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  1. #231  
    Senior Member Rakesh Malik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rand thompson View Post
    You can only do what you can do given the short amount of time you were given for prep. Hopefully we will get to see the short you filmed, it looks interesting.
    Hopefully it will be soon. It was a fun film to shoot!
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  2. #232  
    Senior Member rand thompson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakesh Malik View Post
    Hopefully it will be soon. It was a fun film to shoot!
    Alrighty then, will be looking out for it.
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  #233  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jarek Zabczynski View Post
    So will all this eventually end up as a HeliumColor/HeliumGamma thing or will it be the current implementation of RWG/Log3G10 plus a LUT?
    While we're testing, we're just using the 3D LUT capability of the Helium cameras to run LUT versions of IPP2 output transforms. This is great for quick testing, but it's not what the full implementation is about. In the full implementation we're handing the 3D LUT capabilities of the camera back over to their primary job of doing creative transforms, and the rest of the IPP2 is done via math. This means you get a good degree of monitor output independence on the different ports, say normal SDR on the LCD and HDR over the HD-SDI. It also means live CDL (+saturation) grading. It means we can make the histogram understand Log and thus be usable. And more...

    And just to re-iterate, there is no, there will not be "helium color" or "helium gamma" - that was the way we found worked in the past but now we've managed to expand on the in-camera processing pipeline we can do things differently / better.

    Graeme
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  4. #234  
    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme Nattress View Post
    While we're testing, we're just using the 3D LUT capability of the Helium cameras to run LUT versions of IPP2 output transforms. This is great for quick testing, but it's not what the full implementation is about. In the full implementation we're handing the 3D LUT capabilities of the camera back over to their primary job of doing creative transforms, and the rest of the IPP2 is done via math. This means you get a good degree of monitor output independence on the different ports, say normal SDR on the LCD and HDR over the HD-SDI. It also means live CDL (+saturation) grading. It means we can make the histogram understand Log and thus be usable. And more...

    And just to re-iterate, there is no, there will not be "helium color" or "helium gamma" - that was the way we found worked in the past but now we've managed to expand on the in-camera processing pipeline we can do things differently / better.

    Graeme
    All good I think.

    The only shortage at this point is, as I see it, the fact that they are preview luts and not just luts, in other words if they could hit the clip also on playback and preferably also baked into the proxies. Then there would not be much more to ask for. Or one little thing, a flag in the side car that says what lut was used when recorded so RCXP and other NLE´s could simply display the clips with the lut automatically as default.

    But all the above is sugar on the cream as I see it. Works well as it is now but the above would make great perfect as I see it.
    Björn Benckert
    Creative Lead & Founder Syndicate Entertainment AB
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  5. #235  
    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme Nattress View Post
    And just to re-iterate, there is no, there will not be "helium color" or "helium gamma" - that was the way we found worked in the past but now we've managed to expand on the in-camera processing pipeline we can do things differently / better.
    :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
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  6. #236  
    Senior Member Anthony Berenato Jr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme Nattress View Post
    While we're testing, we're just using the 3D LUT capability of the Helium cameras to run LUT versions of IPP2 output transforms. This is great for quick testing, but it's not what the full implementation is about. In the full implementation we're handing the 3D LUT capabilities of the camera back over to their primary job of doing creative transforms, and the rest of the IPP2 is done via math. This means you get a good degree of monitor output independence on the different ports, say normal SDR on the LCD and HDR over the HD-SDI. It also means live CDL (+saturation) grading. It means we can make the histogram understand Log and thus be usable. And more...

    And just to re-iterate, there is no, there will not be "helium color" or "helium gamma" - that was the way we found worked in the past but now we've managed to expand on the in-camera processing pipeline we can do things differently / better.

    Graeme
    Awesome to see this. Really hoping that all this choice of what the color science is doing with the newer LUTs gets implemented into some sort of IPP2 menu system, because I've seen some gorgeous stuff happen with almost all of the newer contrast presets. Overall, extremely excited as long as a LUT doesn't have to be touched in it's final representation. Clients don't always seem willing to learn new tricks.
    Anthony Berenato Jr.
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  7. #237  
    Senior Member Brendan H. Banks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Holland View Post
    Correct, this is just "how things are" until everything is finalized.

    Remember everything you are seeing is a "preview" until the camera firmware, REDCINE-X Pro, and the SDK are hammered down to the floor.
    Cool, that's what I was guessing. Appreciate the help Phil.

    Loving this new pipeline.
    Brendan H. Banks
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  8. #238  
    Senior Member Jeffrey Loewe's Avatar
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    Looking forward to trying this new firmware.

    Totally random question is the Dragon sensor harder to produce than Helium?

    If so what are the thoughts of a Raven with a smaller cut of Helium and maybe a bump to 5 or 6K in resolution(with a higher cost for course)? Epic-W's are cranking out so fast and have been for awhile that just seems to make to much sense to me for some reason. I really wanted a Raven, but the line is long, and really far out. If the Raven/Scarlet-W could go out the door faster with Helium, maybe that update is around the corner at some point?
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  9. #239  
    Senior Member Anthony Berenato Jr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffrey Loewe View Post
    Looking forward to trying this new firmware.

    Totally random question is the Dragon sensor harder to produce than Helium?

    If so what are the thoughts of a Raven with a smaller cut of Helium and maybe a bump to 5 or 6K in resolution(with a higher cost for course)? Epic-W's are cranking out so fast and have been for awhile that just seems to make to much sense to me for some reason. I really wanted a Raven, but the line is long, and really far out. If the Raven/Scarlet-W could go out the door faster with Helium, maybe that update is around the corner at some point?
    I don't believe that either sensor is easier to make than the other... It's just that they built totally new lines for Helium and prepped sensors to build an army of cameras that would ship as soon as the upgrade system went online. I'm sure both are at max capacity right now, and a changeover wouldn't alleviate anything. But hey - it's all worth the wait.
    Anthony Berenato Jr.
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  #240  
    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Berenato Jr View Post
    Awesome to see this. Really hoping that all this choice of what the color science is doing with the newer LUTs gets implemented into some sort of IPP2 menu system, because I've seen some gorgeous stuff happen with almost all of the newer contrast presets. Overall, extremely excited as long as a LUT doesn't have to be touched in it's final representation. Clients don't always seem willing to learn new tricks.
    Yes, trying to make the menu system simple and self-explanitory so that it's easy to use and not confuse people.

    Graeme
    www.red.com - 8k Digital Cinema Camera
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    IPP2, Image Processing, Colour Science and Demosaic Algorithms
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