Thread: Are there any validations to these claims made by Blackmagic Design?

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  1. #21  
    Senior Member jake blackstone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha Engel View Post
    AMD earned their money and current stockprice with PC and Server CPU's, not with selling GPU's to Apple.
    NVidia makes it earnings with the GPU's in the gaming, server and AI business.

    When you want to earn some money on Apple be a monopolist like Qualcomm, no other company gets a descent price for their products/services while selling to Apple or using Apple standards.
    Apple is in the game for earning all the money.
    And once more, what is your point?
    I mentioned nVidia as an example of a huge company Apple refuses to do business with. The same goes for BMD, except BMD is tiny in comparison.
    Got it?
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  2. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by jake blackstone View Post
    And once more, what is your point?
    I mentioned nVidia as an example of a huge company Apple refuses to do business with. The same goes for BMD, except BMD is tiny in comparison.
    Got it?
    It didn't hurt NVidia one bit that they don't do business with Apple, it made them creative and now they are the biggest in AI and parallel computing in the world.
    BMD is tiny(selling more RAW capable camera's than any other manufacturer) but a growing privatly owned company doing pretty good (atleast from a consumer standpoint).

    When you want to make use of ProResRAW you need an external recorder like you did in the 1980's, while with most other camera's you can do it in/on camera.
    Curently their are no benefits in using ProResRAW compared to other RAW(like) formats.
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    i used to use cineform and really liked it, any idea why it's not being developed more? last i heard Gopro had bought it, but then released it as open source or something. I haven't used it in a while cuz my computer will run r3d's without transcoding. but i've thought for a while that cameras could be using it in camera and sorta wondered why more didn't.
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  4. #24  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devindra S. View Post
    i used to use cineform and really liked it, any idea why it's not being developed more? last i heard Gopro had bought it, but then released it as open source or something. I haven't used it in a while cuz my computer will run r3d's without transcoding. but i've thought for a while that cameras could be using it in camera and sorta wondered why more didn't.
    It's still alive https://github.com/gopro/cineform-sdk and it's gaining momentum under Resolve users.
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  5. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by jake blackstone View Post
    BMD directly rips FCPX lock stock and barrel as a SECOND editor in Resolve and now they trying to directly compete with with Apple ProresRAW codec. Apple has long memory and can be very vindictive.
    I don't think that's exactly true. If you watch the June 3 video presentation on the Mac Pro, Blackmagic is very much a participant in the demo and Apple specifically sites Resolve and the actually show a colorist in the Apple demo room using the Advanced Panels on a Resolve project. They also invited Grant Petty and several other BMD people, and he was there at the intro. I think if Apple was really concerned, they would've shut BMD out completely.

    I had hoped that negotiations for Windows ProRes rendering were ongoing, but it's been a long time now and doesn't seem to be ending anytime soon.
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  6. #26  
    Senior Member jake blackstone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wielage View Post
    I don't think that's exactly true. If you watch the June 3 video presentation on the Mac Pro, Blackmagic is very much a participant in the demo and Apple specifically sites Resolve and the actually show a colorist in the Apple demo room using the Advanced Panels on a Resolve project. They also invited Grant Petty and several other BMD people, and he was there at the intro. I think if Apple was really concerned, they would've shut BMD out completely.

    I had hoped that negotiations for Windows ProRes rendering were ongoing, but it's been a long time now and doesn't seem to be ending anytime soon.
    Business is business. Apple sued Samsung, while purchasing huge amount of products from them and still do after the suit was resolved.
    You don't negotiate with Apple about Prores license. Company must submit a business plan as to how APPLE will benefit from licensing Prores to that company. If the argument is weak, NO PRORES FOR YOU! Pretty simple really...
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  7. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha Engel View Post
    It didn't hurt NVidia one bit that they don't do business with Apple, it made them creative and now they are the biggest in AI and parallel computing in the world.
    BMD is tiny(selling more RAW capable camera's than any other manufacturer) but a growing privatly owned company doing pretty good (atleast from a consumer standpoint).

    When you want to make use of ProResRAW you need an external recorder like you did in the 1980's, while with most other camera's you can do it in/on camera.
    Curently their are no benefits in using ProResRAW compared to other RAW(like) formats.

    It's not about who got or going to get hurt, it's about Apple having long memory. Once you get on their shit list- nVidia, BMD, it's very difficult to get off it. But, if there is business necessity or if there is money to be made, Apple has no problem doing business even with their biggest competitors and suppliers, like with Samsung.
    Business is business...
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  8. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha Engel View Post
    When you want to make use of ProResRAW you need an external recorder like you did in the 1980's, while with most other camera's you can do it in/on camera.
    Curently their are no benefits in using ProResRAW compared to other RAW(like) formats.
    That is until we see ProresRAW in iPhone.
    Apple tried to overturn Red IP the easy way and that didn't fly. So, now Red will directly benefit from Apple licensing Red IP the traditional way. And that in the process will make ProresRAW the most popular RAW codec overnight.
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  9. #29  
    What's technically wrong with cDNG, i mean it's a codec holding RAW data - RAW data is the most basic simplest data there is.

    In this case IMHO people should have just developed cDNG more. There are compressions that can be applied, there are internal look up tables for mathematical compression of linear data. I just fail to see where cDNG doesn't work, save for the real fact that many app developers would rather force people down their own proprietary roads. That's the issue with it, there's nothing wrong with the codec itself.

    Aside from R3D as part of an eco-system i would rather record cDNG as that can then be used and opened in many applications.

    It is true that Resolves debayer isn't that good.

    But again this is the implementation of the codec, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with the codec itself

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  10. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulcurtis View Post
    What's technically wrong with cDNG, i mean it's a codec holding RAW data - RAW data is the most basic simplest data there is.

    In this case IMHO people should have just developed cDNG more. There are compressions that can be applied, there are internal look up tables for mathematical compression of linear data. I just fail to see where cDNG doesn't work, save for the real fact that many app developers would rather force people down their own proprietary roads. That's the issue with it, there's nothing wrong with the codec itself.

    Aside from R3D as part of an eco-system i would rather record cDNG as that can then be used and opened in many applications.

    It is true that Resolves debayer isn't that good.

    But again this is the implementation of the codec, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with the codec itself

    cheers
    Paul
    The issue with CDNG is the processing power needed for true high quality debayer algorithms. Resolve has improved significantly since V10, but on my i7 quadcore the highest quality export runs about 2.5 fps with a basic grade. That’s for 2k. It will barely play 24fps realtime on the timeline in Resolve and Lightworks, but not fluidly enough for efficient editing. Compression doesn’t make any difference in this. I have tried up to 7:1 compression with Slimraw.
    I have used Raw Therapee and Capture One pro on some Bolex footage and really like the higher quality results, but with those it typically runs between 2.5 and 5 seconds PER FRAME. Those I reserve for fine art gallery loops. But they can be useful for problem shots too.
    Raw Therapee has some really interesting wavelet processing tools that produce unique looks and textures.





    I still prefer working with uncompressed CDNG from the Bolex using color managed CIE XYZ linear to whatever finishing color space in Resolve. I prefer the look of grading from the linear data rather than log conversions. Slimraw Cineon lossless log compression is pretty close to linear, but converting to any of the common video log spaces makes recovering the rich color gamut of the Bolex difficult. The footage can maintain subtle color and texture into very deep shadows that log formats kill.

    Red got there first with a practical raw compression scheme, and with IPP2 it is IMO still head and shoulders above any of the newcomers if you have the skills and time to make use of it.
    I shudder to think of what shooting 8k in CDNG would require. Bring one of those new 64 core Ryzen machines to its knees.
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