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  1. #1 Zeiss Otus Bokeh 
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Hiya,
    I just got a Zeiss 55 1.4 Otus and was planning on getting the 85 and probasbly the 28. We are planning on using it on gimbals and also when there is just low light.

    However I just read a review that pointed out that Otus has "onion rings" in the bokeh, which I can see now when I look at them. It does not look great, when it does happen but it seems to not happen so often.

    I never reflected on that behaviour for video. How much a problem could that be? I know the Canon 85 1.4 does not have it, however it has chromatic abberation and is less sharp instead.

    Here is the review:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=La036dB-x_M

    Here is another image of the bokeh



    So basically I'm debating if I should buy more of them or not.
    What do you guys think?
    Andreas
    Last edited by AndreasOberg; 11-28-2019 at 05:57 AM.
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  2. #2  
    Onions rings are a sign of sharpness in the lens design. It's a personal preference.

    The more expensive you go the more corrected and heavier a lens becomes. If you want it all then you're looking at Zeiss supremes, Arri Signatures and Leicas.

    But below that you balance cost vs look.

    I personally don't like busy bokeh and i'm very happy with my APO HyperPrimes. But others will prefer the Zeiss rendering and sharpness.

    Also in day to day use these situations may not come up as well.

    To me, the cutting off of the bokeh because of the barrel is more annoying..

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  3. #3  
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    That's pretty subtle. The K35s have much worse onion rings from what I've seen. (It's the result of using aspherical elements, except Sony alone has found out how to polish them out.) It's whatever you can live with imo.
    Last edited by Matt W.; 11-28-2019 at 07:16 AM.
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  4. #4  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W. View Post
    That's pretty subtle. The K35s have much worse onion rings from what I've seen. (It's the result of using aspherical elements, except Sony alone has found out how to polish them out.) It's whatever you can live with imo.
    Yea, I think that if I would shot a romantic film with close up of characters and bokeh details in the background I would avoid this lens. But if we shot animals the sharpness is so valuable on the animal, the whiskers, the featers etc. It makes it possible to really crop into 8k as well and still have a sharp image.

    One situation I could imagine that could cause issues is when you film water, there you can have beautiful bokeh highlights. However if they are really bright then the onionrings probably are less visible.

    Cheers
    Andreas
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  5. #5  
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    I thought this was a feature of the lens designed to make it more sexy...

    Alludes to the human form a bit, am I right ?

    If it really bothers you it might be something you can mask by adjusting luminance values within a certain range and color tonality...

    Do you have this kind of illumination showing up in the background of your natural history films ? I imagine not, but that’s not my world so outside my realm of expertise...
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  6. #6  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    "Onion Rings" in the bokeh allude to a few things, namely grinding tolerances, but also it's very difficult to removed them out of higher end complicated aspherical designs. Sort of part of the trade off of good clean modern optics. Even $$$$$ glass has rings now and again.

    I wrote up an article on the "Otus Trio" with some sample images *gasp* 3 years ago, none of my lenses have very apparent onion skinning IMO:

    http://www.phfx.com/articles/otusInFocus/

    I have yet to purchase the 100mm, but I likely will in 2020.

    These really are some of the best primes to date. Their only real fault IMO is that there aren't a few more focal lengths. And I'll goad the big Z a bit. Release the wide angle in 2020 please.
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  7. #7  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    That is good to hear Phil.
    I agree with you that the main limitation is that it does not have more lenses.

    I did ask Zeiss at a Photo show recently and they did not seem positive about a more wide lens due to the difficulty of making it 1.4. But I also hope for a more wide.

    Nice article Phil, I remember reading it way back and of course also remember your crazy Helicopter city flyower with 3 monstros.
    Sounds like we will prob get a few more then. I plan on using them on a gimbal filming penguin chicks. Should all to all be quite an experience!
    I tested the Sigma Art 135 1.8 and it also has a very high quality. When it comes to low light I like the idea of combinging the 3 Zeiss with the 135 1.8 and also the 15mm 1.8.
    What wide angle lens would you use now when you need wider than the 28mm Phil?
    Canon 16-35 2.8 III has quite high quality and not much CA so I will probably use that one quite often.

    When it stops raining here in UK would be nice to compare the Zeiss to the Canon 50-1000 at the wide end, this is where the Canon is the "least strong" and has a bit of CA.

    Best,
    Andreas
    Last edited by AndreasOberg; 11-28-2019 at 10:50 AM.
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  8. #8  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Question is... the 85 or the 100mm.
    100 is 200g heavier which is not great on a handheld gimbal. But it is longer, sharper in the corners, but a bit less sharp in the center, also has more vignetting and cost more.

    Hmmm, decisions decisions...
    Andreas
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  9. #9  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Ok, ordered the 85 and the 28. Got an amazing price!
    I'm a bit concerned how to fit these in carry on luggage, especially together with the CN20x50 which is 7.3kg with motor, and everything else sensitive.
    Andreas
    www.ObergWildlife.com- Natural History Filmmaking
    www.WildlifeRescueMovie.com- Saving the animals of the Rainforest!
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  10. #10  
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    I think otus is dead. What is the point o releasing 100 if they have 85? Short cut. If 100was a Macro i would understand. It is expansive for Zeiss to develop Otus and there are no sales. Companies like Sigma are killing them. For 2 years they have not come up with wides or macro. Time to move on.
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