How many EVF´s is out there?

[Steen Linde]

How is it going with the delivery of the EVF´s?
How are they working.? Nobody seems to talk about them very much,
so I guess there is only a few out there. But I would really like to
hear about some hands on experience.

Cheers

[Brook Willard]

There are roughly 20 out there.

They're awesome. What do you want to know?

[Finner]

Heard there was a blueish tinge to the first models (I think blueish, some color anyway). How do the new ones work? Any issues? They allow a multi EVF and HDsdi to run simultaneously right?

[Steen Linde]

Is it easy to see focus? Do you know the feeling with most video viewfinders...
the resolution could be better, it´s hard to judge the focus, the picture could be better...?
Is it like having a really good quality tool in your hand?
Anything you don`t like?

Cheers

[Brook Willard]

The blue tint was on the optics of the old viewfinders [which were essentially beta units that some lucky folks got]. It's gone.

The viewfinder is also brighter than those old units. The old viewfinders' limitations should be forgotten like Boris & Natasha's limitations for the most part.

The EVF and HD-SDI out [720p] do function simultaneously.

The resolution is 1280x848, so it is [to my knowledge...] the highest resolution color viewfinder in the world. I could be completely wrong, but I've not run into a better one.

My experience with viewfinders spans most of the hot shots out there... F23, Genesis, a handful of ENG/EFP-style viewfinders, etc. The RED EVF is as good as or better than any other EVF I've used. It's pretty great.

The thing is sturdy. It's a giant hunk of metal with glass inside. It's undeniably a professional tool... no DV-style garbage.

That stuff aside, it's not perfect.

What many people haven't realized from the pictures is that it's huge. It weighs several pounds and is about the size of a long [16oz?] pop can.

The diopter doesn't have measurements or settings... so your AC will need to put tape around it to mark settings.

The diopter also doesn't lock down [unless I somehow missed a lock], so grabby folks will change their setting.

The EVF on a Noga arm is a tall order. It doesn't move like an optical viewfinder does... it moves like a pop can on a Noga arm. You have to move it with two hands and some care. Any ham-fistedness will result in an out-of-level viewfinder or an unscrewed [from the Noga arm] viewfinder. ET's EVF bracket is a MUST for those that are used to optical viewfinders.

It's also quite long. While this is a given and not something RED really could've done anything about, just be aware of its length. For handheld configurations, the butt of the EVF will stick very far forwards from the camera body. It's not a deal breaker, but don't forget that this sucker's big.

Also know that the LEMO connector sticks even farther out of the end. A dual 90˚ cable helps a ton.

As for judging focus... you can judge focus just as well as you can on a 720p monitor. Everybody has their own opinions of whether or not that's possible.

I can't wait until I can turn off the menus/status indicators/timecode in the EVF though... an operator shouldn't have to stare at that all the time.

Hope this helps. It's not a proper review, but it's a quick status check of what's going on with the EVF. There are those with much more experience with the EVF than I.

[Finner]

The diopter doesn't have measurements or settings... so your AC will need to put tape around it to mark settings.

Unfortunate. I spoke to red employees about the need for this before NAB 07 and while I was there I explained it all to another key red employee. Unfortunately I guess it fell on deaf ears.


The diopter also doesn't lock down [unless I somehow missed a lock], so grabby folks will change their setting.

To bad. Tape to lock it I guess.


Also know that the LEMO connector sticks even farther out of the end. A dual 90˚ cable helps a ton.

Can you get those double 90 cables from red or where did you get them?

[Brook Willard]

I've seen people who got double 90˚ cables from RED... I don't know if one ships with the EVF or not.

The diopter is by no means loose... friction will hold it in place 95% of the time... but just be aware. A quick change of lubrication could make it tighter... I don't know much about the inner workings of this bad boy.

I hope people don't take what I've posted here as gospel. I don't have much experience with it... those with more experience should chime in.

[Rick Darge]

thanks Brook

That helps

Where can I see a picture of the ET EVF mount? I heard rumors that it was a little pricey.. Do we know yet? Can one order one today?

[Brook Willard]

I think it's $900 or so... I don't remember the exact retail price.

I'll post a picture when I can.

[Matt Uhry]

thanks Brook

That helps

Where can I see a picture of the ET EVF mount? I heard rumors that it was a little pricey.. Do we know yet? Can one order one today?

Under $1000 I think, you'll appreciate the necessity of it when you see the EVF's formidable size and weight. Red's EVF is about $7,500 dollars cheaper than anything like it so don't get crazy about the cost of ET's bracket - I've messed around with it and it's worth every penny.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

[Jim Hoffman]

Where can we get more info on ET's products - their website doesn't say a whole lot at this point - but they are referenced a bunch - is there a place to go on the web yet or do we need to call them?

[R Fogg]

Contact them directly.

[Steen Linde]

Thankyou Brook.
Very informativ.

Cheers

[Steve Sherrick]

Yeah, the viewfinder with the ET solution still seems like a fair price relative to market value.

Steve

[Tonaci Tran]

Where can I see a picture of the ET EVF mount?

In case you didn't see it yet.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/uploaded/7039_1202123137.jpg

More info: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8425

[Brook Willard]

Just to clarify, that picture is of a prototype mount. The final mount will be narrower, keeping the EVF closer to the body.

[Jay A. Kelley]

I really need my damn EVF... In typical RED fashion, I was told a "week or two" after I got my camera. Well.... guess what...

Sigh...

I need my EVF.. RED HELP!!!!

Jay

:)

[B Newberry]

I really need my damn EVF... In typical RED fashion, I was told a "week or two" after I got my camera. Well.... guess what...

Sigh...

I need my EVF.. RED HELP!!!!

Jay

:)

ha. join the club then. about 307 people a head of you need theirs too. thats if they ordered the EVF-- and they should have.

[Kelly]

We are shipping them out in order as soon as we get them in... as soon as we have yours, you will get an email from Red. Thank you all for being so patient!

[Poi Boy]

Great Smile Kelly !
Aloha
-A

[Jay A. Kelley]

Kelly how many have left so far?
Jay

[Greg M]

Jay,
Most of us dont have one yet...I'm still waiting too and I paid for mine in October.

[Jay A. Kelley]

So your number 83 still have no EVF?!

Jesus... At this rate my grandkids will be waiting for it!

I have a film the end of this month, and now I have to sell them on the 'ol, "you don't need an EVF" line.

:)

Jay

[Steve Sherrick]

My understanding is that they are ramping up now that cameras are shipping at a more regular rate. Don't know what that means in terms of numbers, but I suspect we will see more of them hit the streets soon.

I think you'll be okay Jay. Maybe not for that film, but I've got to think that with your number it won't be too long. I know that's not music to your ears, but hopefully you'll love it when it arrives and forget all about the wait.

Steve

[Jim Hoffman]

We've heard about delays with the camera - what the reason for the delays with the EVF? Is it because it is still being developed - is it a manufacturing issue? Still in a beta stage? wazzzzuuup wit dat? Curious...

[Steve Gibby]

I've had an EVF since early December. The first one I had was a prototype which I beta tested for about 5 weeks, then about three weeks ago I traded that one in on a production model.

In a sentence: The RED EVF seriously rocks! I've been an electronic camera guy for most of my career, so I've used scores of viewfinders, including the best in each generation of television cameras.

As Brook mentioned, the RED EVF is sizable - I'd say about 3 lbs and about 8" long. Im a sight focuser, even in 35mm, and yes, even in wide open apertures. In my experience of two months with the EVF, the 1280x848 resolution is easily enough to visually set critical focus, even in shallow DOF situations. Most of the footage I've shot using the EVF has simply entailed a quick push of the 2x magnification button on the side of the camera (or the button on the EVF itself) and a racking of focus, then a quick button push to get back to 1x magnification. I don't work with focus pullers or ACs, but I regularly achieve critical focus on my own, quite often with hyper-shallow DOF. I've done it for years with lower resolution viewfinders, so the RED EVF easily allows me to do that.

I'm running Build 14 on RED 8x. Build 14 has some extra bonuses for EVF users, like a default setting that enables the EVF to pull extra detail from the black areas in the image.

I use a double L cable, which you can get from RED. I've been using the Noga mount, but I beta tested the Element EVF mount for a week back in mid-December, with my RED EVF, on RED 8, using an Optimo 24-290 zoom.

I have one of the very first productions versions of the Element EVF mount coming this week. I anticipate it being even better than their prototype EVF mount I tested for them.

When I get a chance I'll revisit this thread with a more thorough breakdown of my impressions of the EVF.

Get it...you'll love it. I also use the RED LCD regularly for high angle, low angle, and stabilizer shooting. I need both, and I seriously like both. I've been using the RED LCD for 51/2 months now, and the RED EVF for over two months.

[BASSAM MSSALATIE]

Great Hair Too :blush: http://www.reduser.net/forum/uploaded/3151_1203065760.gif .:blush: Kelly

[BASSAM MSSALATIE]

i am sure that each human eye has it's own :matrix: FFD :blink: Like any lens
so :would the VF has focus setup adjustments for each different eye which well be using it ..??:huh:

[red1225]

thanks Brook

That helps

Where can I see a picture of the ET EVF mount? I heard rumors that it was a little pricey.. Do we know yet? Can one order one today?

ET's EVF mounting bracket is $960. Like Brook said...this is a "must have" if you are used to optical view finders.

Hey Finner...do you get kick backs from ET like I do for every sales pitch?:biggrin: :bleh: :) :sarcasm:

Just kidding!

[Mark L. Pederson]

ET's EVF mounting bracket is $960. Like Brook said...this is a "must have" if you are used to optical view finders.


It's a "must have" period. We've shot lots on the EVF - I got to play with an ET EVF bracket during a camera test check out a week ago - and it is WELL worth $960.

[Shawn Nelson]

It's a "must have" period. We've shot lots on the EVF - I got to play with an ET EVF bracket during a camera test check out a week ago - and it is WELL worth $960.

Is the Red arm not sufficient for the EVF?

[red1225]

It's a "must have" period. We've shot lots on the EVF - I got to play with an ET EVF bracket during a camera test check out a week ago - and it is WELL worth $960.


Mark...glad to hear positive feedback as I plan to purchase this piece of equipment. p.s. how was FL? Lunch next week???:whistling:

Shawn...evidently the EVF is rather large (heavy too) and doubt (this is speculation on my part) that the noga/isralli arm will support it in a functional way. These arms "give way" after time and a lot of use. The ET EVF bracket seems to be a more traditional type of "eye piece leveler"

[LEON]

Is the Red arm not sufficient for the EVF?
If you like to find horizon fast, this ET device permits that, even if you change orientation, you will not need to adjust, it goes back to its original position,
this is what I understood from Stephen at ET plus some pictures.

[Mark L. Pederson]

Mark...glad to hear positive feedback as I plan to purchase this piece of equipment. p.s. how was FL? Lunch next week???:whistling:


still in FL - on set now - yes, lunch Wed.

[Poi Boy]

Ordered mine..now it is a race to see what gets here first, the EVF or the mount !
Aloha
-A

[Paris Remillard]

Just for reference, what's the rez of the LCD again?

EDIT
Nevermind. Got it. 1024x600

[Brice Ansel]

Is the Red arm not sufficient for the EVF?
Same as Shawn I'll be curious to know how the red arm behave with red evf.
Brice

[Axel Mertes]

We are shipping them out in order as soon as we get them in... as soon as we have yours, you will get an email from Red. Thank you all for being so patient!

Hi Kelly,

your "Avatar" is unfair. How should we complain anymore, looking at your smile...

Next time cover at least your shoulders, you make us nervous! Was it from a larger photo? Oh, please, don't answer that question...!

Smile,
Axel

[Finner]

Same as Shawn I'll be curious to know how the red arm behave with red evf.
Brice

I do not see any of the multi axis arms on the market like the red arm working well with the EVF. The ET solution is what was needed.

[Joel Kaye]

Any clue as to why the EVF is built like a grenade? Scarlet is going to be smaller than the EVF if it's truly a pocket cam.

Wasn't it possible to make the thing a smaller and lighter? I just feel like they went down to the Hummer machine shop and made it look cool as opposed to being an efficient piece of gear. I've got the urge to take the thing apart and put it all in something else... (no, I'm not really going to try that)

[chuck colburn]

Having made some V/F for cine cameras I would guess that a good portion of the weight is from the glass used in the eyepiece. To get a decent flatness of field you would need at least a pair of achromatic doublets of sufficent diameter to cover the ground glass (sensor) in the EVF barrel. These tend to be thick lens elements and therefore heavy. They could be made out of molded polycarbonate which would reduce the weight but then you would need a plano (flat) window to protect the plastic lenses from scratching.

[Mark Pugh]

Is the Red arm not sufficient for the EVF?

I've seen the EVF and it's true that it's too heavy for the Red arm IMHO. Theoretically you could get by for a short while, but i know it would drive me nuts - would definitely slip. In a rougher hand-held environment It would'nt been good enough at all. The element technica solution is first class.
Maybe a cheaper, but less functionally sophisticated option would be to mount a decent ball head onto a side handle, as long as the quick- release plate fits onto the EVF ok. I suppose it would.

[Adrian T.]

Hi Kelly,

your "Avatar" is unfair. How should we complain anymore, looking at your smile...

Next time cover at least your shoulders, you make us nervous! Was it from a larger photo?

Yup. Here it is: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=11984&postcount=3 (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=11984&postcount=3)

[Mitch Deoudes]

Anyone know if the final model will be eyepiece leveler compatible? I've seen this question asked a bunch of times, but haven't seen an answer posted yet.

[Brice Ansel]

I do not see any of the multi axis arms on the market like the red arm working well with the EVF. The ET solution is what was needed.
Wich mean I need 900 extra dollars to spend in another compagnie to have a fonctionnal evf?!
Sounds weird!
Brice

[Finner]

Wich mean I need 900 extra dollars to spend in another compagnie to have a fonctionnal evf?!
Sounds weird!
Brice

If you don't want to know the answer why did you ask the question?

[Brice Ansel]

If you don't want to know the answer why did you ask the question?
I wanted an answer, and I got it. Thank you Finner.
Brice

[Finner]

I know the ET option adds price but it also makes the overall EVF system very good. In the end it is well worth it, you won't be sorry. I am just happy to have this option.

[Greg M]

and you expected this to be included a/ under $5k vf?

Even with the optional mount, which btw is not required, the Red EVF is a bargain

[Brook Willard]

Anyone know if the final model will be eyepiece leveler compatible? I've seen this question asked a bunch of times, but haven't seen an answer posted yet.

With the ET bracket, yes.

[Arnaud Paris]

ET is a great company working closely with Red to bring their expertise to this adventure through amazing products.

When a lot of us who have known and bought from ET say 'it's a must' it means that you will truly understand why spending these $1000 on top of the EVF price is a smart idea.

The same way like buying the Red One body alone is a possibility but buying the production pack along is a smart move even though you could find other ways to 'dress' your Red One body.

In both cases, compared to the competition, the options that we're recommending here are truly given to you at an amazingly low price.

[Axel Mertes]

Yup. Here it is: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=11984&postcount=3 (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=11984&postcount=3)

THIS makes me even more nervous :)

But I am married, what shall I say...

Now I know at least why the sticker I had on order had not been delivered. Give a T-Shirt to Kelly, boys, she deserves one. But I like that sticker dress too!

Axel

[Brice Ansel]

and you expected this to be included a/ under $5k vf?

Even with the optional mount, which btw is not required, the Red EVF is a bargain
I'm shure the ET mount is a bargain for the price, and I'm not complain about the price. I just thought the red arm included in evf pack was an alternative, I was just surprise to read it was useless.
Thanks for your advise guys and forgive my ignorance.
Brice

[Steve Gibby]

Except for the one week in December when I beta tested the ET mount for ET, I've been using the RED Arm (Noga arm) with my RED EVF for over two months now. Most people here know that I do a lot of highly-mobile production work, which is very demanding on equipment.

Since I've used a RED EVF for 2+ months, and I have also used both the RED Arm and the ET bracket extensively, here's my opinion on the options:

Big crew cine style production: the ET mount is what you'll want

Small crew and single person cine style production: the ET mount will be desirable, but if you don't have one or can't afford one, the RED Arm used carefeuly and correctly will suffice

Big crew EFP style production: the ET mount is what you'll want

Small crew and single person EFP production: the ET mount will be desirable, but if you don't have one or can't afford one, the RED Arm used carefeuly and correctly will suffice

----------------------------

For over two months now I've made the EVF work just fine with the RED Arm. I set up the arm carefully and regularly check the tightness of the tension lever and the mounting point on the the RED side handle where I have the arm attached. I've used the EVF on the arm in full EFP shoulder held B4 2/3" zoom configurations, and alternately on sticks with big cine lenses (Optimo 24-290) and 35mm still zooms (Canon FD 150-600). I've never had a problem with the RED Arm failing, but as mentioned, I check the tension lever and mount point regularly. If the RED Arm mount point to the RED side handle were to loosen, and the EVF drop a bit, the EVF cable stretching across the top of the camera to the EVF bus on the other side would keep it from dropping completely off the camera.

Summary: the ET mount is the best way to mount your RED EVF for many uses, but the RED Arm can be used if you're attentive to its lever adjustment. The ET mount is solid and multi-direction adjustable. The RED Arm is fairly adjustable and can be solid with the EVF if you use it right.

I own and regularly use the RED EVF and the RED LCD because I need them both for the wide variety of shooting style and genres I work in. I also own and regularly use the RED Arm, and have beta tested the ET mount and will receive my ET mount this week. With the choice of both, I'll use the ET mount for the EVF and the RED Arm for the RED LCD - the best of both words IMO.

[Brice Ansel]

Thanks for clarifying Gibby. Really apreciate it.
Brice

[John Cordell]

Agree with Gibby, the arm is usable, and indeed I did use it for quite a while. But I now mount the EVF to the side handle and find I'm much happier. For those reading this thread who didn't happen upon my description of how I mount my EVF:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8618

[Steve Gibby]

Agree with Gibby, the arm is usable, and indeed I did use it for quite a while. But I now mount the EVF to the side handle and find I'm much happier. For those reading this thread who didn't happen upon my description of how I mount my EVF:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8618

I saw that John. Looks like you figured out a simply modification that works, and may be an option for others seeking a similar solution. I like the RED side handles. I currently mount the EVF to the left side handle using the RED Arm, and the right side handle is used for either a shock mount for my shotgun, or to mount a wireless receiver.

The cool thing about RED ONE is that there is flexibility to accessorize it about any way you want/need, and mount things wherever you want/need, depending on what type of cine style or EFP style setup you're using.