Firmware upgrade policy - Executive Decision

[Andrew M.]

Jannard, I was wondering what will be the firmware upgrade policy.
Camera is highly modular and upgradeable.
There is high probability that some future options or modules that do not even exist on our wish list now, will need to be supported in the future firmware upgrades.
Since original reservation holders did contribute to the shaping of the final product, can we count on the free future firmware upgrades for next 3 years?

Andrew

[Curran Giddens]

Do firmware upgrades usually cost money?

[Andrew M.]

Do firmware upgrades usually cost money?

Major upgrades revisions do. Usually upgrades are free during the warranty period.
Current camera technology had limited upgrade possibility since these cameras are not modular. RED is entirely different beast.

[Ivan G]

can we count on the free future firmware upgrades for next 3 years?

Andrew

I'd like to see that happen for reserve holders.

[Brook Willard]

Just to get it out of the way, the first firmware update [the one for cameras 1-100 that will fully enable all features] will not cost money.

As for updates down the line? I dunno.

[Michael Morlan]

Most camera firmware upgrades cost money because you have to send the camera into a service center. RED One firmware is meant to be flashed in the field.

No muss. No fuss. No cost.

Of course there are two major issues:

1. As with any field-flashed device, it is possible to "brick" your camera if the flash goes awry.
2. It is possible that a major feature upgrade might have a fee associated with it.

:)

M

[Andrew M.]

Just to get it out of the way, the first firmware update [the one for cameras 1-100 that will fully enable all features] will not cost money.

Good try, but no cigar….

[Brook Willard]

I don't know what you mean by that.

[Andrew M.]

1. As with any field-flashed device, it is possible to "brick" your camera if the flash goes awry.


Usually upgrade routine keeps the old firmware revission in the backup place in the memory and if the upgrade does not come up, you press the reset combination of the key and you are back to the original firmware.

[Andrew M.]

I don't know what you mean by that.

I was thinking that you were joking...

[Brook Willard]

I was merely pre-answering the inevitable "you mean my enabling update for camera #__ will cost me money???"

[Jannard]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

[Brook Willard]

Alrighty then. Once again... thanks, Jim et al.

[Andrew M.]

I was merely pre-answering the inevitable "you mean my enabling update for camera #__ will cost me money???"

As I mentioned above, usually what I have seen on the other equipment, not cameras, the firmware upgrade is free during the warranty period no matter what, correct me anybody if you have different experience. So once you mentioned that first 100 cameras that will be shipping in next 3 months after the NAB, I was just imagining someone saying:
Warranty is 3 months or 3 miles whatever comes first.
Hey! judging on other Jim’s products the warranty is good solid.

[Shawn Nelson]

Jim, what I am afraid of is that I drop the camera - my fault -, the titanium shell survives but my sensor is now no good. If I mail you back my camera, with the broken mysterium still inside, will you be offering cheaper chip replacement?

[Zach Hilton]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

Sounds extremely fair enough.

[Poi Boy]

Jannard for President !
-A

[Andrew M.]

Jim got me 3 second earlier on this.
Thanks! Jim, I didn’t expect that…..

[Andrew M.]

Jim, what I am afraid of is that I drop the camera - my fault -, the titanium shell survives but my sensor is now no good. If I mail you back my camera, with the broken mysterium still inside, will you be offering cheaper chip replacement?

This calls for accident insurance...

[Hrvoje Simic]

The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

Great, man.

A 21 century buisness mentality.
The customers will appreciate this and you will make a lot of dimes anyway.

[Billy Summers]

Jannard for President !
-A

Straight uP! Jannard, you are such a stand up person! I am feeling the vibes, even from a distance. Man, this is an amazing situation...

Respect.


B.

[LighthouseMEdia]

Excellent policy JIM!!!! Better policy than you'll get from the other companies.

[Shawn Nelson]

This calls for accident insurance...


Insurance would have to be for the full value of the camera. Perhaps Jim could offer some kind of a premium warranty (i'd pay extra) such that if your Red gets damaged you could mail it back to them. That way you are basically insurring against only damage (not theft) and then Red only is out the raw cost, since they'd have the damaged Mysterium back, they'd have proof someone wasn't stealing chips.

[Gbabymogul]

:bleh:
All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

JimCheers.

Makes Sony's "hey Anders why risk it"? brochure look even more...desperate


:Guinness:

[Michael Hastings]

Kyocera/Yashica used to have this on their video cameras. It was called a "Fault Free" warranty and only required that you get the camera back to them - no matter what was wrong or damaged they would fix it or replace it for free. By doing it this way it avoids being an "insurance" policy that would be subject to heavy state and federal regulation.

BTW I think Ritz camera still offers something like this.


Insurance would have to be for the full value of the camera. Perhaps Jim could offer some kind of a premium warranty (i'd pay extra) such that if your Red gets damaged you could mail it back to them. That way you are basically insurring against only damage (not theft) and then Red only is out the raw cost, since they'd have the damaged Mysterium back, they'd have proof someone wasn't stealing chips.

[jbeale]

...the titanium shell survives...

Is there an update to the below info that I didn't hear about?

http://www.reduser.net/forum/archive/index.php/t-3.html

Jannard 12-29-2006, 07:08 PM
The production body has been changed to aluminum... but again, more changes are possible.
Jim

[damonbots]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

People always throw out the "almost spit coffee on my keyboard" cliche all the time... well, I actually did... it's recoverable. Maybe it just went down the wrong pipe, but you gotta love this guy. I'm sure Sony, Panasonic, blah blah are discussing what is fair in their boardrooms right now.

[Michael Mann]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well.

That's very fair. Thank you.

[Zakaree Sandberg]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

when can i buy stock! RED = the next costco in terms of customer service!!!

[Mike the beginner]

All software upgrades will be free for the life of the camera. All downloadable firmware upgrades will be free as well. All hardware upgrades will be handled on a case by case basis. If it is something that fixes a known problem, it will be on our nickel. If it is a chosen upgrade (like a newer sensor), then there will be a charge associated with it. There might be an exception to the rule that I'm not thinking about. The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".

Jim

That is far more than fair in fact THAT IS BLOODY MARVELOUS

Mike the beginner

[damonbots]

That's very fair. Thank you.

Hey Mike,

On a quick sidenote... Tom Sizemore says he's sorry for Robbery Homicide Division and he's currently available for a flashback should you make Heat 2.
And now back to our regularly scheduled programming...

[Greg M]

Jim, what I am afraid of is that I drop the camera - my fault -, the titanium shell survives but my sensor is now no good. If I mail you back my camera, with the broken mysterium still inside, will you be offering cheaper chip replacement?

WOW...amazing questions.
When you buy a new car, and wrap it around a pole because you drank too much, would you expect BMW to give you a discount on the new engine you have to replace?

[C.H.Haskell]

Jim,

I raise my glass,

cheers

[Ralph Oshiro]

The question I always ask is "what is fair?" in the eyes of the customer. Not "can we make a dime on this?".
I disagree . . . I think the question Jim always asks, is, "What is the coolest, bitchin'ist, most pee-in-your-pants, blow-every-competitor-out-of-the-water thing we can possibly make this camera do, yet still be affordable?"

[Mardi_Gras]

Just to get it out of the way, the first firmware update [the one for cameras 1-100 that will fully enable all features] will not cost money.

As for updates down the line? I dunno.

Brook, with all due respect, instead of going back and editing your posts after each gaff, I say, consult with the Red team before answering really sticky questions, you might end up misinforming those of us that rely on information from the board and its moderators. Just a word of advise.