Quickest way into Avid?

[Zach Hilton]

I know there have been multiple threads on Avid's current workflow. I've only used Avid for a few months back at a previous job, but find that some potential clients are using Avid and I'd like to be slightly more educated on the workflow so if anyone would be willing to give a brief statement on the current workflow I would be much obliged. The 3 things that I'd be interested in finding out are

1) What is the quickest way to get footage into Avid? Can I export to the DNxHD codec via Redcine or Compressor and then import that directly into Avid without any more converting or transcoding? If so, it would make sense for me and mine to convert footage for clients to a resolution of their choosing so that it is an easy ingest for them.

2) Is there a way to edit footage in Avid whilst maintaining the link to the original R3D files (similar to the FCP workflow and using Ibloom's script)?

3) Lastly, what are people doing for their workflows as of now?

Thanks for your time in answering some questions.

[MichaelP]

Quickest way is QT references from Red Alert! directly into Avid at the resolution of your choice. All metadata is maintained by using MetaCheater to create an ALE file before the import. Ouptut is an EDL with the reel ID as found in the QT from Red Alert! with timecode. There will soon be a step by step in Studio Monthly www.studiomonthly.com outlining the Red Alert! and MetaCheater workflow.

Michael

[Zach Hilton]

Quickest way is QT references from Red Alert! directly into Avid at the resolution of your choice. All metadata is maintained by using MetaCheater to create an ALE file before the import. Ouptut is an EDL with the reel ID as found in the QT from Red Alert! with timecode. There will soon be a step by step in Studio Monthly www.studiomonthly.com outlining the Red Alert! and MetaCheater workflow.

Michael

Great thanks! When is "soon" for the article if you don't mind me asking. Look forward to it.

[Dylan Reeve]

There isn't yet a clear solution for Avid cut to REDCINE XML for 'pull list' but there will be a solution (or solutions) soon.

For offline editorial the importing of proxy QT files (on a Mac, as QT libraries are required) is the fastest option (in my experience it's about 150% runtime - so 90 minutes to import 60 minutes of footage).

For finishing, you can certainly use REDCine to export DNxHD but it only supports a single DNxHD resolution (115 I think) at the moment. This will fast-import into Avid as long as you have the right options set on the import - about 10% runtime, so 6 seconds for a minute clip, but obviously the conversion time to DNxHD will be significant.

[Zach Hilton]

There isn't yet a clear solution for Avid cut to REDCINE XML for 'pull list' but there will be a solution (or solutions) soon.

For offline editorial the importing of proxy QT files (on a Mac, as QT libraries are required) is the fastest option (in my experience it's about 150% runtime - so 90 minutes to import 60 minutes of footage).

For finishing, you can certainly use REDCine to export DNxHD but it only supports a single DNxHD resolution (115 I think) at the moment. This will fast-import into Avid as long as you have the right options set on the import - about 10% runtime, so 6 seconds for a minute clip, but obviously the conversion time to DNxHD will be significant.
Thanks Sycophant. Any pointers on what the "right options" would be for importing DNxHD into Avid? I'm guessing I could probably get a better quality import by going through Redcine first, no? Or does the proxies hold up after importing into Avid?

[Dylan Reeve]

It's mainly down to picking the right pixel aspect and colour mode... 601/709 in both case is required for the Quick Import to work I think.

For offline I have no problem with the Proxies at all. The low resolution at 4K 2:1 is 512x256 I believe, so it's undergoing some scaling coming in, but even imported to DV it looks nice on the client monitor. The other option is the 1024x512 resolution, which works quite nicely also.

I will be doing a very fast turn around short film in a couple of months for delivery on DV - and will be using the 1024 resolution proxy for editing and probably for delivery too in this case (unless I have much more time than I anticipate).

[aneditor]

The questions asked by Strongbad are exactly what I am looking for DEFINITE answers to. I am interested in MichaelP's answer of using quicktime references that are then imported into the Avid using a resolution of my choice. This would still be like importing any quicktime in the Avid, meaning it wouldn't be "instantaneous", right?
After I have a locked cut, I still don't clearly understand how my EDL would reference back to the original .r3d files in order to create dpx files or 10-bit qts to output to HDCAM-SR. I would be finishing on the Flame.

sidenote: It'd be great if there was just one posting on this Avid Workflow forum that had the "correct" workflow so that an inquiring mind wouldn't have to look through and consolidate pertinent information from 10+ postings.

[Dylan Reeve]

Currently there is no 'correct' workflow for Avid. Even for FCP it's not totally clear what is the best way...

The QT Proxies (only supported on Intel Macs, as the QT plugin is only available for Mac currently) can indeed be imported into Avid (on the Mac). In our case, that import seems to take about 150% of runtime, so 90minutes for an hour of footage.

The process I've used so far is:
1) Generate QT Reference files in desired resolution in a single directory, using REDline
2) Open QT Ref files into MetaCheater to build ALE.
3) Import ALE into Avid project.
4) Use 'Batch Import' to reconnect all files to clips from ALE
5) Edit
6) ???

6 is where it gets tricky. There is no option to create a RED XML currently. Avid has software they are testing for this, but no product out just yet. The complexity of the RED XML makes it impossible to build one directly from an EDL alone.

It might be possible to take from Avid to FCP (with Automatic Duck) and then use RedTrip from FCP.

[dylancarter]

For offline editorial the importing of proxy QT files (on a Mac, as QT libraries are required) is the fastest option (in my experience it's about 150% runtime - so 90 minutes to import 60 minutes of footage).


I have not been paying attention lately, but I thought AVID did not import the TC when importing quicktimes? That is the whole point of MetaCheater. no?

[Dylan Reeve]

Yeah, so MetaCheater first, then import the QT Reference against the ALE from MetaCheater.

[Michael Bach]

This works for us.

We start off by using Redline to generate the QT wrappers.
We then use Metacheater to create the ALE file and import the ALE and rushes into the Avid (Mac only at this stage)
Meanwhile we load all of the Rushes into Redcine and get the Frame Rate right on each clip. After doing so we save the whole rushes Library as an XML file.
We have written an App which imports the XML Library file and then the EDL from the Avid and generates a load list for Redcine. You can also add Handles at this point. The output file is saved as an XML say called Redine Cuts.
Lastly we go back to Redcine and open the whole Library XML. This once again puts the entire Rushes on the timeline. While the whole Library is open we then open the Redcine Cuts XML which has the effect of deleting the unrequired frames off the timeline leaving only those required for the Edit plus the handles specified earlier.
We then render out to DPX Redlog and can do a network conform on the Pablo/Inferno to get the clip into an uncompressed state.

Its not perfect...but it works. We haven't got the App sorted well enough yet as dissolves, M2 commands etc need some thinking about before the correct frames are extracted.

We can also use a PC avid now because Redline does Transcodes properly so we can generate H264 or DV Qts with TC then using Metacheater etc

We will keep working on it but I suspect that Avid, Autodesk and Quantel will have this sorted quickly after the R3D format is "released" to all.

Hope that helps

Cheers

Michael