Toronto RED-Meet 04

[IAN SUN]

Toronto RED-Meet 04

Date: Wed. Feb. 6, 2008
Time : 6:00pm
Location: PS Production Services
80 Commissioners Street
Toronto, ON M5A 1A8
T (416) 466-0037










Toronto RED MEET-04









Agenda






6:00pm Image Gear Equipment cine equipment display open for browsing.

6:30 meeting start.

1. Build yourself a RED ONE!
A workshop by Gregor Hagey with RED ONE #98.
Rigging a RED ONE to shoot with RED parts and other accessories.

2. The Toronto RED Group Buy.
A show and tell with some production equipment you may need to purchase. Presented by Mike Wilder of Image Gear.
Sign up and indicate your interest in a group buy for various production equipment.

3.RED ONE Rental Rates.

4. Toronto RED.org website update
Volunteer to help build the site.

Please add to, or alter the agenda to keep the discussion going.

[R. Gonzales]

Hey Bro Sounds good.

What about pricing and post?

Method

[Dylan Macleod, CSC]

Unfortunately I now can't make it! Please post details of the meeting.

Hey Method...come on...put your foot in your mouth!:wacko:

Dylan Macleod, CSC
Cinematographer
Toronto, Canada
www.dylanmacleod.com

[Joffy]

I will be there. Looking forward to meeting everyone.

[R. Gonzales]

Unfortunately I now can't make it! Please post details of the meeting.

Hey Method...come on...put your foot in your mouth!:wacko:

Dylan Macleod, CSC
Cinematographer
Toronto, Canada
www.dylanmacleod.com

Not I sir,

like I said Its just a rumour and I need proof first before I start down that road...

I guess I already started :umm:

No, not going there, sorry.



Respectfully

Method

[Tim Martin]

I'll put my foot in my mouth. It's going to be an interesting year for Toronto. We as a city will have a tremendous amount of Red Cameras shortly made available to us. Rental houses (Sim, PS, DJ Woods, Joe Sutherland and who knows who else) will have cameras available sooner then later. Pricing is going to become a heavily debated issue among the owners planning to rent the cameras out.

How do you price a camera that many people can afford to buy, but make sure that people still see a need to rent your F900, Varicam's, etc as well. I believe that when all is said and done the camera will rent out body, tripod, CF mount, cards, drive and 1 basic zoom lens for somewhere between $500 and $750. I am aware many are hoping that the price stays closer to $1500. I think they are wrong. It will come down to supply and demand. I think there will be a larger supply of cameras in the city then is required.

We are seeing a very similar situation to what occurred in post three years ago. Final Cut Pro suddenly became an acceptable piece of software (with correct hardware of course) to finish films on. There are shops that are still trying to run both Final Cut and Discreet Flame as finishing tools. Pricing becomes and issue.

I think what will be even more interesting is the accessory and service industry that will develop with the Red. That is where people will really make a killing. Producers love to not worry about post until it is too late. There will be many projects that will not have planed accordingly and then will have to pay a pretty penny to have the project finished.

The big rumors are who is teaming with who. I don't think all of the rental companies are prepared to become digital labs as well (even thought some may be working towards that). That means relationships will have to be formed between rental company, on set support and post. I've personally heard different rumors (they are just rumors, so I won't repeat), but it leads me to believe that there will be some interesting developments over the course of 2008.

It is of no surprise to me that most of the events that are being held around the Red have different players involved. Sim has an open house showing both Red with Scratch (I was there). PS is having one. And there is the 4k event being held by DJ Woods.

Everyone is trying to make sure it is clear that they are experts with both 4k and the Red, because that is what will be the selling feature of where you rent it.

Crazy.

[R. Gonzales]

I'll put my foot in my mouth.


Tim It's good to see you posting.

As to putting your foot in your mouth... Not really. Your post is very informative and carefully worded. I would urge readers to pay attention to specific things in your post. I.e.:


How do you price a camera that many people can afford to buy, but make sure that people still see a need to rent your F900, Varicam's, etc as well.


And specifically

service industry that will develop with the Red. That is where people will really make a killing.


digital labs as well (even though some may be working towards that). That means relationships will have to be formed between rental company, on set support and post.

What are you trying to say here Tim? Are rental companies forging relationships with post houses as a package rental?



Everyone is trying to make sure it is clear that they are experts with both 4k and the Red, because that is what will be the selling feature of where you rent it.


Has anyone thought of the liabilities of a data centric workflow and who might be responsible for a failed hard drive? Who picks up the tab, the insurance company, the rental company, or may be the manufacturer? Companies willing to rent out equipment might have a point in wanting to control the whole workflow process to minimize data loss.

Or

Maybe not.


Method

[R. Gonzales]

A Big thanks to Ian Sun Gregor Hagey,Morning and Penny@ PS. Red meet 4 was a good one. Mike Wilder of Image gear showed some accessories and gave a good Demo.

I learned quite a lot about Red and it's accessories. The Big question is do I go with 19mm or 15mm arri offset. It was good to feel the weight of the camera in a handheld config. It felt good, If I remember correctly built up with Red 18 -50mm the package weighin at 33 lbs.

I had been lookinfg for alternitives to the Red LCD but after seeing it in person i am beginning to think it might be the best way to go especially for the 1st asst. Gregor rigged it in such a way that when the camera is on your shoulder it was easy to operate and if needed let go one of the rods.

We did discover a cuple of quirks though that I believe should be a fairly simple fix for RED (Can we say Micrometers Please) but I'l let Gregor and Red duke it out because this could be an isolated problem.

I really just wanted to say thanks I would go into more detail but I just don't have the time.

Method

[IAN SUN]

Thanks Method, It was an excellent MEET despite the adventure we all had driving through the winter wonderland.

I just got in, real busy, but I will post some pics and more thoughts in a bit.

And yes a huge thank you to all of you who ventured out, Morning and Gregor for giving us that great workshop, Mike from Image Gear and of course Penny and all the folks at PS.

RED-MEET 05 will take place inside a month, for those of you who wanted to attend but could not due to the crazy weather.

[Brian Broz]

I'm curious what what discussed about rental rates (here in Canada).
So far I haven't heard much about body/pkg rates here and of course more importantly how many days per week. (I suppose that depends if the writer's strike is resolved shortly).
Thanks for any info.