Thread: Why film will stay the king...

Reply to Thread
Page 3 of 14 FirstFirst 123456713 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 136
  1. #21  
    Senior Member Peter Majtan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Tokyo, Japan
    Posts
    3,985
    Quote Originally Posted by Mendes Nabil View Post
    If some of you have examples about the "superiority" of digital over film, don't hesitate .. ;)
    I'll bite...

    1. Immediacy. Right after I press stop on my camera I can review and confirm that I have the shot I wanted. No need to wait for lab to develop, process and project the stock only to find out I need to reshoot (long after the set / situation / location has disappeared...).

    2. Access. Both for young and experienced shooters. You can now afford on a reasonable budget to go out and learn / practice the craft when you are not working on a paid job. Every time I film something - I learn something new (good or bad) which makes me better cinematographer...

    3. Affordability. Lots of great creative concepts and talent never got the chance / opportunity to shine back in the days of 35mm film. While the digital revolution brings a ton of crap - it also brings some gems that we would have otherwise never seen...

    4. Portability. You can go to remote locations and all I need is my car, laptop and a HDD to store data - and I can be shooting indefinitely. How many cans can you really carry? And more importantly - how many will you expose before you need to get to the lab ASAP?

    5. Postproduction. Related to both Access and Affordability above. All you need is a media reader and a laptop and you can create marvels...

    These are just my top 5. There are many more - I will let other to chime in...

    The King is dead! Long live the King!



    Peter
    You don't need eyes to see, You need a vision!
    www.petermajtan.com - www.derylgroup.com
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2. #22  
    RED TEAM Stacey Spears's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Sammamish, WA
    Posts
    3,129
    Quote Originally Posted by George Tsai
    Speaking of which, I still have mine:-P
    And when I think of box sets, Abyss is the first one that comes to mind, which I see you have. :)
    Reply With Quote  
     

  3. #23  
    Senior Member Isaac Marchionna's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    1,281
    I'd lament the death of quality movie archival such as commentary, makings of, etc, but once DVDs started shipping without even a trailer for the movie they were selling, things were already in the toilet.

    Abyss and T2 were amazing LDs, so was the directors cut of Aliens.
    Isaac Marchionna
    DART Design
    DRAGON-X 03914
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #24  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    291
    Quote Originally Posted by paul schefz View Post
    You are posting a link to a YouTube clip.....I agree that it looks great....but in which way is that analog? I can understand if someone prefers analog film, analog workflow and analog projection, or film, process and print for stills.....but nowadays every piece of film is scanned, so even if one shoots film, the final product is pretty much always digital....the best scanners are only digital capture devices just like the sensor in a camera.....
    And like someone here mentioned....this is not something that I would point out as a wonderful example of how good film can be....the tones are pretty crushed.....but again....it's YouTube!
    Thank you Paul. I was about to remark on the absurd hilarity of this thread but you made all my points for me.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #25  
    REDuser Sponsor Martin Stevens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    1,869
    I thought the intent of this thread was to promote a web link. If I may be so bold.
    Regards,
    Martin Stevens

    President and Founder of Glidecam Industries, Inc.
    Producer and Director at Metaphoric Pictures Corporation.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #26  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    291
    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Stevens View Post
    I thought the intent of this thread was to promote a web link. If I may be so bold.
    Ha ha! Well if that was the intent, it didn't work, at least not with me. The OP's point was so ridiculous, it made me laugh, not click. He'd have been better off saying "look at this! Really cool clip!"
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #27  
    RED TEAM Stacey Spears's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Sammamish, WA
    Posts
    3,129
    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac Marchionna
    Abyss and T2 were amazing LDs, so was the directors cut of Aliens.
    Basically anything James Cameron. :) His directors cuts were always worthwhile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mendes Nabil
    if some of you have examples about the "superiority" of digital over film, don't hesitate .. ;)
    In addition to what Peter listed, I would add, at least for more me:

    1. Increased resolution.
    2. Less noise.

    I am sure for some that both of my examples are why they prefer film.

    I do think that 15-perf Imax looks superior to what digital can capture today. The opening of the Dark Knight was breathtaking as was the Dubai scene from Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol when Tom Cruise was just hanging around. Both of these had me grabbing my seat during the Imax presentation at the Pacific Science Center in Seattle. Nothing I have seen shot digitally has had the same visual impact. I look forward to future Red cameras with larger sensors.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #28  
    As soon as film goes into a DI it's no longer film, it's a digital camera recording film. Anything film can do a 3D LUT + a sufficiently large color gammut can do exactly the same. There's nothing magic in film, it's just a really really beautiful LUT from reality -> RGB.

    Everything these days at some point becomes RGB digital. Eventually we'll have a wide enough dynamic range that we won't need optical filtration either.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #29  
    Moderator David Battistella's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Florence, Italy
    Posts
    9,998
    Quote Originally Posted by Mendes Nabil View Post

    Again, i would be the most delighted man if such a quality could emanate from a camera as little as the epic body, imagine...
    Red is an innovative company, they constantly look for improvements, and they "listen" .. If they could bring the magical of film (texture and color) in a Red body, it would be damn crazy....
    For an interesting perspective on what quality is I recommend reading ZEN and the art of motorcycle maintenance. The book really dives into the question of how we describe quality and what it really is. It's probably the most subjective word used to describe something because it really can not be defined. Much like our love of film, it's just something we all know.

    I think the best way to describe it is that it is actually, in a way, alive. It takes nothing more than organic materials to make and no electricity is used to create the image, just light and chemicals. So there is a mystery in that which produces a character and we still understand this alchemy is magical. Also you only see your image through ground glass until you can actually see you film projected with a simple light bulb.

    Then again, there is a bit of mystery in this process of breaking down a new sensor like the dragon.

    in recent weeks I have been completely blown away at how this sensor holds highlights and the rich tones it produces. There is a depth and three dimensionality to the image that feels a lot like a negative stock.

    Film is not dead in my mind or in my memories. To declare it as such does not honor it's legacy or it's role in bringing us to where we are. Were it not for films cost and the care required, we'd hardly have a tradition of cinema and cinematography. It might be "dead" to some people but to me it's still alive in dragon because I want to bring that same care and attention to the image making because of the image it produces.

    battistella
    "Colors are the wounds of light."
    -William Blake
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #30  
    Senior Member Ryan De Franco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    840
    Battistella thanks for the most inspiring post on any camera forum, ever.

    Especially the bit on what film has done for the care and tradition in our work. It's that tradition that can seem lost in the trade for "access" and "immediacy." There is so much room at the table -- but the conversation can sometimes sound less polite these days.

    On my end it is the intensity of movement -- next to my ear in the camera, buried in the grain in the cinema, and through the platters and pulleys and gears where I started as a projectionist -- random, consistent movement -- that will keep film in a high place for me. Light is random and consistent. Film's chemistry is random and consistent. I try to find the same joy in the randomness of a black shade, a hotel room color grade, or consistency in stop lights and waveforms, but it's more than nostalgia ... There is a human connection to film's chemical mechanical movement that we are learning to replace.

    David's process with Dragon is about as inspiring as any I can imagine for myself.

    Film is not dead in my mind or in my memories. To declare it as such does not honor it's legacy or it role in bringing us to where we are. Were it not for films cost and the care required, we'd hardly have a tradition of cinema and cinematography. It might be "dead" to some people but to me it's still alive in dragon because I want to bring that same care and attention to the image making because of the image it produces.

    battistella
    The more opinions you have, the less you see.
    Wim Wenders
    Reply With Quote  
     

Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts