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  1. #31  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha Engel View Post
    When you would have avoided the $24k Mac Pro and went for a $14k threadripper workstation with 2 RTX Titans on Windows or Linux you would be waiting for the release of a 12k red camera to put some pressure on the workstation, while still being able to use the rocket.

    CPU: AMD Threadripper 3990X 2.9 GHz 64-Core Processor ($3899.99 @ Amazon)
    CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X73 73.11 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($171.48 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: Gigabyte TRX40 AORUS XTREME XL ATX sTRX4 Motherboard ($849.00 @ B&H)
    Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 256 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($1199.99 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($148.93 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Sabrent Rocket 4 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($849.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Sabrent Rocket 4 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($849.99 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: NVIDIA TITAN RTX 24 GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($2499.98 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: NVIDIA TITAN RTX 24 GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($2499.98 @ Amazon)
    Case: Corsair 750D ATX Full Tower Case ($159.99 @ Newegg)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA T2 1600 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($459.99 @ B&H)


    Total: $13589.31
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    That $24,000 isn't exactly accurate. My Mac Pro was actually $15,000ish. I also spent another $2,000 on third party RAM that was arguably overkill. My SSD based RAID cost $6,500. Would love to know if that Windows machine you spec'd out can do 248fps ALEXA render speeds without an Apple Afterburner card.
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  2. #32  
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    Quote Originally Posted by gillianseed View Post
    "it just seems morally wrong to reward Apple with revenues they simply do not deserve."

    Really? The new Mac Pro 2019 increased my ALEXA renders by 450%, with a 60fps increased just from the Apple Afterburner alone. PHANTOM render speeds increased by 900% with the Mac Pro. The RED render speeds dropped by 20%. Something tells me Apple isn't the problem here.
    Imagine how much they would have sped up if you were on a high end workstation! Note you’re comparing your render speeds to a 10 year old machine.

    I have a Mac Pro and I like it for rare instances when OSX is required, but using the right tool for the job is generally the best approach in the professional world.
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  3. #33  
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Meyer View Post
    Imagine how much they would have sped up if you were on a high end workstation! Note you’re comparing your render speeds to a 10 year old machine.

    I have a Mac Pro and I like it for rare instances when OSX is required, but using the right tool for the job is generally the best approach in the professional world.
    Correct, and ProRes is the 90% codec of choice for high-end film production, so a Mac Pro with an Afterburner card is probably the right tool for the job. The jobs I do that use RED cameras are always Directors that own the camera themselves. Just did a burger chain job for the video on their menu boards and we had stereotypical RED issues all day long related to glitches and weird color science. For example, the pink drink was showing up as orange in the RED and I had to isolate and color correct in Resolve. Also panicked the client whenever we played back slow-mo from camera because all the highlights turned into pink orbs. To my knowledge, ALEXA/VENICE/Phantom do not do these things. Had to Google the pink orb thing and found people talking about this issue going on 3 years and RED still hasn't fixed it. There was a discussion at the end of the job on what to use next time and it sounded like they may try Alexa next time. If they have the money, they go for ALEXA.
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  4. #34  
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    Quote Originally Posted by gillianseed View Post
    Correct, and ProRes is the 90% codec of choice for high-end film production, so a Mac Pro with an Afterburner card is probably the right tool for the job. The jobs I do that use RED cameras are always Directors that own the camera themselves. Just did a big McDonald's job for the video on their menu boards and we STILL had stereotypical RED issues all day long related to glitches and weird color science. For example, the pink lemonade slushie was showing up as orange in the RED and I had to isolate and color correct in Resolve. Also panicked the client whenever we played back slow-mo from camera because all the highlights turned into pink orbs. To my knowledge, ALEXA/VENICE/Phantom do not do these things. Had to Google the pink orb thing and found people talking about this issue going on 3 years and RED still hasn't fixed it. There was a big discussion at the end of the job on what to use next time and it sounded like they were going to rent Alexa from now on. No one really chooses to rent RED cameras. If they have the money, they go for ALEXA.

    Why aren’t you recording ProRes on your Red shoots, if that is what you prefer to use?
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  5. #35  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha Engel View Post
    When you would have avoided the $24k Mac Pro and went for a $14k threadripper workstation with 2 RTX Titans on Windows or Linux you would be waiting for the release of a 12k red camera to put some pressure on the workstation, while still being able to use the rocket.

    CPU: AMD Threadripper 3990X 2.9 GHz 64-Core Processor ($3899.99 @ Amazon)
    CPU Cooler: NZXT Kraken X73 73.11 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($171.48 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: Gigabyte TRX40 AORUS XTREME XL ATX sTRX4 Motherboard ($849.00 @ B&H)
    Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 256 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($1199.99 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($148.93 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Sabrent Rocket 4 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($849.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Sabrent Rocket 4 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($849.99 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: NVIDIA TITAN RTX 24 GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($2499.98 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: NVIDIA TITAN RTX 24 GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($2499.98 @ Amazon)
    Case: Corsair 750D ATX Full Tower Case ($159.99 @ Newegg)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA T2 1600 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($459.99 @ B&H)


    Total: $13589.31
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    Also, how would I export ProRes files out of Resolve on a Windows machine? I thought it wasn't possible except in Adobe products and Scratch, which doesn't work for me. DPs know and like Resolve, and 90% of post houses request ProRes dailies.
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  6. #36  
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    Quote Originally Posted by gillianseed View Post
    Also, how would I export ProRes files out of Resolve on a Windows machine? I thought it wasn't possible except in Adobe products and Scratch, which doesn't work for me. DPs know and like Resolve, and 90% of post houses request ProRes dailies.
    You can record them in-camera or use RCX. You could even install an nVidia card in your Mac Pro and boot into windows to access CUDA if you want.

    Lots of ways to get faster until Metal support is up to snuff.
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  7. #37  
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    It's not what I prefer, it's what a large majority of professional post houses request for dailies on each job. We typically use the native format of the camera, whether it's Phantom's Cine, Venice's X-OCN, RED's REDRAW and for Alexa it's mostly ProRes4444 or ARRIRAW on big-budget shoots. Shooting 8k ProRes4444 is not feasible on the RED system.
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  8. #38  
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    Quote Originally Posted by gillianseed View Post
    It's not what I prefer, it's what a large majority of professional post houses request for dailies on each job. We typically use the native format of the camera, whether it's Phantom's Cine, Venice's X-OCN, RED's REDRAW and for Alexa it's mostly ProRes4444 or ARRIRAW on big-budget shoots. Shooting 8k ProRes4444 is not feasible on the RED system.
    You do you, man.

    I usually shoot both r3d and prores at once.
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  9. #39  
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    Quote Originally Posted by gillianseed View Post
    That $24,000 isn't exactly accurate. My Mac Pro was actually $15,000ish. I also spent another $2,000 on third party RAM that was arguably overkill. My SSD based RAID cost $6,500. Would love to know if that Windows machine you spec'd out can do 248fps ALEXA render speeds without an Apple Afterburner card.
    248 fps for full-HD/2k? and what kind of ProRes?, to be honest I have no idea. What it can do is ~280 fps 4.6k BRAW at 3:1 (CPU limited) and so can the cheaper $2k cheaper 3970x (stock settings).

    The biggest advantage of the workstation compared to the Mac Pro is that it can handle every current codec and resolution in realtime for a fraction of the price.
    Our current systems (3950x) can only do ~180 fps 4.6k BRAW at 3:1 (the max we need at that resolution is 120 fps, the camera can't shoot more fps at that resolution).
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  10. #40  
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Meyer View Post
    You can record them in-camera or use RCX. You could even install an nVidia card in your Mac Pro and boot into windows to access CUDA if you want.

    Lots of ways to get faster until Metal support is up to snuff.
    We often use multiple bodies from different manufacturers on jobs. Did an AT&T spot that used two RED Heliums, an Alexa65, and Sony smaller prosumer cameras. Rebooting my entire system every other camera reload to change operating systems would be horribly inefficient, not to mention look unprofessional. Also cannot make ProRes files in Resolve on a Windows machine.
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