
So excited for Dragon Jim. 85 19MP stills per second is blowing my mind!

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:09 AM
I too wish for a low light ability but the sensor is a daylight sensor so without a full histo you are going to get some noise. For now, use the fastest lens you can find f1.2 or faster.

For highlights, we get a few more stops of DR. It's possible with enough DR you might be able to leave your filter kit at home.




Is Dragon at the stage where we could see screenshots or video tests in the near future? How good is it's low light ability and highlights?

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:11 AM
19MP still snow with 6k? That's 5MP more than 5k?


So excited for Dragon Jim. 85 19MP stills per second is blowing my mind!

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:11 AM
technically you can get 120 19MP stills per second?

Malvin Ng
04-16-2012, 02:15 AM
technically you can get 120 19MP stills per second?

The picture says 120fps @ 5K not 6K

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:15 AM
I too wish for a low light ability but the sensor is a daylight sensor so without a full histo you are going to get some noise. For now, use the fastest lens you can find f1.2 or faster.

For highlights, we get a few more stops of DR. It's possible with enough DR you might be able to leave your filter kit at home.

Yeah hey if it has more low light, cool, if not, that's a mega bonus because it'll be up in the highlights.

Niko Pueringer
04-16-2012, 02:16 AM
Hey Jim and co,

Scarlet user here, just chiming in to say thanks for enabling us growing artists. I'm really looking forward to the Dragon, and it's really incredible that you offer an upgrade path for the lower-end users. Looking forward to more!

Jannard
04-16-2012, 02:16 AM
Some of each...

Jim


Yeah hey if it has more low light, cool, if not, that's a mega bonus because it'll be up in the highlights.

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:17 AM
All these new updates/gear have got me a little too excited tonight. If I was in Vegas with you all, I'd be really drunk.


The picture says 120fps @ 5K not 6K

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:18 AM
Some of each...

Jim

*faints*

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:19 AM
Cool, so much beauty in low light situations.


Some of each...

Jim

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:21 AM
...and what an upgrade path it was for us. Truly a special deal and now the M upgrade. You do your customers right Jim.


There is no path for Dragon to the RED ONE. That upgrade path was RED ONE to EPIC.

Jim

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 02:22 AM
hahahaha


*faints*

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:22 AM
Cool, so much beauty in low light situations.

I can't wait!!!!!

Peter Stadelmann
04-16-2012, 02:24 AM
Wow! The best news ever...thanks RED!!!

Spike Baumann
04-16-2012, 02:26 AM
Gonna dump our lights for some candles...

Mike Halper
04-16-2012, 02:27 AM
I understand upgrades won't happen until the end of the year, but how do we order and get on the queue now? :biggrin:

Niko Pueringer
04-16-2012, 02:30 AM
Any chance you will post example footage online soon?

shashbugu
04-16-2012, 02:31 AM
INCREDIBLE....

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:35 AM
Any chance you will post example footage online soon?

yeah +1

Patrick Grossien
04-16-2012, 02:35 AM
Some of each...

Jim

Give us stills or clips to marvel at ! ;) though I'm quite certain the red theater at the booth might provide just that... Sigh!

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:37 AM
oh just read this in LOOM thread in response to "is [loom] shot on a "dragonized Epic"?", so I guess no images will be available till later this year
-------------------------------------------------------------
No. EPIC M-X.

Dragon sensors not ready until the end of this year.

Jim


http://www.reduser.net/forum/images/redfox/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Demetri Zuev http://www.reduser.net/forum/images/redfox/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?p=987275#post987275)
Jim, is this shot on a "dragonized" Epic?

Peter Stadelmann
04-16-2012, 02:47 AM
Ups, i think Canon gets roasted again:violent5:!!!!!!!!!

Alvise Tedesco
04-16-2012, 02:50 AM
Great news. Wow on the much better DR.
I imagine Dragon Epic and Scarlet will maintain somewhere the same actual performance difference between their (them? their? my fcking english is fcking worst than my italian, wtf)
Since Scarlet is the "lower end" camera, I really wellcome the better sensitivity and hope you'll see the importance of pushing overcrank at lower (think of today 3k) resolutions.
I mean I would prefer if you keep the new boards affordable skipping the 24/25 fps at 6k. Even at 5k.

Mike Halper
04-16-2012, 02:53 AM
So with 15 stops DR native, what is it with HDRx?

Adrian T.
04-16-2012, 02:54 AM
So with 15 stops DR native, what is it with HDRx?

21 stops! :ihih:

Mike Halper
04-16-2012, 02:56 AM
So no potential firmware change to add even more with the new sensor? Just thought the new sensor might be able to allow more than +6. Still awesome though.

Scott Summers
04-16-2012, 02:57 AM
21 stops! :ihih:

That...blows...my...mind!!!

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 03:02 AM
You know they will update the firmware on everything, dragon included.


So no potential firmware change to add even more with the new sensor? Just thought the new sensor might be able to allow more than +6. Still awesome though.

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 03:03 AM
What is the max DR on film?


21 stops! :ihih:

Jeff Whitehurst
04-16-2012, 03:09 AM
I'm no expert, but I did see this Wikipedia page that says the human eye is capable of ~20 stops
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_eye#Dynamic_range

Daniel Murphy
04-16-2012, 03:10 AM
Sorry guys but I must click 'Like' :-)

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 03:12 AM
I'm good with that. Film what you see.

Thanks Jeff.


I'm no expert, but I did see this Wikipedia page that says the human eye is capable of ~20 stops
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_eye#Dynamic_range

Will Keir
04-16-2012, 03:14 AM
Dragon sensors not ready until the end of this year.

Jim


http://www.reduser.net/forum/images/redfox/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Demetri Zuev http://www.reduser.net/forum/images/redfox/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?p=987275#post987275)
Jim, is this shot on a "dragonized" Epic?


Good. That will give me plenty of time to dig 6k worth of ditches.

Ambarish Manepalli
04-16-2012, 03:15 AM
15 stops of dynamic range with more in HDRx opens up so much more... Can't wait to save for the Epic or upgrade our Scarlet. Red delivers.
Leaving every other major manufacturer to scratch their heads, and cast dispersions. I'm really looking forward to end of 2012 and 2013.

shashbugu
04-16-2012, 03:22 AM
freakishly advanced resolution and DR

Jeff Whitehurst
04-16-2012, 03:29 AM
What is the max DR on film?

David Mullens says he counts on 10 stops when shooting film.
http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?47950-Dynamic-Range-of-quot-Super-35-quot-Celluloid-Film&p=632327&viewfull=1#post632327

Michael Ou
04-16-2012, 03:31 AM
Scarlet upgrades won't begin until 2013. 1st EPIC upgrades begin end of this year.

Jim
Only RED gives us Christmas announcements in April!!! Never in the history of the art has its tools and its processes become a source of grand inspiration, as evidenced by the goosebumps I get each time a new announcement is made. Perhaps its because our possibilities to create are no longer limited by tools of yesteryear and monstrous financial models. The fact that Red is exceeding our expectations and firing up our imaginations to unimagined possibilities as to what we can create with these tools is true cause to rejoice! It will be a very good year and an even better Holiday!!! Merry Christmas to us ALL!!!!

CsabaJuhasz
04-16-2012, 03:36 AM
Wow! You guys really went crazy!!! :-)

luigivaltulini
04-16-2012, 03:47 AM
yehaaaaaaaaaa DRAGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNNN

THANKS
RED TEAM :)))))))

Rob Ruffo
04-16-2012, 03:50 AM
I'm no expert, but I did see this Wikipedia page that says the human eye is capable of ~20 stops
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_eye#Dynamic_range

That is debatable. Your eye moves around, and the iris opens and closes. That range is not all at once.

Rob Ruffo
04-16-2012, 03:51 AM
Good. That will give me plenty of time to dig 6k worth of ditches.

If you own a Scarlet, might be a bit more than 6K. Not sure how much more.

Peter Karlsson
04-16-2012, 03:52 AM
Any chance we will see a "DragonFF" sensor with FF35 aspect ratio (30mmx20mm)!? That extra height would be gold for all VFX/ANA work :) I m willing to throw in a extra grand or two for that option :)

George Petersen
04-16-2012, 03:57 AM
Actually... Red is the color of life. The color of passion. Aggression. War.

Jim

It's also the color of blood and Canon's new balance sheet! Between Red's and Nikon's new products, Canon is having their ass kicked bad/good! :emote_headwall:

Jeff Whitehurst
04-16-2012, 03:57 AM
That is debatable. Your eye moves around, and the iris opens and closes. That range is not all at once.
Ok, like I said I'm no expert. Does seem like the Dragon sensor has the eye's range of capability covered though, no?

ericyoung
04-16-2012, 04:08 AM
Just read all Jim and Jarred's NAB updates - head spinning. It's too much for a gearhead to take! :biggrin:

I was trying to stop spending money!!

Biggest for me are Dragon 15stops with really low noise. Redray and Red Projector.

Brett Clements
04-16-2012, 04:12 AM
Congrats guys. Love to see a Company just polarize a whole trade show with the picture of a Dragon.

Adam Howden
04-16-2012, 04:16 AM
This is excellent news guys! Would be great if the new sensor had a frame size choice that is the same as true academy Super 35mm physical dimensions, whatever that is :-)

Daniel Peters
04-16-2012, 04:37 AM
I'd just like to say...it took me almost 3-4 months to choose between #canon and #red for my future camera, so so happy i chose #red ;)

Had my Scarlet for about just under a month and love it

I hope since the Scarlet was due 120fps in SD
maybe with the dragon update the 120fps will be in 3K with either no crop or the crop 3K is currently in

4K would be great but i will def settle with 120fps in 3K ;)

Paul Russell
04-16-2012, 04:41 AM
Want want want want.

Jeffrey Loewe
04-16-2012, 04:54 AM
Excited but worried about the price of the upgrade price on the scarlet.

Ray Sullivan
04-16-2012, 05:12 AM
6K for 6K .. two soccer moms in a hot tub
j

And the award for best comment goes to...

Dave Blackham
04-16-2012, 05:18 AM
So can we assume with the new latitude, which is great news by the way to improve on something that was already outstanding, is now the best in its class in terms of noise floor also ?

Frederick von Sulle
04-16-2012, 05:25 AM
Everything you buy in technology goes down in value the minute you buy it. We have provided a way to mitigate that loss with upgrade programs. The real way to win this game is to put your tools to work.

Jim

At a certain moment technology items (if excellent) can go up in value. Original RED One's (not MX) will become a collectors item, I bet. Lower the serial number higher the value. Think Bugatti !

George Petersen
04-16-2012, 05:40 AM
Sensor size is 30x15.8mm. Pixel size is 5 micron.

Jim

So does this mean that there's a 34.56 megapixel FF Dragon sensor in my future?:ihih:

Meddy MOST
04-16-2012, 06:26 AM
you've made it again ...
I'm too excited to see all that !!

greg filipkowski
04-16-2012, 06:28 AM
Great news

Lauri Kettunen
04-16-2012, 06:28 AM
Much better than M-X.

That's music in my ears and pretty easy to understand. :-)

Wayne Morellini
04-16-2012, 06:55 AM
Ok, here are the important questions (great job with the 6k too). When can we buy scarlet with one as standard, and when are we getting the fulframe 8k version you announced a few years back, November?

Thanks Jim, got to luv u.

Evan Starkey
04-16-2012, 07:07 AM
I would like a psychiatric evaluation of the man hes gone to far this time

Nils Ruinet
04-16-2012, 07:14 AM
Sweet ! I was concerned that this new sensor would be full frame, but this is just perfect. Can't wait ! I hope this upgrade policy will continue for future sensors too...

Vino Harris
04-16-2012, 07:22 AM
Well that's great for the epic but the scarlet will cost more and we will get less but being able to get the same specs as the old epic sensor would be great! How long will this offer stand because my piggy bank is busted!!!

Vino Harris
04-16-2012, 07:27 AM
I want slow motion abilities for my scarlet......slow motion... slow motion

Jaakko Rinne
04-16-2012, 07:29 AM
So no potential firmware change to add even more with the new sensor? Just thought the new sensor might be able to allow more than +6. Still awesome though.
The limit of +6 with HDRx is quite likely a limitation in usable shutter speeds. At 1/50 shutter the X-track is using a shutter speed of 1/3200 at +6 stops. +7 stops would be 1/6400.

Jon MIchael Puntervold
04-16-2012, 07:31 AM
I want slow motion abilities for my scarlet......slow motion... slow motion

Buy an Epic...

Jon MIchael Puntervold
04-16-2012, 07:32 AM
Dragon, wow, seems fantastic!

Jay Birch
04-16-2012, 07:34 AM
At a native 15 stops... I don't see why anyone would even touch HDRx again ,personally.

Kemalettin Sert
04-16-2012, 07:50 AM
At a native 15 stops... I don't see why anyone would even touch HDRx again ,personally.

maybe for 21? booooom

Kemalettin Sert
04-16-2012, 07:53 AM
would like to buy DRAGONIZED Scarlet if its possible :)

Emanuel A.
04-16-2012, 08:37 AM
Everything you buy in technology goes down in value the minute you buy it. We have provided a way to mitigate that loss with upgrade programs. The real way to win this game is to put your tools to work.

Jim
Mine was bought second hand for what I figured was a fair price, but it dropped drastically quickly. I'm ok with it, it's just money, but a person can hope can't they. No need to be like that.
They were obsolete at the announcement.

Jim
Meanwhile... Canon C300 customers are kicking themselves after seeing their cameras become obsolete barely after they've been delivered.So true :-)

Pascal Payant
04-16-2012, 09:19 AM
Will the low light situation will be way better? can it compete with canon?

Patrick Tresch
04-16-2012, 09:22 AM
Will the low light situation will be way better? can it compete with canon?

My speculation on behalf of Jim's words... it would be +1 stop better in low light and +1 stop better in high lights.

Patrick

Pascal Payant
04-16-2012, 09:27 AM
I think at this point resolution 5k is way enough. they need to be the best at low light and other area. resolution is not everything
they need amazing low light cause sony and canon are the king now. they need to put slow motion at 4k at least for the scarlet

Ketch Rossi
04-16-2012, 09:35 AM
At a native 15 stops... I don't see why anyone would even touch HDRx again ,personally.


Oh, but I will... ;)

AndrewThomas
04-16-2012, 09:38 AM
How much of the lowlight capabilities of the Canon and Sony cameras comes for in camera noise reduction?

fALk Gärtner
04-16-2012, 09:56 AM
Actually... Red is the color of life. The color of passion. Aggression. War.

Jim

Indeed and thank you RED for everything - even though I don´t know if I can afford an upgrade (depends on the next months rentals) to my very awesome scarlet I am more then happy with what I have. Thank you for taking care of your customers and even more thank you for pushing technology to its limits. Maybe you want to get into the processor and computer bussiness as well - innovation has been lackluster - especially on the highend - in recent years ;)

Jeremy Torrie
04-16-2012, 10:01 AM
Has anyone from Red posted what they define as 6K for reference purposes? And, these are all fantastic announcements -any word on the internal NDs? Is that still happening?

Yannick Verry
04-16-2012, 10:02 AM
Dragon, monstro etc sensor upgrade is fucking exciting , it s like a dream coming thru , but :

Same as Jeffrey , the people who have bought a scarlet are for most of them low budgect people, if they weren t they would have bought an Epic, Epic owner are not low budgect people , the epic cost 3,66 times the price of the scarlet , so i am wondering how much will cost the upgrade for the scarlet Owner ?

Jim recently said "certainly less than the price of the camera we bought". So should be below the 10000$ upgrade, or maybe quite close to the 6000$ pricetag of the epic upgrade, but still with limitations if they don't change all the boards. The 6k mode maybe won't go above 6fps, the 5k mode would achieve 24fps but maybe not at at low compression, and the 4k would breathe some fresh air with faster framerates. It would be a decent upgrade, but we shouldn't expect the crazy spec of Epic/Dragon.

Mark Pugh
04-16-2012, 10:03 AM
I think at this point resolution 5k is way enough. they need to be the best at low light and other area.

Well - It's already been decided, so it is what it is. I guess 6k will give a really nice 4k debayered.

AndrewThomas
04-16-2012, 10:10 AM
Has anyone from Red posted what they define as 6K for reference purposes? And, these are all fantastic announcements -any word on the internal NDs? Is that still happening?

Based on Jim's size info, it should be 6000x3160

Mark Andersen
04-16-2012, 10:18 AM
Sometimes I think that all you guy really want to do is drive Arri, Sony, Canon, and all the other "competition" nuts. Make them crazy, keep them up at night gnashing their collective teeth. Go get em boys. It's fun to watch and thank you!

Nick Morrison
04-16-2012, 10:38 AM
This is amazing. More DR than the Alexa, aggressive lowlight, 6K, RAW...specs that blow away the competition all with a built in upgrade path...RED is changing the rules of the game with every new generation of cameras. The competition must feel crushed.

Question: forgive my ignorance, but at 6K what's the crop factor on the new Dragon Sensor going to be?! 1.2? (If Epic 5K was 1.3?). Can someone smart figure out the math from Jim's specs?

Jesper Sichlau
04-16-2012, 10:38 AM
Who needs HDRx when you have 15+ stops of dynamic range?

And also.... do you get a discount if you've bought the Dragon T-shirt ;)

Marko Hocevar
04-16-2012, 10:43 AM
One great thing about waiting for the dragon is being able to use the Scarlet.
Come to think of it I wonder why the RED One owners had such a hard time waiting for EPIC to be released (it was not about the deposits - admit it :-)

dj ditt
04-16-2012, 11:18 AM
I am also interested to see what the price point for Scarlet owners will be to upgrade to Dragon...I would love to be able to shoot at a higher compression in order to get higher frame rates (Don't worry I know I didn't buy an EPIC, but higher frame rates with higher compression)

Kitersfa
04-16-2012, 11:56 AM
Jim…all I have to say is you guys just took it from 6 to midnight!

My career as a DP has also gone to midnight since I got the Red One in 2009 and now the Epic.

Philip (Sorry, I don't know why my name hasn't changed from kitersfa to Philip Roy yet?)

Christopher Probst
04-16-2012, 12:17 PM
These are exciting times! Can't wait for all of these goodies to become available!

Emin Ibrahimov
04-16-2012, 12:27 PM
Red vs the rest is like Mac vs PC. Jim you are the next Steve Jobs :)

Gunleik Groven
04-16-2012, 12:29 PM
Looking foreward to see the 1st Dragon r3D's in the wild...

Probably will be well documented by IBC

Christopher Probst
04-16-2012, 12:34 PM
Nice! All of my anamorphics just became a little WIDER! Also, with the smaller pixel size, using 6K as a look around (stabilization) area makes even more sense. And the 5K will work on more lenses. Double WIN!



Sensor size is 30x15.8mm. Pixel size is 5 micron.

Jim

Yannick Sadler
04-16-2012, 12:35 PM
Taken from the Red Store (any Epic order page):


NOTE: Any collection or group of items placed as a single order that includes 1x EPIC brain and totals over $50,000 in invoiced value will receive the DRAGON sensor upgrade at no charge.

Really?! :-)

mark foster
04-16-2012, 12:57 PM
ok--I hate to beat a dead horse--but I feel like with all the back and forth and guessing there has been no definitive answer to the red one saga, was the red one to epic the last physical upgrade for the red one? I love the red and have just bought one last year and was waiting for today to see if i should go MX or not--Im hoping to know officially that there will not be any more upgrades to the red one camera. Then i will go MX or buy a scarlet.
And if so may I ask why not--It seams that the sensor would fit in a red one--is it too costly?--I would pay a pretty penny for it--as i love the format and size for Red one. so can we just to be clear with serious answer, Its still a great camera and years ahead of others, I just dont want hold onto to these pipe dreams anymore.

thank you

mark

Mestizo Devon
04-16-2012, 01:03 PM
ok--I hate to beat a dead horse--but I feel like with all the back and forth and guessing there has been no definitive answer to the red one saga, was the red one to epic the last physical upgrade for the red one? I love the red and have just bought one last year and was waiting for today to see if i should go MX or not--Im hoping to know officially that there will not be any more upgrades to the red one camera. Then i will go MX or buy a scarlet.
And if so may I ask why not--It seams that the sensor would fit in a red one--is it too costly?--I would pay a pretty penny for it--as i love the format and size for Red one. so can we just to be clear with serious answer, Its still a great camera and years ahead of others, I just dont want hold onto to these pipe dreams anymore.

Jim stated earlier that there would be NO upgrade path to the dragon for the RED ONE, it was the Epic...

thank you

mark

Jim stated earlier that there would be NO upgrade path to the dragon for the RED ONE, it was the Epic...

Jon Carr
04-16-2012, 01:34 PM
I'm surprised no one asked for the native ISO of Dragon?

Mike P.
04-16-2012, 01:37 PM
It's native ISO is 6k... err.... I mean... uhh... What is its native ISO? Smaller pixels on similar sized sensor usually means more noise (without noise reduction processing which RED cameras do not have.) Even if it's still ISO800, with supersampling it'll look pretty rad. Plus with 5u photosites/pixels, I'd imagine a fairly organic looking noise/grain when you push the ISO.