Thread: HYDROKOMODO. 3 years and still waiting

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  1. #31  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Hofmeyr View Post
    Don't think I want to use a phone as my primary monitor, but it's nice to have it as a backup.

    As far as I recall, the plan was to have a wired connection and a phone cradle. Did this change?
    If you change Android into a dedicated monitor OS with an integrated Red Control App, then it's not really a phone anymore. It's then also able to record back to camera metadata stuff that a phone generally has that a cinema camera doesn't, like better Gyro data for post stabilization, directly into the R3D files.

    I mean, there's so much that could be done if the source code for the phone were unlocked and integrated into how the camera and phone interact. At least as trial run and then Red could make a real monitor product out of the tech later on.

    Really hope Red or Jarred is reading this
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  2. #32  
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    The way I see it, any developments that happen in regards to phones and Komodo will have nothing to do with Hydrogen in particular. So if people want to push for more phone integration, it'd be better to just leave any Hydrogen-specific details/requests out of it. It may be that things get developed in ways that allow Hydrogens to be better used in conjunction with the Komodo (and DSMC3), but I imagine Hydrogen integration itself isn't even on the list of priorities at RED.

    Just editing to add I do like the idea of RED opening up options in regards to monitoring and data-gathering/manipulation, so don't want to seem dismissive of the whole idea.
    Last edited by Les Hillis; 08-31-2020 at 12:53 PM.
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  3. #33  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Hillis View Post
    The way I see it, any developments that happen in regards to phones and Komodo will have nothing to do with Hydrogen in particular. So if people want to push for more phone integration, it'd be better to just leave any Hydrogen-specific details/requests out of it. It may be that things get developed in ways that allow Hydrogens to be better used in conjunction with the Komodo (and DSMC3), but I imagine Hydrogen integration itself isn't even on the list of priorities at RED.
    I'm not talking about a phone, I'm talking about how the H1 has parts that can integrate with the infrastructure of a camera like no other phone and that it's something that's now cancelled. I'm talking about stripping away the "phone things" within it, keeping the connector, WIFI, Gyroscope, even an ability to stream from it. There are things within a phone that has tremendous use when filming that could be utilized, especially when the H1 has a high-speed connector on the backside. And who cares about if it's prioritized or not? It's like saying that because it's not prioritized it doesn't hold any value, which makes no sense. They could work on it later, Mikael could take a look, or as I said, give out the source code since it's a dead project and let someone else make something. I just think that it's wasted potential not to look into how the H1 could be a piece of support equipment. It will definitely give it a second life value.
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  4. #34  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Hofmeyr View Post
    Don't think I want to use a phone as my primary monitor, but it's nice to have it as a backup.

    As far as I recall, the plan was to have a wired connection and a phone cradle. Did this change?
    Well since H1 is no longer supported and the OS is 2 years old...
    I think its time to move on, expecting a company to support a dead product is wishful thinking. RIP H1
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  5. #35  
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    Okay, I thought you were talking about phones in general. If you're talking about using the Hydrogen in particular, I don't really don't see RED spending time on it. Wouldn't they have to start making them again for that to be worthwhile?

    But yeah, if there are unique parts the H1 has that might be integrated into another product, I can see that might be worth checking out, if RED haven't done that already.
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  6. #36  
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    I don't know if I would say "like no other phone". Doesn't pretty much every phone have a "high speed connector", a gyro and wifi? Yes there is a toughened case but that is about it. It's a dated Android phone at this point -- that's a double negative.

    Also I believe the H1 was available through a carrier briefly. Updating any carrier software is a huge exercise. I think Greg has the best use for the H1 -- as a book-end with a Newton on the other end.
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  7. #37  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Hillis View Post
    Wouldn't they have to start making them again for that to be worthwhile?
    Sure, that's the major problem. But the thing is that there are thousands of them out there that could get a second life. All of them will be worthless in a generation or two. So if we had a cable and software for it, we would still have a very high-end monitor that rivals the high-end line of touch monitors in Red's store. The development cost wouldn't be that much if you count in that everyone with a Komodo and a H1 would probably get it and it would be a seriously low-cost monitor on the used market that gets new life with just a new cable and software. Then, of course, the environmental perspective of using this old gear and not just letting thousands of old H1s pile up in some third world country.

    Quote Originally Posted by Med D View Post
    I don't know if I would say "like no other phone". Doesn't pretty much every phone have a "high speed connector", a gyro and wifi? Yes there is a toughened case but that is about it. It's a dated Android phone at this point -- that's a double negative.

    Also I believe the H1 was available through a carrier briefly. Updating any carrier software is a huge exercise. I think Greg has the best use for the H1 -- as a book-end with a Newton on the other end.
    This is why I said that the Android OS should be scrapped and the entire thing rebooted with new software that makes it a pure monitor for Komodo. The H1 has a high-speed connector on the back side that was meant to integrate with the camera module that was canceled at the same time as the phone itself. So it has the capacity to put through a whole other level of bandwidth and function than just a USB-C connector. So if you combine that with all the stuff inside it that's common on other phones, you could essentially make it so it feeds the Gyro data back into the metadata of the R3D file and you have an instant SteadXP quality stabilizer that's more powerful than the kickstarter one. Couple that with a streaming capacity that gets fed from the camera through the Red cable and you have a much higher quality broadcast camera for online broadcasting. Keeping it "a phone" is not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about using the hardware tech inside it, stripping out the "phone" software part and remake it into a very powerful monitor with extra capabilities. The H1 is not just a phone, especially when you start looking past its Android part.
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  8. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Holland View Post
    If you are a Hydrogen owner there is a discount available for the full production Black models. Early bird cameras, which are more expensive than the Black release cams aren't applicable for the discount. There was only a mention of the development of Hydrogen 2, but that was a far off horizon and nothing was ever hard planned.

    There was a Camera Module of some sort that was planned for Komodo, which also would have cost money. The benefit of being a Hydrogen owner is you do get that Komodo discount if you want one.

    The question really comes down to if you were interested in the Camera Module and if that ever interested you. Komodo likely was going to be released in it's current form either way based on what Jarred's said in interviews and even shown a much older prototype. Though Komodo is not a "camera module", it's a bit more fully featured than the initial prototype of that module shown was by a fairly large margin. And is in effect compatible with IOS as well as shortly Android devices and not limited to one exact phone.

    A completely hot and personal take as RED Hydrogen and RED Digital Cinema weren't exactly the same company or truly related. Though RED Hydrogen didn't survive the onslaught of modern day 3-6 month mobile phone cycles and had some rather large potholes when it comes to the general consumer experience, what's far more interesting to me is the people still using Hydrogen in 2020. I'm still paying attention to that crowd who are still tapping into the H4V and Lightfield tech, 3D, and other things you can use the phone for. And a really hot take, my Ti still gets 3 days per charge. But most mobile phone companies now offer huge batteries around the same year of the H1 launch. A lot of criticism surrounding the project and rightly so, but it is very interesting that there are people still using these devices as phones, content creation, and presentation.

    My personal take was if Hydrogen featured 3 cameras with wide, normal, and tele lenses without the focus on H4V and smidge more focus on 2D, things might have played out a bit differently. The following year is when the newer iPhones and other cameras with multi-cams/focal lengths hit and some of that integration is sexy. Not to mention killing the auxiliary lens business to some degree. Now we have fancy mirror and periscope zooms. Lots of interesting small tech these days.
    Ha! I still use mine as my primary phone. Every now and then I still take a 4v picture...

    But before this I had a flip ... So ... I don't pay that attention to the phone market.
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  9. #39  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian Jadot View Post
    Ha! I still use mine as my primary phone. Every now and then I still take a 4v picture...

    But before this I had a flip ... So ... I don't pay that attention to the phone market.
    Same until this week, which actually happened more as a "project requirement" to upgrade to something else, can't really talk about that now, but 5G related which Hydrogen doesn't support. But yeah, the fact that nothing really slowed down, maintained great battery life, and survived my rather weird travels and impacts; I think there was a lot more good than bad.

    Biggest negatives were the fingerprint scanner and perhaps the Android security update missing in action. The H4V stuff being so early and new didn't really bother me. I've been early to all sorts of tech while wrinkles needed ironing out.

    Telling you though, if I can put any of these phones into a Titanium shell with a forehead and chin for camera and speakers (I think that would allow for rather large speakers btw), and remove notches forever, I wouldn't be opposed to that.

    Headphone jack was/is a plus too but it seems the world is moving on for mobile on that front. A good USB to 3.5mm adapter works I guess if you are in love with your headphones or earbuds that aren't wireless.

    The biggest bummer is we don't get to see what Hydrogen 2 was on the path to being, though it was mentioned a few times. So many interesting things could have been omitted and of course built upon. But I would say safely that short of being a real major player in screen tech and manufacturing it would be very hard to compete. Phone camera sensors are another small world thing, but there's a lot that can be done there too. Heh. I got some wild ideas on all this I guess. I imagine somebody will come along and get creative in the face of material refinement as of late.

    It's still a very interesting device for those avid 3D folks interested in H4V, that's where one of my other phones ended up and that guys doing crazy stuff which is rad.

    The benefit to those into Komodo is your discount on the camera is sort of the actual price you paid for the phone, which I think is a nice plus when it comes down to it.
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  10. #40  
    After everything is said and done (I am so excited about the Komodo, it is pretty much bought once the H1 Discount version hits ... for me anyways) ... However, I am still going to be in search of a 4.5k+ true pocket cinema camera. Something the same size as the original BMPCC that won't draw the attention a rig will. One day maybe ... I was really hoping the Hydrogen + the Camera module would have been it.

    PS I got 2 phones, plus a $1,000 (hopfully) off on the Komodo. Not a bad deal all in all,
    Scarlet-X #2034 "Bea"
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