Click here to go to the first RED TEAM post in this thread.   Thread: Have the compression algorithms improved on Dragon?

Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 20 of 20
  1. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Haase View Post
    the stills are always noisier. Do a test in rcx. I think it's because r3d is compression designed for motion and not stills. The Mx at 800 in tungsten produces noisy stills but when it moves it looks good.

    I'd like to see more elaboration on this point. What about all the fashion shoots done with Red?

    I don't buy the "stills are noisier" theory… unless they truly are noisier but it's so negligible it's not even worth mentioning ?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2. #12  
    Senior Member Eric Haase's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    1,029
    Quote Originally Posted by zak forrest View Post
    I'd like to see more elaboration on this point. What about all the fashion shoots done with Red?

    I don't buy the "stills are noisier" theory… unless they truly are noisier but it's so negligible it's not even worth mentioning ?
    You can see it for yourself. Shoot some footage at ISO 800 - preferably under tungsten light in a studio and look at stills. There is noise but it appears minimized when you play. There isn't actually less noise- it just appears that way. Part of it has to do with the fact that the Epic is noisy in the 0-15% IRE range. Most of the time this tone occurs in the background (like a painted wall) and rarely on a subject's face. So during motion you're attention is mostly directed to the moving object which has less noise than the background. In a still you have more time to look at everything in the frame. Just my theory from observation but try it for yourself.

    And regarding the fashion shoots... I would suspect that they rate the camera lower in a controlled studio environment like at 320 and use plenty of light and fill the histogram. Also, they can reduce the noise in the stills in post. The stills are usually retouched a lot.
    Eric
    cinematographer
    www.ericjhaase.com
    Reply With Quote  
     

  3.   Click here to go to the next RED TEAM post in this thread.
  #13  
    Red Leader Jannard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    8,257
    The cleaner the sensor, the easier compression is. Dragon is cleaner.

    Jim
    "The camera is arguably one of the most important of all inventions… it is the single tool that has the ability to stop time, record history, generate art, tell stories, and communicate messages that transcend language like nothing else ever conceived."

    "Everything in life changes... including our camera specs and delivery dates..."

    We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone with a bad attitude.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #14  
    Senior Member Eric Haase's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    1,029
    Quote Originally Posted by Jannard View Post
    The cleaner the sensor, the easier compression is. Dragon is cleaner.

    Jim
    so awesome!!! 800 was a gift. This is amazing.
    Eric
    cinematographer
    www.ericjhaase.com
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #15  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    767
    Ahh, so you are saying we are paying $9500 to have our Epics cleaned? ;-)
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #16  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    767
    On a serious note, thanks for putting the best camera in the world in my hands, TWICE in 2 years. Forever greatfull
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jannard View Post
    The cleaner the sensor, the easier compression is. Dragon is cleaner.

    Jim
    Wonderful news!
    Is there going to be REDCODE 1:2.5 option in Dragon's firmware? What is happening with availability of RED SSD TURBO MAG 512 GB and is there any faster solution on the way? Thanks in advance!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8.   This is the last RED TEAM post in this thread.   #18  
    Red Leader Jannard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    8,257
    Working on it...

    Jim

    Quote Originally Posted by Filip Orlandic View Post
    Wonderful news!
    Is there going to be REDCODE 1:2.5 option in Dragon's firmware? What is happening with availability of RED SSD TURBO MAG 512 GB and is there any faster solution on the way? Thanks in advance!
    "The camera is arguably one of the most important of all inventions… it is the single tool that has the ability to stop time, record history, generate art, tell stories, and communicate messages that transcend language like nothing else ever conceived."

    "Everything in life changes... including our camera specs and delivery dates..."

    We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone with a bad attitude.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #19  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    1,012
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Coleman View Post
    Its weird I noticed a lot more noise in the stills that Mark posted compared to the footage. It make me wonder if Mark ran the footage through some noise reduction or if the noise being so small just got lost in the h.264 compression, Or was it the Jpeg compression from the photos that introduced noise that wasn't actually there...could be a lot of things.
    You are comparing temporally compressed h264 to JPG stills. The h264 is compressed to on average dedicate about 50KB/frame, whereas the JPG is compressed at about 500KB/frame. The first thing you lose when applying lossy compression is usually the appearance of noise, because it's randomness spatially and temporally make it the hardest part of an image/video to compress.

    As for R3D stills and motion having noise that looks different I would guess that noise is a bit harder to see when its moving as it may tend to average out a bit temporally to our eyes/brain. Just a guess, though I imagine there are a number of things that may allow us to see noise better when it is not "moving".
    Noah Yuan-Vogel | noahyv.com
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #20  
    Senior Member Bing Bailey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    896
    will the new Sata Express standard be usable/adaptable for RED Dragon/SSD's since it allows over 4 times the speed of Sata III
    Film, A glorious dance between Technology and Art....!
    Epic-W......
    Reply With Quote  
     

Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts