Deadline for deciding on configuration?

[jeffry alan]

So I assume when our number is up we will be contacted to let RED know what we want on the camera, and then it will be custom built to our specs?
And since RED is completely modular and we can upgrade ad infinitum, the base price at $22k is just the starting point.

That gives me some time to decide since I'm #918

J*

[Brook Willard]

The base price is $17,500. With a $2,500 allowance for reservations. The rest is up to you.

[Joel Kaye]

You are absolutely wrong Brook

I don't think Brook said the price didn't change. He simply said $17,500 +$2500 allowance towards accessories.

I think we all can agree the price is a little different today than it seemed to be yesterday. Luckily we all have that refundable +10% guarantee if we want to use it. Somehow I think most of us are staying along for the ride.

[jeffry alan]

.......and you missed the point of my thread, which is: when do we have to decide on options, tell RED, have them assemble it, come up with the balance, etc?

J*

[jeffry alan]

I don't think Brook said the price didn't change. He simply said $17,500 +$2500 allowance towards accessories.


and all I am saying is that a viewfinder and a battery are not "accessories".

J*

[Joel Kaye]

.......and you missed the point of my thread, which is: when do we have to decide on options, tell RED, have them assemble it, come up with the balance, etc?

J*

As soon as you buy accessories you'll get the discount. Jim didn't say reservation holders "ACT NOW" to get your $2500 credit.


and all I am saying is that a viewfinder and a battery are not "accessories".

I think the RED are calling them accessories though. I'm pretty sure if you sued them the judge would say the company gets to define what it thinks accessories for their product are called.

Hollywood even gets to define "Net Profits" in a way that no business school has ever taught.

[jeffry alan]

So there is an unlimited number of "accessories" for all of the first 1430 rez holders just sitting there waiting to get slapped on the "base" camera?

J*

[Adam C Lubkin]

.......and you missed the point of my thread, which is: when do we have to decide on options, tell RED, have them assemble it, come up with the balance, etc?

J*


Jim has said before that we'll have 30 days once our number is called. (That was in reference to the camera, before the issue of accessories came up)

Other than the optional RAW Port, I don't see what needs to be assembled. The various accessories you just bolt-on/plug-in as desired.

[PaulClements]

You don't HAVE to buy red branded batteries or viewfinder so technically Brook isn't wrong. That said why anyone would want to buy anything else is another matter. However the proposed price was just that... proposed. Red have always said from the getgo that everything was subject to change. Personally I look at the pricelist and find that you can get a pretty good package for less than many anticipated previously.

RED ONE CAMERA BODY $17,500
RED ONE PREMIUM PRODUCTION PACK $2,750
RED ONE POWER PACK $1,650
RED EVF Viewfinder $2,950
RED DRIVE 320GB $900 x 2
Nikkor 35mm Photo Mount $500
Sub Total = 27150
Allowance = -2500
Reservation = -1000
Total = 23650


I wouldn't call that basic. Whilst we all want to get as much bang for the buck it's important to be realistic in our expectations and Red has done very well to beat them regularly.

In terms of Deadline I don't think manufacturing the accessories is as difficult as the camera itself and therefore there can be a greater leeway for delivering them nearer the delivery of the camera

[tj williams]

Jeffry excuse me but check the pricing on the SonyF900 and Panasonic HDX900 and you will see that the battery and the viewfinder are options. Panasonic has widely advertised pricing through dealers of the NEW HDX900 camera, which did not include viewfinder or mounting plate or battery or charger.

[jeffry alan]

I think the RED are calling them accessories though. I'm pretty sure if you sued them the judge would say the company gets to define what it thinks accessories for their product are called.


Boy, you talk like a guy who moved to that pit we native Zonans call PHX!

HAH, just kidding, don't sue me!

J*

[Joel Kaye]

Boy, you talk like a guy who moved to that pit we native Zonans call PHX!

HAH, just kidding, don't sue me!

J*

You're from here too? I'm sure we'll soon be patting each other on the back regarding our bitchin' cameras. We might not have enough money left over for coffee but that's another issue. :umm:

[jeffry alan]

I started some of the first threads on dvxuser (before this forum was created) and actually got some pretty lucid and useable responses from Gibby and others as to why the RED might not be best suited to field work, and also the configuration of a basic RED camera, before the fanboys jumped on the bandwagon.
But it seems like there is lacking an impartial viewpoint here (except for a few members like Shawn Nelson on the 'Accessories' thread) as to what constitutes a RED camera, (useable in the field).

I Say it comes in for around $22K without the lambourghini extras.

J*

[jeffry alan]

You're from here too? I'm sure we'll soon be patting each other on the back regarding our bitchin' cameras. We might not have enough money left over for coffee but that's another issue. :umm:

Nah, I lived there for five years before moving to the Bay Area, but now I am stuck in Tucson, although I suspect if I do get the RED that I will be working up there, (just indoors or after October).

BTW, I think there are at least five of us REDheads in AZ, we should get a network going (after the camera's come out of course)

J*

[Joel Kaye]

I Say it comes in for around $22K without the lambourghini extras.

I'd agree with that. Or more. You need lenses, follow focus, plus everything else that's not even on that page.

I think skepticism is healthy... I'm a pretty skeptical guy BUT I think Jannard and the crew he's hired are going to pull it off. I've been disappointed by other cameras so we'll see the proof at NAB hopefully.


Redheads in AZ
Yeah - 5 or 6 I think. We'll definitely have to get together and compare notes. That's kind of a nice amount. Not too many - like L.A. heh. Of course those guys could actually put 1000 in service every day. We might have trouble keeping 6 busy.

[Greg M]

You are absolutely wrong Brook, the price has changed. Maybe you weren't paying attention. Here, I will help you.

Initially, the PROPOSED price included a way to actually view the recorded image (what is known in the industry as a viewfinder), and also included an energy device to supply power to said camera. Without a 'viewfinder' the camera is useless, also a battery is a pretty important feature. without either of these 'extras', your nifty camera is inoperable.

This swell allowance doesn't even cover the basic cost of an absolutely integral piece of the camera, i.e the EVF which goes for $2950, $450 more than the super generous allowance.

And what do all these little gadgets attach to? Well I guess we could duct tape them to our arm, or some other ingenious method to keep them near the camera, or we could shell out (at the very least) another $1250 for the stuff that makes the camera useable with all the needed parts.

So I ask you Brook, do you have issue with my estimate for $22000 for a basic, useable RED camera, or are you just being a defensive REDhead?



J*

When I bought a Varicam, the viewfinder was an option. I paid extra for this option (I believe it was $4k). The batteries and charger were options, I paid extra for those options. The camera did not include any rails to attach a mattbox or monitor, those were options. Believe it or not it didnt even include a tape to record on....I paid extra for those too.

If you are dissatisfied with the pricing ask for your grand back...you lost nothing.

These prices are more than fair, and the pricing scheme is very typical for any other camera, video or film.

[Anders Holck]

Not to mention that the tape deck is optional too...

[jeffry alan]

When I bought a Varicam, the viewfinder was an option. I paid extra for this option. The batteries and charger were options, I paid extra for those options. The camera did not include any rails to attach a mattbox or monitor, those were options. Believe it or not it didnt even include a tape to record on....I paid extra for those too.


If you are dissatisfied with the pricing ask for your grand back...you lost nothing.

These prices are more than fair, and the pricing scheme is very typical for any other camera, video or film.



I knew some fanboy would make the leap of logic to (incorrerctly) ass-ume that I was complaining about the price since I (heaven forbid) brought it up, but, unfortunately, I am not.
However, the RED base camera initally included viewfinder and battery

J*

[Greg M]

you just sound very bitter, read your own posts.

[Jannard]

The base camera, LCD and battery discussion is handled very well by Stuart English's thread. We have done everything we can to make the camera MUCH better for ALMOST the same net price. And by MUCH, I mean a TON. 4K on-board recording was not a part of the early package that reservation holders bought last year. And the LCD was going to be a flip-out 3.5" instead of our now 5.6" Hi-res that can be positioned anywhere. We have worked long and hard to build a better program than anyone envisioned. But you have to look at the whole package to see that we have had our customers best interest at heart.

Jim

[Anders Holck]

No it didn't include a viewfinder.
A lcd screen was initially said to be included in the base package.

The lcd and a battery is $2150. The allowance is $2500 so that leaves 350 for a v-mont plate for the camera, and you still get all the promised components plus tons of extra capabilities..

[Joel Kaye]

The lcd and a battery is $2150. The allowance is $2500 so that leaves 350 for a v-mont plate for the camera

Good point. If there's an a la cart v-mount the price could be right on the money and include the better specs. Well - add $900 for the drive... but still when this thing was announced no one imagined we might be able to toss SLR lenses on there. If they perform well it'll be an amazing savings.

[Brook Willard]

You are absolutely wrong Brook, the price has changed. Maybe you weren't paying attention. Here, I will help you.
Just to re-establish, you were wrong here.

Watch it, guys. The main questions in this thread have been answered. Any more shots at each other and I might have to do my job.

[jeffry alan]

The base camera, LCD and battery discussion is handled very well by Stuart English's thread. We have done everything we can to make the camera MUCH better for ALMOST the same net price. And by MUCH, I mean a TON. 4K on-board recording was not a part of the early package that reservation holders bought last year. And the LCD was going to be a flip-out 3.5" instead of our now 5.6" Hi-res that can be positioned anywhere. We have worked long and hard to build a better program than anyone envisioned. But you have to look at the whole package to see that we have had our customers best interest at heart.

Jim

Jim, I don't question that RED will deliver more than anticipated and rival anything out there, and also possibly be the most innovative camera ever made, but I am just trying to figure out the cost of the best system.

From your 'Storage 101' thread it seems that I might want to invest in the RED RAM (eventually), which ups the cost. But since it is modular, I don't have to worry about that up front.

I am anticipating getting a look at the LCD (no pun intended) and EVF at NAB, and actually seeing some product.

-congrats Jim, I look forward to meeting you at the show.

J*

[Greg M]

Jeffry,
Sorry to attack you personally...its just that I came to this site tonight to get some information and I spent an hour wading thru all the whining about the price change and lack of vf, etc, etc and just had enough....you were the last whiner I read. Sorry.

[Greg M]

Watch it, guys. The main questions in this thread have been answered. Any more shots at each other and I might have to do my job.

Where was it answered?

edit:
is post 9 the correct answer?

[Brook Willard]

You can buy and install accessories as you see fit. They're accessories. The only factory-installed option is the RAW PORT and that can be installed at your will [just send in the camera...].

That and the fact that the base price is the same $17,500 it's always been.

[jeffry alan]

Just to re-establish, you were wrong here.

Watch it, guys. The main questions in this thread have been answered. Any more shots at each other and I might have to do my job.

Sorry Brook, I was referring to my calculations in a previous thread, thank you for your humble and gracious correction.

J*



Base camera = 415 bhp, 192 mph Porsche 997 GT3 (wheels, glass and fuel not included, driver optional):sarcasm:

[Greg M]

The only factory-installed option is the RAW PORT and that can be installed at your will [just send in the camera...].



Is this confirmed, or speculation?

If I ordered the camera with RED FLASH, I can send it back and add the RAW PORT at a later date?

[David Collard]

Well done Jim and your Red Team.
I like your style. I admire your technology.
Join me aboard the Nautilus.

[Brook Willard]

Is this confirmed, or speculation?

If I ordered the camera with RED FLASH, I can send it back and add the RAW PORT at a later date?

Correct. You could also order it with no flash and no RAW port... presumably a cover will be in place.

[Greg M]

WOW...thats huge

[Brook Willard]

I could be wrong. I'm pretty sure I'm right. Wait for confirmation.

[david farland]

The dispute in this thread began regarding base price including lcd /battery (plus along the way we were promised something extra).

Jim points out the extras here (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=17028&postcount=1) and remarks on hecklers here (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1140&postcount=1)

Anders points out the base price didn’t change!

Good night nurse!

DF

[Roberto B]

and all I am saying is that a viewfinder and a battery are not "accessories".

J*

sure.. i don't give a damn if the cinealta guys are coming here saying their game..

it's supposed to be a different game, right?..

[Häakon]

Personally I look at the pricelist and find that you can get a pretty good package for less than many anticipated previously.

RED ONE CAMERA BODY $17,500
RED ONE PREMIUM PRODUCTION PACK $2,750
RED ONE POWER PACK $1,650
RED EVF Viewfinder $2,950
RED DRIVE 320GB $900 x 2
Nikkor 35mm Photo Mount $500
Sub Total = 27150
Allowance = -2500
Reservation = -1000
Total = 23650

What is the $1,000 "reservation" credit you've listed?

[Alexander Nikishin]

What is the $1,000 "reservation" credit you've listed?

The $1,000 reservation fee, it's deducted from the total.

[Häakon]

Ah, gotcha.

[Curran Giddens]

Sorry to burst anyone's bubble, but, the $1,000 reservation fee is still money spent. Unless, of course, you are adding up the total of how much more money you have to spend.

[Roberto B]

yeah.. let's change the speech here.. nothing against to this good project related.. but we all are smart people here right?..